Football Talk 2005-2006 (Soccer) - Page 26

**Team Sheep** · 09-07-2005, 06:49 PM

I think all he means is that they can escape with a 1-0 victory or something after playing poorly on occasions. I'm sure he didn't mean that Bolton play crap every week.

**Wengerland** · 09-07-2005, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team Sheep

I think all he means is that they can escape with a 1-0 victory or something after playing poorly on occasions. I'm sure he didn't mean that Bolton play crap every week.

Actually that was what i meant

i don't see them every week to be fair but whenever i have they've just hoofed it up to Davies and gone from there. I'm sure Allardyce wouldn't have been moaning about Chelsea playing "long pass" if he didn't appreciate that his team were quite direct.

One thing he'd do if he was in charge was instill some passion in the players, personally i believe if they're pulling on the Three Lions then them playing with passion should be a given, but clearly not.

**toxic rooster** · 09-08-2005, 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Astley316

you obviously dont see the whites that much then, sure they can get down and scrappy, but bolton also play some good football,

Are you related to Wengerland somehow?

**Wengerland** · 09-07-2005, 06:42 PM

The Northern Irish fans were immense aswell, some of the best support i've ever heard.

**Danny Electric** · 09-07-2005, 06:48 PM

Wright-Phillips was at least getting behind teh defence and causing them problems.

**Astley316** · 09-07-2005, 06:51 PM

then i apologise if i misunderstood his comment

**Team Sheep** · 09-07-2005, 06:54 PM

I wasn't ripping on you or anything, just saying like.

**Astley316** · 09-07-2005, 07:01 PM

again, i apologise, i just hear so many people at working calling the whites, when they dont see them play, but yeah, like boltons tactics or not, he's got all these players playing there heart out for the reebok faithful everyweek, when all they were orignally viewed as was mercenries, i dont perticualr want to see my team without there manager, but i think he'd do better then any of the other options, but then again this is the fa, and we all know they wont do jack

**Wengerland** · 09-07-2005, 07:02 PM

I don't want to get into an argument about how Bolton play football but that is my opinion, they can play football and like i say, do play it around if Davies doesn't win the aerial challenge but when they played Everton it was horrible to watch and both sides contributed to that.

People could have said Leicester played terrible football when we were in the premiership, even under O'Neill, i'd have accepted that cause i recognise that we weren't pretty to watch then and Adams just plays hoofball.

**Danny Electric** · 09-07-2005, 07:03 PM

What Sam has done at Bolton is amazing.

**Astley316** · 09-07-2005, 07:03 PM

me either, and yeah ill admit against everton we went back to route one, but agains Newcastle the next game, we out played them

**Wengerland** · 09-07-2005, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Astley316

me either, and yeah ill admit against everton we went back to route one, but agains Newcastle the next game, we out played them

That's fair enough and i apologise for generalising if it's not always the case. Whether i have liked the football or not is irrelevent considering the success Big Sam has had at Bolton. I'm not sure whether he'd want the England job with Bolton in Europe though.

I wouldn't want McLaren really, he's on the staff now and it isn't helping and Doink doesn't seem to like him and i read elsewhere that Boro fans preferred Robson's style of football, if not results.

Sod it, just bring back Sir Bobby

**Mr. Monday Morning** · 09-07-2005, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wengerland

Sod it, just bring back Sir Bobby

I said it first

Somebody start a campaign. He'd get half the names wrong and Kieron Dyer wouldn't get much of a look in, but is that so wrong? When was the last time we got to a major semi final before Italia 90 fercrissakes?

**Maluco** · 09-07-2005, 07:56 PM

Just back from the game boys, and I know it must be gutting for you, but is the single greatest moment in any of our supporting lives, crowd was electric and we actually felt we deserved it.

From an objective, Sven has no idea, Lawrie Sanchez outmanouvred him tonight by using our players where they are best at playing, England forced players out of position and quite frankly got out played at times

**Astley316** · 09-07-2005, 07:15 PM

EL TEL!!!!!!

**Wengerland** · 09-07-2005, 07:53 PM

Actually i don't know why i didn't mention him for it earlier, but Martin O'Neill. The England job is by no means a proper full time one so he could look after his wife still and i can't see one of the jobs he was after becoming available in the near future. Not English as such but at least he's British and as good as the main English candidates.

