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Old 11-09-2015, 11:46 PM   #401
The CyNick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark One View Post


You've got your opinion and probably wouldn't be convinced even if an internal memo leaked. I've got mine because I'm calloused and suspicious. Cool.

Congrats on the gimmick. Real great contribution to the thread.
Congrats on the self loathing wrestling fan gimmick
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Old 11-10-2015, 12:08 AM   #402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
Taker and Kane needed to get heat back. They are building to a match at Survivor Series.

Crowd who paid tickets to see the show seemed to be going apeshit.

Buuuuut IWC scoffs therefore it is crap.
No doubt it is a massive crowd pleaser, but if it was teased longer, the climax would have been so much the "bigger moment" and the crowd would have gone even more banana.
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Old 11-10-2015, 12:09 AM   #403
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And that's all I have to say about that.

Not engaging any further because I like peace and harmony.
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Old 11-10-2015, 01:34 AM   #404
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I've only read these last 3 posts so far and haven't watched Raw and I can already tell this thread is going to be hilarious to go through.
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Old 11-10-2015, 01:50 AM   #405
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
Taker and Kane needed to get heat back. They are building to a match at Survivor Series.

Crowd who paid tickets to see the show seemed to be going apeshit.

Buuuuut IWC scoffs therefore it is crap.
That second line is EXACTLY why I always said Santino should have won the world title from Daniel Bryan at Elimination Chamber in 2012!!! Because the live crowd that night were begging for it and would have gone apeshit if it happened! And that's all that matters!

Thank you for justifying that point, CyNick!!!
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Old 11-10-2015, 02:47 AM   #406
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Why are they still taker and kane? Bray stole their powers.

Taker should have come out on a bike to Rollin' with Isaac Yankem riding on the back.
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Old 11-10-2015, 02:59 AM   #407
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He's a liar.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:01 AM   #408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
All the more reason. A man without a soul is cold.
There's no such thing as a soul

Bray is a bit more complex than just being a heel.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:05 AM   #409
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Wayne Rooney? The fuck?
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Old 11-10-2015, 08:02 AM   #410
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Barrett having to sell the fuck out of that weak-ass slap.
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Old 11-10-2015, 09:19 AM   #411
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
That second line is EXACTLY why I always said Santino should have won the world title from Daniel Bryan at Elimination Chamber in 2012!!! Because the live crowd that night were begging for it and would have gone apeshit if it happened! And that's all that matters!

Thank you for justifying that point, CyNick!!!
Its okay context isn't important. Taker or Santino. Pretty much a coin flip, eh?
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Old 11-10-2015, 11:11 AM   #412
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Old 11-10-2015, 02:09 PM   #413
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
Its okay context isn't important. Taker or Santino. Pretty much a coin flip, eh?
Are you implying there is a context where making the live crowd go apeshit might not be as important as the big picture?
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Old 11-10-2015, 02:14 PM   #414
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
Are you implying there is a context where making the live crowd go apeshit might not be as important as the big picture?
I'm saying a pop that a guy like Santino gets isn't the same as the pop a money player like Taker gets.

I don't think you understand the difference. At least not based on the fact that you compared the two in a previous response.
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Old 11-10-2015, 02:58 PM   #415
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I don't think you're capable of answering a question. So I'll take that as a "Yes. Sometimes the pop of the live crowd isn't worth blowing things in the long run."
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:02 PM   #416
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I don't care who the pieces in the specific comparison are. It's irrelevant. The pop Santino would have gotten that night would have been bigger than the pop Taker got last night. It would have been a much more memorable moment as well. I'm sorry you can only grasp "One guy big star! One guy not big star! Does not compare!"

But they didn't do it because a one night pop wasn't worth shitting on a story long-term.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:05 PM   #417
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Any live crowd is going to pop anytime the Undertaker shows up, doesn't mean its the right choice. I mean Bray Wyatt gets over on his promos alone and then with a video package unravel everything Bray has said since HITC. They should have kneeled at the feet of Wyatt and brought the apocalypse.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:20 PM   #418
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smelly Meatball View Post
This is glorious. These two are a couple in real life, right?

Can imagine Ambrose just making this up as he goes along, has no idea what he's saying but just going with it.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:28 PM   #419
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
I don't think you're capable of answering a question. So I'll take that as a "Yes. Sometimes the pop of the live crowd isn't worth blowing things in the long run."
What did they blow on Monday?

