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Old 12-22-2016, 09:53 PM   #81
Blonde Moment
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Originally Posted by DaveWadding View Post
Pentagon Jr.
Quite frankly the whole show ....
I wish the WWe was paying attention
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Old 12-22-2016, 09:53 PM   #82
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But seriously his comeuppance was pretty awesome.
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Old 12-23-2016, 04:35 AM   #83
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Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
AJ Lee couldn't carry Charlotte's..... What the devil do women carry? Anyway, Charlotte is way better.
That right there is obvious intentional trolling. I had already made a point, and nowhere in that point was me making a comparison of which woman was better- a comparison made more unfair by timing and circumstance. But, hey, don't let what was written get in the way. Just disguise it better in future, please.
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Old 12-23-2016, 08:59 AM   #84
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Vader.

He, in the warning days of his life, used Twitter in a way it SHOULD have been used from the onset. In the process, he made folks who have never heard of the little British boy and the other guy care about them. Ricochet vs. Ospreay would have eventually been seen now, but wouldn't have had the buzz it has had it not been for a crotchety old timer.

And in his use of Twitter, he not only made folks care about Ospreay, he booked himself a payday. In 2016. And it drew. That is why I put Vader in as Wrestler of the Year.
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Old 12-25-2016, 03:53 PM   #85
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I'll elaborate on my Matt Hardy choice.

Let's look at Matt compared to AJ, where were both of them a year ago? In late 2015, AJ was on top in NJPW, he was a fixture at ROH and was one of the main guys in the Bullet Club (the top stable outside of the WWE). On the other hand Matt Hardy was a semi-main eventer in TNA. He'd had some moderate success there in the tag division and realistically, the only reason he became Heavyweight Champion there was because Jeff was injured and a "Hardy" was gonna walk out of BFG with the title because they were in North Carolina.

So this year, yes AJ has had a ton of success. He made a huge debut at the Royal Rumble, had great feuds as a heel and face and is one of the main eventers in the largest promotion in the world.

On the other hand, NOBODY saw at the beginning of 2016, that Matt Hardy would be one of the most talked about wrestlers this year. He's completely reinvented himself, arguably surpassed his brother as the "better Hardy brother", and like I said, he's gotten more wrestling fans to talk about TNA, that they have in years. People chant DELETE on RAW and Smackdown, people are actually watching TNA

So I guess the argument would come down to, AJ was already a star and then became a top guy in the one place he hadn't been yet. On the other hand, Matt had always been "the other Hardy brother", and he is now one of the biggest wrestlers in professional wrestling today. I gotta give it to Matt
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Old 12-25-2016, 07:04 PM   #86
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Nice reasoning, but it doesn't hold up for me.

It is simply surreal how well AJ Styles has fit into the WWE. I've always had faith in him, because he's always had that "Tony Hawk" charisma. That seems like a very dated reference, but he's got that "what he does is really cool" thing about his ring work. But to see him come in, with his own name, essentially maintain his entire gimmick and presentation, steal the spotlight constantly and knock it out of the park in the ring and on the mic, allegedly making a huge fan out of Vince McMahon is absolutely incredible stuff.

AJ Styles is the WWE World Heavyweight Champion. His name is now on the same list as Bruno Sammartino, Hulk Hogan, Steve Austin and The Rock. Not only that, he has held it for over 100 days. The James Ellsworth stuff was dumb, but that looks to be over now. Plus, he's got guys like Jim Ross saying that they haven't seen someone this good since Shawn Michaels, and I actually agree. He's synthesized the in-ring demands of New Japan with the sports entertainment shtickery of TNA and become the most consistent deliverer in professional wrestling.

Matt Hardy is being talked about like Chyna got talked about for going into porn. Lena Dunham said something that has gotten her loads of media attention again -- but she hasn't "surpassed" anybody. I really don't think you can ironically be the best wrestler in the world -- otherwise James Ellsworth would take it over Matt Hardy.

Bubba Ray Dudley was a bigger deal, statistically, than Matt Hardy is right now. Was Bully Ray ever truly the wrestler of the year? He was a big fish in a tiny, tiny pond that managed to reinvent himself because if he didn't he'd be worthless. And, to his credit, he did reinvent himself quite well -- getting himself into tremendous shape and being pretty damn good on the mic. Put him back in the WWE and he's just Bubba Ray Dudley though -- but still infinitely more well known than Bully Ray.

I used to be a Matt Hardy mark, but this talk about him being "better" than Jeff right now is pretty silly. If Jeff Hardy decided he was bored of being paid to phone it in and he wanted another run on top, he could phone Vince and say "Hey boss, want me to sell you some more merch." Vince would have him back in a heartbeat. Hell, if he returned tomorrow they'd probably give him the Royal Rumble and put him against Kevin Owens at WrestleMania and give him his first Mania win. Matt Hardy would be forgotten in a week.

