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Reload this Page Ermaximus & KyleEmmott Present the 11/19/12 Raw Thread: It's a Punk Party and RYBACK made 3 new friends!
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:03 AM   #361
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supreme Olajuwon View Post
Right and American Cena on Raw had a 5 star match with Punk

WONDERFUL!
Cena did a good job during that match but it was about Punk and the crowd.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:06 AM   #362
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I also wish they let Punk win cleanly on PPV. When was the last time that happened, Summerslam? Heels are allowed to win cleanly. Ask Dolph Ziggler. We can already see some stupid TLC match between Punk and Ryback with Punk retaning when the popcorn guy goes "rogue" and takes out Ryback. It's just dumb. Have Punk go over cleanly.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:10 AM   #363
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You want Punk to go over Ryback cleanly?

That wouldn't exactly do wonders for putting a face over. Punk isn't that type of heel. He should get clean wins and not lose so much on free TV. But he shouldn't be put cleanly over Ryback.

Big Show beating Sheamus for that title... THAT was incredible booking from a heel going over cleanly standpoint. Show looked like a monster and Sheamus looked like a monster who just couldn't quite get the job done.

Punk is not a monster and doesn't need to be booked as such. Strong, yes. Beating Ryback clean, no.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:12 AM   #364
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I'm all for Punk facing midcarders on Raw every week though, making some of them look like they can actually kinda compete on his level before he ends up getting the win clean though.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:15 AM   #365
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My thoughts on heel champions looking strong is this: if Ric Flair did it, it's ok.




AND RIC FLAIR DONT WIN CLEAN, BEACHES
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:17 AM   #366
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob11 View Post
I also wish they let Punk win cleanly on PPV. When was the last time that happened, Summerslam? Heels are allowed to win cleanly. Ask Dolph Ziggler. We can already see some stupid TLC match between Punk and Ryback with Punk retaning when the popcorn guy goes "rogue" and takes out Ryback. It's just dumb. Have Punk go over cleanly.
He has been champion for a year and done mostly clean wins until they amped up his heel run. They are going to build it to where people will be foaming at the mouth to see Punk lose. It's wrestling 101.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:19 AM   #367
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
You want Punk to go over Ryback cleanly?

That wouldn't exactly do wonders for putting a face over. Punk isn't that type of heel. He should get clean wins and not lose so much on free TV. But he shouldn't be put cleanly over Ryback.

Big Show beating Sheamus for that title... THAT was incredible booking from a heel going over cleanly standpoint. Show looked like a monster and Sheamus looked like a monster who just couldn't quite get the job done.

Punk is not a monster and doesn't need to be booked as such. Strong, yes. Beating Ryback clean, no.
Sheamus/Show impressed me at HIAC and the match Sunday Night was not bad either. They have some good chemistry. I can't argue agains that.
So another PPV with Punk retaining by a rogue security guard. Is this what it's going to be until WM? Punk beats The Rock by Lesnar interference I assume. Go over at HIAC by a rogue ring worker setting up his WM match with...who, Cena? Since it's in the NYC area Cena will be booed out of the building. Who else? Ryback? ehh, Sheamus? he's on SD. Punk is so far head and shoulders above any of his rivals on the Mic, and in the ring that it just gets me to DVR Raw and only watch a couple solid mid card matches and anthing Punk. The Vickie/Ziggler/AJ/Cena storyline is painful to watch.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:21 AM   #368
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Would be nice if next week Punk wore the "Macho" colors as an homage for passing Macho's reign and then Heyman/Punk make some wise remark involving him to get some cheap heat.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:22 AM   #369
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Steele View Post
He has been champion for a year and done mostly clean wins until they amped up his heel run. They are going to build it to where people will be foaming at the mouth to see Punk lose. It's wrestling 101.
I just wish he would have a clean win or two but whatever. Okay, so people are foaming at the mouth to see Punk lose, but to whom? The Rock who only shows up a couple times a year? Cena? They need to build someone up to be the guy. I don't think Ryback beating Cena for the title is going to do much. Once again, who is the guy right now who the crowd is 100% behind?
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:22 AM   #370
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob11 View Post
Sheamus/Show impressed me at HIAC and the match Sunday Night was not bad either. They have some good chemistry. I can't argue agains that.
So another PPV with Punk retaining by a rogue security guard. Is this what it's going to be until WM? Punk beats The Rock by Lesnar interference I assume. Go over at HIAC by a rogue ring worker setting up his WM match with...who, Cena? Since it's in the NYC area Cena will be booed out of the building. Who else? Ryback? ehh, Sheamus? he's on SD. Punk is so far head and shoulders above any of his rivals on the Mic, and in the ring that it just gets me to DVR Raw and only watch a couple solid mid card matches and anthing Punk. The Vickie/Ziggler/AJ/Cena storyline is painful to watch.
You are assuming a lot of things and getting riled up about what you think will happen over the next 6 months just because of 2 logical PPV finishes?
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:22 AM   #371
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smelly Meatball View Post
Would be nice if next week Punk wore the "Macho" colors as an homage for passing Macho's reign and then Heyman/Punk make some wise remark involving him to get some cheap heat.
That would be pretty awesome.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:24 AM   #372
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob11 View Post
I just wish he would have a clean win or two but whatever. Okay, so people are foaming at the mouth to see Punk lose, but to whom? The Rock who only shows up a couple times a year? Cena? They need to build someone up to be the guy. I don't think Ryback beating Cena for the title is going to do much. Once again, who is the guy right now who the crowd is 100% behind?
That is why they are building up his heat. FFS...
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:25 AM   #373
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Steele View Post
You are assuming a lot of things and getting riled up about what you think will happen over the next 6 months just because of 2 logical PPV finishes?
You mean 3. I can see Vince saying no interference by any WWE employee at TLC, then the rogue popcorn vendor.
My main point stands. You see it your way, I see it my way. No point in arguing.
While I'm talking with you, can you please unban me from the stream? I did nothing to deserve it.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:26 AM   #374
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supreme Olajuwon View Post
My thoughts on heel champions looking strong is this: if Ric Flair did it, it's ok.