Should we expect to see a huge dip in network subs following Mondays show?
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:30 PM   #420
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
I don't care who the pieces in the specific comparison are. It's irrelevant. The pop Santino would have gotten that night would have been bigger than the pop Taker got last night. It would have been a much more memorable moment as well. I'm sorry you can only grasp "One guy big star! One guy not big star! Does not compare!"

But they didn't do it because a one night pop wasn't worth shitting on a story long-term.
Nothing changed in the storyline based on what happened. Was always leading to a match with Taker and Kane at SurvSer. That's still the plan. Maybe you missed all the promos about 25yrs of Undertaker.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:33 PM   #421
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Simple Fan View Post
Any live crowd is going to pop anytime the Undertaker shows up, doesn't mean its the right choice. I mean Bray Wyatt gets over on his promos alone and then with a video package unravel everything Bray has said since HITC. They should have kneeled at the feet of Wyatt and brought the apocalypse.
That would be an illogical angle for Taker but okay. Like I said above, it doesnt fit with the advertising they have been doing for weeks related to SurvSer and Taker. This thing was always going to lead to SurvSer. How do you advertise Taker on that show and have him do what? Hold Bray's lantern?

You still can't grasp that heels boast and lie, eh?
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:35 PM   #422
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Santino should not have won the rumble nor should he have won the title at EC.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:41 PM   #423
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Stop that. You know Bray is not a regular heel. He has to be believable to get over, now he doesent eat souls and he's scared to death of Taker and Kane. They could have Wyatt being this all powerful heel and carrying on the supernatural gimmick instead they make him look weak. If Taker and Kane win at Survivor Series it will be a joke, and they might as well repackage Bray if they aren't going to take his character serious.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:49 PM   #424
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Quote:
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Stop that. You know Bray is not a regular heel. He has to be believable to get over, now he doesent eat souls and he's scared to death of Taker and Kane. They could have Wyatt being this all powerful heel and carrying on the supernatural gimmick instead they make him look weak. If Taker and Kane win at Survivor Series it will be a joke, and they might as well repackage Bray if they aren't going to take his character serious.
I don't think he's different than any other heel. He lies, cheats, and steals.

I didn't see Bray as being cowardly. He fought and got put down. Now he'll be back next week for the next round and spin some yarn about how he's in Taker and Kane's head. Maybe plays off the times Kane has turned on Taker. It's all part of the ebb and flow of an angle.

I would expect The Wyatts to lose at Survivor Series. It's more important right now for Taker to be strong, especially if he's working John at Mania. Maybe Bray escapes from being pinned and he has a one on one with Taker at TLC or Rumble.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:54 PM   #425
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
That would be an illogical angle for Taker but okay. Like I said above, it doesnt fit with the advertising they have been doing for weeks related to SurvSer and Taker. This thing was always going to lead to SurvSer. How do you advertise Taker on that show and have him do what? Hold Bray's lantern?

You still can't grasp that heels boast and lie, eh?
I don't even know what you two are arguing about but I get the basic idea of the story line from reading these comments.

No one's saying that heels can't, don't or shouldn't boast and lie as you claim Bray has been doing, or be chickenshits, a la Seth's recent run.

That can't be all that the heels do though, otherwise every heel virtually seems the same, and there's no long term drama or consequences for the faces. Unfortunately, that seems to be the only way WWE can write a heel character these days. Either that or WWE's forgotten faces can appear vulnerable a lot of the times for storytelling purposes. Hell, maybe it's both.

You can have heels that do more than boast and lie or play the chickenshit character. It used to be commonplace actually.

From what I gather is going on now and where I remember Bray's character from when I've stopped watching, the problem is Bray's character has been doing the same thing for ages and hasn't addressed your theory of what's going on in storyline. So Bray and the storylines don't make any sense and always ends up going nowhere.
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:57 PM   #426
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He doesn't steal, he almost stole some souls but WWE screwed that up. He was acting scared when Taker and Kane entered, were you not watching? Your probably right about Taker and Kane going over which is dumb and does nothing for Wyatt.
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Old 11-10-2015, 04:02 PM   #427
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If Bray is dominant over top guys he will be turned babyface by the crowd. There was a time there where fans were doing sing along with him. That's not supposed to be the reaction a heel gets. It will be easy one day to turn him face, because a good portion of the crowd is into his gimmick.

When he does turn face them he can cut through the roster like a hot knife through butter. Until then he should be jumping guys when the numbers are in his favor, talk up how guys are in his spell and then get his cumuppance. Booking 101.

