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Old 05-24-2010, 09:25 PM   #1
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Jack and Kate's goodbye was incredible
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Old 05-24-2010, 09:27 PM   #2
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I watched the pilot just a while ago. It's a whole new experience going back to the start
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Old 05-24-2010, 10:27 PM   #3
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Im very happy Desmond played a big role in the end game of Lost. From the moment he appeared in Season 2, something about him just made him my favorite character.

I know he didnt ultimately save the day (that could only have been Jack's job), but Jack couldnt have done it without him.
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Old 05-24-2010, 11:16 PM   #4
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It brings Desmond's whole "See you in another life brother" exchange with Jack full circle as well. I kinda want to re- watch the earlier seasons just to see if I can pick up on the foreshadowing and build with the characters.
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Old 05-24-2010, 11:32 PM   #5
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Wow amazing. Dunno how anyone who called themself a Lost fan couldn't love this ep. So many great moments. Hurley's barely-concealed glee at seeing Charlie again. Sun and Jin getting enlightened. Locke's line to Jack after becoming enlightened. Locke and Ben outside the church. The reunion in the church. The final scene. Lord, the final scene. Damn near teared up so many times.

The enlightenment "montages" were a fantastic way to take us back through the series. Brilliant.
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Old 05-25-2010, 03:30 AM   #6
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Amazing... that is all
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Old 05-25-2010, 04:08 AM   #7
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That was a mind blowing 2.5 hours finale. I was satisfied on every level. I was so happy to see Shannon back, I loved her.

Great great great ending. I cried a ton through out the episode.

BTW reason why Michael wasn't there is explained earlier in the season his soul is forever trapped on the Island, he can never move on, ever. That's way you don't even get a glimpse of him in the Flash Sideways verse.
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Old 05-25-2010, 08:48 AM   #8
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Incredible.

I might have been one of the people expressing frustration with earlier episodes in this season, but in terms of the character stories ending I couldn't be much happier. I got goose-pimples/chills on a number of occasions - especially with the enlightenment scenes - and welled up on one or two occasions.

For people questioning if the plane got off the island...it did.

Christian tells Jack that "some of them died before you, some long after". Kate tells Jack she missed him. This is because Jack died on the island, Kate left on the plane to live a full life in the real world. If she died at 80 she wouldn't have seen Jack for a good 50ish years. That's why she missed him.

Was Hurley wearing a Jacob-esque shirt during that church scene?
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Old 05-25-2010, 09:25 AM   #9
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So why isnt Libby trapped?
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Old 05-25-2010, 09:43 AM   #10
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So why isnt Libby trapped?
Why would she be?
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Old 05-25-2010, 09:26 AM   #11
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I notice Hurley was much more confident a person in the afterlife, probably due to hi many years ruling the island with Ben.
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:21 AM   #12
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I don't understand people saying there wasn't much of a ending for the island reality.
We got to see them go into the heart of it, which was an awesome location. We saw the final fight between Jack and The Smoke Monster, and the event of the Island being destroyed once and for all (until Jack saved it).
We also saw a new Jacob crowned, and everyone trapped there set free.

I don't know what more people could have wanted from the Island. We got so much from season to season, and I think they really saved the most epic, conclusive stuff for last.
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:28 AM   #13
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Some people just had unrealistic high expectations of having EVERY question answered, which will not happen on pretty much any show ever, let alone Lost. People wanted every possible question answered, even the most obscure ones. There's no time for that. The show has always been about the characters, with the island secondary.

A lot of questions that went unanswered were because they came from other questions. With some questions that did get answered a lot of the hardcore Lost theorists refused to believe or thought there had to be more to. At that point it's just getting ridiculous.

I can honestly say now that I know pretty much all there is to know about the survivors. The Island? Not so much, but isn't that the point?
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:43 AM   #14
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A lot of questions that went unanswered were because they came from other questions. With some questions that did get answered a lot of the hardcore Lost theorists refused to believe or thought there had to be more to. At that point it's just getting ridiculous.
Yea, I also noticed that. When answers would come, there'd be 50 more questions about it.
I think a big part of that is because a lot of the mysteries extended for multiple seasons, so the eventual answers were hyped to mythic status in minds. When the answer would come, they'd expect some monumental long winded explanation, but a lot of times all it required was an abrupt answer. Some of them hit you right over the head, but that's really all an answer is. All of the things that went into the mystery are the explanation.

Like The Smoke Monster. It perplexed people for years, and then we met this awesome character named MIB. After a few episodes, he says "sorry you had to see me like that." BOOM. It's revealed he's The Smoke Monster, but everyone expects more explanation like that and starts to theorize that it means something else.

I think the same thing happened a couple weeks ago when we saw MIB transformed into the Smoke Monster and there were a wealth of theories about it being someone else set free, and so on.

This theorizing is part what makes the show really fun, and interesting. But I also think it has to do with the unreal expectations and over-analyzing that is bred.
I think a lot of fans got really hung up on that aspect, and lost sight of what was really going on. Theorizing is awesome, but at some point it turns into a general interest in science and prediction/answers, and has nothing to do with the story. That's fine, because who am I to say what they should enjoy, but I'd argue they might not really 'get it.' That sucks too because they obviously missed the point, which was incredibly rewarding in the end.
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:56 AM   #15
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The writers are in a tough spot too...Take for instance the outrigger scene...They said when they introduced it last season, they absolutely knew who was on the other boat...