You can notoriety and infamy by fucking a dog on RedTube, but you're not going to win Adult Film Star of the Year. Stop this talk about Matt Hardy being great. He's doing backyard wrestling with the illusion of camp (but it's not even authentically that, because it's intentionally bad), and when you all get sick of it, everyone -- every single person will change their tone to "Yeah, he needs stop this" and will look back on this and feel a little silly, with the most positive thing being said being "Ha, well, I liked it at the time because it was different," but secretly everyone will know what a steaming pile of shit it was.

Oh, and if TNA went under and Vince McMahon called and said he wants mid-card Matt back again, Matt Hardy would change his hair back so fucking fast it'd break all your hearts. But Vince is more likely to want Jeff and let Matt Hardy keep doing his bullshit in CHIKARA or something, until Jeff burns out on top and they decide they want to do a Hardys thing because there's more money in Jeff with Matt or Jeff on his own than Matt on his own and everybody knows it.
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Old 12-25-2016, 08:04 PM   #87
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Saying what Matt Hardy has done is the same as fucking an animal on Redtube is completely disrespectful to him and anyone who is a professional wrestler. 20 + year veterans including guys the caliber of Lance Storm and Chris Jericho have praised Matt for his "broken" gimmick... I didn't see them doing the same for China doing porn so you're analogies make no sense.

As far as AJ goes, you said it yourself, he was already a star. He was a star in TNA, he was a star in ROH, he was a star in NJPW, and it's not surprising to see him become a star in the WWE. Matt Hardy literally went from mediocrity to one of the most watched professional wrestlers of 2016. If it was "so easy" to do what he's done.... why hasn't anyone else done it with his success?

As far as "he'll drop everything and go back to WWE", until he does that, you can't say that he would. I personally know what he makes per indie show, and obviously he's not hurting for money now. It's not everybodies dream to go to the WWE, or in other cases, go back to the WWE.
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Old 12-25-2016, 08:16 PM   #88
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Matt Hardy is the one completely disrespecting himself with this horseshit. It is bad and it is supposed to be bad -- that is one of the chief defenses I hear of it. If it is supposed to be bad, why is it disrespectful to say it is bad? Matt Hardy is doing bad work now. It's just getting over with geeks who seem to have a more prominent voice because we are the only people who still watch wrestling because this is what it churns out.

This whole "AJ is a star" thing is completely backwards. Yes, he worked in TNA and New Japan, but the difference between even New Japan and WWE is immense. I think there were some numbers that came out that said that New Japan was about 1/5 the size of WWE. You don't work down to WWE.

Matt Hardy has been in the WWE before. He has been at WrestleMania. He has been a major merchandise mover and worked in the ring with the likes of The Undertaker and Stone Cold Steve Austin. He is now a star? Because he manages to get 40,000 more people to watch TNA than usually do by putting on a freak show that no one has seen before?

And that is exactly my point about Matt Hardy -- he is making enough money to sustain his "creative freedom" on the independent scene for the moment. He's working everybody and raking in the cash for fucking around. Hey, in that sense maybe he is a good professional wrestler? But when people suddenly go "Eh, I'm over this" and they stop forking over the money until Matt Hardy tries to be genuinely good again, why wouldn't he take the huge sack of cash from Vince McMahon? You can't say the dude is not motivated by the money and then cite money as a reason that he wouldn't go back.
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Old 12-25-2016, 08:20 PM   #89
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AJ Styles stock has jumped TREMENDOUSLY. Matt Hardy is doing high school theater for a promotion that has lost so much ground it needs to stand on one leg to stay dry. I don't see how this is even a discussion.
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Old 12-25-2016, 08:22 PM   #90
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Nikky Chance.

He finally got his CHW Interstate Title back.
this
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Old 12-25-2016, 08:26 PM   #91
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I am actually thinking about dropping Lance Storm's podcast from my listening because the latest episode seems to be one where he praises this shit. But I am also curious to hear what he says about it, since he is usually spot on about things. I think Jericho would just go to bat for it because he backs the boys and is probably happy that Matt gets to fuck around and make money. Pure speculation though. Maybe Jericho does sincerely think it is brilliant that Matt drinks magic poison and stuff. I'm not going to let it shatter my Jericho fandom though. I'll keep it in a separate compartment like Austin's domestic violence accusations.
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Old 12-25-2016, 08:42 PM   #92
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Aren't James Storm, Bram (dude needs a last name) and Eddie Kingston part of some new faction? If they got Broken Matt and beat him within an inch of his life, unzipped their pants, pissed on him, shat in his mouth and ate Maxell, then there MIGHT be some hope for all of this. Jeff Hardy can snap out of his stupid gimmick and be all "We were trying to have fun an entertain our fans but these guys have ruined that" and go to war with them.

