MLB 2005-2006 Offseason Thread

[DaveWadding]

Originally Posted by L L Cool G saying you have "500 reasons why Blanton is better" prertty much states that its obvious. Chacin 13-9 Blanton 12-12 that's all that needs to be said

LOL. Go read up on baseball statistics before you try to come in here with shit like that. For your own sake, you fucking homer.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by L L Cool G saying you have "500 reasons why Blanton is better" prertty much states that its obvious. Chacin 13-9 Blanton 12-12 that's all that needs to be said

Do you honestly think win-loss records mean anything?

I was talking about Joe Blanton vs. Gustavo Chacin, why you're bringing Vernon Wells, Mark Kotsay, Orlando Hudson, Eric Chavez, Shea Hillenbrand, and Bobby Crosby into the discussion is beyond me.

Let me ask you something, who was a better pitcher in 2005?

Jon Garland: 18-10, 3.50 ERA, 115 K, 1.17 WHIP
Johan Santana: 16-7, 2.87 ERA, 238 K, .97 WHIP

How about these two?

Jeff Weaver: 14-11, 4.22 ERA, 157 K, 1.17 WHIP
Roger Clemens: 13-8, 1.87 ERA, 185 K, 1.01 WHIP

These two?

Brandon Backe: 10-8, 4.76 ERA, 97 K, 1.46 WHIP
John Patterson: 9-7, 3.13 ERA, 185 K, 1.20 WHIP

You are wrong on so many levels

[RoXer]

Pretty sure hes being sarcastic

[RoXer]

Lets hope at least.

[Joey Slugs]

Originally Posted by The Miz Do you honestly think win-loss records mean anything?

You seriously have to be joking to make a statement like that.

Or just seriously stoned.

[RoXer]

You're all pulling my leg

[RoXer]

Twisting my arm

[RoXer]

Yanking my chain

[VonErich Lives]

Originally Posted by Joey Slugs You seriously have to be joking to make a statement like that. Or just seriously stoned.

Slugs, the issue with W/L records is it depends just as much or more on the rest of the team then the pitcher.

Unlike K's, Walks ERA which are all pretty much controlled by the pitchers ability, W/L requires the team to play good defense and score runs.

Who is a better pitcher?

20-2, 50K 100Walks 4.52ERA

OR

7-15 100K 25Walks 2.12ERA

[VonErich Lives]

Originally Posted by DaveWadding LOL. Go read up on baseball statistics before you try to come in here with shit like that. For your own sake, you fucking homer.

Once again another A-game post by Wadding.

Really, just log off and don't come back, you're by far the worst poster ever.

Now if you had responded with a point of view or opinion or facts, that would make you a better poster, instead you come out of nowhere in a conversation you hadn't been involved in and all you add is insults at LL Cool with no facts or info of your own.

Seriously, just go away.

[Joey Slugs]

Originally Posted by VonErich Lives Slugs, the issue with W/L records is it depends just as much or more on the rest of the team then the pitcher. Unlike K's, Walks ERA which are all pretty much controlled by the pitchers ability, W/L requires the team to play good defense and score runs. Who is a better pitcher? 20-2, 50K 100Walks 4.52ERA OR 7-15 100K 25Walks 2.12ERA

Honestly, I would take the 20 win pitcher because over the course of an entire season he kept his team in the game (in one way or another) to win 13 more games.

** But I do understand that some pitchers just get lucky (like giving up 6 1st inning runs but your team comes back with 7 in the 2nd and you are still inline for the win if you can outlast the 5th)**

I don't bank W/L records as bible (I'm really into sabermetrics) but they do hold water when it comes to ranking pitchers.

But yeah, Blanton is the better pitcher.

[Joey Slugs]

Originally Posted by VonErich Lives ...and all you add is insults at Slugs with no facts or info of your own...

This time around he was knocking Gertner, but thanks for the back up.

[VonErich Lives]

Originally Posted by Joey Slugs This time around he was knocking Gertner, but thanks for the back up.

heh, yeah it was Gertner, even still, as much as a Putz Gertner can be, Waddings comments still weren't needed like that, especially when he's one of the first to cry that all I do is insult people who disagree with me.

I need a nap...

g-night.

[Joey Slugs]

Originally Posted by VonErich Lives heh, yeah it was Gertner, even still, as much as a Putz Gertner can be, Waddings comments still weren't needed like that, especially when he's one of the first to cry that all I do is insult people who disagree with me. I need a nap... g-night.

