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#1 |
Soundly Defeated Wadding
Posts: 40,590
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If I thought they were going to use these guys to put over younger stars, I wouldn't have much of a problem with it. They are just using them for paydays. It is so short sited and irresponsible. Having Batista win the Rumble does nothing for anybody and it denied a future star a spot. Again. And next year it will happen in some capacity again. And the year after. Again.
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#2 |
Soundly Defeated Wadding
Posts: 40,590
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And no. You don't get to tell me Batista is a big deal after the Rumble. You just don't get to do that anymore. I'm sorry. I can't allow that to happen. You at least don't get to tell me he is a bigger deal than Bryan right now.
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#3 | ||
Amazon Affiliate
Posts: 42,694
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DB is super-over with the fans. I'm not even arguing that Batista is a house-hold name, but he's definitely done a lot to increase his value to the rest of the world thanks to his movie roles and other stuff. Just like Lesnar became super valuable thanks to his UFC matches. That stuff does factor in. And if, as some people suggest, Batista going over at Rumble leads to putting over DB even more, then good. I don't know what is planned or unplanned here, but it seems like DB is going to get his due. That said, the logic behind bringing in Lesnar and Batista makes sense, just like the logic behind bringing back Rock made sense. Would people be responding nearly this much, fans or non-fans, if Sheamus or CM Punk had won the Rumble? Or if Reigns had won? If DB went in and won the Rumble after losing to Wyatt, I think that would have been a great storyline in and of itself, coming back from defeat to win one of the biggest matches of the year. That said, how long would people be talking about the Rumble? It'd be done and over with and we'd be talking about something else. Batista winning the Rumble has resulted in a greater show of support for Bryan, lots of talk about the Rumble, controversy over Batista, talk about Chamber, more intensity. Hell, it's gotten ME talking about wrestling and I haven't paid attention for a while now. Seems like a good idea from the standpoint of getting people talking and interested and even, dare I say it...invested in the outcome of the matches. |
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#4 |
Over Like Rover
Posts: 38,444
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this whole thing seems to be based on 1. him being removed from the events 2. his cryptic tweet and 3. the interview he did with Ariel Helwani, which has taken his "maybes" (he may leave in July, he doesn't know how PPV cheques are going to work once the Network starts up) into facts and generalizations ("believed he was going to leave", "the talent" wondering how payoffs will look etc) when in reality there's no official word from anybody.
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#5 |
Over Like Rover
Posts: 38,444
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and seriously, guys, the dronepool article was a pisstake. Not fact. Or anything based in fact other than that Punk once said "yeah, wasn't really a fan of guys coming back for Mania paydays".
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#6 | ||
Amazon Affiliate
Posts: 42,694
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As for Hogan, he had been gone for years, as had Nash and Hall. They hadn't done anything and were riding on their legitimate past appeal. Few people can compare to Hogan's legendary popularity or his legendary role in wrestling, but it's not inappropriate to compare the two returns. Especially when you realize that Batista certainly does compare to Kevin Nash in terms of ability and star-power. Quote:
If the WWE were to actually use him correctly in his best position (that of the asshole), I dunno, maybe it could make money AND also please the hardcore wrestling fans? Rumors are pretty reliable in my experience. |
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#7 | |
Out Of Step
Posts: 12,059
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#8 | |
Posts: 9,670
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#9 |
Hey Mister!
Posts: 54,952
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Punk was just recently the longest reigning champ outside of Bruno. He got the priviledge of working with Taker at mania. He's been in high profile matches with the company's top heels since then, all building to a match with Triple H at mania, which would be the climax of the authority angle, i.e. the biggest angle of the year.
Austin said the right move would have been to try and talk through the problem, rather than just go home. Say WWE doesn't give in to what Punk wants. He should at least work through Wrestlemania anyway. Why? Because he never has to work a day in his life ever again, and it's all thanks to WWE. Yeah, he worked his ass off, and things in the company may not be to his liking, but they paid him ungodly amounts of money. Maybe I'm old school but I believe that if someone is paying you that kind of money, you act like a professional and do your job. I'm not saying you don't have an opinion, or that you even have to keep it. But at least stay til Mania. Leaving now screws over a lot of people. |
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#10 | |
Father of Hinduship
Posts: 21,083
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I'm just speculating on my part, but I'm pretty sure that Punk has vocalized his concerns backstage numerous times.........to deaf ears. If Punk is being booked to buried by Triple H at Mania (at this stage in their careers), then I'd be pretty pissed as well. |
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#11 | |
Father of Hinduship
Posts: 21,083
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Now all of a sudden, you have Orton being pushed as the #1 heel instead? (i.e. a guy that has had numerous discipline problems, and was pretty much an afterthought for 2 years before his re-push). Why can a guy like Batista just waltz-in and take a high profile spot? Again - it's Vince's company and he can do whatever he wants, but the flip side is that CM Punk is an independent contractor.........and he can do whatever the hell he wants as well. |
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#12 | |
Hey Mister!
