MLB 2005-2006 Offseason Thread

[VonErich Lives]

Miz, we're going back and forth over the same subjects.

They let/traded all "most" of those players due to money. No one can say for sure they would have won a WS series w/ them, in the same way you can't say for sure that 2003 they should have won a WS.

The fact remains they don't keep their talent when they reacha certain pay level, if you want to blame that on them being "small market" or on "moneyball", you can pick either one.

You keep asking for examples of when money was a factor and I've listed them, you just don't accept them. Apperently anything short of Billy Beane posting himself you won't accept.

You still don't get that their isn't a right/wrong all the time, that an "opinion" isn't a "Fact", but heck, it's the holiday season so I guess whatever makes you happy.

As for the

Originally Posted by The Miz lol, show me where I have dodged a request for an example

Originally Posted by The Miz Huh? I love how whenever I point out how wrong you and VEL are, I'm either having a "hissyfit" or "crying".

So, I ask once again for examples of how

whenever I point out how wrong you and VEL are, I'm either having a "hissyfit" or "crying".

Normally, this is only directed at me, but since you called BCWWF on this one, you can show the multiple examples of him also.

[VonErich Lives]

Originally Posted by The Miz The Hudson/Mulder stuff was not directed towards you, VEL brought it up. I guess you've never seen an A's playoff game, because in every one Tejada has forgotten how to hit, field, and run. He was by far their biggest choker. 2004 and 2005 are not WS wins with Tejada at SS.

yes, I brought up them as examples along with Giambi and Tejada etc...

As for Tejada in the playoffs.

he's been in 4 div series.
he had 2 good ones and 2 bad ones.

One was really bad (2003) and that effects his "totals" big time. but take a look at his playoff stats.

2000 .409-OBP, .450-SLG, .350-AVG (not horrible numbers)
2001 .304-OBP, .429-SLG, .286-AVG (not great but nor horrible)
2002 .174-OBP, .333-SLG, .143-AVG (This is where it starts to get ugly)
2003 .087-OBP, .130-SLG, .087-AVG (this one is realy ugly, any injuries?)

It's interesting in 2002, he only had 3hits (2 in 2003) yet he had 1-double, 1-homerun, 4-RBI, 3-runs scored, and also what killed him, 7 Strike Outs.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by BCWWF I've decided to go Miz on ya'll. Enjoy.

I'm flattered my name is associated with using facts to back up arguments, instead of the BCWWF method, "Nah uh!!!!"

Originally Posted by BCWWF Johnny Damon: World Series Champion 2004, ALCS 2003 Avg. 316 HR: 10 RBI 75 Runs 117 SB 18 Mark Kotsay: Missed playoffs Avg. 280 HR: 15 RBI: 82 Runs: 75 SB: 5 Advantage: Damon

I wonder why Johnny Damon, who bats in front of Renteria, Ortiz, and Manny; scored more runs than Kotsay, who hit in front of Chavez, Payton, and Hatteberg.

Theres no doubt Damon is a better offensive player than Kotsay, but I want to know if you would've competed with Boston's mutiyear deal offer after the 2001 he had.

Originally Posted by BCWWF Jason Giambi: Made the playoffs each year Avg. 271 HR: 32 RBI: 87 Runs: 74 SB: 0 Scott Hatteberg: Missed playoffs, released? Avg. 256 HR: 7 RBI: 59 Runs: 52 SB: 0 Nick Swisher: Young, but still missed playoffs Avg. 236 HR: 21 RBI: 74 Runs: 66 SB: 0 Advantage: Giambi

Swisher was not the 1B, so that's irrelevant. And I already told you Giambi could not be afforded.

Originally Posted by BCWWF Ramon Hernandez: Made playoffs Avg. 290 HR: 12 RBI: 58 Runs: 36 SB: 1 Jason Kendall: Missed playoffs 2005 Avg. 271 HR: 0 RBI: 53 Runs: 70 SB: 8 Advantage: Close, but besides runs Hernandez

lol since Hernandez made the playoffs with the 82-80 San Diego Padres I guess that's a notch in his favor eh? Also, Jason Kendall was amazing working with the young staff this year. Blanton, Haren, and Saarloo's ERAs are much higher with Hernandez behind the plate. How can you compare their offensive stats? Kendall hits leadoff, Hernandez was like 6 or 7.