Yeah, Wadding was the one who jumped all over me when I commented that the Cubs need help when it comes to their starting pitching (because the front office is blind to that fact).

the big point is it was said that there are "500 reasons why Blanton is better"

And I'm telling you that is pure crap.

[DaveWadding]

Originally Posted by Joey Slugs Yeah, Wadding was the one who jumped all over me when I commented that the Cubs need help when it comes to their starting pitching (because the front office is blind to that fact).

We get it. You don't like the Cubs. You're jealous, that's fine. But I still think you need to worry about your own team. You don't see me running around here talking shit about the White Sux all the time and slamming their players and they moves they make and all that shit, so kindly raise up off my nuts.

[Joey Slugs]

Originally Posted by DaveWadding We get it. You don't like the Cubs. You're jealous, that's fine. But I still think you need to worry about your own team. You don't see me running around here talking shit about the White Sux all the time and slamming their players and they moves they make and all that shit, so kindly raise up off my nuts.

Yeah, ok there tough guy. Do you even live in Chicago?

[Joey Slugs]

Sunday, December 18
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Nomar Garciaparra Cubs	Astros? Yankees? Dodgers Indians?	Nomar's L.A. Story Dec 18 - Nomar Garciaparra has agreed in principle with the Dodgers, ESPN's Peter Gammons has confirmed. Garciaparra, who still needs to take a physical and finalize contract details, will likely play first base for the Dodgers. The Yankees, Astros and Indians were originally interested in Garciaparra but we're told by Garciaparra's agent, Arn Tellum, of his choice to join the Dodgers.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Coco Crisp Indians	Red Sox?	Crisp not turning over Dec 18 - With the Dodgers reaching agreement with Nomar Garciaparra, it makes less likely that the Indians will be looking to deal outfielder Coco Crisp, The Boston Globe reported. In a deal for Crisp, the Red Sox likely would have to give up Matt Clement or Bronson Arroyo.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Rudy Seanez Padres	Devil Rays? Rangers? Braves Red Sox	Second set of Sox Dec 18 - Reliever Rudy Seanez, who had a short tour with the Red Sox in 2003, are closing in on a one-year, incentive-laden deal, the Boston Herald reported. "We've worked out an agreement in principle for next year with a club option for another year," Seanez' agent, David Schwartz, told the Herald Saturday. "We need to work through some final details, and hopefully, we'll be able to come to an agreement this coming week." The Braves have made a one-year offer (with plenty of incentives) to Seanez, the Atlanta Journal-Constitution reports. Seanez pitched for Atlanta in 1998-2000 and again late in 2001. Tampa Bay is also interested in the setup man, who had a resurgence last season with San Diego, going 7-1 with a 2.69 ERA in a career-high 57 appearances. Seanez made $550,000 last season and wasn't offered arbitration by the Padres, so he won't cost the team that signs him a draft pick.
Saturday, December 17
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Johnny Damon Red Sox	Dodgers? Orioles? Red Sox Yankees? Cubs?	O's not optimistic Dec 17 - While the Orioles have talked to agent Scott Boras about Johnny Damon, they don't expect to see Damon roaming around Camden Yards on Opening Day, reports ESPN.com's Jayson Stark. "How can you not have interest in the guy?" Jim Duquette, the Orioles' vice president for baseball operations, told Stark Friday morning. "But the likelihood is not very high. It's going to be prohibitive, money-wise." Duquette wouldn't discuss what the Orioles were willing to offer Damon. But indications are that, like the Red Sox and Yankees, they wouldn't want to go beyond four years for a player who just turned 32 last month. Boras has been telling teams he already has "offers" of more than five years for Damon. But the four teams known to be interested -- the Red Sox, Yankees, Dodgers and Orioles -- all dispute suggestions that any of those offers came from them. And only the Red Sox (at four years, $40 million) have admitted making any formal proposal. Duquette said the Orioles have done no more than mention to Boras that they're interested. But most of their conversations with Boras have concerned free-agent pitchers Kevin Millwood and Jarrod Washburn. The New York Post, meanwhile, reports Damon is expected to visit the Dodgers this weekend. However, ESPN's Peter Gammons reports the Dodgers canceled the meeting and one team official says "it isn't happening. Period."

[The Outlaw]

Originally Posted by L L Cool G the big point is it was said that there are "500 reasons why Blanton is better" And I'm telling you that is pure crap.

Yeah word, there's only 499 reasons.

[MVP]

Dodgers looking more like the 03 Red Sox every day

Originally Posted by The Outlaw Yeah word, there's only 499 reasons.

hardly. Chacin will win at least 15 games this year

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by Joey Slugs You seriously have to be joking to make a statement like that. Or just seriously stoned.

