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Old 04-25-2019, 08:54 PM   #1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XL View Post
Would agree with this.

At the risk of being chased off the internet, there was a lot I didn’t like about the movie but the last hour really worked.
nah i'm with you on this too. i thought it was a very strong ending to 10+ years of narrative but was definitely far from perfect. i think, on balance, i probably enjoyed infinity war more.

stray thoughts and observations:
SPOILER: show

- i think they took thor's 'funny' characterisation a step too far, maybe? his initial reimagining in ragnarok was goddamn inspired, and they balanced his humorous and serious aspects beautifully in infinity war, but he just felt a bit too goofy for me in endgame. idk. maybe i am being harsh. but his arc was the only one - compared with the other original avengers, anyway - that felt kind of unsatisfying imo

- on the other end of the spectrum, i goddamn loved banner-hulk. that was absolutely wonderful and a far more satisfying outcome for that character

- steve's arc, also, just beautifully wrapped up. also lol @ "that IS america's ass"

- i accept the 'going back and changing the past doesn't change the future' rhetoric, which enables things like future nebula killing past nebula without erasing herself -- even if it feels flimsy as hell compared to the more logical framework presented by back to the future etc -- but surely thanos travelling to the future and dying there would change things regardless; i.e. thanos goes to the future to attack the avengers and ends up getting dusted; therefore, thanos isn't around to make his later attack(s) in 2018, meaning he never gets all the infinity stones, meaning the events of infinity war should never have happened in the first place. right?!

or is this some kind of "no, it created an alternate timeline, so there is a future where thanos doesn't attack in 2018, but that's not 'our' timeline because time travel is bullshit" bullshit

- so there's a random loki out there somewhere with the tesseract -- presumably gonna be the loki we get for his series. deft workaround, i guess

- i guess if gamora's in gotg 3, she's gonna be 2014 gamora also?

- ok so speaking of gamora, the soul stone demands a sacrifice from the person who wants the stone, right? hence why thanos flings gamora off the cliff -- he sacrifices her to earn it. but nat/clint were both trying to kill themselves; doesn't that mean the other one didn't actually sacrifice anything? sure, clint lost someone he loved, but he didn't sacrifice her. in fact, he was actively trying to stop her sacrifice. i dunno. this film was so narratively overstuffed i might have missed some logical explanation for why suicide would work as a means of giving someone else the stone but it seems a stretch

- also how is clint just holding the soul stone when he wakes up, when it was made clear in guardians and other movies that ordinary people can't just handle the stones? the collector's offsider tries to grab the power stone in gotg 1 and literally explodes. actually, this movie has a lot of problems now that i really think about it

- odds that the 'falcon and winter soldier' series will be called 'captain america and winter soldier'? or will sam keep the falcon name regardless? either way, i really loved the way cap's (and sam's) story played out. again, contrary to thor, i think steve's arc really was handled beautifully

- the random teen at stark's funeral was the kid from iron man 3. i had to look it up because in the cinema i was just like 'who the fuck is that?' -- and i watched iron man 3 like two weeks ago so i am sure i am not the only one who doesn't recognise him.

- on that note, i was actually surprised that only nat and stark died. i was expecting a higher body count for the avengers themselves tbh

- i like that they gave carol her comics-accurate haircut. suited her well. i also appreciated that they didn't really make her the be-all-and-end-all deus ex machina i was expecting her to be. she helped a lot, but was hardly vital

- rocket holding nebula's hand on the ship's steps, his distress when he's trapped under the building debris, and when he tries to shield groot during the end battle are all heartbreaking li'l moments. i know he is a cgi raccoon but goddamn

- tom holland is, as always, an absolute joy. paul rudd also really good at bringing levity where it was needed and appreciated

- whole theatre popped like crazy for cap wielding mjolnir. that reveal and sequence was, admittedly, glorious

