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Old 04-28-2010, 12:20 PM   #841
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Claire smiled when she asked Jack if MIB had told him that it was him pretending to be their father, and it just looked like she had her own private joke going or she knew more.
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:20 PM   #842
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Well that would mean Christian was risen from the dead, and Locke could do the same.
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:22 PM   #843
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Claire smiled when she asked Jack if MIB had told him that it was him pretending to be their father, and it just looked like she had her own private joke going or she knew more.
I don't read too much into how the actors react to things. There seems to be a lot of analysis of the looks on characters faces when things are said.
I understand the subtleties of acting, but I think it's placing stock in something that's not really there.
Most of these actors have no clue what is going on in the next episode
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:24 PM   #844
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It doesn't matter if they know or not, if there is anything to be seen in their reactions, they will be directed to do so. I'm just sayin, usually everything we see or hear is for a reason.
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:25 PM   #845
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Well that would mean Christian was risen from the dead, and Locke could do the same.
Which is exactly what I said will happen. I believe once the realities merge, John Locke will be risen again. Whether we just see the smoke monster fly out of his body, or have his old body emerge from the beach, I dunno. Just think/hope that's how it's gonna go.
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:26 PM   #846
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What is this business about MIB scanning minds? That sounds purely made up. If he had the ability to scan minds he would have known Sawyer was planning to double cross him, the candidates were planning to escape on the boat, and that Sayid didn't kill Desmond, etc. etc. etc.
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:30 PM   #847
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hes stuck in locke's body now and cant do it anymore?
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:30 PM   #848
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I too am of the mind that real Locke is returning. It's possible that he won't, but thematically I doubt it not happening.
I felt pretty strongly that it would happen all along, but last week really sealed it I think. When MIB called John Locke a sucker, I felt it was confirmation.
Seems unlikely to slap him in the face like that, and not have him eat those words.
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:33 PM   #849
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hes stuck in locke's body now and cant do it anymore?
I think it's obvious that he can scan people's pasts, and knows things about people on the island. He definitely has those type of powers, like Jacob does.
I don't think he can flat out read minds though. There's been nothing to really indicate that.
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:38 PM   #850
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What is this business about MIB scanning minds? That sounds purely made up. If he had the ability to scan minds he would have known Sawyer was planning to double cross him, the candidates were planning to escape on the boat, and that Sayid didn't kill Desmond, etc. etc. etc.
Well he's done it to Eko and Richard definitely. I'm not saying he can scan their minds and figure out what they are going to do. But he can scan their pasts, and at least if he has some other skills to it, scan their mind to see what they are thinking at the time. Like Jack asked him WHY he supposedly posed as Christian in the jungle, and since Jack was thinking about when he was following Christian when he asked him, maybe MIB picked up that it lead him to find water/the caves.
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:39 PM   #851
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I don't think he can flat out read minds though. There's been nothing to really indicate that.
Yeah I didn't mean or suggest that was a definite case.

Who was it laughed off my idea of Locke coming back from the dead way back when anyway?
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:43 PM   #852
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No idea but I have never subscribed to the idea of him being dead. He's been "dead" since the finale of Season 4. He's a pretty damn important character to the show, and hugely popular.
As far as a "main character" on Lost goes, I think he shares that role with Jack. I will be a bit suprised if he doesn't come back.

My prediction is that his return is the final cliffhanger. It will probably be the huge moment that ends the episode before the finale.
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:11 PM   #853
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Kate's Horse is not the monster (as confirmed by producers this year)

The difference between needing Locke's body and Christian's body is simple: Being Christian would not have gotten him an audience with Jacob.

Once he was able to manipulate Locke into being the leader of the others and gain their trust, he was able to use that on Richard and Ben to get into Jacob's temple at the foot and use Ben to kill Jacob.

It was all about finding the right loophole to get to that point.

My theory is now that Jacob is dead, he needs to get all the candidate's off the island so he can leave too. If there are no remaining candidates, there is noone to hold him back. (Though I think everyone assumes this).