W-L is way too dependent on factors out of the pitcher's control that it is not credible as a stat for comparing pitchers.

Since I talked about Blanton's poor run support, I'll use him as an example with Mike Mussina.

Blanton
4/24 vs. LAA: 8 IP, 1 ER, 1 HR, 6 H, 2 K, 1 BB (L 1-0)
7/26 vs. CLE: 7 IP, 1 ER, 3 H, 7 K, 4 BB (L 2-0)
8/31 vs. LAA: 8 IP, 2 ER, 6 H, 10 K, 1 BB (L 2-1)

Mussina
4/21 vs. TOR: 5.1 IP, 3 ER, 10 H, 5 K, 1 BB (W 4-3)
7/14 vs. BOS: 6 IP, 5 ER, 8 H, 6 K, 3 BB (W 8-6)
8/29 vs. SEA: 3 IP, 4 ER, 6 H, 0 K, 4 BB (W 7-4)

Is it Blanton's fault he doesn't have Rodriguez, Matsui, Jeter and Giambi on his team?

Joe Blanton: 0-3, 1.57 ERA, 19 K, 0.91 WHIP
Mike Mussina: 3-0, 7.54 ERA, 11 K, 2.23 WHIP

Take your pick

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by L L Cool G the big point is it was said that there are "500 reasons why Blanton is better" And I'm telling you that is pure crap.

My big point was that Blanton was the AL's best rookie pitcher in 2005. Your point was Chacin > Blanton, as soon as I shot that down you changed your point. 500 is obviously a hyperbole, forget I even said that.

MY POINT: Blanton > Chacin. Care to combat the big issue instead of an obviously exaggerated number?

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by L L Cool G hardly. Chacin will win at least 15 games this year

Doubt it, you still have no offense past Wells/Overbay, but even if he doesn't, who cares? I'd be more excited about Chacin's chances to put up 200+ IP, 100+ K, sub-3.50 ERA. If the offense and the bullpen can't get the job done, not his fault.

[YOUR Hero]

I think Chacin will put up those type of numbers next year.

[The Miz]

I still think Chacin has a much greater chance of hitting the sophomore slump than Blanton or Kazmir but he should put up a very solid year and be among the AL's 5 best #3 starters.

[YOUR Hero]

I'd agree to that latter part. Didn't see enough of Blanton or Kazmir to agree or disagree with the first part of your statement.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Thank God Nomar isn't signing with the Yankees. He was always my favorite player on the Sox, and still is one of my favorites now, but if he signed with the Yanks I think I would have had to throw my Nomar bobblehead out of a 3rd story window.

Originally Posted by The Miz Doubt it, you still have no offense past Wells/Overbay, but even if he doesn't, who cares? I'd be more excited about Chacin's chances to put up 200+ IP, 100+ K, sub-3.50 ERA. If the offense and the bullpen can't get the job done, not his fault.

he'll put up great numbers. Hopfully the jays can add another bat. no too kean on them talking about dealing hillenbrand though

[BCWWF]

Why even get excited about young pitchers being good when none of them will come close to Francisco Lariano?

[Joey Slugs]