Originally Posted by BCWWF Miguel Tejada: Missed playoffs Avg. 304 HR: 26 RBI: 98 Runs: 89 SB: 5 Bobby Crosby: Missed playoffs Avg. 276 HR: 9 RBI: 38 Runs: 66 SB: 0 Advantage: Tejada

This is irrelevant because Tejada made no negotiations with the A's and had absolutely no intentions of coming back. I can assure you that Crosby would've touched home plate in the 2003 ALDS, and wouldn't have made an error on every routine play.

Originally Posted by BCWWF Jermaine Dye: World Series Champion Avg. 274 HR: 31 RBI: 86 Runs: 74 SB: 11 Jay Payton: Bitched, traded to A's, missed playoffs Avg. 267 HR: 18 RBI: 63 Runs: 62 SB: 0 (to be fair, included whole season) Advantage: Dye

Payton replaced Byrnes, not Dye. You don't read very well so I'll repeat myself:

Originally Posted by The Miz Why the hell would they want Dye back? They were paying him $11 million to K 128 times, have an OBP of .329 (awful for a corner OF), and hit into a double play in every clutch situation possible. Dye was supposed to be their cleanup hitter and he was fucking terrible. They lost the division by one game that year, I can't tell you how many lost games featured their #4 hitter K'ing 2 or 3 times. And look at his replacement, who made the league minimum. Jermaine Dye 2004: 137 G, .272/.334/.469 (.793), 23 HR, 80 RBI, 128 K Nick Swisher 2005: 131 G, .238/.325/.443 (.768), 21 HR, 74 RBI, 110 K Real drop-off in production there. Dye made over 10 million dollars more than Swisher and barely edged his numbers. Swisher put up all of his stats in the 7 or 8 hole all year, Dye put up his at 4 or 5. Also, Swisher is 24 and a rookie. Dye is 31. Who would you rather have for the next 5 years VEL, Jermaine Dye for $55 million or Swisher for $1.5 million?

--------------------

Originally Posted by BCWWF So there's probably the five biggest offensive losses and their replacements. Besides Tejada, the other four were all on playoff teams and all had better stats than their replacements in Oakland. They had the pitching to spare, but the offense is lacking. Losing all-stars and winning players doesn't help that. BUT WAIT! They have potential! Just give them a year or two to gel and they will be a sure World Series contender! Or even better, if we let them develop into stars then the Yankees can sign them in free agency and we can start all over I love potential!

I haven't said the word potential one time in this thread, good impression though. I do, however, think this team is in much better position to win in 06 than Boston and New York.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Originally Posted by The Miz I wonder why Johnny Damon, who bats in front of Renteria [..] scored more runs [..]

lol I'm surpsing Damon scored any runs infront of Renteria. Edgar was better at hitting into double plays then turning them.

[YOUR Hero]

Cardinals made a very good pick up in Juan Encarnacion. He'll put up bigger offensive numbers, I believe, as a Cardinal. He's a big stud, but never as of yet, hit 20 HRs. I believe that's all going to change. I was hoping the Jays might have made a move for him. The Jays seem like they still believe Rios is going to turn into a big HR hitter, or at least doubles hitter... Still unclear on that myself.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by VonErich Lives Miz, we're going back and forth over the same subjects. They let/traded all "most" of those players due to money. No one can say for sure they would have won a WS series w/ them, in the same way you can't say for sure that 2003 they should have won a WS. The fact remains they don't keep their talent when they reacha certain pay level, if you want to blame that on them being "small market" or on "moneyball", you can pick either one. You keep asking for examples of when money was a factor and I've listed them, you just don't accept them. Apperently anything short of Billy Beane posting himself you won't accept.

lol let's see this list VEL.

I never said money was not a factor for any of the decisions, it has been in 2.

