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Old 05-26-2005, 03:59 PM   #121
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I was just going to say that about Sin City
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Old 05-26-2005, 09:55 PM   #122
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Wow el terrible. Empire Strikes Back is the only one of the 6 that is above a D-grade.
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Old 05-27-2005, 05:36 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJD
Grievious was a warlord alien that was pretty much killed and was turned into an Android to keep him alive, much like Anakin who is also an android. He had a confrontation with Mace Windu that you would see in the later chapters of the Clone Wars micro-series that rendered him pretty fucked up, hence the coughing.

Grievious hates the fact that he is part droid and hates being called a droid cos if anything he is an android.
Errr...You mean cyborg. An android is like C3P0 or the like.
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Old 05-28-2005, 05:26 AM   #124
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Old 05-28-2005, 02:26 PM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wwe2222
Its not like they had a choice. THey had to train Luke or else there would have been noone else to train. OB1, Yoda, and then Luke were the last of the Jedi. If they didnt train Luke, the Jedi would have died out. The question you should be asking is, WHy didnt OB1 try to train Luke when he was younger instead of waiting for him to just pop up one day. But some of the novels explain his uncle kept him away...

also, the 3 jedi that palpi kills with mace. They werent Jedi masters, just jedi knights. So palpi could have easily destroyed them considering how powerful he is.
They had to be masters, they were on the Jedi council.
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Old 05-29-2005, 01:33 AM   #126
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It was good. Not great. I wouldn't really want to see it again.
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Old 05-29-2005, 02:04 AM   #127
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Well I would have to say that Ep III sure makes up for the clusterfuck that was Ep I (minus the lightsabre scene with Maul) and the improved but still lacklustre Ep II.

Loved the beginning space battle sequence, but that alone will make me go back and see the movie again since it was hard to follow all that was going on in that scene. I was just glad I didn't see it in IMAX - serious vertigo issues there

Didn't mind some of the subtle transformations towards Ep IV (space ships, the Death Star beginning, Obi One). I would have to say I didn't mark out at anything like some others here did. I had a good time watching the Yoda/Emperor scene. And as much as the Vader scene was good to watch, I still prefer the moments leading up to it - we now see what happened to Anakin before.

Hated the dialogue! Hated the fact that Jar Jar was even in the damn thing. I still think the best thing for that character would've been that he wasn't saved in the Phantom Menace and was just run over. There, annoying character solved.

Kudos for the introduction to Chewie, the style of the ships, Mr badass himself, Darth Vader and the death of Windu and Dooku. Still can't wrap my head around Grevious. A prototype for Vader, maybe?
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Old 05-29-2005, 07:05 PM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smitty
They had to be masters, they were on the Jedi council.

are you sure? I dont think they were.

Also, Grievous was meant to be a protoype/foreshadow, etc of Vader according to an interview in some magazine that I read. Hence the coughing and the lungs and heart that was underneath his armor.
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Old 05-29-2005, 08:00 PM   #129
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Saw IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Pretty Cool. Loved the Massive Heel Turn by everyone. LOL @ Vader cleaning out the kids. They didn't even see what was coming. Yoda vs The Emperor was really cool.

Who was that dude that became Leiah's dad? Was he even in the past movies?

Anyway, it was cool and now I feel like watching Part 4.
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Old 05-29-2005, 08:25 PM   #130
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By every one
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Old 05-29-2005, 08:30 PM   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Santo
6 years if you assume the Emperor commissioned production after the first Death Star bit it. And it was only, like, two thirds finished.

You also gotta figure the first Death Star had to go through production qualifications and wind tunnel tests. Then there's all the safety inspections and federal regulation tests to pass, which takes 15 years easy on something the size of a small moon. Didn't do crap for all the dangerous gilloutine doors and unguarded floor openings, though. I suspect bribery was involved.

By the time Death Star II was ready, all the certifications has been passed, and the new Death Star was ready to go.
See, I blamed contractors. By Episode 4, Vader had squashed the Unions, but it took time.