- 'i am... inevitable.' 'yeah? well, i... am... iron man' -- predictable as hell, but also absolutely perfect

so yeah... this all may seem like i'm being super-down on the film; i'm not -- i really, really enjoyed it and will undoubtedly watch it again, possibly even once more while it's at the movies, but i also don't think it was the best thing i've ever seen in a cinema at all. to each their own though i guess
Last edited by mitchables; 04-26-2019 at 12:25 AM.
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Old 04-26-2019, 05:16 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mitchables View Post
nah i'm with you on this too. i thought it was a very strong ending to 10+ years of narrative but was definitely far from perfect. i think, on balance, i probably enjoyed infinity war more.

stray thoughts and observations:
SPOILER: show

- i think they took thor's 'funny' characterisation a step too far, maybe? his initial reimagining in ragnarok was goddamn inspired, and they balanced his humorous and serious aspects beautifully in infinity war, but he just felt a bit too goofy for me in endgame. idk. maybe i am being harsh. but his arc was the only one - compared with the other original avengers, anyway - that felt kind of unsatisfying imo

- on the other end of the spectrum, i goddamn loved banner-hulk. that was absolutely wonderful and a far more satisfying outcome for that character

- steve's arc, also, just beautifully wrapped up. also lol @ "that IS america's ass"

- i accept the 'going back and changing the past doesn't change the future' rhetoric, which enables things like future nebula killing past nebula without erasing herself -- even if it feels flimsy as hell compared to the more logical framework presented by back to the future etc -- but surely thanos travelling to the future and dying there would change things regardless; i.e. thanos goes to the future to attack the avengers and ends up getting dusted; therefore, thanos isn't around to make his later attack(s) in 2018, meaning he never gets all the infinity stones, meaning the events of infinity war should never have happened in the first place. right?!

or is this some kind of "no, it created an alternate timeline, so there is a future where thanos doesn't attack in 2018, but that's not 'our' timeline because time travel is bullshit" bullshit

- so there's a random loki out there somewhere with the tesseract -- presumably gonna be the loki we get for his series. deft workaround, i guess

- i guess if gamora's in gotg 3, she's gonna be 2014 gamora also?

- ok so speaking of gamora, the soul stone demands a sacrifice from the person who wants the stone, right? hence why thanos flings gamora off the cliff -- he sacrifices her to earn it. but nat/clint were both trying to kill themselves; doesn't that mean the other one didn't actually sacrifice anything? sure, clint lost someone he loved, but he didn't sacrifice her. in fact, he was actively trying to stop her sacrifice. i dunno. this film was so narratively overstuffed i might have missed some logical explanation for why suicide would work as a means of giving someone else the stone but it seems a stretch

- also how is clint just holding the soul stone when he wakes up, when it was made clear in guardians and other movies that ordinary people can't just handle the stones? the collector's offsider tries to grab the power stone in gotg 1 and literally explodes. actually, this movie has a lot of problems now that i really think about it

- odds that the 'falcon and winter soldier' series will be called 'captain america and winter soldier'? or will sam keep the falcon name regardless? either way, i really loved the way cap's (and sam's) story played out. again, contrary to thor, i think steve's arc really was handled beautifully

- the random teen at stark's funeral was the kid from iron man 3. i had to look it up because in the cinema i was just like 'who the fuck is that?' -- and i watched iron man 3 like two weeks ago so i am sure i am not the only one who doesn't recognise him.