Giambi - could not afford
Foulke - should've resigned, bad play by Beane
Mulder - got trade proposal of a life time, no reason to turn down, got a better SP and two great players for him
Hudson - needed to get rid of a SP and he had highest trade value
Dye - sucked for them in contract year, was not wanted back and did not want back
Damon - sucked for them in contract year, there was no reason to compete with Boston's offer of a multi-year deal
Tejada - not wanted back with postseason play and attitude, best SS prospect in baseball ready and waiting
Isringhuasen - not an impact player

Originally Posted by VEL You still don't get that their isn't a right/wrong all the time, that an "opinion" isn't a "Fact", but heck, it's the holiday season so I guess whatever makes you happy.

Both you and BCWWF have acted like it is a fact that Oakland has the money and refuses to spend it. Despite twice asking for evidence of this you have not responded. Even if this claim is your opinion, you need backup to support your opinion.

Originally Posted by VEL Normally, this is only directed at me, but since you called BCWWF on this one, you can show the multiple examples of him also.

I know what threads they are in, don't feel like digging through 40+ pages right now. I will get back to you however.

In the meantime I want to directly re-ask questions you have dodged.

1. Why should Beane re-sign Jermaine Dye after the awful season he had?

2. Why should Beane re-sign Johnny Damon after the season he had when Boston offers a multi-year deal? If Kotsay was traded to Boston tomorrow, and put up the same numbers Damon did in 2001, would you expect Boston to compete for him with a team offering a multiyear deal?

3. Would you turn down Mulder for Haren, Calero, and Barton when your rotation without him would look like Hudson/Harden/Zito/Blanton/Saarloos?

[The Miz]

Rangers sign Millwood 5 y/12 mil, Cleveland grabs Jason Johnson to replace Elarton as #5 starter

TOR/ARI trade is now official, Glaus for Batista and Orlando Hudson. ith Hudson switching leagues, I'd like to be the first to congratulate Mark Ellis on his 2006 AL gold glove.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Didn't Mulder also only have one year left on his contract when that trade was made?

[BCWWF]

You are biting your own butt in your rebuttals. Your excuse for just about everybody is "there is no way he could come back" or "he didn't want to come back". It is amusing that you think the A's have a better chance of winning next year than the big dogs out east. The Yankees have a better offensive player in each position on the field. No matter how average RJ, Pavano, etc. were last season, they are veterans.

With the A's it all comes back to the same thing. If they make a run next year and maybe even make the playoffs, they will have to start letting their players go because they can't retain them. Quite simply that doesn't have to happen, and letting your good players get away because there are young players coming up isn't effective management of your players.

[Joey Slugs]

Tuesday, December 27
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
J.T. Snow Giants	Orioles? Yankees? Red Sox?	Snow in Boston? Dec 27 - According to the Boston Herald, the Red Sox are negotiating with first baseman J.T. Snow, who could serve as a backup and a defensive replacement for Kevin Youkilis, and a decision may come Tuesday or Wednesday. The Herald reports that Snow is believed to be negotiating with three or four other clubs, and two of them are likely the Yankees and the Orioles.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Originally Posted by BCWWF Quite simply that doesn't have to happen, and letting your good players get away because there are young players coming up isn't effective management of your players.

Well for the A's, what they have been doing has been working so far. Once a talent gets too expensive, bring up someone who isn't going to kill you in salary. Even though this has continued to work, is it going to continue to work forever? The A's aren't perfect though, by doing this they've never had a player who has "had it" like an Ortiz, or a Jeter or something. Somebody who is clutch in the playoffs and does something in a big game. That's why they have never won in the Playoffs, and in my opinion, probably never will.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by BCWWF You are biting your own butt in your rebuttals. Your excuse for just about everybody is "there is no way he could come back" or "he didn't want to come back". It is amusing that you think the A's have a better chance of winning next year than the big dogs out east. The Yankees have a better offensive player in each position on the field.

The A's lineup is much more balanced than New York and Boston's.

You are really quite stupid if you think that because each offensive Yankee is better that gives them some huge advantage. If you've watched baseball at all the last 4 years you should've picked up on the calling card of the recent world series teams:

Chicago: pitching
Boston: pitching
Florida: pitching
Anaheim: pitching

And as far as pitching goes,

Harden > Johnson
Zito > Mussina
Blanton > Pavano
Haren > Wang
Loaiza > Small

Harden > Beckett
Zito > Clement
Blanton > Schilling
Haren > Wakefield
Loaiza > Wells or Arroyo

At this point Oakland's rotation is only on par with Chicago and Minnesota.