Plus, being a project of the Empire, it didn't really need to pass through federal regulations. It basically worked like this.

Emperor: Do you approve of this, your Lordship?
Emperor: Yes I do.

Anyway, while I joked about the Death Star being started so early, it's important to keep in mind that we don't have a total idea of how much time passed. They were running it in tandem with the "good guys" ending, but that doesn't mean they were happening at the same time. Especially with the way Lucas tries to be this deep director.
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Old 05-29-2005, 08:38 PM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by packt up
I also thought of just a potential conflict in stories. Namely that when Anakin is discovered the Jedi council are initially reluctant to train him as he was too old. Yet in A New Hope Luke is trained no problem by Obi Wann despite him being about twice as old as when Anakin was discovered. I know the Jedi Council no longer existed and all but just seems weird that if training has to start really young that Luke was trained at all.
Traditionally, Jedi were trained at a young age.

If you notice, in Empire, Yoda actually says that Luke is too old.

Also, in the Episode 7-9 era, a lot of people are trained at an older age due primarily to necessity, so Lucas probably never envisioned it as a hard-and-fast rule. Not that he's the best guy to go to for rigid standards.

No real plot conflict here.

Not to mention Obi-Wan's defiance of the Jedi council in the first place.
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Old 05-29-2005, 08:43 PM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-L
One thing I forgot to mention...

about the Vader NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

It was kinda parralelled by Luke's NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO in Empire, which I thought was overdone!

I mean if Darth Vader told me he was my father I'd be like...

Shit...let it sink in...shit!
The parallels were forced down our throat, and horribly done for the most part. Most of the ones in Ep 3 were pretty good, but this one was horrible.

In Luke's case, he's pissed off, hating Vader, the guy who killed his dad and lopped off his hand. And suddenly he's hit by this? That made sense.

The Boris Karlov imitation? Fuck that.

In terms of Vader/Kenobi, and the lighsaber scene...Vader's now more machine than man...Obi-Wan's 20 years older and has lived in solitude. Who cares that they're not doing kung fu somersaults? The Jedi were supposed to parallel samurai anyway, who tended more towards the style illustrated in the original trilogy.
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Old 05-29-2005, 09:00 PM   #134
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To be honest, I disliked all the hopping aroung the Jedi's do in the new series. Silly, specially Yoda. Other than that I find little to complain about.

Is clone wars the animated series that played a couple years ago. (other than the Ep2)
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Old 05-30-2005, 12:59 AM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wwe2222
are you sure? I dont think they were.

Also, Grievous was meant to be a protoype/foreshadow, etc of Vader according to an interview in some magazine that I read. Hence the coughing and the lungs and heart that was underneath his armor.
http://www.starwars.com/databank/cha...iin/index.html

http://www.starwars.com/databank/cha...sto/index.html

http://www.starwars.com/databank/cha...lar/index.html

last time I watched Episode III, I noticed all three were in the council meeting, so there ya go.

Also, Grievous has his cough because Mace Windu force crushed his chest in the Clone Wars cartoon series.
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Old 05-30-2005, 06:38 AM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loose Cannon
Who was that dude that became Leiah's dad? Was he even in the past movies?

Anyway, it was cool and now I feel like watching Part 4.
He is Bail Organa, the guy who supposedly started the whole Rebellion due to his distaste of the new Empire. He raised Leia and gives her his name (Leia Organa) but is killed when Alderan is destroyed in Episode 4.

In Leia's message to Obi Wan she says "you served my father in the Clone Wars", Organa is of whom she speaks.

AND Grievious has nothing at all to do with Vader, whats all this prototype nonsense?
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Old 05-30-2005, 02:09 PM   #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loopydate
My sister went and saw it a second time this week, and she mentioned that in the scene where Anakin is torn between Mace and Palpatine, there is a shot where he's looking from one to the other that's almost identical to the shot in "Jedi" where Vader is looking between Luke and Palpatine.