Monday, December 19
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Brett Tomko Giants	Padres? Dodgers?	Westside connection Dec 19 - Right-hander Brett Tomko is one in a small handful of pitchers the Dodgers are chasing, but he also is considering signing with the Padres, The Los Angeles Times reports.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Jarrod Washburn Angels	Mariners?	Mariner mission Dec 19 - According to the Seattle Post-Intelligencer, the Mariners hope the final details on a four-year deal with Jarrod Washburn will be wrapped up in the next day or so and the left-handed starting pitcher can undergo the mandatory physical exam. The deal is worth $36 million to $38 million, The Tacoma News Tribune reports. Washburn, who has a history with Seattle GM Bill Bavasi (previously the Angels GM from 1994-99), has spent his entire eight-year career with the Angels and is 75-57 with a 3.93 ERA.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Johnny Damon Red Sox	Dodgers? Orioles? Red Sox Yankees? Cubs?	Return to Beantown? Dec 19 - Center fielder Johnny Damon declined the Red Sox's offer of arbitration, the Boston Herald reports. By doing so, Damon will effectively set a Jan. 8 deadline for re-signing with the Red Sox. If he is not signed by that date, he cannot negotiate with the Sox until May 15. ESPN's Peter Gammons reports the Dodgers canceled a meeting with Damon and one team official says "it isn't happening. Period." While the Orioles have talked to agent Scott Boras about Damon, they don't expect to see Damon roaming around Camden Yards on Opening Day, reports ESPN.com's Jayson Stark. "How can you not have interest in the guy?" Jim Duquette, the Orioles' vice president for baseball operations, told Stark. "But the likelihood is not very high. It's going to be prohibitive, money-wise." Duquette wouldn't discuss what the Orioles were willing to offer Damon. But indications are that, like the Red Sox and Yankees, they wouldn't want to go beyond four years for a player who just turned 32 last month. Boras has been telling teams he already has "offers" of more than five years for Damon. But the teams known to be interested -- the Red Sox, Yankees and Orioles -- all dispute suggestions that any of those offers came from them. And only the Red Sox (at four years, $40 million) have admitted making any formal proposal. Duquette said the Orioles have done no more than mention to Boras that they're interested. But most of their conversations with Boras have concerned free-agent pitcher Kevin Millwood.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Byung-Hyun Kim Rockies	Rockies?	Rocky Mountain high Dec 19 - The Rockies would like to bring back Byung-Hyun Kim, but it's going to be for about one-fifth of the $6 million he earned last year, and Kim will have to reclaim his spot in the rotation, the Rocky Mountain News reports. The Rockies see Kim adding depth to their rotation, and what makes him especially attractive is his age -- he turns 27 on Jan. 19. Before finalizing the deal, though, the Rockies want a sit-down with Kim in which they can make sure he understands his role.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Tony Graffanino Red Sox		Graffanino will try arbitration Dec 19 - According to the Boston Herald, Tony Graffanino will be staying with the Red Sox -- for now, at least. Graffanino is expected to accept the team's offer for salary arbitration. The decision effectively takes Graffanino off the free-agent market and binds him to the Sox entering spring training of 2006. A 33-year-old veteran of 10 major league seasons, Graffanino earned $1.1 million last season in the second year of a two-year, $2.2 million deal. He finished the year with a .309 average, seven home runs and 38 RBI in time split with the Sox and Royals, meaning he could be in position to earn roughly $2 million in arbitration.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Kenny Lofton Phillies	Diamondbacks Dodgers Orioles	L.A. story Dec 19 - The Dodgers also are close to an agreement on a one-year contract with Kenny Lofton, The Los Angeles Times reports. Lofton, 38, would play center field much of the time, leaving J.D. Drew in right field. Lofton batted .335 and stole 22 bases in 25 attempts in 110 games for the Phillies last season.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Reggie Sanders Cardinals	Dodgers Blue Jays? Royals?	Designated role Dec 19 - Dodgers GM Ned Colletti had hoped to add veteran Reggie Sanders in left field, but has found competition from American League teams that view Sanders as a designated hitter and are perhaps willing to give him more than a one-year deal, The Los Angeles Times reports.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Octavio Dotel Athletics	Cardinals? Yankees? Dodgers? Twins? Mets? Astros? Rangers?	A Bronx tale? Dec 19 - Free-agent reliever Octavio Dotel will most likely choose a team soon, and the Yankees feel good about their chances, The New York Post reports. Dotel, a hard-throwing righty coming off Tommy John surgery, received 11 offers this winter and piqued the interest of both the Yankees and Mets. The 32-year-old whittled down his choices to four teams in the last week, and the Yankees showed more substantial interest than the Mets, according to a source.

[BCWWF]

Look at Dotel's description. It's all the New York media speculating that the Yankees are going to get him. "According to a source" basically means completely unreliable. But as long as "The Yankees feel good about their chances" you know that he must be going there. One of their 20 different newspapers says so!

[VonErich Lives]

Graffanino being back makes me happy.

(insert Miz or Hero joke here)

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by BCWWF Why even get excited about young pitchers being good when none of them will come close to Francisco Lariano?

[MVP]

Does Graffanino also play 1B?

[RP]

i swear Nomar's nose has grown since i've seen him in a Cubs uni.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by MVP Does Graffanino also play 1B?

He did in Kansas City this year for the first time in his career really, he has 26 games there. Don't expect Boston to settle with Graffanino at first.

[The Miz]

WOOOOOOOOOOO RYAN FRANKLIN NON-TENDERED WOOOOOOOOOO

[BCWWF]

I wouldn't mind Graffanino on my team, to be honest. Besides the playoff blunder he is a solid infielder.

[VonErich Lives]

Originally Posted by The Miz He did in Kansas City this year for the first time in his career really, he has 26 games there. Don't expect Boston to settle with Graffanino at first.

Considering the current 1B is Youkillis, I could see him platooning there, then again, we don't have a start SS yet either... so who knows.