**Ogen** · 09-07-2005, 08:05 PM

I didn't want to go to Germany anyway full of fucking nazis.

**yianni** · 09-08-2005, 01:47 AM

Well we got out of fucking jail hardcore against Kazakhstan last night.

**packt up** · 09-08-2005, 05:05 AM

All those people calling for Svens sacking: don't be so fucking stupid.

1) It would cost SHITLOADS to sack him on his current contract so no go for FA
2) Do you really think sacking the manager with two games to go is going to give the new manager enough time to do anything
3) Although the formation failed spectacularly it also has to be said that all the players yesterday apart from Robinson and Beckham played VERY poorly

I'm not saying he's good but I would say that he is still by far the best available. People forget that it would have been 7 competitive wins in a row if we won last night. And I know its the manner of defeat that is shocking and abysmal but what are the alternatives. It was a historically shambolic result there's no denying that but if we win our next to games and qualify none of you will give a shit.

Till we lose in the quarters and WC again.

**Mr. Monday Morning** · 09-08-2005, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packt up

All those people calling for Svens sacking: don't be so fucking stupid.

1) It would cost SHITLOADS to sack him on his current contract so no go for FA
2) Do you really think sacking the manager with two games to go is going to give the new manager enough time to do anything
3) Although the formation failed spectacularly it also has to be said that all the players yesterday apart from Robinson and Beckham played VERY poorly

I'm not saying he's good but I would say that he is still by far the best available. People forget that it would have been 7 competitive wins in a row if we won last night. And I know its the manner of defeat that is shocking and abysmal but what are the alternatives. It was a historically shambolic result there's no denying that but if we win our next to games and qualify none of you will give a shit.

Till we lose in the quarters and WC again.

I'm not especially calling for his head but

1) Take it out of the player's wages for being so inept

2) This isn't Ron Atkinson coming in with a couple months left to try and avoid relegation, it's the fucking most talented England team in at least 20 years. They shouldn't need much coaching or motivation, just someone to pick the team and get them playing to their strengths. Do you really think there's anyone who would be considered who wouldn't have any idea at all about how to do that?

3) Up to now Robinson playing well has been a given, mostly cause we've been playing sub-standard teams but still. Beckham played well because there was no-one around him all game. If they tried that against, say, Eire, Keane would've (in footballing terms) raped him all night. Also to a certain extent how are Lampard and Gerrard meant to get into the game when he pings the ball over their heads all night?

**packt up** · 09-08-2005, 05:06 AM

Also Bolton do play shit football barring Okocha and Diouf. Shit but effective

**packt up** · 09-08-2005, 07:50 AM

1) lol if that happened that would be great
2) Who do you propose to do this exactly? If its so simple how come Mcclaren hasn't stepped in and sorted it out? International teams don't get much time to train together - if a new person comes in do they even have a friendly to try stuff out? (I don't think they do but I don't really know)
3) Indeed. Beckham I think has been shit for England for ages. Drop him back and he pings em around great but as you said Lampard and Gerrard suffer. The formation is shit no doubt and doesn't help but if Lampard and Gerrard need Beckham to pass to them just to do something in the game then they are playing shite too.

**Mr. Monday Morning** · 09-08-2005, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packt up

2) Who do you propose to do this exactly? If its so simple how come Mcclaren hasn't stepped in and sorted it out? International teams don't get much time to train together - if a new person comes in do they even have a friendly to try stuff out? (I don't think they do but I don't really know)

McLaren's pretty much running the team as it is. Did you see him last night telling Rooney to smile right after he got booked?

Fucking gimp

Hell since I brought his name up why not Ron Atkinson. He could dazzle oppo players with his bling jewellery

**The Mask** · 09-08-2005, 08:12 AM

i didn't think players got paid by the FA for internationals

**packt up** · 09-08-2005, 08:15 AM

I don't think they do I think MMM was just implyin some sort of FA imposed fine or something. *shrug*

**Doink** · 09-08-2005, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packt up

I don't think they do I think MMM was just implyin some sort of FA imposed fine or something. *shrug*

Do you seriously think these players are playing for the good of their country and for an 'england cap' to put with their collection ?

Get real, the FA prob have to pay the clubs to release the players, they defo pay the players and then they will give them win bounes etc on top of that.

