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Old 09-23-2015, 04:51 PM   #1
The CyNick
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Originally Posted by XL View Post
I see. Like the never-ending Orton/Sheamus programme that everybody raved about!



So, we have to tread water for a couple of months with programmes that don't hold any interest for the sake of a match that we've already had 3 times in the last month? Yes that's "long-term booking" but it's boring before we get there, and we've already been to the destination 3 times recently.

Also, I think it's pretty much accepted that they weren't building to Bryan winning the World Title at Mania. Doesn't he say as much himself in a WWE produced interview?

Or is "we had Bryan lined up to face Sheamus until Punk walked and Batista failed to get over as a face and we had to scramble to put something together" part of the story?
I think a lot of ideas were up in the air, but if you watch the TV in the months leading to Mania, the central storyline was HHH driving it home that Bryan was above average but not good enough to be champion. The logical conclusion to that would be Bryan overcoming the odds.

But i guess some guy in catering told one of the dirt sheet writers it was all leading to Sheamus vs Bryan, and that's what we'll believe to be true. But ya know, plans change, just in case we got the story completely wrong.
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Old 09-23-2015, 04:55 PM   #2
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I understand what you're saying Cynick, regarding having to present short/mid/long term storylines but do you seriously believe that they plan that far ahead? When everything points to the contrary?

But more importantly, you can't sit there and basically tell people that they should enjoy the short term crap in the hope that the long term stuff will be good. How much "good will" can a company/product/TV build up before they pay it off? There's not many TV shows that ask you to sit through 40-120 bours of TV before you get a decent pay-off/progression.
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Old 09-23-2015, 04:59 PM   #3
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Well considering Dave Meltzer is friendly with most wrestlers and they all seem to like and trust him, I generally buy his word.

The dirt sheets aren't always right but they're as good as source as any sports writers dishing the scoop. I think you're reaching and you assume that everyone here is a typical internet fan, when in reality this is a pretty god damned well educated (wrestling wise) group of guys who've come up watching around over 20 years. Your take is largely off base, and your arguments are painting you into a corner. If you want to debate, you need to come with better stuff than "LOL U BELIEVE THE DIRT SHEETS" because from what I see, they're mostly going on the absolute fucking dreck they have to watch every Monday Night and are not taking any behind the scenes bullshit into account.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:05 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Gorgeous Dale Newstead View Post
Well considering Dave Meltzer is friendly with most wrestlers and they all seem to like and trust him, I generally buy his word.

The dirt sheets aren't always right but they're as good as source as any sports writers dishing the scoop. I think you're reaching and you assume that everyone here is a typical internet fan, when in reality this is a pretty god damned well educated (wrestling wise) group of guys who've come up watching around over 20 years. Your take is largely off base, and your arguments are painting you into a corner. If you want to debate, you need to come with better stuff than "LOL U BELIEVE THE DIRT SHEETS" because from what I see, they're mostly going on the absolute fucking dreck they have to watch every Monday Night and are not taking any behind the scenes bullshit into account.
His business relies on people like you believing WWE is a garbage fire. That drives more people to his newsletter to read about the "drama backstage". Meanwhile, he never talks to the key players who actually make these changes (Vince, Kevin, Trips, Steph). He picks up bits and pieces from mostly disgruntled workers, who likely have less than 5% of the full picture of what is going on. Then when he's wrong about something, he just goes "plans changed".

The reality is its a successful $1.3B business that continues to grow. But, sure, because you, Meltz, and a few dudes on the internet dont like how Cesaro is being booked, it means the sky is falling. Listen man, I've heard the same song and dance for more than 10 years from that guy. Its all BS. Try watching the product without reading the sheets, and try to tell me its not more enjoyable.
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Old 09-23-2015, 05:01 PM   #5
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Its been stated by numerous wrestlers that the plan was Batista vs Orton at Mania.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:06 PM   #6
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Its been stated by numerous wrestlers that the plan was Batista vs Orton at Mania.
Maybe it was, maybe it wasnt. The inner circle may have had 3 or 4 ideas for potential main events. They ended up getting fully behind Bryan winning the strap.
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Old 09-23-2015, 05:04 PM   #7
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But you're making the discussion about something it's not.

Simply, there are a lot of people that aren't happy with the product (half a million that were watching last year but aren't this week, for example).
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:17 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XL View Post
But you're making the discussion about something it's not.