You know -- wrestling?
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Old 12-25-2016, 09:21 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noid View Post
I don't see how this is even a discussion.
People enjoyed Matt Hardy the most in wrestling this year. I'm not sure why this is such an issue for you.

I didn't really like him that much, but I'm not going to tell people they're wrong for liking him better than anyone else.
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Old 12-25-2016, 09:29 PM   #94
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Tough choice for me, but I'm going with Jericho. He's been fantastic in everything he's done this year.
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Old 12-25-2016, 10:01 PM   #95
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"Wrestler of the Year" implies quality and not just what you've enjoyed. Film of the Year isn't your favorite porno, even though you blew a load to it and didn't the latest Oscar bait.
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Old 12-25-2016, 10:25 PM   #96
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Irrelevant comparison. If people enjoyed it, it had good qualities to them. This isn't an official awards thread, it's a matter of opinion. Whether you or I agree with it or not doesn't really matter. Objectivity doesn't really matter. A lot of people answered the question with the wrestler who entertained them the most, and in this context that's not a wrong answer.
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Old 12-25-2016, 10:27 PM   #97
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This is a discussion of semantics. I think Wrestler of the Year does demand a bit of objectivity and honest critique. I'll show myself out.
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Old 12-25-2016, 10:30 PM   #98
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It isn't about semantics, though. You're coming into an opinion thread and telling people they're wrong for making a different choice than you.
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Old 12-26-2016, 06:05 AM   #99
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We're discussing what "Wrestler of the Year" means. That's semantics.
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Old 12-26-2016, 08:24 AM   #100
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Arrow
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noid View Post
We're discussing what "Wrestler of the Year" means. That's semantics.
Nah, the discussion is "Wrestler of the Year (In Your Opinion)" but you keep telling people they're wrong.
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Old 12-26-2016, 08:38 AM   #101
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Looks like Noid didn't get what he wanted for Christmas and he's gonna take it out childishly on everyone here.

Matt Hardy probably has to be the wrestler of the year for me if we take EVERYTHING into consideration. His character work was just so much better than what anyone else had to offer this year. And not only is he doing this stuff in TNA, but he's been bringing the character all over the indy's and in Europe and smashing it out of the park.

AJ had a great year, some great matches, and also has a great character. If Matt Hardy didn't smash his character out of the park this year it likely would've been AJ's year, but Hardy changed the game this year.
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Old 12-26-2016, 08:45 AM   #102
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I haven't seen any of Matt Hardy this year, so I can't even comment on the quality of it or anything, but I just find it absurd to tell someone that their opinion is wrong.
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Old 12-26-2016, 10:16 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by Rollermacka View Post
20 + year veterans including guys the caliber of Lance Storm and Chris Jericho have praised Matt for his "broken" gimmick... I didn't see them doing the same for China doing porn so you're analogies make no sense.
Austin was praising it on his podcast last week, too. I could care less about the rest of TNA really but this stuff has been getting a ton of positive attention. I'm a #CornetteSheep and even I fucking love it. Wrestling is shit right now. Trying to do stuff in the same style WWE's been doing it isn't gonna work. So Matt decided to completely go in a totally new direction. The guy's actually being innovative. Not "he's doing some cool new flippy moves no one has ever seen before" but actually completely unique from top to bottom. Wrestling needs something different right now. We'll be talking about this long after we've forgotten about AJ Styles' match on some recent Sunday Night Raw.
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Old 12-26-2016, 10:56 AM   #104
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We're discussing what "Wrestler of the Year" means. That's semantics.
No, that's what you keep harping on for whatever reason. The point of the thread is Wrestler of the Year (In Your Opinion).

But yeah, everyone is wrong for not picking AJ Styles.
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Old 12-26-2016, 12:24 PM   #105
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Austin was praising it on his podcast last week, too. I could care less about the rest of TNA really but this stuff has been getting a ton of positive attention. I'm a #CornetteSheep and even I fucking love it. Wrestling is shit right now. Trying to do stuff in the same style WWE's been doing it isn't gonna work. So Matt decided to completely go in a totally new direction. The guy's actually being innovative. Not "he's doing some cool new flippy moves no one has ever seen before" but actually completely unique from top to bottom. Wrestling needs something different right now. We'll be talking about this long after we've forgotten about AJ Styles' match on some recent Sunday Night Raw.
Yeah seriously. The only time I've cared about Edwards V Lashley was during that Non Stop Deletion. Is that match still ongoing?
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Old 12-26-2016, 01:26 PM   #106
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I don't remember there being a finish to it during Total Nonstop Deletion. Might have to watch it again but I don't remember seeing a finish to Lashley/Edwards.
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Old 12-26-2016, 03:34 PM   #107
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LOL, this is completely ridiculous. You can add "in your opinion" in parenthesis to anything, it doesn't excuse a complete lack of critical faculties. Everything is "in your opinion" when you are discussing something. If this was a discussion about your favorite act of 2016, then Matt Hardy would be a perfectly valid response. Saying "Wrestler of the Year (in your opinion)" is basically the same as saying "Wrestler of the Year."

