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#761 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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#762 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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#763 |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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lol, that's the Kenny Williams of old, trading El Duque/good prospect for crap and Rowand for an inevitable 60-day DL stint
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#764 |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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But ROFL @ Steve Phillips saying Chicago has one of the best rotations of all time. WHAT A FUCKING DUNCE. Not even #1 in the AL.
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#765 | ||
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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Quote:
That's the beauty of having the best pitching coach in the game. Quote:
95% of the teams out there would drool to have our "problems". Hey Miz... can you honestly name me one other team that has the chance to have five 20 game winners? I can't think of anyone. |
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#766 |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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Starters:
Buehrle Garcia Contreras Vazquez Garland Bullpen: Cotts Politte Sanders McCarthy Hermanson Bajenaru Tracey Closer: Jenks ----------------- I'm sorry, that is just fucking sick. Five #1 starters, two of the top set-up men in the game and a 100mph flamethrowing closer. |
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#767 | ||
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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Quote:
Who are these "people", btw? Quote:
You don't have "five legitamite 20 game winners". You have a 16, 14, 15, 18, 9 and an 11 game winner. You seriously do not have a chance to have more than 2. Do you realize how hard winning 20 games is? 4 people did it last year, only 1 in the AL. Colon, Willis, Oswalt, and Carpenter are all each way better than your 2-5 starters. Sure I can name a team that has a chance for five 20 game winners. Oakland A's. It won't happen, but that doesn't matter, the White Sox are highly unlikely to even have 2 anyway. Barry Zito: 23-5 in 2002, one of most durable starters in MLB, has never missed a start. Rich Harden: 10 wins in 19 starts in '05, dominated every time he was healthy, will have at least 1 Cy Young if he stays healthy Dan Haren: won 14 games in his first year as a starter even after an awful first-half Joe Blanton: easily AL's best rookie starter, 12 wins despite being in top 5 in worst run suport in AL. Esteban Loaiza: 21-9 2001, consistenlt starts 30+ games Out of this group, probably only Harden will do it, but out of yours, it will only be Buehrle. I am willing to bet my house that Vazquez, Contreras, Garcia, and Garland (he'll be traded anyway) will not win 20 games. Even if they did, so what? That would just be a tribute to Chicago's offense scoring alot of runs and their bullpen not fucking up. Do you dare to say all 5 starters will have ERA's under 4? The pitching coach argument is stupid. A great pitching coach can't turn crap into not crap. Do you have a reason why every shitty starter Chicago had from 1988-2004 wasn't magically turned into Doc Gooden by Don Cooper? Vazquez was an above average NL pitcher and got raped in the AL. I don't want to judge him off one bad year in New York, but he had a 4.42 and a 1.25 WHIP in the NL and a pitcher's park. I guarantee you you will not see his Montreal lines again. Chicago's pitching staff his great, no doubt. They have a 20-game win/Cy young caliber ace and 4 very solid starters. But, they're pitching staff is worse than 2005's (this may be too close to call, Garland is on the move) and they do not feature the AL's best rotation. They are not even close to an all-time top rotation. Oakland starters > Chicago starters, in '06 |
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#768 | |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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Don't say KC Royals. Mark Redman is technically a #1 starter. |
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#769 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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2006: Chicago = Playoff team Oakland = 2nd place if they are lucky. |
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#770 |
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History's Greatest, Mr. E
Posts: 42,425
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(Vasquez was technically the D-Backs ace, Miz.)
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#771 |
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History's Greatest, Mr. E
Posts: 42,425
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Hey, remember that time the A's beat the White Sox 5 out of 6 times?
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#772 |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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Do you pay attention? Garland has turned down a 3-year offer. He has stated he wants to test the market in 2006. http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/sp....asp?id=132181
Oakland is so much better than the Angels right now its ridiculous. 2nd place if they're lucky? I know you probably won't but I'd loved to be humored with a reason why Texas or Seattle could finish ahead of them. Anyway, the topic wasn't standings, it was pitching staffs. Any comments about Oakland's? Nice job ignoring 90% of my post, btw. |
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#773 | |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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#774 |
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History's Greatest, Mr. E
Posts: 42,425
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Touche.