AND RIC FLAIR DONT WIN CLEAN, BEACHES
Tell that to Ricky Steamboat.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:26 AM   #375
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You've got to have a hot heel in order to make a hot babyface.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:27 AM   #376
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It takes one of those once in a generation (or two) guys to just get over huge as babyfaces on their own.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:28 AM   #377
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Quote:
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That is why they are building up his heat. FFS...
Punk has white hot heat right now. I think I've gone off point a bit. I just don't see Ryback as "The Guy."
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:28 AM   #378
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Even then, they still need a heel to go against.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:29 AM   #379
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Quote:
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Punk has white hot heat right now. I think I've gone off point a bit. I just don't see Ryback as "The Guy."
He has only been around for a few months in a role other than squash matches.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:30 AM   #380
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob11 View Post
Sheamus/Show impressed me at HIAC and the match Sunday Night was not bad either. They have some good chemistry. I can't argue agains that.
So another PPV with Punk retaining by a rogue security guard. Is this what it's going to be until WM?
Until Royal Rumble... yes, probably. They've kinda cornered themselves to where it's gotta be Ryback vs Punk at TLC and it will be a TLC match meaning Ryback doesn't have to get pinned to lose again. Really no way Punk loses though as to set up Rock vs Punk at the Rumble so it's likely to be another "rogue security guard" type finish as you called it. I'd go as far as to say the TLC thing is much more than just random speculation.

Everything you've booked after that is completely random speculation. I can totally see Rock beating Punk at the Rumble and I wouldn't be too surprised if Punk somehow retained via some crazy finish/run-in.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:30 AM   #381
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Quote:
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You've got to have a hot heel in order to make a hot babyface.
I continue to agree. Punk is the hot heel. I think it's someone who isn't currently involved in this angle who could be "The guy."
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:31 AM   #382
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
Until Royal Rumble... yes, probably. They've kinda cornered themselves to where it's gotta be Ryback vs Punk at TLC and it will be a TLC match meaning Ryback doesn't have to get pinned to lose again. Really no way Punk loses though as to set up Rock vs Punk at the Rumble. I'd go as far as to say the TLC thing is much more than just random speculation.

Everything you've booked after that is completely random speculation. I can totally see Rock beating Punk at the Rumble and I wouldn't be too surprised if Punk somehow retained via some crazy finish/run-in.
I just see Rock going for a people's elbow when Lesnar runs in, F5, Punk retains. NO DQ match of course. Sets up their WM match.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:33 AM   #383
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He has only been around for a few months in a role other than squash matches.
Even Goldberg won the US title from Raven to get more over. It seemed like one week Ryback was squashing two jobbers on SD, the next he's in the main event at HIAC. We have to assume The NXT guys and Brad Maddox going to be Punk's security.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:35 AM   #384
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And it was a shitload more intriguing of a main event than WWE had put on in a long time.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:37 AM   #385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob11 View Post
Even Goldberg won the US title from Raven to get more over. It seemed like one week Ryback was squashing two jobbers on SD, the next he's in the main event at HIAC. We have to assume The NXT guys and Brad Maddox going to be Punk's security.
He got a huge reaction with the big stars. You've said yourself WWE needs big stars, so why not test the waters with him. It isn't like WWE put the strap on him.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:37 AM   #386
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Quote:
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And it was a shitload more intriguing of a main event than WWE had put on in a long time.
What, waiting to see who ran in to save Punk. I was surpised it was the ref but still...
So you support Ryback becoming "The guy" in WWE. I don't at least as of yet. I think this is one of those cliche and cheesy "agree to disagree" type of deals.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:40 AM   #387
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I do support Ryback's push but regardless...

