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Old 04-12-2007, 01:47 PM   #1
Kane Knight
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Owen Hart.
This is in response to some of the stuff in the various fanboy wars topics and whatnot.

Owen was a big boy. He was a professional wrestler and had to have known the risks inherrent in any stunt, let alone one that involved coming down from the rafters.

I'm not saying that we didn't lose a good guy or anything, but can't we just agree that shit happens sometimes, and accidents are accidents?

Bret Hart has every right to be upset at the loss of his brother, and maybe the spot shouldn't have been done, but it was. And the fact is, it's a relatively safe stunt but there are always risks involved.

I know there are factors involved in terms of the wrestling world, but in the end, he went through with it and he died. And it was terrible, and it was a loss. But it was a mistake, and accident, and nobody should have an axe to grind over this. At least, none of us.

“There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”

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Old 04-12-2007, 01:52 PM   #2
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Well said. I particularly find myself annoyed with the people who find fault with Vince and the company for continuing the PPV. The people in attendance paid for a show, they had a right to expect one, and would have been well within their rights to leave if they felt it appropriate. Owen was a performer with a great love of the business, and in any performance situation "the show must go on."
But too many people can't accept that some things are just terrible, senseless mistakes, and must find a way to fix blame. It saddens me and damages Owen's memory that so many people must point fingers.
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Old 04-12-2007, 01:55 PM   #3
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I don't blame anybody, it was a total freak accedent, nobody would have purposfully made that tragic event happen. If it were my brother I'd feel differently probably, so I don't discriminate against Bret for any ill feelings he has, he is totally right to feel however he wants to feel.
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Old 04-12-2007, 01:58 PM   #4
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True. Wrestling is a dangerous business to be in and there's a risk of serious injury or death in just about everything wrestlers do. They get into the business knowing this and it's ridiculous that when an accident happens, it's always somebodies fault, and somebody should be held accountable for it. No, there is no true accountability to an accident. The only accountability could/should be placed on the one directly involved in the accident. Sometimes the outcome of the accident is horrific and tragic, but, like previously stated and relating to Owen Hart, he knew what he was getting himself in to and he took the responsibilities and consequences of his actions.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:02 PM   #5
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I completely agree. It's not as if this was the first time and entrance like that was done either. Hell, Sting had been doing it for a long time before Owen's accident.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:02 PM   #6
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Off topic sort of, but i bought The History of the WWE/F Championship and i watched Bret vs Owen for the title in the steel cage. That might be one of the best steel cage matches i've ever seen. The technical spots having to do with them diving for the door and trying to climb out were just about flawless and beautiful to watch. Incredible match.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:04 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 311
I completely agree. It's not as if this was the first time and entrance like that was done either. Hell, Sting had been doing it for a long time before Owen's accident.
And Sting's entrance, with the fall and dead stop, was far more dangerous.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:37 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Rectal Pertruder
Off topic sort of, but i bought The History of the WWE/F Championship and i watched Bret vs Owen for the title in the steel cage. That might be one of the best steel cage matches i've ever seen. The technical spots having to do with them diving for the door and trying to climb out were just about flawless and beautiful to watch. Incredible match.
yea, to me, that the best steel cage match of all-time. They used the cage door in a way nobody has ever duplicated. They actually made the door exit seem meaningful.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:38 PM   #9
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Here's the cage match, plus the Bret/Benoit tribute.

I was angry when I saw Sting doing the entrance too. I was actually watching that PVP when it happened, and it was definately surreal. I also remember developing a soft-spot for Jeff Jarret and Debra afterwards. WWE tried to do an interview with them before the match and they were both in absolute tears.

Anyway, RIP Owen.

Edit: In my opinion, this is one of the best promos Bret ever gave. (Not saying alot in my opinion, but at least there was some kind of meaning behind it.)
Als, god I hated Vince as an announcer.



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Old 04-12-2007, 02:39 PM   #10
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Owen Hart is overrated.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:43 PM   #11
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Owen Hart is way overrated.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:51 PM   #12
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I'm not really sure what you mean by 'overrated.' Owen is Owen. He was never 'the' champ. He was mid-card talent at best. He could get around the ring with the best of them, yes, but he was never anything special. (In my opinion)

I just always thought he was thought of and remembred as exactly what he was. However, he did contribute to shows ever time he was on them, and he's had some fantastic matches. (See the cage match posted.)