Simply, there are a lot of people that aren't happy with the product (half a million that were watching last year but aren't this week, for example).
ratings fluctuate. The business as a whole continues to thrive. Why is that?
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Old 09-23-2015, 05:06 PM   #9
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Oh look, another thread turned into a CyNick argument.
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Old 09-23-2015, 05:10 PM   #10
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Yeah, it's a little silly. He's like a black hole (or a car crash).
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Old 09-23-2015, 05:16 PM   #11
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I'm always a little worried I'm being circular with my arguments but unfortunately he takes the cake. Pretty smart guy, but he's wasting his time trying to make meaningless points.
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Old 09-23-2015, 05:41 PM   #12
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His initial bone to pick which I agree with is he didn't get his moment with the fans, instead he had to come down and interrupt some stupid authority promo, just like a "regular" part of the show.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:39 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorgeous Dale Newstead View Post
His initial bone to pick which I agree with is he didn't get his moment with the fans, instead he had to come down and interrupt some stupid authority promo, just like a "regular" part of the show.
Batista was really screwed over by that run on WWE TV. I remember seeing that movie he was in completely bomb at the box office right after his run. Oh, whats that? It was a financial success, and has launched Batista into the mainstream in Hollywood, and allowed him to get multiple future bookings? Hmmm makes me think he run was actually a success.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:43 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
Batista was really screwed over by that run on WWE TV. I remember seeing that movie he was in completely bomb at the box office right after his run. Oh, whats that? It was a financial success, and has launched Batista into the mainstream in Hollywood, and allowed him to get multiple future bookings? Hmmm makes me think he run was actually a success.
His run in WWE had literally nothing to do with the success of Guardia--no, I'm not even gonna bother.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:13 PM   #15
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You are inferring a lot from the fact that we read the dirt sheets. First of all I ain't paying for his shitty news letter and I don't listen to his radio show. I pick up bits and pieces of dirt sheet news and the rest I just go with what I see. What I often see is meandering acts and dead crowds, interspersed with some pretty good matches, and a bunch of guys who are trying to remember scripted lines. So I avoid watching very much.

People get upset watching a guy like Cesaro who is incredibly talented have the rug pulled out from under him any time he gains traction. Vince himself claimed he's not too big on Cesaro, yet whenever you give the guy a chance to really work in a good spot, he delivers. That's not Dave Meltzer telling anyone, that's what people see.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:28 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorgeous Dale Newstead View Post
You are inferring a lot from the fact that we read the dirt sheets. First of all I ain't paying for his shitty news letter and I don't listen to his radio show. I pick up bits and pieces of dirt sheet news and the rest I just go with what I see. What I often see is meandering acts and dead crowds, interspersed with some pretty good matches, and a bunch of guys who are trying to remember scripted lines. So I avoid watching very much.

People get upset watching a guy like Cesaro who is incredibly talented have the rug pulled out from under him any time he gains traction. Vince himself claimed he's not too big on Cesaro, yet whenever you give the guy a chance to really work in a good spot, he delivers. That's not Dave Meltzer telling anyone, that's what people see.
So you just parrot what he says. I commend you for saving your money.

Another one of these guys who "rarely watches" but knows every angle that Cesaro has been in. Got it, you rarely watch.

Cesaro is the perfect example of a guy who wasnt ready, and really still isnt to headline. He close, but he's not there yet. He needs to work some programs, learn how to bring a crowd up and down in the course of a match, and then we'll see where we're at with him. He's got a lot of gifts, but Mark Henry is a strong mofo, and was from day, doesn't mean he should be carrying the company.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:41 PM   #17
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You PREFER to believe some musings of a con man who's whole business is predicated on telling half truths and making crap up to generate interest in his product. Its really hilarious how much you believe in him.
Are you talking about Meltzer or McMahon here?
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:42 PM   #18
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Are you talking about Meltzer or McMahon here?
Vince is a con man too, no doubt, thats the business. Or it was anyway. Now he's a publicly traded, he has to be more up front.

Meltz has no such restraint.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:14 PM   #19
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those consistently declining ratings sure are a great sign for their product.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:15 PM   #20
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and those ratings weren't declining when the product was at its best 15 years ago... football season or not.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:41 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Gorgeous Dale Newstead View Post
and those ratings weren't declining when the product was at its best 15 years ago... football season or not.
LOL 15 years ago.

You know how AMAZING it is to be on TV for 15 YEARS?