If over two years his big loses are to Cena, Reigns, and Taker, he's in a great spot. But people here like to exaggerate.
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Old 11-10-2015, 04:08 PM   #428
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He doesn't steal, he almost stole some souls but WWE screwed that up. He was acting scared when Taker and Kane entered, were you not watching? Your probably right about Taker and Kane going over which is dumb and does nothing for Wyatt.
I don't think you watched. If he was scared, he would have powdered and let his henchmen take the beating while he watched. He tried to fight, he just got beat up because it was more of a fair fight. Classic heel stuff.

This program isn't about Bray though. This is what is difficult with you people. The program is about celebrating Taker's 25 years in the WWE. It's about selling Undertaker week on WWE Network, It's about Taker making a rare appearance at the event he debuted. It's about heating him back up for a high profile match against whoever it is in front of 100k people in his home state in what could be his last match. Bray can lose this program, go into something with a guy like Randy Orton and get his heat back. Or maybe he turns babyface soon. Lots of options. But he's not going to be a difference maker in the next 6 months. Taker will be.
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Old 11-10-2015, 04:13 PM   #429
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Your funny, just because the dude wins he's a face? No if he beats the right people the fans still hate him. Brays good enough on the mic to draw heat from a crowd even if they sing along. He has them in the palm of his hand just like the rest of the Wyatt family. The character has a lot of potential as a heel but WWE doesn't want to pull the trigger. Also by having Taker and Kane under his command it draws heat because he is keeping them from the fans. That's the problem with WWE they go by the book and are afraid to step outside the box and produce.
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Old 11-10-2015, 04:15 PM   #430
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I don't think you watched. If he was scared, he would have powdered and let his henchmen take the beating while he watched. He tried to fight, he just got beat up because it was more of a fair fight. Classic heel stuff.
Fair fight it was 4 on 2 and the 2 won. Made the 4 look real weak.
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Old 11-10-2015, 04:48 PM   #431
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Your funny, just because the dude wins he's a face? No if he beats the right people the fans still hate him. Brays good enough on the mic to draw heat from a crowd even if they sing along. He has them in the palm of his hand just like the rest of the Wyatt family. The character has a lot of potential as a heel but WWE doesn't want to pull the trigger. Also by having Taker and Kane under his command it draws heat because he is keeping them from the fans. That's the problem with WWE they go by the book and are afraid to step outside the box and produce.
So you just want the Daniel Bryan angle again. Only this time is fo real!!!!

Awesome way to build up Undertaker week by making him look like a weak minded sheep. He's on par with Erik Rowan. Perfect!
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Old 11-10-2015, 04:51 PM   #432
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Fair fight it was 4 on 2 and the 2 won. Made the 4 look real weak.
Babyfaces overcome odds. Never seen that before.

I know when I watch Batman, if he cleans house on the villain and some henchmen I immediately tweet out #stoooooopid #batmansuckscantwaitforthesequel #pushthejoker #ihaventwatchedbatmansincekeaton
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Old 11-10-2015, 04:56 PM   #433
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You amaze me. Never said anything about Taker being Rowan. He could have been used by Bray to wreak havoc on WWE. Taker could still play heel and have a "Undertaker week". If Roman Reigns can be a face and be booed, Undertaker can play heel and get cheered.
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Old 11-10-2015, 05:05 PM   #434
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Babyfaces overcome odds. Never seen that before.

I know when I watch Batman, if he cleans house on the villain and some henchmen I mmediately tweet out #stoooooopid #batmansuckscantwaitforthesequel #pushthejoker #ihaventwatchedbatmansincekeaton
If Bray Wyatt was a Batman villian he would have taken Batmans soul and wrecked Gotham. Batman would have been looking for his soul found it and then kicked Brays ass.

WWE made Wyatt talk about being a soul keeper and even gave him powers and then the next scene Taker and Kane are magically back with no explanation or even hint that their souls were even gone to begin with.
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Old 11-10-2015, 07:44 PM   #435
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I enjoyed RAW this week. Some head-scratching annoyances, but overall a better show than anything they have put on in months and months.

* The tournament brackets were what I expected. I know some are confused as to how some guys got in there, but a lot of people who wanted Finn Balor in the tournament are complaining that Tyler Breeze got in without ever having wrestled a RAW match. Um...

* The Triple H/Roman Reigns shit made sense. I'm thinking Reigns does turn heel. Lol at people booing Roman Reigns not turning heel. Hopefully Vince gets the message soon.