Now I need to see it again, 'cause if that's true, that's a very cool touch by Lucas.
Yep, that's exactly what popped in my head when I saw that
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Old 05-30-2005, 03:24 PM   #138
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There's been a lot of talk about Leia and her parentage, I was just thinking...

it's been said by someone that Leia believes the Organa's to be her parents, has she not noticed that Bail is black or at least mixed race, and she is as pale as a ghost!??!

Just something that didn't sit right with me!
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Old 05-30-2005, 03:42 PM   #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-L
There's been a lot of talk about Leia and her parentage, I was just thinking...

it's been said by someone that Leia believes the Organa's to be her parents, has she not noticed that Bail is black or at least mixed race, and she is as pale as a ghost!??!

Just something that didn't sit right with me!
You're asking if the girl who kissed her brother noticed her "father" was not white? Are you daft?!
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Old 05-30-2005, 04:41 PM   #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow
You're asking if the girl who kissed her brother noticed her "father" was not white?
Good point!
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadow
Are you daft?!
No!
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Old 05-30-2005, 05:44 PM   #141
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I finally saw this today. Not really much to comment on as far as the quality of the movie, it's all been discussed already.

The comment I have lies in the fact that the entire meaning of the series is changed now. If you watch 4-6 it is the story of the evil empire being overthrown by an unlikely hero, etc. However, if you watch them from 1-6 it simply becomes the story of Darth Vader. If you were to someone new to the series watches them in this order it destroys the signicance of so much. The focus of the story isn't really on the jedi, the empire, the power struggle, or all that. It lies pretty much on Vader. Sure the other stuff is there, but you notice it so much more when you watch it out of order.
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Old 05-30-2005, 06:05 PM   #142
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I've heard Lucas claim that the saga was ALWAYS about Vader! I say this is bullshit though! He always seems to come up with a reason (excuse) for everything that doesn't make sense!

I remember him claiming the Star Wars story was always a 6 part (at one point I'm sure he claimed 9 part!!!???) story, yet in the docs on the boxset he clearly states that he split his original story in 3 cos of pressure from studios not accepting his script!

SO, AareDub what order would you show the films in (if you were showing them to someone that hasn't seen any of them!)
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Old 05-30-2005, 07:02 PM   #143
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Definitely 4-6, then 1-3.

If for no other reason, someone might not want to sit through 4 more movies if they had to watch 1 and 2 first.
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Old 05-30-2005, 09:36 PM   #144
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4,5,6,1,2,3 is the best way to watch this series. I agree.
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Old 05-30-2005, 10:15 PM   #145
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I don't think Organa is killed on Alderaan when it blows up, because when Leia gets back to the Rebel base she hugs her dad in a New Hope.
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Old 05-30-2005, 10:19 PM   #146
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Originally Posted by YOUR Hero
4,5,6,1,2,3 is the best way to watch this series. I agree.
I would have to agree too, since Hero and I are few of the posters who have seen these movies in theatres since the beginning and as much as the time line is out of whack (going from Vader 20 years in til death, then how he's made). It loses the shock value of some of the stuff in the latter triology if one watches them numerically.

Still, if Lucas ever made a 7-9 (and there are rumours) - I would go 4-6, 1-3 and if they ever exist 7-9....
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Old 05-31-2005, 11:42 AM   #147
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Originally Posted by Crash Bang Newstead
I don't think Organa is killed on Alderaan when it blows up, because when Leia gets back to the Rebel base she hugs her dad in a New Hope.
Nope. He's dead.
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Old 05-31-2005, 11:40 PM   #148
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yea 4,5,6, 1,2,3,

I mean if they (meaning young kids) see 1,2,3, first with all the sweet animation or whatever, they're gonna be like, what the fuck is this shit with 4,5,6,

Kids love the animation
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Old 06-04-2005, 02:42 AM   #149
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I'd watch them 4, 5, *trippy flashback* 1, 2, 3 *back to the future*, 6.