I love your logic. Its just...words cant even describe.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:18 PM   #22
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the ratings have been on a consisten decline for a decade. that's not a fluctuation. those are just facts.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:23 PM   #23
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the ratings have been on a consisten decline for a decade. that's not a fluctuation. those are just facts.
So? In your mind, if you dont have ratings at 2005 levels, you cant be financially successful?

How people consume the product today is much different than it was in 1995 and even 2005. Surely you can understand that.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:34 PM   #24
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So? In your mind, if you dont have ratings at 2005 levels, you cant be financially successful?

How people consume the product today is much different than it was in 1995 and even 2005. Surely you can understand that.
i do understand that, but i'm not so sure advertisers or the network care. ratings are ratings.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:36 PM   #25
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i do understand that, but i'm not so sure advertisers or the network care. ratings are ratings.
So did WWE get cancelled or do they keep getting signed to lucrative TV rights fee deals? Maybe I should stop reading the WWE Financial Reports, and just come to you for the health of the business.
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Old 09-24-2015, 01:34 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
So? In your mind, if you dont have ratings at 2005 levels, you cant be financially successful?

How people consume the product today is much different than it was in 1995 and even 2005. Surely you can understand that.
Nobody is talking about financial success, we are talking about putting forth a great product. 2 and a half men was still financially successful with Ashton kutcher, while simultaneously eating a dick.
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Old 09-24-2015, 06:07 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorgeous Dale Newstead View Post
Nobody is talking about financial success, we are talking about putting forth a great product. 2 and a half men was still financially successful with Ashton kutcher, while simultaneously eating a dick.
Yeah but now you're in a territory where you are saying your opinion is all that matters. Which is why you fit well with the IWC mentality. You have a small percentage of the audience that follows newsletters and newz sites, and you guys think the WWE should cater to you. Meanwhile all you do is bitch about the product, BUT the kicker is you are the most loyal fans WWE has.

So its odd to expect them to cater to you. The financial success of the company is the only thing that matters. Sure, ratings are lower than 1999. But guess what, technology has changed since then. There are more cable channels since then. Of course ratings are going to be lower. Would WWE trade in their 1999 TV contract for their 2015 TV contract? I highly doubt it. Sure, higher ratings would be amazing, but the bottom line is the bottom line. And the bottom line is really healthy for WWE right now. So something must be going right.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:19 PM   #28
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NO DIRT SHEETS NEEDED
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:22 PM   #29
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:25 PM   #30
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:35 PM   #31
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god you are a patronizing fuck.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:41 PM   #32
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hahaha, you read WWE financial reports?

The fuck is your damage, boy?
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:43 PM   #33
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hahaha, you read WWE financial reports?

The fuck is your damage, boy?
Yes, I do.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:44 PM   #34
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Do those include spandex spendings and shit like that?
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Old 09-23-2015, 07:01 PM   #35
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Do those include spandex spendings and shit like that?
Its not a specific line item.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:48 PM   #36
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I've often wondered if somebody from WWE secretly posts on TPWW. The more I read from The CyNick the more I'm convinced he works there.
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Old 09-23-2015, 06:56 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vito Cruz View Post
I've often wondered if somebody from WWE secretly posts on TPWW. The more I read from The CyNick the more I'm convinced he works there.
One of these days CyNick is gonna reveal himself to have been Vince McMahon all along.
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Old 09-23-2015, 07:37 PM   #38
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Seriously what the fuck are you all arguing about? Don't know what the fuck happened to this thread. Original poster was right though, fucking product sucks so much right now. You can all bitch about ratings/original plans/Batista's cock all you like. Doesn't change the fact that WWE programming is so boring right now.
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Old 09-23-2015, 08:20 PM   #39
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Lol at this thread and Cynick. Dude must be a member of the Vince McMahon kiss my ass club. Anyone that thinks it was the plan for Bryan to main event WM30 from the start is blind. They literally had to pull him out of a feud with Wyatt in which he had just became a member of the Wyatt family.
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Old 09-24-2015, 12:20 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Simple Fan View Post
Lol at this thread and Cynick. Dude must be a member of the Vince McMahon kiss my ass club. Anyone that thinks it was the plan for Bryan to main event WM30 from the start is blind. They literally had to pull him out of a feud with Wyatt in which he had just became a member of the Wyatt family.
The angle played itself out. Bryan wanted to get Bray alone.

I don't think Bryan winning was necessarily the plan the day after Mania 29, but I do think it was in the plans months before 30. Hence all the interactions with HHH.

But keep thinking everything was an accident
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