The game is too money orientated now-a-days and the players yet again show they dont give a damn, its not like Robson, Butcher, Pearce & Moore are playing anymore, yes they will have recieved a cash bonus for playing but all those guys would bleed for the cause and do anything to make sure England got a result. You name me one player like that now?

Mclaren is not the man for the job, Sven SHOULD be sacked as this will give the new guy time to assess what he has and has the time to pick the side that actually gives a fuck and wants to win. IMO if Sven stays, we will be lucky to get past the group stages, should we even make it that far.

Rooney is a child who really really needs to grow up, so fuck you werent getting the ball and playing out of position. ROONEY you are paid to play football, if the manager puts you in goal, you play there.

**Chavo Classic** · 09-08-2005, 08:16 AM

Embarrassed to be an England football fan. Simple as

**packt up** · 09-08-2005, 10:01 AM

Actually Doink the clubs pay the players wages whenever they are playing internationals. Have you never heard a manager complain something along the lines of "x got injured playing internationals. This is an outrage because we pay his wages!" etc etc.

From the economist:

"But perhaps the biggest example of the anti-commercial impulses that run through the game is the World Cup itself. Football clubs around the world have to lend billions of dollars-worth of talent to their national sides, free of charge. The clubs will pay the players' wages throughout the tournament, and have to accept that their precious stars may return exhausted or even injured."

http://www.economist.com/surveys/sho...issue=20020601

**Doink** · 09-08-2005, 12:22 PM

the players will recieve a financial benifit from playing for their country, the clubs stil pay the wages as the players are on contracts so the club cant stop a payment because the player is on international duty, the only thing a club can do is refuse to release the player.

Do you honestly think that a player is going to travel half way across the world off his own back and play for his country? seriously what is in it for the player unless there is a financial offer for him?

the clubs are pissed off as they run the risk of the player being injured for which they will get no compensation if he is.

**toxic rooster** · 09-08-2005, 12:28 PM

Something about REPRESENTING YOUR COUNTRY perhaps?

**packt up** · 09-08-2005, 12:31 PM

Everyone wants to represent their country I should hope. The reasons for that are personal but I would like to think that everyone just wants to have the honour of putting on an England shirt. Its like when Chris Sutton refused to play for the England B Team the stupid prick. The thing is when playing for your country money shouldn't be the motivating factor. Club football is a totally different thing.

The only financial benefit I can see players getting is some sort of performance bonus like "win the world cup and we'll give you some money". Just playing for their country raises their profile hugely and is enough of a "financial" bonus.

**packt up** · 09-08-2005, 12:31 PM

Or just what Wee Gooner said ^

**Cactus Sid** · 09-08-2005, 01:18 PM

Just thought I'd say

Not a fan of Cristiano Ronaldo, but major props to him for playing despite the death of his father

**packt up** · 09-08-2005, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cactus Sid

Just thought I'd say

Not a fan of Cristiano Ronaldo, but major props to him for playing despite the death of his father

I'll second that. I have to say I hate him probably as much as any player in the world but

**Rob Ban Fan** · 09-08-2005, 01:56 PM

Rio and Ashley Cole need to learn how to play til the whistle.

I fucking hate it when players just stand there with their arm up expecting the lino to flag. Fat boy Unsworth did it and got done by Robbie Fowler and just stood there shouting at the linesman while Fowler crossed for them to score. Fat wanker.

If they had chased Healy back instead of giving him so much time to finish, it might not have happened.

**packt up** · 09-08-2005, 03:10 PM

In fact Doink your talking total shit. If your telling me every single player who plays at the World Cup is doing it for financial reasons and not because they want their country to do well your a fucking head case.

**Doink** · 09-09-2005, 03:57 PM

I agree with everything TL and Rob have said so far!

Quote:

Originally Posted by packt up

In fact Doink your talking total shit. If your telling me every single player who plays at the World Cup is doing it for financial reasons and not because they want their country to do well your a fucking head case.

I'm not saying that money is the only reason they play however it is a factor, IMO all players who play at international level will recieve money for playing from their countrys FA however it is in an indivividuals display as to if they are doing it for the love of their country or not. Look at beckham, there are times when he plays and ou can see it means so much to him that he does everything he can to try and win (ala stu pearce in his day) but then there are times where he looks as tho its a chore to pull on the england shirt. This happens with too many players.

IMO players do recieve money to play for national team however your opinion may differ, i have no problem with that.