Originally Posted by BCWWF No matter how average RJ, Pavano, etc. were last season, they are veterans.

LMAO yes. New favorite BCWWF quote. You know who else is a veteran? Al Leiter. Pat Borders. Benito Santiago. What does being a veteran have to do with not sucking?

RJ - excellent year in 05
Mussina - 4.45 ERA, 1.37 WHIP, but...uh... he's a veteran!
Pavano - Well, he's gotten raped in every start he's every made in the AL, but I guess I can't be too harsh on a veteran.
Wang - 4+ ERA, actually better stats than Mussina/PAvano, but he loses mad points in the veteran category
Small - A veteran with good stats! Yes! I'm quote sure he'll be able to repeat his 10-0, 3.20 in 2006.

Why have good players when you could have veterans?

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by sTiMa34 Well for the A's, what they have been doing has been working so far. Once a talent gets too expensive, bring up someone who isn't going to kill you in salary. Even though this has continued to work, is it going to continue to work forever? The A's aren't perfect though, by doing this they've never had a player who has "had it" like an Ortiz, or a Jeter or something. Somebody who is clutch in the playoffs and does something in a big game. That's why they have never won in the Playoffs, and in my opinion, probably never will.

How many playoff games have you seen Rich Harden, Dan Johnson, Nick Swisher, Bobby Crosby, Jason Kendall, Milton Bradley, Mark Ellis, Joe Blanton, and Huston Street play? How do you know if they "have it" or not?

Zito "has it", check out his postseason numbers.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by VonErich Lives yes, I brought up them as examples along with Giambi and Tejada etc... As for Tejada in the playoffs. he's been in 4 div series. he had 2 good ones and 2 bad ones. One was really bad (2003) and that effects his "totals" big time. but take a look at his playoff stats. 2000 .409-OBP, .450-SLG, .350-AVG (not horrible numbers) 2001 .304-OBP, .429-SLG, .286-AVG (not great but nor horrible) 2002 .174-OBP, .333-SLG, .143-AVG (This is where it starts to get ugly) 2003 .087-OBP, .130-SLG, .087-AVG (this one is realy ugly, any injuries?) It's interesting in 2002, he only had 3hits (2 in 2003) yet he had 1-double, 1-homerun, 4-RBI, 3-runs scored, and also what killed him, 7 Strike Outs.

In 2000-2001, Tejada was not a big star player yet so getting anything out of him was nice. 2002 Giambi was gone, the weight was on Chavez/Tejada, both of them fell asleep. It wasn't even Tejada's offense that killed them, in 2003 if he and Byrnes can touch home plate, Yankees/Red Sox Boone walkoff never happens. Not to mention is bobble or bad throw every time a big out or DP was needed.

Originally Posted by YOUR Hero Cardinals made a very good pick up in Juan Encarnacion. He'll put up bigger offensive numbers, I believe, as a Cardinal. He's a big stud, but never as of yet, hit 20 HRs. I believe that's all going to change. I was hoping the Jays might have made a move for him. The Jays seem like they still believe Rios is going to turn into a big HR hitter, or at least doubles hitter... Still unclear on that myself.

encarnacion is a mess in the outfield though.

I agree with you on Rios(a.k.a mr ground out to short")

[VonErich Lives]

Originally Posted by The Miz In 2000-2001, Tejada was not a big star player yet so getting anything out of him was nice. 2002 Giambi was gone, the weight was on Chavez/Tejada, both of them fell asleep. It wasn't even Tejada's offense that killed them, in 2003 if he and Byrnes can touch home plate, Yankees/Red Sox Boone walkoff never happens. Not to mention is bobble or bad throw every time a big out or DP was needed.

Ok, for now on, you just let me know which stats we can count and which we can't, it will save us all time.

