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Old 06-02-2004, 02:17 PM   #121
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Besides the fact that we don't have one so Butt will have to do.
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Old 06-02-2004, 02:17 PM   #122
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England don't have any quality holding midfielders.

Nicky Butt: he's shite, and Zidane would laugh in his ugly face.

You got in there quickly.
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Old 06-02-2004, 02:19 PM   #123
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Anyway, no team with Steven Gerrard in it needs a holding midfielder. He's a box to box man. Teams with a player like that can cope easily without someone shit like Butt.

Holding midfielders are needed for sides like Portugal where their talent is seperated into all out silky attackers and defensive sitting players who can spread the play about.
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Old 06-02-2004, 02:34 PM   #124
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If he's a box to box man then he goes up to France's box you can bet your ass Zidane won't track him back.

He maybe box to box but thats no good when Zidane is 20 yards infront of him.

Even if you say well one of them sit back thats crap because we saw Lampard can't sit back for shit and Scholes cant tackle something which is dead.

Having Becks or Gerrard sit back is a waste of them seems as though they are two most dynamic midfielders by a mile.
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Old 06-02-2004, 02:41 PM   #125
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It isn't that simple. You can't man mark Zidane, because Henry will tear you a new arse, and Vieira and Makalele will dominate. Pires will also be free to roam around where he wants.

Sometimes you have to take the game to a team, rather than try to neutralise them. Play to your own strengths, in other words.

Sacrificing your best players for Nicky Butt, in the vague hope that he'll mildly irritate Zidane is idiotic.
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Old 06-02-2004, 02:42 PM   #126
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And no holding midfielder, not even Nicky Butt, sits in front of his defence the whole time without getting forward. If you want that, you may as well play 3 men at the back.
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Old 06-05-2004, 07:57 AM   #127
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News today seems to indicate against Iceland England will play a straight 4-4-2 with Lampard and Gerrard in the centre.

Presumably this means Scholes won't play and there'll be someone else (Dyer?) on the left wing.

Maybe we'll get more than a good half hour this time
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Old 06-05-2004, 08:27 AM   #128
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I read scholes is playing on the left
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Old 06-05-2004, 10:23 AM   #129
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Scholes playing on the left is a fucking joke - pure and simple. As for all this Butt negativity - tell me when Lampard has done it for England? He hasn't, not at the top level. I don't care if he's played out of his skin for Chelsea, he still has to prove himself in my eyes as a top quality International midfielder.

We should play a team that has players suited to the jobs they are asked to fufill. Granted the left-side role is a problem area, but any United fan can testify that using Scholes out there is an absolute waste of his ability and has certainly affected him this season. Being shoved around the midfield has hindered Scholesy's form and doing so for England will not help.

The best individuals do not always make the best team. To go into Euro 2004 without a real holding player in midfield against France is ridiculous in my eyes. Sven, in my eyes, has just followed what the Press have been banging on about and by suddenly picking Lampard has totally fucked up the system he's been playing for years now. Well done Sven.
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Old 06-05-2004, 10:42 AM   #130
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Sven can't really win to be fair,he's told he can't leave Lampard out because he's had such a good season but after he plays everyone is saying bring back Butt.

I don't agree with the England form argument,otherwise Vassell should be certain to be in the squad and most i've spoken to (myself included) would rather have Defoe.

This,in my opinion,is for the best.Lampard and Gerrard help out defensively,with the former in particular often coming back to collect the ball and playmake at Liverpool.Afer all,if Butt was in then it would only be Gerrard on the left,which is another waste.
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Old 06-05-2004, 10:48 AM   #131
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Personally, i'd probably play

Cole Lampard Gerrard Beckham

across the midfield. Or phil neville, which whilst he sucks, I imagine he'd be more effective cause at least he can play on the left.
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Old 06-05-2004, 10:58 AM   #132
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Scholes has played on the left for United this season and did well.
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Old 06-05-2004, 11:06 AM   #133
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Scholes has played on the left for United this season and did well.
I beg to differ and there's no way he's remotely as effective there as he is in the middle.
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Old 06-05-2004, 11:20 AM   #134
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Scholes has played on the left for United this season and did well.
who against?
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Old 06-05-2004, 11:54 AM   #135
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I don't think I have ever seen Wayne Rooney pass the ball for England, he is way too fucking greedy, not just today but he always is.
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Old 06-05-2004, 12:19 PM   #136
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3-0 up against Iceland
I wish I had Sky Sports, so bored.
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Old 06-05-2004, 12:39 PM   #137
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Dunno, Scholes hasn't really been on the left at all and has just drifted infield as and when he wants and it seems to be working ok...only problem is that'll leave Cole horribly exposed against a decent team and we'll be fucked
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Old 06-05-2004, 01:48 PM   #138
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Finished 6-1
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Old 06-05-2004, 02:22 PM   #139
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First half England looked good. Scholes was very dangerous coming in off the left, and MMM, against a good side, they'll probably be more worried about none of their midfielders or defenders being able to pick Scholes up when he makes those runs, rather than getting at Ashley Cole.
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Old 06-05-2004, 02:37 PM   #140
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Wayne Bridge WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. That boy has skill.