The whole intrigue of that match was that whoever wins it's going to be a huge deal. You don't get that often anymore. It was a "big fight feel" because of it. And the fact that it was in the cell made the whole idea of someone interfering more tricky.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:40 AM   #388
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What, waiting to see who ran in to save Punk. I was surpised it was the ref but still...
So you support Ryback becoming "The guy" in WWE. I don't at least as of yet. I think this is one of those cliche and cheesy "agree to disagree" type of deals.
There was a very real possibility they put the belt on him.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:40 AM   #389
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He got a huge reaction with the big stars. You've said yourself WWE needs big stars, so why not test the waters with him. It isn't like WWE put the strap on him.
Yes, but I wish they would have him feud with upper end heels that weren't the top heel to see instead of this. They need the guy who every week when his music plays the arena errupts. I think it speaks to their lack of depth more than anything. Come on James, let me back in. What did I do?
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:41 AM   #390
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And yeah, Ryback has stood in the ring with CM Punk and had an entire crowd chanting his catchphrase. It's not like they're just forcing him on people.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:42 AM   #391
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob11 View Post
Yes, but I wish they would have him feud with upper end heels that weren't the top heel to see instead of this. They need the guy who every week when his music plays the arena errupts. I think it speaks to their lack of depth more than anything. Come on James, let me back in. What did I do?
You are complaining about WWE trying to create a new star just because they aren't doing it the way you would like despite you clearly saying they need new stars.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:43 AM   #392
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Yes, but I wish they would have him feud with upper end heels that weren't the top heel to see instead of this. They need the guy who every week when his music plays the arena errupts. I think it speaks to their lack of depth more than anything. Come on James, let me back in. What did I do?
They probably planned on doing just that until Cena got injured and they had to rush Ryback into the picture because, like you said, they didn't have a guy who could step in and make a main event feeling match and Ryback was the fresh face who could do it.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:45 AM   #393
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Ryback stood in the middle of the ring with John Cena and CM Punk - the hottest superstars of the past decade and not only held his own with the crowd, but was taking in majority of the crowd.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:48 AM   #394
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There was a very real possibility they put the belt on him.
Punk is going to get to number 6 over Cena and seeing that may have made Heyman legit emotional. He may have not been in the back smoking a joint with Van Dam as he likes to say. Once he gets to 6 that's it. I doubt they will hold it on him for 3 years like number 5 aka Morales. I just didn't see that possibility. I do like the concept that anyone can win the title which is why I loved Punk's first cashing in of the MITB. Can't argue that.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:51 AM   #395
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You are complaining about WWE trying to create a new star just because they aren't doing it the way you would like despite you clearly saying they need new stars.
I just think it's too fast which they have a history of doing. That Sac crowd helped Ryback when he first clothleslined Punk. Crowds themselves are a different subject for a different day. No matter how great the preformers are, dead crowds just kill any buzz.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:54 AM   #396
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I just think it's too fast which they have a history of doing. That Sac crowd helped Ryback when he first clothleslined Punk. Crowds themselves are a different subject for a different day. No matter how great the preformers are, dead crowds just kill any buzz.
If it was Chicago, NYC, or Philly, or some other well known smark hotbed I'd see your point but Sacramento and multiple crowds have gone bonkers over Ryback.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:54 AM   #397
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As I think, it's also hard because of dead crowds to get someone over. I'm willing to give this is a chance. I just hope my fears don't verify.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:55 AM   #398
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If crowds and such aren't your barometer for how over a guy is...then what the fuck is?
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:57 AM   #399
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If it was Chicago, NYC, or Boston, or some other well known smark hotbed I'd see your point but Sacramento and multiple crowds have gone bonkers over Ryback.
Sac has a history of being a decent crowd. It was discussed in that Raw thread. Maybe I'm just waiting to hear a pop that simply is never going to be there. I'm thinking of going to Raw next month since it's coming here.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:59 AM   #400
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As I think, it's also hard because of dead crowds to get someone over. I'm willing to give this is a chance. I just hope my fears don't verify.
Crowds will never be like they were during the Attitude Era because of the amount of kids and parents who won't act like belligerent drunken hooligans. Crowds will also never be like the 80s because kayfabe is dead. The modern crowd is still excitable, but when any crowd outside of your go-to hot wrestling markets react to a star like they did with Ryback then you know you have something special.
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