* I couldn't put myself through Show/Reigns. Not because it sucks, per se -- but I just value my time a little bit more than that. And that's coming from me. It made sense in terms of match choice and placement, but that's the sort of product the WWE delivers now -- they actually back themselves into a corner where they have to serve up shit that CyNick sheepishly defends.

* Kevin Owens came off as a star here. Titus O'Neil was trying really hard. Titus keeps his cool when a crowd doesn't care about him. Played to them well. Owens probably should have lost because he is the IC Champion, and you should always have your champion lose non-title matches, but I guess they wanted some shock factor on the show or something.

* Paige cut a pretty good backstage promo with some edge. Becky seemed more connected to the audience tonight. They had a good match. Becky winning makes sense, because you should always have your #1 Contender lose. Maybe they go with a Triple Threat at Survivor Series? If not, even better. Why put the top two women in a division against each other?

* The best thing about Natalya/Naomi was Nattie's attire. Didn't get much time and you can tell people don't really care about Naomi and Tamina. They do care about Sasha, but the whole "We want Sasha" thing is really weird. They should probably just have revealed that Banks was behind the attack and have Nattie go through Naomi and Tammy en route to a Survivor Series Kickoff Match with Banks.

* Ziggler and Miz actually had a good match, and Dolph is still selling the leg. It makes him look a bit weak though, because guys like Cena and Ryback don't have a hurt leg at the end of a match. The crowd pretty much died when Miz took control of the match. They liked Dolph, but like in Cesaro/Sheamus, the crowd wanted to see what they wanted to see. They weren't with the "story" the match was trying to tell of a back-and-forth rivalry.

* Cesaro and Sheamus tore it up, but it's obvious that Cesaro is far more boring than Sheamus, so he probably should have won if Sheamus weren't Money in the Bank winner. You should never put your MITB winner over. Why build a guy with a magic bullet?

* I like the idea of Reigns vs. Cesaro. Because Cesaro is so boring, I fully expect Reigns to get cheers for being the lightning rod of charisma that he is.

* The New Day were pretty entertaining. I didn't like that they won, because they are the champions. But I guess Neville is actually in the tournament on SmackDown, so you can't have him win either. Tough situation. Good booking idea though.

* Alberto Del Rio and Zeb Colter continue to play off each other well and deliver poignant and deep interviews.

* Dean Ambrose and Tyler Breeze had a good match. Breeze looked like he could hang, and Ambrose look lucky after he hurt himself. One could make a joke about Breeze not only not being able to create an injury in his opponenet on his own, but also not being able to exploit it, but that would be mean. Since this was his first time out the gate, we've probably just seen Tyler Breeze booked in the best way he ever will be.

* After seeing The Undertaker and Kane totally destroy The Wyatt Family, I am DEFINITELY ready to pay money to see them do it again at Survivor Series. Remember when Mike Tyson knocked out the World Heavyweight Champion the week before he actually became the World Heavyweight Champion? Great PPV strategy.

* Honestly, I understood why they didn it. They wanted the Taker pop and for him to actually do something in England. Cool. The Family can claim surprise. I mean, they were all ready for them, but surprise and all.
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Old 11-10-2015, 08:17 PM   #436
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What did they blow on Monday?

Should we expect to see a huge dip in network subs following Mondays show?
Jeeeeeesus

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Old 11-10-2015, 08:20 PM   #437
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Getting flashbacks of that story about Vince Russo wanting Taker to chokeslam Kane through the announce table the week after Kane debuted. Blowing through the heel getting heat and the payoff of the face getting revenge as quick as possible is always a great way to build up to a PPV match.
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Old 11-10-2015, 08:26 PM   #438
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Yeah, should have just had Taker/Kane reappear and say that they wanted their souls back....

Then at the PPV they could have had a Soul on a Pole match....
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Old 11-10-2015, 08:39 PM   #439
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They could have just had Luke Harper be the guy who gets laid out by Taker/Kane. Harper is good enough to make it look great and sell it like a minor set-back.
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Old 11-10-2015, 08:40 PM   #440
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Getting flashbacks of that story about Vince Russo wanting Taker to chokeslam Kane through the announce table the week after Kane debuted. Blowing through the heel getting heat and the payoff of the face getting revenge as quick as possible is always a great way to build up to a PPV match.
CyNick doesn't understand, #fan. What successful wrestling territory has wrestling ever run?
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