Posts: 54,952
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He was in high profile matches with Taker, Jericho, and Lesnar. From there he worked with Ryback, who was just coming off his feud with Cena over the title. Then he and Bryan feuded with the Wyatts and The Shield, the hottest new heels in the company. Not exactly Sunday Night Heat duty. |
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#13 |
Out Of Step
Posts: 12,059
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You can't keep the same guy on top forever though, even Cena got taken out of the title scene for a while, like Fignuts said it wasn't like he was feuding with El Torito.
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#14 |
Soundly Defeated Wadding
Posts: 40,590
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How can you even compare Cena and Punks runs? Cena has been at the very top of the company for ten years and has essentially main evented every Wrestlemania since his rise. Punk hasn't main evented one.
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#15 |
Hey Mister!
Posts: 54,952
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Punk should have main evented against John Cena against the Miz. I'll give him that. But that's the only year it makes sense, since Punk vs anyone isn't getting top billing over Cena vs Rock, or even against a Bryan vs Batista/Orton match this year.
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#16 |
Out Of Step
Posts: 12,059
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Pretty much what Fignuts said. Cena is their Hogan, he'll be pushed ahead of pretty much everyone. Punk has only been a main event level guy for a handful of years, and a few of those featured matches that were guaranteed top billing no matter what. Punk getting dropped out the title picture keeps him fresh, he's still featured prominently though.
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#17 |
Posts: 24,441
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If this were The Great Khali stating frustration at the part timers coming in to top spots? Would anybody be arsed?
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#18 |
Hey Mister!
Posts: 54,952
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Dunno why I'm even arguing. Like I said, still leaning towards work.
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#19 |
Father of Hinduship
Posts: 21,083
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#20 |
Out Of Step
Posts: 12,059
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If it's legit, his contract expires July, would be beyond daft not to take the 'Mania bonus money before going home, bitch on twitter till then but get paid at least. Probably 2+2 equals doghouse again though.
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#21 |
king of sucks
Posts: 4,414
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yeah that is dumb punk should have waited. now i guess he can fued with jeff hardy in the indys
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#22 |
Soundly Defeated Wadding
Posts: 40,590
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No. Having your babyface main event of WM get booed out of the building isn't a good idea. Nobody is going to convince me of this. There could be possible good things to come out of it as byproducts, but the end does not justify the means. There were plenty of ways everyone could've benefitted instead of the shitstorm that was Rumble.
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#23 | |
Father of Hinduship
Posts: 21,083
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As it relates to Batista however, we don't even know if he'll still be a face by Mania'. Lot can change. Wait and see. |
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#24 | |
Amazon Affiliate
Posts: 42,694
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I don't know if the WWE staff understands the psychology of the fans, but it seems like the idea of it being a set-up to some extent shouldn't be absolutely dismissed. Either way, I don't see Batista winning at Mania. I also doubt that he would have been facing Orton in the main-event. Fuck, Orton has to lose the title at Chamber just to set up a decent match at Mania. Here's what I think would have happened, assuming DB wasn't supposed to happen and really was getting depushed. Batista wins Rumble, turns heel, Orton drops title to (popular face who is not DB). Batista loses at Mania for a happy ending. If DB wasn't meant for a depush, then it makes sense for Cena, the only other top face to get involved with a non-title feud directly after the Orton deal. Does anyone really think Batista was meant to be a face when he main-evented Mania? |
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#25 |
king of sucks
Posts: 4,414
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i wish jeff jerret could start another wrestling company with a tv deal, we need a better tna
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#26 |
Hey Mister!
Posts: 54,952
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He vocalized his concerns and they gave him a contract with pretty much everything he wanted, made him champion numerous times, and have placed him in main event, high profile programs ever since.
Sounds like he got treated pretty well. Punk just seems like one of those people who are never happy. He could be booked to win every match he wrestles, beat Bruno's run with the title, and get promised a spot in the HoF as "The Greatest Wrestler Who Ever Lived", and he'd still find something to bitch about. And yeah, WWE as a corporation are vicious assholes. That didn't just start last Tuesday, and it's never been a secret. Punk knew that when he signed his first contract, so you can't really use that as an excuse. |
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#27 |
Soundly Defeated Wadding
Posts: 40,590
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If Batista is heel at Mania, it is because they called an audible and not because they planned it that way.