I apologize that I interpreted "Wrestler of the Year" to imply some sort of analysis. When I am asked to rate something, that usually comes into play.
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Old 12-26-2016, 03:34 PM   #108
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Rob Van Dam is Wrestler of the Year.
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Old 12-26-2016, 03:42 PM   #109
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Quote:
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LOL, this is completely ridiculous. You can add "in your opinion" in parenthesis to anything, it doesn't excuse a complete lack of critical faculties. Everything is "in your opinion" when you are discussing something. If this was a discussion about your favorite act of 2016, then Matt Hardy would be a perfectly valid response. Saying "Wrestler of the Year (in your opinion)" is basically the same as saying "Wrestler of the Year."

I apologize that I interpreted "Wrestler of the Year" to imply some sort of analysis. When I am asked to rate something, that usually comes into play.
You can interpret it how ever you want as can everyone else. No one is forcing you to call Broken Matt Hardy Wrestler of the Year. If you think Styles is Wrestler of the Year that's fine but if so.so he else thinks different than that doesn't mean they are wrong.
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Old 12-26-2016, 04:10 PM   #110
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Lol, those are semantics. That was my point. Has CyNick put something in the water around here?

If you interpret the meaning of the question to be "who was your favorite act of the year" then Matt Hardy is, well, a sad answer, but I suppose a valid one. Some people like being hit with pool cues until they cum too. If you interpret the question to carry some sort of critical component -- as I have -- I have clearly laid out reasons that Matt Hardy would not be a valid contender.
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Old 12-26-2016, 04:13 PM   #111
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Quote:
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Rob Van Dam is Wrestler of the Year.
Well yeah, you can be stupid, or you can at least back up your opinions with matches and segments.

I mean, I can link to what I liked and type ad-nauseum about how much I enjoyed Matt Hardy this year. Or you can be a twat and just try to put down other people.

It depends how you view wrestling. To me, it's just a TV program. If he wrestled in a ring this year, he qualifies and the most entertaining person wins. I don't care if he wrestled a Meltzer 5 star match or had someone fired out of a volcano while a boat broke up a pinfall. Whichever one you enjoyed the most is the vote.
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Old 12-26-2016, 04:20 PM   #112
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Some people like being hit with pool cues until they cum too.
Why do you keep saying these things? They aren't funny, and certainly don't help your argument any.
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Old 12-26-2016, 04:21 PM   #113
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So your point is still "everyone else is wrong for not answering like I did." Got it.
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Old 12-26-2016, 04:28 PM   #114
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Just like everywhere else on the internet, yes.
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Old 12-26-2016, 04:36 PM   #115
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It's still a landslide victory for the Phenomenal One. I don't see a reason to comment further on quality of picking. The fact that he's even in the running is pretty amazing for a guy who was signed just as a favor because they wanted Jeff back.
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Old 12-26-2016, 04:52 PM   #116
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So your point is still "everyone else is wrong for not answering like I did." Got it.
No, actually.
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Old 12-26-2016, 04:55 PM   #117
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Well yeah, you can be stupid, or you can at least back up your opinions with matches and segments.
Thank you. That concession that there is such a thing as a silly answer -- or an unfounded opinion -- goes a long way to proving my point. There is an interpretation to the question that would disqualify certain candidates from objective consideration.
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Old 12-26-2016, 04:59 PM   #118
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AJ Styles and it's not even close. A character Vince had no hand in making has finally come into the wwe, and on the tail end of his prime at that, and has made himself one of the faces of the company. To convince Vince and Co to run with him is a feat of epic proportions. And he did it because he is that damn good.

When Vince made the comment in an interview a couple months ago that he should have gotten aj 10 years ago....that's all I needed to know that he's the best right now.
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Old 12-26-2016, 05:06 PM   #119
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Please change the title of the thread to "Who was your favourite wrestler in 2016?"

There.

Silly argument over.
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Old 12-26-2016, 05:08 PM   #120
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Quote:
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AJ Styles and it's not even close.
Don't say that too loud! Nah, just kidding -- good answer.

It's actually surreal that he has made such a big believer out of Vince McMahon in such a short time.
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