I think MiB is also the reasoning behind the whole getting pregnant on the island thing. I assume if people cannot get pregnant there, it was harder to produce new groups of candidates.
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:16 PM   #854
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I was thinking about it, and maybe a lot of us had the wrong idea about MIB needing Locke's body.
Maybe he can just imitate the dead, and only needed Locke to kill himself. The body was brought back as part of simulating the conditions of 815.
MIB needed Locke's body brought back so people, namely Ben and Richard, would believe that Locke had risen from the dead and they would then take him to Jacob.
That could be why he said he needed the body brought back.

That would put rest to the idea that he needs the physical body of a dead person on the island to replicate them. It just so happens that the body of everyone he has posed as is on the island, except Isabella.

That's the best I got right now. An episode highlighting MIB's history/powers is really key
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:25 PM   #855
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Well yeah I thought all of that was agreed and known; that they needed his body, and they needed to recreate the conditions as best they could so they could make it back; the guitar, Christian's shoes on Locke, Sayid in cuffs not kate etc

I still think the main question is not what his true powers is or are, but what Jack asked him, who he has actually been and when. I want to know who the guy in the chair was in the cabin in season 3, I want to know who asked Locke to 'help him', and I want to know who was in the cabin with Christian in season 4.
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:39 PM   #856
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but the good people said they needed locke's body to go back.... penny's mom and jaco himself... why would they want that if bringing them back would give mib a chance to leave
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:57 PM   #857
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Which is exactly what I said will happen. I believe once the realities merge, John Locke will be risen again. Whether we just see the smoke monster fly out of his body, or have his old body emerge from the beach, I dunno. Just think/hope that's how it's gonna go.
I really hope that Locke doesn't rise from the dead. And by that I mean the body of Locke buried at the beach.

It doesn't make any sense for the "monster to fly out of his body" because that is not his body. MiB hasn't taken over Locke's actual body, he just appears as Locke.

The only way I would buy it is if Locke's consciousness switches across to ALT_Locke's body - as we've seen happen in part to Desmond and Hurley.

The only problem there is that ALT_Locke is in 2004 whilst the on-island action is presumably in 2007(?).
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:06 PM   #858
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but the good people said they needed locke's body to go back.... penny's mom and jaco himself... why would they want that if bringing them back would give mib a chance to leave
They didn't know what he was plotting. If they did they wouldn't have gone through with that.
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:08 PM   #859
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Well yeah I thought all of that was agreed and known; that they needed his body, and they needed to recreate the conditions as best they could so they could make it back; the guitar, Christian's shoes on Locke, Sayid in cuffs not kate etc

I still think the main question is not what his true powers is or are, but what Jack asked him, who he has actually been and when. I want to know who the guy in the chair was in the cabin in season 3, I want to know who asked Locke to 'help him', and I want to know who was in the cabin with Christian in season 4.
I forgot about that. Someone else was in the cabin with Christian at the same time?
I thought it was just Christian and Claire one time, and a mysterious figure another time.
Can you tell me what episode it was I'm curious to see it. I recall all that stuff with the cabin but I don't really remember any of the details.
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:14 PM   #860
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I forgot about that. Someone else was in the cabin with Christian at the same time?
I thought it was just Christian and Claire one time, and a mysterious figure another time.
Can you tell me what episode it was I'm curious to see it. I recall all that stuff with the cabin but I don't really remember any of the details.
Yeah it was the first episode of the 4th season, The Beginning of the End? - Hurley finds the cabin, and he looks through a window and sees Christian, just as another person peeps through the window, or key hole or something, you only get to see their eye.



Claire was in the cabin with Christian during season 4, Cabin Fever when Locke went to get further instructions.
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:19 PM   #861
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They didn't know what he was plotting. If they did they wouldn't have gone through with that.
See I agree with you there, like how Widmore said Locke needed to be back on the Island or the wrong side will win. I believe at that point and what he was saying was that he knew of the MIB and that Locke was important but didn't know how much, despite the fact Widmore saw Locke on the Island back in the 50s looking the same as ever.