[YOUR Hero]

Miz, while I tend to agree with you on most things. I find it pretty weak on your end to blame an entire team failing on a bobbled ball or base running mistake., These things happen all the time and are simply the easy things to remember when discussing a lost series. There are so many factors involved that it's really not fair to state they are why things went wrong. Also, it's pretty shitty, IMO, to feel a player sucks and should be traded based on an incident such as that. Tejeda, for example is better than one missed play. I understand Crosby was coming up the system, I understand that Tejeda was looking for huge sums of money, but it's pro baseball and he was deserving of it. Oakland should have tried to keep him.
You posted some great posts in this thread, but that doesn't change the fact that Oakland moves players once they reach a certain plateau, they get good value for them, yes, however, they trade them off because of salary concerns as much as anything.

[BCWWF]

Once again, if you don't keep players who are in their prime, you will remain consistent but barring a big break you will never win a World Series.

It's not a hard concept to grasp, The Miz, they got rid of at least five offensive players who are much better than their replacements right now. Damon, Giambi, and Tejada are three of the top offensive players in the league, and there is no doubt the A's are below par offensively.

[BCWWF]

Let's compare the A's to the Twins. Oftentimes they are compared because they have both been consistant small market teams, but in reality Terry Ryan is a much better GM.

The Twins built a successful team with for the most part average players. When their contracts ran up, Ryan let guys like Koskie, Mientkiewicz, Guzman, Rivas, Mays, Milton, etc. go. Once another team overpays for them, they all do worse on a different team without the Twins base.

So when Ryan lets the more "role player" types walk elsewhere for more money (or trade them) he finds room to sign the important guys, like Hunter, Stewart, Santana, Radke, Nathan, etc.

By doing this, they get to keep the big guns while basically nothing walks away.

Then with some guys, for example Pierzynski, the Twins no longer needed his service so they called up San Francisco. For AJ, they got low priced middle reliever Joe Nathan (who would become an All-Star closer), Francisco Lariano (a AA prospect who is said to be better than Johan at that stage, and who will start the season in the MLB) and Boof Bonser (current AAA pitcher who will be in the Majors soon).

That is for AJ Pierzynski.

Last season didn't go as expected because Morneau hit a sophomore slump, but I have no reason to believe the Twins can't win the division again this year. The pitching staff is as good as anybody in the league (Santana-Radke-Silva-Lohse-Baker, with Jesse Crain, Juan Rincon, and Joe Nathan in the pen) and a batting order that will go Stewart-Castillo-Mauer-Morneau-Hunter-White-Ford-Batista-Bartlett.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I don't know if their clutch or not, that remains to be seen. Until you do something in the clutch, can't really be called though can you? So you can call it choking, or call it not being clutch. The A's haven't had it before - what makes this year any different? Different prospects, better pitching? For the last few years they've great pitching staffs but they couldn't get out of the first round. I'll give it to Beane, he is able to field great teams by managing his money. Some teams can't even get it right with a lot of money (Mets) so I'll give him credit there. I can't dispute that, but there is something about them, I don't know. I'll admit, I'm not that big of a baseball fan and maybe I am just blinded by the media or something. I see them doing the same old shit, "choking in the playoffs"..Like I don't see why this year is gonna be any different?

[BCWWF]

Well I would rather have Rich Harden than a World Series MVP pitching for me in the playoffs, thats for sure.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by VonErich Lives Ok, for now on, you just let me know which stats we can count and which we can't, it will save us all time.

Who said anything about discounting? I'm not responding to any more posts you make until you answer the 3 questions you've continuously failed to answer.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by YOUR Hero Miz, while I tend to agree with you on most things. I find it pretty weak on your end to blame an entire team failing on a bobbled ball or base running mistake. These things happen all the time and are simply the easy things to remember when discussing a lost series. There are so many factors involved that it's really not fair to state they are why things went wrong. Also, it's pretty shitty, IMO, to feel a player sucks and should be traded based on an incident such as that. Tejeda, for example is better than one missed play. I understand Crosby was coming up the system, I understand that Tejeda was looking for huge sums of money, but it's pro baseball and he was deserving of it. Oakland should have tried to keep him. You posted some great posts in this thread, but that doesn't change the fact that Oakland moves players once they reach a certain plateau, they get good value for them, yes, however, they trade them off because of salary concerns as much as anything.