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#28 | |
Father of Hinduship
Posts: 21,083
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Who cares if Batista's direction wasn't pre-planned. Batista was a top star in the WWE and had been away for 4 years. Why wouldn't the WWE see if they could push him as a Top Face? Back in 2004 - Edge returned from a serious injury after a long layoff, and his character started getting boo'd shortly. The WWE then turned him heel. In 2007 - Jericho returned after a 2.5 year absence and started getting boo'd shortly afterwards. The WWE turned him heel shortly afterwards as well. What's wrong with calling an audible if some pre-determined plan goes wrong? |
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#29 |
Over Like Rover
Posts: 38,444
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like a million other things in the history of pro wrestling
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#30 |
Soundly Defeated Wadding
Posts: 40,590
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Alright. I'm just saying let's stop acting like they have a master plan. It is very clear that they do not have control of their audience right now. Rumble was a complete disaster. If they get control again, it will be because they regained it with some damage control and not because of any sort of plan. They fucked up. Badly. Which is fine. But to deny that they fucked up badly is just kind of ignoring the problem at this point. Smarks can be right sometimes.
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#31 | |
Hey Mister!
Posts: 54,952
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#32 |
Over Like Rover
Posts: 38,444
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still not buying into this theory that they somehow "fucked up badly" or that it was a "complete disaster" because they didn't enter Bryan into the Rumble in front of a huge smart crowd/the "smartest" crowd since last years post Mania RAW. If anything, the mistake was not knowing that was the kind of crowd they'd be getting and at least giving Batista (and Rey to an extent) a fighting chance in front of an audience like that. But hindsight is 20/20.
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#33 | |
Soundly Defeated Wadding
Posts: 40,590
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#34 | |
Over Like Rover
Posts: 38,444
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#35 |
Soundly Defeated Wadding
Posts: 40,590
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You are being really ridiculous. how many people do you know that don't use the internet? Because I know very few. And this wasn't a pwinsider poll. It was a WWE poll. People from all walks of life like the official WWE facebook page. It isn't even close to all smarks. And the margin of people that didn't like it is so vast compared to those that did. Man. I'm sorry. I really like you, but you are just wrong here. It was a complete and utter failure. The guy that is supposed to main event WM as a babyface got viciously booed. A guy that just made his return like a week prior. It was not a good look whatsoever.
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#36 | ||
The Champ is Here!
Posts: 13,614
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#37 | |
boop/bop/beep
Posts: 38,430
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#38 | |
Amazon Affiliate
Posts: 42,694
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*Rog, those are fair points, but I still think the comparison is apt. It's not as if I was comparing the return of someone like Maven to the epic(ly disappointing) return of the nWo. Batista was a multiple-time former Champion, had memorable feuds with Cena and Mysterio, had Hollywood exposure that the WWE has ALWAYS been keen on and he still looks like a badass. I imagine a lot of fans were pretty excited about his return and it would make sense for the character to play an important role at both the Rumble and Mania. I will say that when the nWo returned, I think it was far too late. If not for them running out their contracts it would have been so much easier to capitalize earlier. If not for my love of Scott Hall and my hopes for a nWo return that would recreate the circumstances of the original angle I probably would have panned it altogether. The best thing that came from it, was the return of baby-face Hogan and The Rock's heel turn (their match as well) and I detest Hogan. So if Batista's initially well-received return isn't as momentous as the return of the nWo I concede the point, but it's sure does bring back memories. |
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#39 |
Posts: 9,670
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Batista's Hollywood exposure doesn't exist yet. The marketing drive hasn't really started for GotG yet, never mind it's not out until August and it's not like people are anticipating it like The Avengers. At present he's got no Hollywood appeal - are they so desperate to have him there when the time comes that they'll send him to the top spot 7 months in advance to keep him happy when he generates a bit of interest for playing third billing in a summer blockbuster. That also assumes that the audience likes him.
The nWo returning wasn't great, but it was still a once in a lifetime opportunity that people had actively dreamed about at one point. That is not Batista in the WM main event by any stretch of the imagination. Also, nWo was quite a unique thing, and came into a product that was pretty diverse and full of new sights- Chris Jericho was main eventing wrestlemania . This is a shit retread of the Rock's return which happened an exhausting two times in a row. Something not great happens twice and then you follow it up with the same thing for a third time, only even worse? |
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#40 |
shisen sucks all the cock
Posts: 1,617
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guys......you can't have a work when neither of the 2 parties are commenting. if punk Is laying low and wwe isn't acknowledging shit then its not a work.
and besides its pg era and app friendly now the demographic that's catered to does not know what a work is |
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