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#775 | ||
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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Harden? You said it yourself, "If he stays healthy". Sounds like the faith that the Cubs put in Prior: "He can be the greatest pitcher ever, if only he could stay healthy" Haren hasn't proven that he can put together a complete season. Time will tell. Blanton is the only one I can see having a shot at 20 wins, just not with the A's. And Loaiza? I'll admit, it was amazing what he did for us in '01 but he'll never come close. His time with the Yankees & Nationals proved as much. |
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#776 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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#777 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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#778 |
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History's Greatest, Mr. E
Posts: 42,425
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Too bad they're not better than Oakland though.
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#779 |
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History's Greatest, Mr. E
Posts: 42,425
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Because if they were, they should have won more than once.
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#780 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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#781 |
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I'm all there is
Posts: 31,811
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okay saying that's one of the greatest rotations of all-time like 4 months before start time is ridiculous. That's a real bold statement.
And five guys winning 20 is about as dumb as Eric Burnes (sorry Burnsie ) That's never happened or hasn't come close to happening in the history of baseball.
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#782 | ||||
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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228 IP, 14-13, 171 K, 3.86 ERA, 1.20 WHIP. Good enough to be better than three of your five "20 game winner/#1 starters"[/quote] Quote:
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#783 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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Chicago 99 63 .611 Oakland 88 74 .543 That would pace Oakland around 11 games back if they were in the same division? Hmmm. |
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#784 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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#785 |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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How many times did Chicago have to play LAA or go pitch in Texas? How many times did Oakland get to play the Tigers and Royals? Regular season records aren't fair to compare when the division quality is so unbalanced.
There's no doubt that Chicago > Oakland in 2005, but I'm talking about 2006. |
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#786 |
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History's Greatest, Mr. E
Posts: 42,425
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Paul Abbott? Wasn't he the guy with one hand?
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#787 | |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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#788 |
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History's Greatest, Mr. E
Posts: 42,425
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We're all posting at the same time here
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#789 | |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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#790 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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#791 | |
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History's Greatest, Mr. E
Posts: 42,425
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#792 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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Going just based on that the Sox would have to be better than Oakland again. |
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#793 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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![]() I do love a good debate. |
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#794 |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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Added:
SP Javier Vazquez 1B Jim Thome 3B Rob Mackowiak Lost: OF Aaron Rowand 1B Frank Thomas SP Orlando Hernandez DH Carl Everett RP Damaso Marte 3B Geoff Blum RP Luis Viscaino Not really sure where they got better |
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#795 |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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Lost:
OF Aaron Rowand - the trade can go either way right now 1B Frank Thomas - didn't play much, not as big of an impact anymore SP Orlando Hernandez - hurt DH Carl Everett - Thome will hit better RP Damaso Marte - don't get me started. 3B Geoff Blum - no huge loss, he did come through when we needed it though RP Luis Viscaino - again, no huge loss |
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#796 |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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No huge loss, you're right, I asked where they got better. Thome is way too risky to give up one of your best players. Hernandez/McCarty > Vazquez
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#797 | |
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Second City Saint
Posts: 5,806
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Quote:
Vazquez is an improvement of over Hernandez (still unproven but El Duque lost too many games due to injury). A healthy Thome is an improvement over Thomas/Everett. And from what I have seen, Mackowiak is an improvement as a backup role for Crede (incase his back acts up again). Add to that what Garland or Contreras can pull in the trade market (if that's what it comes to). |
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#798 |
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The People's Member
Posts: 18,092
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All that matters is that Tony Batista is back in the US of A.
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#799 |
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WTF do you want?
Posts: 14,760
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Slugs, I know "last year was last year", but only one team had more then 100 wins and you think you'll have 5 starters with 20wins?
Yeah, it's possible, so it David Ortiz hitting a home run in ever single at bat, I wouldn't bet on it, but it "could" happan. You have a good rotation, and that's about it. The questions with Duqe and Contrares are age, no one knows their real age, and how injuries will effect them. If you get .500 record and a sub 4.25 ERa from Vazquez be very happy. |
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#800 |
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Clutch Poster
Posts: 11,997
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Why did the Cards blow $15.9 million on Ricardo Rincon and Braden Looper, the most useless relievers of all time?
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