Anyway to do what the FA have done and take the heat away from sven and england...... CHELSEA DRUG TEST THEIR OWN PLAYERS !!!!

so fuck, i think this is a good idea as they will find thwe cheats before the fa but not to con the fa, i believe they do it for the good of the game, if they know someone is on drugs from their own tests, they will not play this player until is clean and will sure as hell fine him. The only problem i see with that is that the FA cant ban him for a month (or 10months if he misses a test). The player is unlikly to play anyway so where is the problem.

Chelsea are trying to not cheat there opponents by doing these tests IMO so from me i give a

and believe other clubs should do it aswell.

**Rob** · 09-08-2005, 03:56 PM

Why are the English public after Bobby Robson? He is past it. I respect the hell out of him but the players don't have the professional respect for him now. He lost the dressing room at Newcastle and had no answers to solve their problems. Plus he is miles too old. They need an active coach. Erikkson is a joke. Always has been. Only ever won the championship at Lazio in his career and I could do that if I had £90 million to spend (thus nearly killing the club so nice management skills there too by the way).

Still though, I was rolled over laughing at Ian Wright being close to tears last night

**Danny Electric** · 09-08-2005, 04:12 PM

I agree with Rob.

**Londoner** · 09-08-2005, 05:14 PM

The funny thing is I actually called this a few weeks ago,I think it was in a pm to doink.I said a defeat for england in the qualifiers is right around the corner for us, I based that opinion on our performances in the qualifiers.Last night was no shock to me, well it was abit I guess at first but it was only a matter of time. Sven keeps getting away with lcucy results due to the quality of our squad.It's just aswell we have such a good defence overall because otherwise we would not of got away with the results we have.

For example, we could only beat azaberjian 1-0 i think it was, yet Poland batter them 8-0!Then we hear excuses from Beckham saying 'well every team in europe is orgnaized now'..what aload of crap.Yeah i'm sure getting beat 8-0 is a sign of an organized team!

Then there's the playing players out of position rubbish that Sven does.Look at Andy Johnson, look at Joe cole yesterday, he's also too scared to drop either gerrard/lampard.Them two can not play together, i'm convinced about that.I would drop gerrard as his performances for england haven't been that impressive, imo.

Then there's the not making good sue of friendlies to give young up and coming players a chance rubbish, Sven has made us think that friendlies are rubbish by doing all those subs so that if he loses then he wont get blamed. Well I think that plan has backfired on him.When Downing could've had a proper debut to solve our left side problem, he gave downing like 10 mins or something.He then plays Johnson on the right side of fucking midfield when he's a striker.That's just plain stupidity and it shows me he doesn't care for the future of our countries football.I don't think he cares whether we win the world cup or not either, i'm sure the players do, but Sven isn't doing his part.

We'll struggle a 1-0 win out of Austria, and we'll get a draw in poland, no way will we win both.

09-07-2005, 06:49 PM	#1
Team Sheep T�m Defaid Posts: 6,646	I think all he means is that they can escape with a 1-0 victory or something after playing poorly on occasions. I'm sure he didn't mean that Bolton play crap every week.

09-07-2005, 06:42 PM	#4
Wengerland Theo Zagorakis Posts: 7,148	The Northern Irish fans were immense aswell, some of the best support i've ever heard.

09-07-2005, 06:48 PM	#5
Danny Electric dirty irani Posts: 11,956	Wright-Phillips was at least getting behind teh defence and causing them problems.

09-07-2005, 06:51 PM	#6
Astley316 white army Posts: 516	then i apologise if i misunderstood his comment

09-07-2005, 06:54 PM	#7
Team Sheep T�m Defaid Posts: 6,646	I wasn't ripping on you or anything, just saying like.

09-07-2005, 07:01 PM	#8
Astley316 white army Posts: 516	again, i apologise, i just hear so many people at working calling the whites, when they dont see them play, but yeah, like boltons tactics or not, he's got all these players playing there heart out for the reebok faithful everyweek, when all they were orignally viewed as was mercenries, i dont perticualr want to see my team without there manager, but i think he'd do better then any of the other options, but then again this is the fa, and we all know they wont do jack

09-07-2005, 07:02 PM	#9
Wengerland Theo Zagorakis Posts: 7,148	I don't want to get into an argument about how Bolton play football but that is my opinion, they can play football and like i say, do play it around if Davies doesn't win the aerial challenge but when they played Everton it was horrible to watch and both sides contributed to that. People could have said Leicester played terrible football when we were in the premiership, even under O'Neill, i'd have accepted that cause i recognise that we weren't pretty to watch then and Adams just plays hoofball.