Anyways, saw this movie today. It was ok. Some great action sequences. Though Yoda/Palpatine was better than Obi Wan/Anakin. Some lame action and dialogue.

And now, as is custom, instead of focusing on the positive, I shall point out negatives.

- I didn't like how Anakin turned to the dark side. At first it seemed like it was going to be good, with Palpatine trying to convince him that the Jedi were evil and trying to seek power. However, it quickly disintegrated into the one dimensional reason of "I want to save her!" and he forgot the rest.

- Also, he turned evil waaaaay to easily with absolutley no middle. It's like... he was good and then all of a sudden he's like "I shall be your evil apprentice now" and then he's suddenly evil incarnate, killing little kiddies with no remorse.

- Anakin needed to kill more people. I mean, he's supposed to kill all the jedi. But all he did was kill a bunch of kids. Offscreen. Everyone else was killed by clones (and Windu by the Emperor). WTF. I paid to see Anakin Skywalker, Jedi Slayer.

- What the hell was up with the Wookie planet? They totally messed it up. Where are the giant trees and deep forests? And did they forget the part where they do not go to the ground level due to it being dangerous? KOTOR Kahyyyk > ROTS Kashyyyk.

- I actually like the lightsaber duels in the original Star Wars trilogy better. Best duel still remains Luke/Vader in ROTJ.
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Old 06-04-2005, 03:46 AM   #150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-L
I've heard Lucas claim that the saga was ALWAYS about Vader! I say this is bullshit though! He always seems to come up with a reason (excuse) for everything that doesn't make sense!

I remember him claiming the Star Wars story was always a 6 part (at one point I'm sure he claimed 9 part!!!???) story, yet in the docs on the boxset he clearly states that he split his original story in 3 cos of pressure from studios not accepting his script!

SO, AareDub what order would you show the films in (if you were showing them to someone that hasn't seen any of them!)
Lucas changes his story every couple of years.

Now he claims his movies parallel Vietnam.

Lucas has claimed he would not make the other episodes (1-3, 7-9), then he claimed he would make Episodes 1-3 and he had always intended to, but he wouldn't do 7-9... Speaking of always intended, ever noticed how each set of revisions to the plot is always how he "originally envisioned it?"

His earliest claims were that he wrote 3, and that they were each too long. This seems to be the tune most like what everyone else actually says. I think the first time I heard the comments that the movies were always about Vader was sometime in the 90s. Since earlier material on the movies clearly stated otherwise...

But hey, looking for holes in Lucas' stories is about as useful as finding water in the ocean...
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Old 06-04-2005, 05:40 AM   #151
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Well, for what it's worth, here's what Rossman at therossman.com says about what Lucas had originally intended for Episodes I-III before his misguided paternal hubris kicked in:

Quote:
One thing that I came across years ago on the young internet (back when the Red-5 website was the place to find out what was being changed in the original trilogy for their "special edition" releases) was a short synopsis of what Lucas had originally planned for the rest of his 9 part Star Wars storyline that he wrote down shortly after Empire was made. According to this plan, Episode I was supposed to focus ONLY on Obi-Wan Kenobi and his perspective of the Galactic Republic and the Jedi Order as the Clone Wars erupt (or something like that. Remember, I read this ages ago, but that was the general idea). No Anakin, no JarJar. It was supposed to be a view of the Jedi Order in their prime so that we could see all that was lost thanks to the Emperor and Vader later on.

Episode II was supposed to be about Obi-Wan befriending Anakin and the beginnings of the rise of Palpatine. The Clone Wars would be the focus of this film and the fighting would end when the movie did. We were also to have met Anakin's love (and Luke and Leia's mother) in Episode II. Episode III was the fall of Anakin to the Dark Side, the creation of the Empire, the hiding of Luke and Leia, and the destruction of the Jedi. So far, Lucas kept the plot of this one the most intact.
But yeah, Lucas is full of it.