Better than Bret? That would probably start another flame war.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:57 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 311
I'm not really sure what you mean by 'overrated.' Owen is Owen. He was never 'the' champ. He was mid-card talent at best. He could get around the ring with the best of them, yes, but he was never anything special. (In my opinion)

I just always thought he was thought of and remembred as exactly what he was. However, he did contribute to shows ever time he was on them, and he's had some fantastic matches. (See the cage match posted.)

Better than Bret? That would probably start another flame war.
I'm not saying he sucks, but the way fanboys put him over, he didn't deserve it.

He was never someone that should've been World Champion. He was a career mid-carder through and through.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:01 PM   #14
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Almost always, when I hear someone mention Owen, I always see how he was probably one of the best wrestlers to never hold the world and was one of the best ever.

Like KooS said, he was a great mid-carder and that's where it stops. He NEVER should have been World Champion.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:01 PM   #15
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Owen was going to get the gimmick of "The Game" that eventually went to Triple H. Owen could have been a main event draw, and would have been had he not died. I do not think he was overrated he was fantastic in every way that a wrestler needs to be.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:05 PM   #16
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Yeah, and Eddie was supposed to win the championship the week after he died.

Bull-fucking-shit.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:12 PM   #17
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You can belive what you want, say what you want but I really don't care.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:18 PM   #18
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Actually I heard that The Countdown to the Millenium gimmick was going to be for Owen Hart.

Y....2....H!
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:19 PM   #19
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You can say anything after the fact.

I could say that Macho Man was supposed to do the WM9 run-in, but got injured and couldn't do it.

Doesn't make it true.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:43 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
This is in response to some of the stuff in the various fanboy wars topics and whatnot.

Owen was a big boy. He was a professional wrestler and had to have known the risks inherrent in any stunt, let alone one that involved coming down from the rafters.

I'm not saying that we didn't lose a good guy or anything, but can't we just agree that shit happens sometimes, and accidents are accidents?

Bret Hart has every right to be upset at the loss of his brother, and maybe the spot shouldn't have been done, but it was. And the fact is, it's a relatively safe stunt but there are always risks involved.

I know there are factors involved in terms of the wrestling world, but in the end, he went through with it and he died. And it was terrible, and it was a loss. But it was a mistake, and accident, and nobody should have an axe to grind over this. At least, none of us.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:47 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jordan X
Owen was going to get the gimmick of "The Game" that eventually went to Triple H.
I always laugh whenver I hear this. What "gimmick" is there behind "The Game?" You know how that would have changed HHH's career? His theme song would be different and people wouldn't hold up "Game Over" signs when they wanted him to lose, or "Game Not Over" signs when he returns from an injury. Owen, had he not died, would have been called "The Game" Owen Hart and would have gone on being Owen Hart. I fail to see exactly what "gimmick" goes along with being called "The Game."






Honestly I always thought "The Game" was a dumbass thing to be called anyways.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:48 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xero Limit 126
You can say anything after the fact.

I could say that Macho Man was supposed to do the WM9 run-in, but got injured and couldn't do it.

Doesn't make it true.
Actually it was going to be my dad, but he had to work that night.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:54 PM   #23
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"The Game" gimmick is fairly generic anyway. He's a veteran wrestler who is considered one of the best and usually hangs out with a powerful crowd.

That can be attributed to about 10 high-profile wrestlers.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:54 PM   #24
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coulda woulda shoulda is stupid and I will put no emphasis on it. But I don't see Owen as overated just because a couple of posters on here say he should have been WWF Champ. It's takes more people then TPWW posters to get me to say anybody or anything is overrated.