- on that note, i was actually surprised that only nat and stark died. i was expecting a higher body count for the avengers themselves tbh

- i like that they gave carol her comics-accurate haircut. suited her well. i also appreciated that they didn't really make her the be-all-and-end-all deus ex machina i was expecting her to be. she helped a lot, but was hardly vital

- rocket holding nebula's hand on the ship's steps, his distress when he's trapped under the building debris, and when he tries to shield groot during the end battle are all heartbreaking li'l moments. i know he is a cgi raccoon but goddamn

- tom holland is, as always, an absolute joy. paul rudd also really good at bringing levity where it was needed and appreciated

- whole theatre popped like crazy for cap wielding mjolnir. that reveal and sequence was, admittedly, glorious

- 'i am... inevitable.' 'yeah? well, i... am... iron man' -- predictable as hell, but also absolutely perfect

so yeah... this all may seem like i'm being super-down on the film; i'm not -- i really, really enjoyed it and will undoubtedly watch it again, possibly even once more while it's at the movies, but i also don't think it was the best thing i've ever seen in a cinema at all. to each their own though i guess
SPOILER: show
Agree with you on Thor. The guy should have been (even more) heartbroken; he’s lost his brother, his father, mother, his sister was evil, he lost his home, and half his people, then he didn’t go for the head. He blames himself but it’s all played for laughs. A little too much.

That we one of my overall nitpicks; the movie was “too funny” given the gravity of what happens/was happening. I get that Marvel movies are funny, but I felt it undermined a lot of the plot.

Some of the fan service/call backs were delightful - the “don’t do anything stupid” exchange between Cap and Bucky was great - but a lot of it was laid on very thick.

The All-The-Female-Heroes-Team-Up was way too tacked on. Bleh.

I’ve never been in a movie theatre where people actually cheer/applaud (it’s not a very British thing to do - but we had a pop for Cap being worthy, I think Peter got a reaction, and there was a guy behind me who shouted “yibambe” when Panther walked on screen

I think for a long time I was “concerned” they were going to undo everything and that wouldn’t have sat very well with me. 2 hours and 10 minutes in the movie came to life; I think at the start of the battle. Which is unusual for me as I’m not really one for action scenes.

I’ll be seeing it again with my wife in the next couple of weeks so my perspective might change.

Again, I thought it was good but there was a lot that didn’t work for me.
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Old 04-25-2019, 03:45 AM   #3
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Quite simply the best film I've ever seen in the cinema. Would gladly go back and see again and again.
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Old 04-25-2019, 07:47 AM   #4
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Old 04-26-2019, 12:04 AM   #5
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I really loved it overall.

There's so much going on in it that it's hard to remember everything. Every character gets at least one big moment. Two I didn't expect to have as large of roles as they did.

SPOILER: show


Ant-Man
Nebula



I don't think it's perfect - but I concur w/ sentiment it's immensely satisfying and you will laugh and feel really emotional, both, multiple times throughout.
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Old 04-26-2019, 12:15 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slik View Post
I really loved it overall.

There's so much going on in it that it's hard to remember everything. Every character gets at least one big moment. Two I didn't expect to have as large of roles as they did.

SPOILER: show


Ant-Man
Nebula



I don't think it's perfect - but I concur w/ sentiment it's immensely satisfying and you will laugh and feel really emotional, both, multiple times throughout.
yeah i worry that my criticisms made it seem like i didn't love it... absolutely not the case. it really was v satisfying and immense and fantastic in all regards but i also think it's very easy to forgive a lot of its foibles (including many of the things i mentioned in my previous post) because of the investment of time and emotion we've put into these films over the past decade

i'll probably enjoy it (even) more on a second go-around
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Old 04-26-2019, 12:06 AM   #7
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I also really like that

SPOILER: show


We got the trinity of Thor, Cap and Tony battling Thanos

Cap and Tony's stories wrap up, but Thor's still has more to tell.

I guess this means the Black Widow film will be a prequel.

People in my theater went nuts for Cap/Mjolnir and the return of Peter Parker.
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Old 04-26-2019, 12:23 AM   #8
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I didn't take it as you didn't like it at all @ my pal Mitch Ables!

For some reason this line keeps popping in my head from the movie

SPOILER: show


I get emails from a raccoon
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Old 04-26-2019, 12:32 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slik View Post
I didn't take it as you didn't like it at all @ my pal Mitch Ables!