09-07-2005, 07:03 PM	#10
Danny Electric dirty irani Posts: 11,956	What Sam has done at Bolton is amazing.

09-07-2005, 07:56 PM	#14
Maluco Reigning Tipsters Champ! Posts: 2,088	Just back from the game boys, and I know it must be gutting for you, but is the single greatest moment in any of our supporting lives, crowd was electric and we actually felt we deserved it. From an objective, Sven has no idea, Lawrie Sanchez outmanouvred him tonight by using our players where they are best at playing, England forced players out of position and quite frankly got out played at times

09-07-2005, 07:15 PM	#15
Astley316 white army Posts: 516	EL TEL!!!!!!

09-07-2005, 07:53 PM	#16
Wengerland Theo Zagorakis Posts: 7,148	Actually i don't know why i didn't mention him for it earlier, but Martin O'Neill. The England job is by no means a proper full time one so he could look after his wife still and i can't see one of the jobs he was after becoming available in the near future. Not English as such but at least he's British and as good as the main English candidates.

09-07-2005, 08:05 PM	#17
Ogen Posts: 16,220	I didn't want to go to Germany anyway full of fucking nazis.

09-08-2005, 01:47 AM	#18
yianni FOC Posts: 18,042	Well we got out of fucking jail hardcore against Kazakhstan last night.

09-08-2005, 05:05 AM	#19
packt up Posts: 3,460	All those people calling for Svens sacking: don't be so fucking stupid. 1) It would cost SHITLOADS to sack him on his current contract so no go for FA 2) Do you really think sacking the manager with two games to go is going to give the new manager enough time to do anything 3) Although the formation failed spectacularly it also has to be said that all the players yesterday apart from Robinson and Beckham played VERY poorly I'm not saying he's good but I would say that he is still by far the best available. People forget that it would have been 7 competitive wins in a row if we won last night. And I know its the manner of defeat that is shocking and abysmal but what are the alternatives. It was a historically shambolic result there's no denying that but if we win our next to games and qualify none of you will give a shit. Till we lose in the quarters and WC again.

09-08-2005, 05:06 AM	#21
packt up Posts: 3,460	Also Bolton do play shit football barring Okocha and Diouf. Shit but effective

09-08-2005, 07:50 AM	#22
packt up Posts: 3,460	1) lol if that happened that would be great 2) Who do you propose to do this exactly? If its so simple how come Mcclaren hasn't stepped in and sorted it out? International teams don't get much time to train together - if a new person comes in do they even have a friendly to try stuff out? (I don't think they do but I don't really know) 3) Indeed. Beckham I think has been shit for England for ages. Drop him back and he pings em around great but as you said Lampard and Gerrard suffer. The formation is shit no doubt and doesn't help but if Lampard and Gerrard need Beckham to pass to them just to do something in the game then they are playing shite too.

09-08-2005, 08:12 AM	#24
The Mask That Entenbrot, The Mask Posts: 56,852	i didn't think players got paid by the FA for internationals

09-08-2005, 08:15 AM	#25
packt up Posts: 3,460	I don't think they do I think MMM was just implyin some sort of FA imposed fine or something. shrug

09-08-2005, 08:16 AM	#27
Chavo Classic The Great Pink Hope Posts: 8,817	Embarrassed to be an England football fan. Simple as

09-08-2005, 10:01 AM	#28
packt up Posts: 3,460	Actually Doink the clubs pay the players wages whenever they are playing internationals. Have you never heard a manager complain something along the lines of "x got injured playing internationals. This is an outrage because we pay his wages!" etc etc. From the economist: "But perhaps the biggest example of the anti-commercial impulses that run through the game is the World Cup itself. Football clubs around the world have to lend billions of dollars-worth of talent to their national sides, free of charge. The clubs will pay the players' wages throughout the tournament, and have to accept that their precious stars may return exhausted or even injured." http://www.economist.com/surveys/sho...issue=20020601

09-08-2005, 12:22 PM	#29
Doink Posts: 1,434	the players will recieve a financial benifit from playing for their country, the clubs stil pay the wages as the players are on contracts so the club cant stop a payment because the player is on international duty, the only thing a club can do is refuse to release the player. Do you honestly think that a player is going to travel half way across the world off his own back and play for his country? seriously what is in it for the player unless there is a financial offer for him? the clubs are pissed off as they run the risk of the player being injured for which they will get no compensation if he is.