His constant pimping of the story being a mythological Joseph Campbellian tale is extremely pompous. Imagine if Bryant Singer had put out a documentary on how Superman is really the modern heir of the Gilgamesh legend. Technically he'd be right, but your ego would have to be pretty large if you think your the God-ordained spokesperson.
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Old 06-04-2005, 06:16 AM   #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Santo
His constant pimping of the story being a mythological Joseph Campbellian tale is extremely pompous.
I think that is the gayest Star Wars-related sentence I have ever seen in my life. "pompous". wth
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Old 06-04-2005, 01:07 PM   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gouda
I'd watch them 4, 5, *trippy flashback* 1, 2, 3 *back to the future*, 6.

Anyways, saw this movie today. It was ok. Some great action sequences. Though Yoda/Palpatine was better than Obi Wan/Anakin. Some lame action and dialogue.

And now, as is custom, instead of focusing on the positive, I shall point out negatives.

- I didn't like how Anakin turned to the dark side. At first it seemed like it was going to be good, with Palpatine trying to convince him that the Jedi were evil and trying to seek power. However, it quickly disintegrated into the one dimensional reason of "I want to save her!" and he forgot the rest.

- Also, he turned evil waaaaay to easily with absolutley no middle. It's like... he was good and then all of a sudden he's like "I shall be your evil apprentice now" and then he's suddenly evil incarnate, killing little kiddies with no remorse.

- Anakin needed to kill more people. I mean, he's supposed to kill all the jedi. But all he did was kill a bunch of kids. Offscreen. Everyone else was killed by clones (and Windu by the Emperor). WTF. I paid to see Anakin Skywalker, Jedi Slayer.

- What the hell was up with the Wookie planet? They totally messed it up. Where are the giant trees and deep forests? And did they forget the part where they do not go to the ground level due to it being dangerous? KOTOR Kahyyyk > ROTS Kashyyyk.

- I actually like the lightsaber duels in the original Star Wars trilogy better. Best duel still remains Luke/Vader in ROTJ.

Wow, settle down man.
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Old 06-04-2005, 01:37 PM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by road doggy dogg
I think that is the gayest Star Wars-related sentence I have ever seen in my life. "pompous". wth
You'll have to forgive me for that. It was, like, two in the morning and I was in the middle of writing my term paper.

Um... how about ... "Lucas is teh suk."
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Old 06-04-2005, 02:08 PM   #155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Santo
Well, for what it's worth, here's what Rossman at therossman.com says about what Lucas had originally intended for Episodes I-III before his misguided paternal hubris kicked in:
Disclaimer: The following is in the interest of fairness:

Much like trying to fit ANH, Empire, and Jedi into one screenplay, this intent seems great but implausible. While I have limited "screenplay" experience, this would end up being either split up or more rushed than the trilogy he ended up making.

I say this because the events of RotS should have fit into two movies, but the second one was dragged out so horribly that there was no chance of that. Lucas has the same flaw many people who become demigods in our society posess: Lack of editorial process. People just fellate him for everything he does now. He's rich enough that he doesn't need to take advice. He's "brilliant" enough to get away with it.

The original series benefitted from a lot of criticism. The "prequels" did not.
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Old 06-04-2005, 02:08 PM   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Santo
You'll have to forgive me for that. It was, like, two in the morning and I was in the middle of writing my term paper.

Um... how about ... "Lucas is teh suk."
Too many big words still.
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Old 06-04-2005, 02:12 PM   #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Santo
His constant pimping of the story being a mythological Joseph Campbellian tale is extremely pompous.
Especially when his original story is so horribly derivative of Kurosawa's "Hidden Fortress," which is also where he supposedly drew inspiration (Before he became a larger than life figure....)
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Old 06-06-2005, 12:37 PM   #158
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So I was watching Spiderman 2 yesterday. And after the hospital scene with Doctor Octopus going all insaneand turning into a "monster" he's all like "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!"
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Old 06-06-2005, 02:01 PM   #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by road doggy dogg
I think that is the gayest Star Wars-related sentence I have ever seen in my life. "pompous". wth
hahaha
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