For some reason this line keeps popping in my head from the movie

SPOILER: show


I get emails from a raccoon
that was a great line

SPOILER: show

stark's "he turn into a baby?" was also a+ delivery from rdj
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Old 04-26-2019, 01:45 AM   #10
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Great film, so much fan service and so many nods to the comics, other films in the franchise etc

Couple of things

SPOILER: show
- the time travel stuff is a lil bit ropey, but it's always going to be with time travel. The different realities and stuff would be fine, but even so, Thanos was taken out of his reality and into the future so technically nothing he does post-2014 would have happened. Plus Cap showing up as an old man in the same reality he was originally from sorta throws a curve ball into it all, but yeah, time travel is always ropey so it can be glossed over s bit. Glad they didn't just "undo" infinity war in it's entirety tho. Which kinda leads me to...

- if everyone was brought back 5 years later, then the world would still be a total mess. People would have moved on, maybe got new families, just for their old ones to come back. I'm hoping Far From home might touch on it s little bit, cause otherwise Pete's going to Europe with a buncha kids who continued to age for 5 years while he was dust. I guess they'll just conveniently have all his classmates that we know of being part of the snap. Or the whole film could be pre-infinity war.

- Really naive of me, but for a split second when Strange and Wong et al were portaling everyone into battle, i thought they MIGHT let The Defenders or Agents of Shield into the movie. I think the fact they brought in James D'Arcy to play Jarvis opened the door in my mind for them to bring others into play.
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Old 04-26-2019, 01:55 AM   #11
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So many other little things I loved

SPOILER: show

- Seeing Starlord singing from Rhodey's/Nebulas point of view
- similarly the other point of view of the avengers awkwardly posing over Loki after the battle of New York
- all girl avengers was cool
- "Hail Hydra"
- "Avengers Assemble"
- original antman helmet
- the kid at the funeral (that I also had to check online, although I'd read a few weeks back that he would be in there in some capacity but totally forgot) was a nice touch
- Everything Hawkeye did was so good, well worth him missing out on infinity war to get the Ronin version
- Sup with Cassie Lang seemingly aging 10 years instead of 5 lol
- Korg and Miek and them getting called dickheads online
- Just the sheer amount of cast members, the end credits with the special cards for the original 6 was great

So much more but just a few bits of the top of my head I wanted to mention
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Old 04-26-2019, 01:58 AM   #12
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Fucking movie makes lord of the rings look like a playground slap fight, fuck.
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Old 04-26-2019, 02:44 AM   #13
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SPOILER: show
That entire sequence of everyone coming back was just one sustained pop in my theater.
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Old 04-26-2019, 02:52 AM   #14
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Almost forgot

SPOILER: show

Marked out super hard for the shot of a lone captain america, beaten and bruised, walking defiantly toward Thanos. That is one of the most iconic moments from the Infinity Gauntlet comic, and I'm really happy they got it in.
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Old 04-26-2019, 06:01 AM   #15
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SPOILER: show


I loved Lebowski Thor. He had enough sobering moments to balance it out, imo.

Also thought the female team up was pretty badass.

Only thing I didn't like is that Hulk never redeemed himself against Thanos. I was waiting for the moment where Banner loses control and hulk kicks Thanos's ass, but it never happened. Felt like an unresolved plot thread considering hulk was so embarassed by his defeat that he regressed so deeply into banner.
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Old 04-26-2019, 08:15 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fignuts View Post
SPOILER: show


I loved Lebowski Thor. He had enough sobering moments to balance it out, imo.

Also thought the female team up was pretty badass.

Only thing I didn't like is that Hulk never redeemed himself against Thanos. I was waiting for the moment where Banner loses control and hulk kicks Thanos's ass, but it never happened. Felt like an unresolved plot thread considering hulk was so embarassed by his defeat that he regressed so deeply into banner.
SPOILER: show
seem to remember reading an interview with the russo bros explaining that hulk wasn't embarrassed; he had the shits with banner for only letting him out to solve his problems. thanos was just the final straw. so banner and hulk finding peace and coexisting was the resolution for that.

edit: yeah, here you go
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Old 04-26-2019, 09:05 AM   #17
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What a ride
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Old 04-26-2019, 11:57 AM   #18
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How long do we need spoiler tags? Surely anyone not wanting the film to be spoiled should avoid a thread entitled "Avengers: Endgame"?

