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Old 09-20-2004, 07:51 PM   #41
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You mean there's been football since 1999?
and after 1999
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Old 09-21-2004, 12:24 AM   #42
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Sanders is great no doubt about that, but his claim to fame is the juke 5 guys and run 80 yards for a score.

It is really tough to say the best ever at a position because the teams have different guys surrounding them.

I've got to go with Walter.
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Old 09-21-2004, 01:28 AM   #43
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That's a pretty good claim to fame when talking about best runningbacks, Gonzo.
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Old 09-21-2004, 10:32 AM   #44
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Bo Jackson was fun to watch. Too bad he didn't last so long.
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Old 09-21-2004, 11:53 AM   #45
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BO KNOWS TOUCHDOWNS.
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Old 09-21-2004, 11:53 AM   #46
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Old 09-21-2004, 02:17 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by el fregadero
That's a pretty good claim to fame when talking about best runningbacks, Gonzo.
LOL really

"He's not a great runningback, he can just break any tackle and score big runs. That is totally irrelevant to the discussion of who is the best runningback."
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Old 09-21-2004, 02:31 PM   #48
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More often than not however, he was losing one or two yards on his runs because he tried to do too much.
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Old 09-21-2004, 02:41 PM   #49
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He averaged 5 yards a carry for his career.
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Old 09-21-2004, 02:43 PM   #50
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Also, when a runningback does run for negative yards on a carry, alot of the time that is because the line missed a block and he got hit right after he got the ball.
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Old 09-21-2004, 02:50 PM   #51
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Well yeah, his line sucked. But if you run say 4 runs for -2 yards each that is -8 yards. You run your next run for 12 yards. 10 total yards. 2 yard average on your runs, doesn't mean you get 2 yards every play.

Stats lie so meh.

He was great but I don't think he was the greatest.
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Old 09-21-2004, 03:48 PM   #52
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What are you talking about. He had a 5.0 CAREER yards per carry, and he played 10 seasons. His yards / game over his career was JUST under 100 (99.8). Not to mention his NFL-record 14 consecutive 100-yard games, or his 10 consecutive 1,000 yard rushing seasons (and NFL record five 1500 yard seasons). Or his NFL record 25 games of 150 yards, or his 15 50+ yard TD runs. If all that doesn't say consistancy, then I don't know what does.



...oh nevermind, I forgot that stats lie. Totally irrelevent.
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Old 09-21-2004, 04:48 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gonzo
More often than not however, he was losing one or two yards on his runs because he tried to do too much.
If you put your head down and push ahead, you will get 3 YPC every time and never lose yards.

If you juke and jive, you're likely to be stuffed once in a while, but if you can make the defender miss, you're off to the races.

You can't have it both ways. On defense, you can blitz, but you will be leaving one player uncovered. You can go for an interception, but you're risking being burned for a touchdown. You can throw the ball long, and risk it getting intercepted. You can run a trick play, but the trickier the play, the greater the chances of a mistake nullifying it, or a turnover occurring.

You pick and choose. In some systems, a 3 YPC workhorse back is ideal. But if your system includes never making the playoffs, and pretty much just sucking year in and year out, then a home-run threat at HB is great.

Also, like someone said... his line sucked. And like someone else said, stuffs usually occur when the line breaks down.

So my rant might have been wasted. With a better line, he'd be averaging a lot more than 5 ypc.
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Old 09-21-2004, 04:54 PM   #54
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I think what he is trying to say is that for all the big plays Barry made he had a lot of bad plays too. Like one play he would run for thirty yards, then the next try to do it again but just get tackled negative five yards. You put those together and his average is like 12.5 yards then. I think what his point is that Barry would get big runs and pad his stats, but he would also make mistakes trying to get those runs more often and thus costing his team a drive or what not.

That is just what I think he is trying to say, not my personal opinion. In a way it would make sense because the Lions were never a Super Bowl caliber team, but also he was far and away the best player on the team and one player can't do it all, so it goes both ways.
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Old 09-21-2004, 05:02 PM   #55
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If you're the only good player on your team, then you're damn right they're going to key off on you.