That goes for Lampard and Cole too, notice how the ball bobble just before Cole's chance in the second half .

As I have said for a while Neville is better going forwards then he is defending, what a fucking girl, seriously, did you see the little poof put his hands over his face when the Iclandic player went for the overhead. Campbell was hardly marking his man tight, and as for Scholes at the back post . That was about the only thing Scholes did wrong, pretty hot performance, based on that I can see Lampard only being on the bench, but we will see.
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Old 06-05-2004, 02:41 PM   #141
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I thought Lampard did ok,who would replace him then? cause Butt certainly wasn't great.

Gudjohnsen isn't the fastest player but when he picked it up on the half way line that time and just ran Butt only caught him when he slowed,i'm pretty sure Gerrard and Lampard could tackle him much quicker.
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Old 06-05-2004, 02:48 PM   #142
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Lampard is not a left midfielder, Joe Cole would do a better job out there then Lampard, seriously.

Scholes showed today why England have to play him and Gerrard in the centre, Becks will be on the right hand side, Lampard should be on the bench.
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Old 06-05-2004, 03:48 PM   #143
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My team if I were Sven would:
Robinson
G Neville
Bridge
Terry
Campbell
Lampard
Gerrard
Scholes
Beckham
Owen
Beattie

Sven should have taken Defoe and Beattie instead of Heskey and Vassell. Lampard deserves to be in the team more than anyone because he was the best english player in the premiership last season.
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Old 06-05-2004, 03:57 PM   #144
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Not about England but has anyone just seen Robbie Keane's goal for Ireland on channel 5.
Fucking amazing.
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Old 06-05-2004, 03:59 PM   #145
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shit,didn't realise the Ireland game was on.
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Old 06-05-2004, 04:06 PM   #146
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1-0 ireland
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Old 06-06-2004, 03:26 AM   #147
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Out of interest, have the authorities stamped down on potential English hooligans, taking away their passports to prevent them going to Portugal? I brought this up because I was just watching TV and they had a highlights package of the ugly scenes between the English lads and the Germans at Euro 2000. Hopefully there will be no crowd trouble but it's difficult to see it not happening considering the tension between some European countries. I would definately have expected riots between Greek and Turkish fans had Turkey made it, but they didn't. LATVIA!
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Old 06-06-2004, 06:21 AM   #148
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They reckon they've confiscated the passports of a ton of people but they said the same thing before Euro 2000. I imagine if someone really wanted to get to Portugal to start something it wouldn't be too difficult for them to get a fake or find some other way of getting there.

I hope it doesn't all blow up but unf. there's always some retards who live for a fight
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Old 06-06-2004, 06:22 AM   #149
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English fans get the worst rap. I've seen the Turks do far worse and not get punished. England are already being threatened of being kicked out the championships if the fans misbehave.
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Old 06-06-2004, 06:31 AM   #150
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Oh we're not the only ones by a long shot. The Germans and Turks to name but two are just as bad.
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Old 06-06-2004, 06:41 AM   #151
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The Dutch are mad bastards too.
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Old 06-06-2004, 06:44 AM   #152
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Yeah I was gonna put the Dutch but I couldn't remember if they were or not But now I remember that absolute shitstorm that went down when they played Germany IIRC, and...yeah.

Watch out for those crazy Latvians too
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Old 06-06-2004, 07:24 AM   #153
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English fans get the worst rap. I've seen the Turks do far worse and not get punished. England are already being threatened of being kicked out the championships if the fans misbehave.
That's a fair call, there are fans who are just as bad as the English. I know for one thing that in the Greek league away fans have been banned from all venues cos of increasing crowd problems which have been in existence for several years though. I'm not sure how the fans behave when the national team plays, I haven't seen much footage of games or anything, so I can't really say much about Greece, but yeah, I've seen some Turkey games (both the national team and their teams in Europe) and some of their fans are shocking too.

But yeah, I can understand how it's a bit unfair how it's the English who get a bad reputation and not others as well. Oh well, hopefully not that many hooligans get into Portugal and disrupt what looks to be a really interesting tournament. By the way, Portugal 1-2 Greece.
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Old 06-06-2004, 09:53 AM   #154
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Kronik does not have that much rep yet (10+)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by legendkiller
My team if I were Sven would:
Robinson
G Neville
Bridge
Terry
Campbell
Lampard
Gerrard
Scholes
Beckham
Owen
Beattie

Sven should have taken Defoe and Beattie instead of Heskey and Vassell. Lampard deserves to be in the team more than anyone because he was the best english player in the premiership last season.
Heskey & Vassell showed why they were in the team yesterday, especially Vassell, the guy is class for England.
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