SPOILER: show
Anyways, I loved it. As others have said, there's some bits I loved, some bits didn't really work, but damn there was so much to cram in, and overall I'm satisfied.

My only real nitpick complaints are that the final battle could have been a bit longer, and maybe given everyone more moments to shine? I feel like a few characters didn't really get any moments in there. What did Bucky do besides turn up at the start? Or Groot? Drax jumped on a guys back for all of two seconds. And what did Hulk actually do?

And also as someone else said above, man, during that line up moment I'd have loved to have seen the Defenders, Agents of SHIELD and even the Inhumans in the background.

Still, when all was said and done, it was a great film, and holy fuck at "Avengers Assemble". It's one of those moments you wanna burst out into tears, joy, laughter, just everything!
Last edited by Rammsteinmad; 04-26-2019 at 12:41 PM.
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Old 04-26-2019, 12:11 PM   #19
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I always think it's common courtesy unless the thread title has "Spoiler" in it.
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Old 04-26-2019, 12:36 PM   #20
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Can someone put SPOLIER ALERT in the thread title?
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Old 04-26-2019, 12:44 PM   #21
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I don't think there are any active Entertainment forum mods.
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Old 04-26-2019, 12:53 PM   #22
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Don't even know where to start.
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Old 04-26-2019, 01:04 PM   #23
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In a good way?
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Old 04-26-2019, 03:30 PM   #24
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In a good way?
A very good way. The only thing that comes close to a complaint I could only say in the form of a compliment.
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Old 04-26-2019, 02:25 PM   #25
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Trying to see if I can score tickets for today since my Schedule freed up but right now waiting for Fandango wait time to lapse which has gone from over a hour to as low as 15 minutes now back up to 30
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Old 04-26-2019, 02:34 PM   #26
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The only thing it needed was Joey Ryan showing up and dick-flipping Thanos
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Old 04-26-2019, 02:44 PM   #27
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The only thing it needed was Joey Ryan showing up and dick-flipping Thanos
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Old 04-26-2019, 05:13 PM   #28
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SPOILER: show
Hold on. Why wasn’t the plan to jump back in time just to get the Time Stone, use it to turn back time to the Battle of Wakanda and tell Thor to go for the head? Or just jump directly back to Wakanda and cut his head off?

Guess you shouldn’t pick it apart?
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Old 04-26-2019, 06:12 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XL View Post
SPOILER: show
Hold on. Why wasn’t the plan to jump back in time just to get the Time Stone, use it to turn back time to the Battle of Wakanda and tell Thor to go for the head? Or just jump directly back to Wakanda and cut his head off?

Guess you shouldn’t pick it apart?
They explained it

SPOILER: show
The scene where ant-man suggests killing baby thanos, they explain that the past is set in stone and you can't change it. Any changes they made to the past won't affect their present, but instead create a divergent timeline. So doing that wouldn't bring back the vanished. Thats why 2014 Nebula and Thanos can die without it affecting anything in the present timeline. It's basically just multiverse theory.
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Old 04-26-2019, 06:32 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Fignuts View Post
They explained it

SPOILER: show
The scene where ant-man suggests killing baby thanos, they explain that the past is set in stone and you can't change it. Any changes they made to the past won't affect their present, but instead create a divergent timeline. So doing that wouldn't bring back the vanished. Thats why 2014 Nebula and Thanos can die without it affecting anything in the present timeline. It's basically just multiverse theory.
SPOILER: show
War Machine, not Ant-Man.
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Old 04-26-2019, 07:52 PM   #31
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Thanks, STD.
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Old 04-26-2019, 09:33 PM   #32
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Quote:
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Thanks, STD.
That deserved a correction.