But I do believe there is one person who knew, or who was at least prepared for Locke to be used as a vessel for the MIB, Jacob. I think Jacob obviously has some kind precognition as one of his powers, kinda like Desmond, he sees flashes or something. But the point is, he saved Locke's life, he bought him to the Island and he didn't seem surprised when he saw his body enter the temple. I know you said about their reactions and stuff. But I just get this feeling Jacob's overall plan is to have faith in his candidates and have them discover their own journey, but also part of his plan is formulated to work with, and eventually weaken MIB's own moves.
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:22 PM   #862
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I really hope that Locke doesn't rise from the dead. And by that I mean the body of Locke buried at the beach.

It doesn't make any sense for the "monster to fly out of his body" because that is not his body. MiB hasn't taken over Locke's actual body, he just appears as Locke.

The only way I would buy it is if Locke's consciousness switches across to ALT_Locke's body - as we've seen happen in part to Desmond and Hurley.

The only problem there is that ALT_Locke is in 2004 whilst the on-island action is presumably in 2007(?).
Yeah ok, it is not Locke's body, but MIB cannot change again, he can only become the smoke monster, right? so in a way, there is actually another body of John Locke walking around, and if like you said, a consciousness is shifted from the real Locke to the body MIB is using, it will more or less shift the smoke monster out and have Locke back in his body. I know, I know, it's not going to happen like that, I'm just thinking with the simplest ideas in mind - my point is - they have a lot to play with in terms of bringing the real Locke back if and hopefully when it happens.
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:54 PM   #863
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I suppose.

The way I see it though is that the Smoke Monster is trapped in the form of Locke. So, if what you suggest happens, Smokey wil be forced back into smoke form or into his own human form (MiB) and there won't be a "spare" body for Locke.

For me that's pushing it too far. Then again, this is LOST!
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Old 04-28-2010, 03:06 PM   #864
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Yeah you are right though....

But when the realities merge, or whatever happens, I'm sure it's going to involve more metaphysical and supernatural aspects that will make sense of whatever happens, at least to some degree.

What if everyone who is in the alt timeline is simply bought back/merges with those on the Island, as in those who are still alive; Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Hurley, Jin, Desmond, Sun, Ben, Miles - and then those who are not - Locke and Juliet (who is going to be Jack's ex wife) will simply be put there, their bodies and consciousness taken from the alt timeline and place back on the Island as new, yet original entities.

In my opinion Juliet is going to be a big key - she is going to be like Desmond, aside from being exposed to the same shit he was, in the same place, although at a different time, she also told Miles 'it worked' (not as a spirt, as a person alive in an alternate reality, I believe) and she is operating as a guide to get them all together to remember and have whatever happens, happen.
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Old 04-28-2010, 03:18 PM   #865
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I honestly think we will get a shit ending.

THe islandwill play out with no jack and crew stopping MiB and all of tem dieing.

But then they will all regain the memories in the alt timeline and live happily ever after, having never went to the island but regaining their memories and relationships in the new world.

Except Kate who will go to jail
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Old 04-28-2010, 03:42 PM   #866
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No, everyone is going to save their significant other because love conquers all.
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Old 04-28-2010, 03:47 PM   #867
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I am worried about the ending. And everything making sense and having a meaning, I would like everything to be answered as much as possible.

Matthew Fox has said not all the mysteries will be answered, and that questions of fate and destiny won't be concluded either. It's going to more about the characters.

But then I have read different from Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse.
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Old 04-28-2010, 03:48 PM   #868
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I honestly think we will get a shit ending...

Except Kate who will go to jail
You call that a shit ending? I've been waiting for Kate to get her comeuppance for at least 3 seasons!!