1-1 game in the 6th, Byrnes makes it home but forgets to touch the plate, Tejada decided to stand there and let Varitek tag him. Its not like they tripped and fell and failed to reach home, I understand that sort of thing, it happens, these were mental mistakes any little leaguer over the age of 12 would not have made. They play with little league fundementals, Oakland wins 3-1 and sweeps the series. Tejada is a great player, but it didn't seem like a coincidence that the 2 straight years where he was the "team leader", he could not hit or field anything. With Crosby in the minors, and Tejada consistently displaying a bad attitude, it was time for him to move on. Tejada was not happy with the teams direction, he didn't want to deal with a "re-building year". His loss, he goes to Baltimore in a year they claim they will contend, finish with a much worse record then the A's, and is now in on an absolute mess of a team and wants out. He's an amazing hitter who has always been below-average defensively and never shown good baseball smarts. I never said Tejada sucks, but I'll take Crosby.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by sTiMa34 I don't know if their clutch or not, that remains to be seen. Until you do something in the clutch, can't really be called though can you? So you can call it choking, or call it not being clutch. The A's haven't had it before - what makes this year any different? Different prospects, better pitching? For the last few years they've great pitching staffs but they couldn't get out of the first round. I'll give it to Beane, he is able to field great teams by managing his money. Some teams can't even get it right with a lot of money (Mets) so I'll give him credit there. I can't dispute that, but there is something about them, I don't know. I'll admit, I'm not that big of a baseball fan and maybe I am just blinded by the media or something. I see them doing the same old shit, "choking in the playoffs"..Like I don't see why this year is gonna be any different?

I don't understand your logic. So because Tejada, Byrnes, and Mulder have played poorly in the playoffs in the past, that means Crosby, Swisher, and Blanton will? It's a completely different team than the ones that choked wearing the same colored uniform.

As far as why they should be better this year:

1. Part of their awful April/May was Blanton/Haren/Saarloos adjusting to being an MLB starter. After those 2 months they were lights out. They shoud all be much better in their second year.
2. They only had Crosby for 84 games last year, sure he could get injured again, but you can't assume that.
3. Swisher, Johnson now have experience under their belt
4. Jason Kendall sucked last year, there's no guarantee of a bounce-back but most guys do in their second year of AL play after spending alot of time in the NL
5. Hatteberg, the most useless hitter of all time, is gone from the 5 hole
6. Milton Bradley and Jay Payton are so much better than Byrnes
7. Full season of Huston Street, some early Dotel fuckups killed them last year
8. Improved bullpen with addition of Gaudin and subtraction of Rincon
9. They still have the pitching and defense, with these two things you can always contend

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by BCWWF Well I would rather have Rich Harden than a World Series MVP pitching for me in the playoffs, thats for sure.

Good, you've learned something, Beckett has never pitched an American League game and his ERA was a full run higher than Harden's despite pitching in the NL last year.

You're right though, Beckett was awesome in 2003 and is more valuable due to the 2 good games he pitched. You know who else was awesome in 2003? Esteban Loaiza. You know who else was a WS MVP? Livan Hernandez.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Well the Oakland A's should run away with it this year then?

[DaveWadding]

D'Backs get:
2B Orlando Hudson
P Miguel Batista

Jays get:
3B Troy Glaus
SS Sergio Santos

done deal. I like it.

[The Miz]

Originally Posted by sTiMa34 Well the Oakland A's should run away with it this year then?

No, you just asked me why I thought this year would be different so I showed how they've improved from last year. There is no clear best team right now, I think Oakland on paper is capable of running away with the West but I don't think it will happen, Oakland/LAA till the end, Texas hanging around for a little bit, Seattle in the gutter. I think Chicago is still a superior team.

[The Miz]

O's sign Burnitz to a 2 yr/6 mil per deal. Can anyone can think of a worse offseason acquisition?

[toxic rooster]

Coming from an uninformed baseball fan like myself who's only ever been interested when World Series time rolls round, the Tribe paying 1yr/$4m-2yr/$11.5m for a starter with an ERA over 4.5?

Granted Jason Johnson was playing for a the Tigers who have a poor defensive record, but isn't that a bit steep?

[BCWWF]

Bartolo Colon won the Cy Young, which makes him the best pitcher in the whole American League.