09-08-2005, 12:28 PM	#30
toxic rooster adjective noun Posts: 30,419	Something about REPRESENTING YOUR COUNTRY perhaps?

09-08-2005, 12:31 PM	#31
packt up Posts: 3,460	Everyone wants to represent their country I should hope. The reasons for that are personal but I would like to think that everyone just wants to have the honour of putting on an England shirt. Its like when Chris Sutton refused to play for the England B Team the stupid prick. The thing is when playing for your country money shouldn't be the motivating factor. Club football is a totally different thing. The only financial benefit I can see players getting is some sort of performance bonus like "win the world cup and we'll give you some money". Just playing for their country raises their profile hugely and is enough of a "financial" bonus.

09-08-2005, 01:18 PM	#33
Cactus Sid Smashing Blouse Posts: 7,800	Just thought I'd say Not a fan of Cristiano Ronaldo, but major props to him for playing despite the death of his father

09-08-2005, 01:56 PM	#35
Rob Ban Fan Rt Hon Ed Balls MP Posts: 9,004	Rio and Ashley Cole need to learn how to play til the whistle. I fucking hate it when players just stand there with their arm up expecting the lino to flag. Fat boy Unsworth did it and got done by Robbie Fowler and just stood there shouting at the linesman while Fowler crossed for them to score. Fat wanker. If they had chased Healy back instead of giving him so much time to finish, it might not have happened.

09-08-2005, 03:10 PM	#36
packt up Posts: 3,460	In fact Doink your talking total shit. If your telling me every single player who plays at the World Cup is doing it for financial reasons and not because they want their country to do well your a fucking head case.

09-08-2005, 03:56 PM	#38
Rob Part time poster Posts: 22,963	Why are the English public after Bobby Robson? He is past it. I respect the hell out of him but the players don't have the professional respect for him now. He lost the dressing room at Newcastle and had no answers to solve their problems. Plus he is miles too old. They need an active coach. Erikkson is a joke. Always has been. Only ever won the championship at Lazio in his career and I could do that if I had £90 million to spend (thus nearly killing the club so nice management skills there too by the way). Still though, I was rolled over laughing at Ian Wright being close to tears last night

09-08-2005, 04:12 PM	#39
Danny Electric dirty irani Posts: 11,956	I agree with Rob.

09-08-2005, 05:14 PM	#40
Londoner One Of A Kind Posts: 22,178	The funny thing is I actually called this a few weeks ago,I think it was in a pm to doink.I said a defeat for england in the qualifiers is right around the corner for us, I based that opinion on our performances in the qualifiers.Last night was no shock to me, well it was abit I guess at first but it was only a matter of time. Sven keeps getting away with lcucy results due to the quality of our squad.It's just aswell we have such a good defence overall because otherwise we would not of got away with the results we have. For example, we could only beat azaberjian 1-0 i think it was, yet Poland batter them 8-0!Then we hear excuses from Beckham saying 'well every team in europe is orgnaized now'..what aload of crap.Yeah i'm sure getting beat 8-0 is a sign of an organized team! Then there's the playing players out of position rubbish that Sven does.Look at Andy Johnson, look at Joe cole yesterday, he's also too scared to drop either gerrard/lampard.Them two can not play together, i'm convinced about that.I would drop gerrard as his performances for england haven't been that impressive, imo. Then there's the not making good sue of friendlies to give young up and coming players a chance rubbish, Sven has made us think that friendlies are rubbish by doing all those subs so that if he loses then he wont get blamed. Well I think that plan has backfired on him.When Downing could've had a proper debut to solve our left side problem, he gave downing like 10 mins or something.He then plays Johnson on the right side of fucking midfield when he's a striker.That's just plain stupidity and it shows me he doesn't care for the future of our countries football.I don't think he cares whether we win the world cup or not either, i'm sure the players do, but Sven isn't doing his part. We'll struggle a 1-0 win out of Austria, and we'll get a draw in poland, no way will we win both.