He was one of the greatest heels in wreslting back in the mid 90's and was a solid IC Champ. He was a solid wrestler and could work anybody. It was retarted that the WWF didn't book Owen/HBK for the Title when Owen returned end of 97. There was money to be made there. Avenging the Harts was the perfect storyline.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:56 PM   #25
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Not just TPWW that thinks of him as a "great".
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:57 PM   #26
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who else? back up your statement if you're going to post that.
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Old 04-12-2007, 03:58 PM   #27
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Owen was definately a solid worker, good mid card talent. And I'll leave it at that.
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Old 04-12-2007, 04:02 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loose Cannon
who else? back up your statement if you're going to post that.
I don't have any links off-hand, but there are forums all over that there is at least a portion that say he deserved the championship. I don't keep every God damn website I visit in my bookmarks.
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Old 04-12-2007, 04:07 PM   #29
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Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Loose Cannon got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
alright, chill out bro. wow.

so, you're saying there are lots of people on message boards who say Owen deserved the championship? Do you know any people in real life that are wrestling fans who think this?
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Old 04-12-2007, 04:09 PM   #30
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All the people I know that like wrestling know and care about the big names and that's about it. Owen never really comes up...
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Old 04-12-2007, 04:44 PM   #31
Theo Dious
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Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
I hear a lot of "Owen was really good, it's a shame he died" stuff, but never the kind of fawning I hear online. He was solid. He was promising. He had a brilliant future ahead of him. But for all we know he might just as easily have gone to WCW after his WWF contract expired, languished in their midcard, and gone to TNA with his buddy Jarrett when it started up.

IF Goldberg didn't kick him in the head first.
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Old 04-12-2007, 04:46 PM   #32
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What year is this?
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Old 04-12-2007, 06:53 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingofOldSchool
I'm not saying he sucks, but the way fanboys put him over, he didn't deserve it.
No, but especially now that he's dead, we have the Kurt Cobain effect. People think he's a genius in the ring because every human is at least a potential necrophiliace.

We love to starfuck, and we love to fuck 'em even more if they lie real still.

Most of Owen's overrating comes from the fact that he's dead. Contrast to Ken Kennedy, or Carlito, or Punk, or Burchill (Before anyone whines at me, I like three of those guys...Doesn't make them any less overrated).

And yes, he's overrated. Even if he's only severely sucked off by the IWC, a large body of them do it. I won't, but I won't pretend that he's treated like an icon by wayyyyy too many people. You know, like Ellen DeGenneress.

No, I'm not saying Ellen is an OWen fan.
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Old 04-12-2007, 07:09 PM   #34
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Well...the haircut...
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Old 04-12-2007, 07:17 PM   #35
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BUT WE SAW HIM ON TV EVERY WEEK, AND I'M SURE THAT EVIL BASTARD VINCE MCMAHON PUSHED HIM OFF!!!!!!!!!!1111111111
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Old 04-12-2007, 07:22 PM   #36
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Well I've never been much of an Owen Hart fanboy.

I didn't care much for him while he was on the roster, but now I kinda wish he was still around, because I know eventually he probably would've made a great heel main eventer.
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Old 04-12-2007, 08:05 PM   #37
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Kurt Cobain effect or not, He was great on the mic, great in the ring, and had amazing charisma. He was an excellent talent, and is a great. Some of you people are freaking idiots.
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Old 04-12-2007, 08:12 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad Company
Kurt Cobain effect or not, He was great on the mic, great in the ring, and had amazing charisma. He was an excellent talent, and is a great. Some of you people are freaking idiots.
OMG WE'RE IDIOTS BECAUSE WE HAVE OPINIONS!11!!1
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Old 04-13-2007, 03:48 AM   #39
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In all honesty, there WAS a time when he could have been a Main Eventer, and it was right after Montreal. "The Black Hart" gimmick SHOULD and god damn do I mean SHOULD have done it for him.

It didn't for 2 reasons, one somewhat understandable, the other not at all.

1. Austin didn't want to work with him again. Sad, to be honest, but it was another freak accident and it almost ended his career. I can understand that.

2. Neither Shawn NOR Hunter wanted to put him over. Pure. And. Utter. Bullshit.

To Say he should have NEVER been a Main Eventer is disingenuous. He had a moment where it would have worked, but it wasn't taken advantage of. In all honesty, I think that when his WWE Contract expired, he would have said to hell with it all and retired altogether.
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Old 04-13-2007, 09:09 AM   #40
Theo Dious
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Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Theo Dious got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vastardikai
2. Neither Shawn NOR Hunter wanted to put him over. Pure. And. Utter. Bullshit.
Not cool, certainly, but no member of the Kliq should have been working with Owen so soon after Montreal.
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