[VonErich Lives]

Originally Posted by The Miz Who said anything about discounting? I'm not responding to any more posts you make until you answer the 3 questions you've continuously failed to answer.

Originally Posted by The Miz In 2000-2001, Tejada was not a big star player yet so getting anything out of him was nice.

So, if you're not a "big star player" it doesn't count... I get it, actually I don't. You love your stats but only when they suit you.

Originally Posted by The Miz 1. Why should Beane re-sign Jermaine Dye after the awful season he had? 2. Why should Beane re-sign Johnny Damon after the season he had when Boston offers a multi-year deal? If Kotsay was traded to Boston tomorrow, and put up the same numbers Damon did in 2001, would you expect Boston to compete for him with a team offering a multiyear deal? 3. Would you turn down Mulder for Haren, Calero, and Barton when your rotation without him would look like Hudson/Harden/Zito/Blanton/Saarloos?

1) I'll give you Dye, but you might think while is avg slipped his fielding and obp were still good and he was coming off an injury, they might give him a shot.

2) Because one off year doesn't always kill a player, because while is avg slipped he still had speed, when he did make contact he was still getting to 2nd base, he was still stealing bases, it wasn't like he completely fell apart.

3) No, I wouldn't, Mulder was proven at the time the others weren't.

Now, I'm still waiting for how "every time you point out how me and bcwwf are wrong we say you're crying or throwing a hissy fit". I mean, it shouldn't take you this long since.

Originally Posted by The Miz I know what threads they are in

I mean, there has to be a LOT of them, since your always right and everyone else is wrong and you're always telling people they're wrong... I could pull all the threads where you tell someone they're wrong or toss in an insult or dodge a question to ask another, but it's really a waste of time, rather then just sticking to the subject "you're wrong... blah blah blah, you always tell me I'm crying or throwing a hissy fit when I won't out how wrong you are..."

You still don't get it and you never will...

Anyway, we just keep repeating the same crap now, so I'll let the others continue this with you if they wish, I'm done.

to summarise, yes the moves worked out, however if Oakland was willing to spend more money they wouldn't have made most of those moves, Why do you think they got an offer for Mulder? "Beane wasn't looking to trade him", you don't really believe that one? do you?

Originally Posted by The Miz I don't understand your logic. So because Tejada, Byrnes, and Mulder have played poorly in the playoffs in the past, that means Crosby, Swisher, and Blanton will? It's a completely different team than the ones that choked wearing the same colored uniform. As far as why they should be better this year: 1. Part of their awful April/May was Blanton/Haren/Saarloos adjusting to being an MLB starter. After those 2 months they were lights out. They shoud all be much better in their second year. 2. They only had Crosby for 84 games last year, sure he could get injured again, but you can't assume that. 3. Swisher, Johnson now have experience under their belt 4. Jason Kendall sucked last year, there's no guarantee of a bounce-back but most guys do in their second year of AL play after spending alot of time in the NL 5. Hatteberg, the most useless hitter of all time, is gone from the 5 hole 6. Milton Bradley and Jay Payton are so much better than Byrnes 7. Full season of Huston Street, some early Dotel fuckups killed them last year 8. Improved bullpen with addition of Gaudin and subtraction of Rincon 9. They still have the pitching and defense, with these two things you can always contend

lol improved bullpen with the addiiton of Gaudin? The Gaudin that couldn't get a single guy out? gimme a break.

[Adder]

Oakland gave up prospects to get a volatile Milton Bradley. Goes against everything they've been doing over the last decade or whatever. Especially considering they didn't get rid of a higher priced player upon acquiring him. Hell, they went and added to the payroll beyond that with Loaiza and is trying to land the Big Hurt.

[RoXer]

I want to defend the A's, but it's hard to remember what really happened and whats happening in my MVP Dynasty

[Excellance of Execution]

I'm actually surprised the A's resigned Chavez a couple years back. They must not have a good 3rd base prospect in the minors.