Also,

SPOILER: show

While the theater audience was very engaged, they didn't seem to care as much for Captain Marvel. Maybe because she's a newer character. There was no audible pop for her big return during the main fight, except for when she no sold Thanos' headbutt.

The "girl power" Avengers moment was kinda cool but felt a bit forced. But I also understand that it wasn't meant for me. I can imagine it meant a lot to young girls.

Since RP ruined Natasha and Tony's deaths, it did take me out of the moment. I would've loved to experience it without any prior knowledge.


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Old 04-27-2019, 03:41 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guru Dave View Post
That deserved a correction.

Also,

SPOILER: show

While the theater audience was very engaged, they didn't seem to care as much for Captain Marvel. Maybe because she's a newer character. There was no audible pop for her big return during the main fight, except for when she no sold Thanos' headbutt.

The "girl power" Avengers moment was kinda cool but felt a bit forced. But I also understand that it wasn't meant for me. I can imagine it meant a lot to young girls.

Since RP ruined Natasha and Tony's deaths, it did take me out of the moment. I would've loved to experience it without any prior knowledge.


I could really see this being a “exit point” for a lot of people. The 10+ year investment has been wrapped up, do people feel as passionately about Spider-Man/Strange/Panther/Falcon/Bucky/Marvel/etc? Will those characters bring in the audience in the same way? Although it’s entirely possible they do.
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Old 04-27-2019, 02:47 PM   #34
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I could really see this being a “exit point” for a lot of people. The 10+ year investment has been wrapped up, do people feel as passionately about Spider-Man/Strange/Panther/Falcon/Bucky/Marvel/etc? Will those characters bring in the audience in the same way? Although it’s entirely possible they do.
I think Spidey, Thor, Guardians, AntMan, Black Panther & Doc Strange will all do fine.


Falcon & Bucky are getting their own show on Disney +, same for Scarlet Witch/Vision, Loki (rumored to be Loki interfering w/ a different era of World History each episode) & Hawkeye/Hawkeye's Daughter as a dad/daughter superhero team. Black Widow has a film, assuming a prequel, due out next year that's described as a James Bond esque thriller.


The real test will be the new characters. Shang-Chi will be martial arts heavy, The Eternals will be very much in the Cosmic realm of the MCU and it's been rumored Feige has his eye on The Black Knight (which would obviously be very swordfighting heavy).
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Old 04-26-2019, 09:01 PM   #35
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Guru Dave, not STD.
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Old 04-26-2019, 09:03 PM   #36
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Spoiler below I guess.














Would have been nice to see a Hawkeye movie released last year dealing with him fighting a super villain within that 5 Years span
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Old 04-27-2019, 01:08 AM   #37
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Yeah, I took my 8 year old cousin and when the lady avenger team up happened she lit up like the Fourth of July. So anyone who has a problem with it can fuck off.
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Old 04-27-2019, 01:39 AM   #38
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Yeah, I took my 8 year old cousin and when the lady avenger team up happened she lit up like the Fourth of July. So anyone who has a problem with it can fuck off.
That's really sweet.
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Old 04-27-2019, 03:29 AM   #39
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Yeah, I took my 8 year old cousin and when the lady avenger team up happened she lit up like the Fourth of July. So anyone who has a problem with it can fuck off.
Or tell her heroes can be powerful regardless of gender and reverence over such a thing as gender misses the point of true heroism?

I mean it was a good shot, nice A-Force thing.
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Old 04-27-2019, 04:59 AM   #40
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Or tell her heroes can be powerful regardless of gender and reverence over such a thing as gender misses the point of true heroism?

I mean it was a good shot, nice A-Force thing.
KT, while I acknowledge your attempt at being cute, you should understand that the world doesn't revolve around you and other people might have unique experiences that you cannot relate to. Cheers.
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