DISCUSSION - Is Randy Orton the most important wrestler in the WWE right now?

[Batsu]

I would just like to say, if a Lesnar/Orton match actually happened, I'd be going for Orton in that match. Especially if Orton becomes a new-age DDP as he seems to be aspiring to be with random RKOing.

[Nowhere Man]

But he won't. DDP popularized the move, which was an integral part of his success. You can't really popularize something that's already been popularized. So really, the RKO is going to hinder Orton in the long run, because he's making himself a second-rate Page. Ripping off someone else's gimmick has very rarely ever worked, and those who have made it work were way more talented than their predecessors. So far, from what I've seen, Orton can't even touch DDP.

[FourFifty]

Originally Posted by Nowhere Man But he won't. DDP popularized the move, which was an integral part of his success. You can't really popularize something that's already been popularized.

It's very rare when I say these two words... You're Wrong. Much respect to you, so please don't misunderstand, but it's very easy to popularize a move that has already been popularized. Beniot and the rock use The Sharp Shooter. RVD, Eddie and Val Venis all use a splash for their finisher much like Superfly. Steve Austin was able to use the Lou Thez Press, and if you don't know where the name came from then stab yourself in the eye. Edge and Rhyno both took a page out of the book of the Goldberg hand book when they use the spear. The Lion Tamer can be traced to the Goldust Trio, while Kurt was able to use Shamrock's ankle lock.

It's all a matter of how it looks.

Beniot, The Rock, Bret Hart and Sting all have their own twist on the Sharp Shooter/Death Lock. From how high they are off the ground, to how they hold the victims feet. It makes that move their own.
Eddie and Val both have their own pose right before their splash, while RVD sells his splash to make it the Five Star.
Lou Thez pinned people with his move, while SCSA punches them.
Edge and Rhyno, while are both more talented than Goldberg, use the move that in the eyes of many people Goldberg made famous. Much like the Sharp Shooter, it's all a matter of how the attacker sells it... I'm just waiting for someone to do a summersault after diving into the “victim’s” rib cage.
I believe if it weren't for Rick Martel, the Lion Tamer wouldn't be here. Just looking at Martel and Jericho... Do I really need to say "it's all a matter of how the attacker does it" again?
I don't recall anyone doing the ankle lock before Shamrock. Seeing him "snap" and twisting someone's ankle in ways it wasn't meant to be twisted was pretty brutal. Here we have "The Most Dangerous Man Alive" grabbing something and twisting it in a way that it should be twisted... then an Olympic gold medal winner doing the same thing... You can't do lot with the ankle lock, but hey, Shamrock isn't in the lime light, so why not use a move that is already over?

DDP isn't in the right now, so we won’t see The Diamond Cutter coming anytime soon.... I'm not saying that gives Randy Orton every right to steal his move, but it's how it's done. While DDP got it over as something you never see coming, Randy seems to put a little more swing into it. That's why I firmly believe that with a little more hype Orton can popularize the RKO, which DDP already got over.

[Nowhere Man]

I hear what you're saying, but at the same time, I highly doubt Orton will re-popularize the Diamond Cutter. Mainly because the RKO looks like crap compared to the Cutter. Page's came out of nowhere, and he had a billion different ways of doing it. Orton's you could see coming a mile away. And there's no real point of having a 'surprise' finisher when there's no surprise to it.

[Wondermouse]

Originally Posted by Nowhere Man I hear what you're saying, but at the same time, I highly doubt Orton will re-popularize the Diamond Cutter. Mainly because the RKO looks like crap compared to the Cutter. Page's came out of nowhere, and he had a billion different ways of doing it. Orton's you could see coming a mile away. And there's no real point of having a 'surprise' finisher when there's no surprise to it.

I disagree with you on two counts.

Firstly, for a long time, the Diamond Cutter didn't come out of nowhere. He very often signalled for it, and hit it. Thing is, when he called for it, it almost always looked like shit. That's because DDP executed it standing still, and thus didn't get full extension. When Orton regularly does it, he runs a little, which allows for nice extension, and a beautiful move.

Secondly, he DOES pull it out of nowhere sometimes. I can think of 3 off the top of my head - and I've seen him do it in a match maybe 6 times.

1 vs. Shawn Michaels - He caught the SCM, spun him around, and hit the RKO. HBK kicked out, but that looked pretty sweet.
2 vs. Cactus Jack - He did it while being clawed, or something similar, I don't remember.
3 vs. Val Venis - He faked a knee injury in the match and popped up from the mat to hit a beautiful RKO.