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But then they will all regain the memories in the alt timeline and live happily ever after, having never went to the island but regaining their memories and relationships in the new world.
This is kinda the thing I'm not getting. A lot of people seem to believe that Desmond awakening the ALT_Losties to what happened on the island will make them want to "back" there leading to the merging of the timelines.

My question is: Why would they wanna?

Island_Desmond had Penny but sought Widmore's approval. ALT_Des already has the approval and has now met Penny. Island_ Hurley has terrible luck and the love of his life is dead, ALT_Hurley is the luckiest man alive and has just met Libby.

Why would they want or need to go back to the island when they have everything they want/need "at home".

Obviously there are some twists and turns to come and that's all based on speculation.
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Old 04-28-2010, 03:49 PM   #869
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Ill conquer your face with my cock.

I think we are at the same thing. Love is the bees knees, so they will still have each other in the alt world, where the lovers are all still alive.
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Old 04-28-2010, 03:55 PM   #870
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You call that a shit ending? I've been waiting for Kate to get her comeuppance for at least 3 seasons!!



This is kinda the thing I'm not getting. A lot of people seem to believe that Desmond awakening the ALT_Losties to what happened on the island will make them want to "back" there leading to the merging of the timelines.

My question is: Why would they wanna?

Island_Desmond had Penny but sought Widmore's approval. ALT_Des already has the approval and has now met Penny. Island_ Hurley has terrible luck and the love of his life is dead, ALT_Hurley is the luckiest man alive and has just met Libby.

Why would they want or need to go back to the island when they have everything they want/need "at home".

Obviously there are some twists and turns to come and that's all based on speculation.
I know, its as if they are all better off etc.

This is what no one knows though, how or what will happen, its too late for them all to meet and decide what to do, get on a plane and go back. I think it's just going to be a matter of them being in the same place at the same time again, and BOOM, some kind of mega mind flash or something will happen that leads to the merging. It might not even be a merge. But there is a reason for this new reality and something has to happen. What else could it be?
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Old 04-28-2010, 04:01 PM   #871
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The regular timeline characters would not be happier in the alt. timeline. That's the whole point. We are seeing versions of their lives that could have been better, but at the same time they would not want everything that happened on the island to go away.
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Old 04-28-2010, 04:04 PM   #872
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Desmond doesnt have his child and the friends he made, he cant turn his back.
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Old 04-28-2010, 04:06 PM   #873
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I guess I also meant that the new timeline characters, at this point and if it wasn't for the other timeline and Desmond, at least they would not know anything, better or worse.
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Old 04-28-2010, 04:07 PM   #874
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He's got time to have his son, he's still in 2004 remember.
He turned his back until Widmore literally dragged him back.
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Old 04-28-2010, 04:08 PM   #875
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I have no idea how the timelines are going to come together, I just know something has to give. I can't wait to see what it is.
I don't think they will live happily ever after in the alt. timeline at all though. I think the regular timeline is where things will be resolved.
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Old 04-28-2010, 04:10 PM   #876
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I agree that that would be the more satisfying climax.
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Old 04-28-2010, 04:10 PM   #877
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.. I think the regular timeline is where things will be resolved.
I agree and would want this to happen.
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Old 04-29-2010, 07:33 AM   #878
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The writers have stated that the final episode will take place on the island haven't they? Or was it just the final scene?
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Old 04-29-2010, 01:39 PM   #879
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So after a bit of theorising and further study, it does indeed look like Ben is either going to die, or be shot by Juliet in the upcoming episodes.

I totally forgot about the Ajira water bottle Sawyer and co found in season 5 when they were time shifting. One of the people who Juliet shoots at gets shot, no doubt.
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Old 04-29-2010, 01:45 PM   #880
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So after a bit of theorising and further study, it does indeed look like Ben is either going to die, or be shot by Juliet in the upcoming episodes.

I totally forgot about the Ajira water bottle Sawyer and co found in season 5 when they were time shifting. One of the people who Juliet shoots at gets shot, no doubt.
You mean during the flashes through time?
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