Listen. Think about it in terms of gambling:

You go to a casino, you put 10 bucks in. You lose 5. You win 20. You lose 5. You win 20 more.

You get rich. Say, the monetary equivalent of 10 straight 1,000 yard seasons, or a career 5 ypc average. Whatever that might be.

Will you whine about all the times you lost? Or the fact that, at the end of the day, you're rich?

It's called an average for a reason.

And I HIGHLY doubt that 5 YPC comes from one huge run and several short losses. That's absurd.
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Old 09-21-2004, 05:04 PM   #56
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Do you have any idea how many carries it would take to gain 200 yards if you kept getting stuffed?
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Old 09-21-2004, 05:53 PM   #57
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I wouldn't call Barry playing "padding his stats". Look at the way he runs, he was designed for the big plays. He wasn't the type of back to run straight through the middle and take a beating for yards. He was one of those risk-reward type players. It's basically like doing a run up the middle or a run to the outside. If you run to the outside and break a tackle or two, that's an easy 10+ yards. Running up the middle, you're almost guaranteed 3-4 ypc, with very little chance of breaking a big 20-30 yard run. Basically what Alphabean said


So yes, the type of runner he was allowed him to be stuffed more often than say, Eddie George, but when your career ypc is 5.0, and you're getting 100 yards per game, you're doing something right. If you factor in that he got 20-30 carries a game, one big run wouldn't negate 10 negative plays, so he obviously was more productive than not, if you understand what I'm trying to say.
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Old 09-21-2004, 06:08 PM   #58
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Yeah, I understand and think the same way, I was just trying to clear up what Gonzo was saying
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Old 09-21-2004, 09:49 PM   #59
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Thank you. I realize that he is a great back, it is foolish to not think that. I'm just saying what BCWWF cleared up for me and that I think there are better that have played.
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Old 09-21-2004, 10:51 PM   #60
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Hes one of the best, but like always when dealing with the "best" you can't really say for sure. He was def. one of the most entertaining backs to watch though. I think he played long enough to be considered one of the top backs though, I wouldn't really compare his career to Terrell Davis's. Davis's career was pretty short IMO, not taking anything away from him though, I loved watching Davis play but he really only had 3 or 4 seasons in his "prime" whereas just about all of Sanders 10 (I think he played 10 seasons?) seasons where probably considered his "prime"
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Old 09-21-2004, 10:58 PM   #61
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I don't think you can compare any of Denver's backs in the last ten years to be the best ever. Not to take away their outstanding performaces but it is largely thanks in part to the system they are in. They are mostly products of the system. Denver is a RB factory.
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Old 09-21-2004, 11:00 PM   #62
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I was going to say the same thing.
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Old 09-22-2004, 12:02 AM   #63
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While all of Denver's backs could rush for 1,000 yards, only TD could get 2,000.

Basically, all HBs are a part of their system. You'll have far better numbers if your offense rules. That's a given. But TD did more than just "run well," he had moves on top of moves, and before the injury, hell when he came back for two games AFTER his injuries, he just had insane vision and moves. We'll never know for sure, but I'm positive TD belongs in the top 25 backs of all time. Not a very "bold" claim, but still a claim.
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Old 09-22-2004, 12:05 AM   #64
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I think Clinton Portis could have if he was given a few years to get really settled down to Shanahan's system. I mean he played for 2 years and had 1,500+ yards each year.
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Old 09-22-2004, 12:08 AM   #65
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Portis I think is a very good back. We can put him and TD on par with each other when Portis gets a Superbowl MVP...
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Old 09-22-2004, 12:22 AM   #66
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I agree that Terrell Davis was on a different level than Portis, but I think the team he played on is what elevated his stats and that as a player wasn't a Barry Sanders or Jim Brown.

Also, I don't think Portis would have been a 2000 yard guy on Denver. He didn't really have the same style, Portis is my favorite kind of running back, the guy who is just a brick speeding down the field. Davis was more of a finesse guy, like Sanders.
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