[Joey Slugs]

Wednesday, December 28
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Joe Randa Padres	Pirates	Bucs, Randa close Dec 28 - The Pirates are closing in on a contract with free-agent third baseman Joe Randa, reports ESPN.com Insider Jerry Crasnick. The Pirates have been looking for a stabilizing influence at third base after losing out to the Dodgers in a bid to sign Bill Mueller. Randa will slide in at third base and allow manager Jim Tracy to use Freddy Sanchez in a utility role. Randa, 36, hit .276 with 17 homers and 68 RBI for Cincinnati and San Diego in 2005.
Tuesday, December 27
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
J.T. Snow Giants	Orioles? Yankees? Red Sox?	Snow in Boston? Dec 27 - According to the Boston Herald, the Red Sox are negotiating with first baseman J.T. Snow, who could serve as a backup and a defensive replacement for Kevin Youkilis, and a decision may come Tuesday or Wednesday. The Herald reports that Snow is believed to be negotiating with three or four other clubs, and two of them are likely the Yankees and the Orioles.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Jeromy Burnitz Cubs	Orioles	Bound for Baltimore? Dec 27 - The Baltimore Sun is reporting that free-agent outfielder Jeromy Burnitz and the Orioles are closing in on a two-year, $12 million contract that could be finalized by the end of this week.
WHO	INTERESTED	THE SKINNY
Ryan Franklin Mariners	Pirates? Astros? Royals? Nationals? Giants? Rangers? Diamondbacks? Dodgers? Phillies?	Franklin generating interest Dec 27 - Ryan Franklin, who became a free agent last week when Seattle declined to tender him a contract, continues to attract interest from teams in the market for a back-end-of-the-rotation starter, reports ESPN.com's Jerry Crasnick. Agent Jeff Frye has been using the recent deals signed by Jason Johnson, Brett Tomko and Scott Elarton as a framework in Franklin's talks with clubs. Franklin has a 23-44 record over the past three seasons, but a lower ERA (4.49) and more innings pitched (603) than any of those three starters. Tomko signed a two-year, $8.75 million deal with the Dodgers last week, while Elarton agreed to a two-year, $8 million contract with Kansas City. Cleveland signed Johnson for one year and $4 million on Monday.

[Adder]

Garland re-signed with the WSOX today.

White Sox sign Garland to three-year, $29 million contract

December 28, 2005 CHICAGO (AP) -- Pitcher Jon Garland agreed to a three-year, $29 million contract Wednesday with the 2005 World Series champion Chicago White Sox. Garland, who was eligible to become a free agent after the 2006 season, will receive $7 million next year, $10 million in 2007 and $12 million in 2008, the White Sox said in a statement.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_yl...v=ap&type=lgns

[Adder]

Report: Palmeiro still not sure why he tested positive

December 28, 2005 NEW YORK (AP) -- Free-agent first baseman Rafael Palmeiro still isn't sure why he tested positive for steroids, he told The New York Times for a story published Wednesday. The 41-year-old Palmeiro was suspended in August for 10 days by Major League Baseball. His steroid test in May came up positive -- just six weeks after he testified in Congress that he had never taken the performance-enhancing drugs.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_yl...v=ap&type=lgns

[Adder]

Former star reliever arrested on robbery charges

December 28, 2005

PALM BEACH GARDENS, Fla. (AP) -- Jeff Reardon, one of the top relief pitchers in baseball history, was released on $5,000 bail after his arrest on charges of robbing a jewelry store.
The 50-year-old former pitcher apologized to officers and blamed his actions on medication he is taking for depression, police said. He was released Tuesday night, with his arraignment set for Jan. 27.
Reardon, who retired in 1994 and ranks sixth in career saves, walked into Hamilton Jewelers at the Gardens Mall on Monday and handed an employee a note saying he had a gun and the store was being robbed, police said.
He fled the store with an undisclosed amount of cash. Police found him at a nearby restaurant, recovered the stolen money and charged him with armed robbery. Lt. David O'Neill said Reardon didn't have a gun and offered no resistance when he was handcuffed.
"He said it was the medication that made him do it and that he was sorry," O'Neill said. He said Reardon has lived in the city for more than 20 years and has never caused problems. Reardon's attorney, Mitchell Beers, said the former pitcher had a 20-year-old son who died of a drug overdose in February 2004, which has been "very difficult for him and his family," and has been on medication for depression. Reardon, who is married and has two other children, also underwent heart angioplasty last week and has been taking medication for that.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_yl...v=ap&type=lgns