However, this season, with some of the characters having all ready been killed off, it became too hard to write it into the narrative and get the actors back so they chose to cut it.

They are in a lose lose situation: If they cut it, people complain. If they change it from what it was, then people complain they didnt know what they were doing with it, etc. etc.
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:31 AM   #16
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Actually this season really delivered huge on the island and the mythology. If you think about it, Jacob and MIB were only introduced officially in the Season 5 finale.
We had heard about Jacob before that, and we had seen MIB but we didn't know when and why it was him.

This season we found out massive things, like what the smoke monster is, and that he was a conscious character all along. I think that has a huge positive impact on the show. He's among the greatest villains ever.
The Lighthouse, and the cave, and all the locations involving Jacob and the Candidates were amazing.
There was a Black Rock and Richard backstory.
We learned the reason why the survivors were on the island all along, and that the island is both a way of protecting the world from evil, and a hiding place of a mystical lifeforce in the world.
I'm not sure why some people still say "what is The Island?" You put it well FearedSanctity. We don't know much more than that, but isn't that the point of metaphysical/supernatural things? It's so much better being given a good explanation of what it's all about, and why it matters, but not much more than that.

That stuff is all awesome. I think some of the fans who complain for more answers probably don't realize how far the show has come from week to week. Just last season they were still answering questions about the Dharma Initiative and The Others.
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:39 AM   #17
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I agree with Jeritron. ALot of complaints have been the show abandoned the mythology of the show during the season and especially in the finale.

I dont know how you can say that is true when you have Desmond and Jack descending into this cave with a glowing pond, skeletons of those who tried this previously, and a literal cork in the heart of the Island.

I know we didnt get a history of who built the temples/statues, etc, but I think you can theorize yourself enough on it.

I also love that the Island is just going to keep on being the Island, and that future visitors will see the remnants of 815 and wonder what happened to those people and who were they.
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:55 AM   #18
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I agree with Jeritron. ALot of complaints have been the show abandoned the mythology of the show during the season and especially in the finale.

I dont know how you can say that is true when you have Desmond and Jack descending into this cave with a glowing pond, skeletons of those who tried this previously, and a literal cork in the heart of the Island.

I know we didnt get a history of who built the temples/statues, etc, but I think you can theorize yourself enough on it.

I also love that the Island is just going to keep on being the Island, and that future visitors will see the remnants of 815 and wonder what happened to those people and who were they.

Yea. I loved that stuff. In addition to the stuff I already listed above, We also got The Lighthouse, the rock cave with the chalk names, the skeletons, the donkey wheel explanation. The storm that destroyed the statue.
We learned there was a society there before The Temple people. We learned about Mother.
Probably a ton of stuff I'm also missing right now.

There was a ton of mythology this season. More than any other, I'd argue. Especially the heart of the island location, with the cork in the ground and the skeletons on the floor. I'd argue that could be the single coolest peice of mythology on it's own. Other things were built upon, but seriously on it's own that is so awesome. It's pretty much as far as you can go for showing new, interesting things on the Island. It's the literal core of everything. And tampering with it makes the Island start falling apart and sinking into the ocean forever. That's about as final as you can get.

Season 5 had a lot too, but that was because they knew they were getting towards the end and it was designed to give a lot of backstory through time travel.
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:54 AM   #19
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Yeah I'm havin a discussion now with a mate of mine who didn't like the ending and feels it made the entire series pointless. His arguments are ridiculous though.

I'm finding it hard to not simply tell him he's an idiot and doesn't understand it all, but that could be pretty ignorant on my part. I've just told him that I feel sorry for him that he couldn't enjoy it because I loved it and it made the show all the better for me.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:12 AM   #20
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Yeah I'm havin a discussion now with a mate of mine who didn't like the ending and feels it made the entire series pointless. His arguments are ridiculous though.
I'm interested to hear why he says it was pointless. I'm guessing it has to do with the fact that everyone ends up in an afterlife anyways?

If it's that, it's just as easy to say that it would all be pointless if they didn't end up in an afterlife anyways.

Life is life, and death is death, regardless of what really happens afterwards. Everything that happens on the island and reality does matter. This is because the stakes of the future, and of the personal and emotional journeys is all real. Especially since the show is about destiny and fate. Jack's need to fix things and complete his purpose is very real. So is the need to protect the Island and stop MIB. And Jack wanting Kate to be safe and grow old, and succeed in getting Claire back to Aaron.
and everything that ever happened on the show.

People always die some day anyways. This goes for any story. Whether there's an afterlife or not doesn't really change what they did in real life.
The only difference is Lost showed it, for the purposes of emotional closure for the characters.
I think it's great that the writers addressed this in the finale. Desmond tried to tell Jack he shouldn't care anymore, and Jack explained how it all still mattered.
They did a lot to put across the importance of what was going on in the reality timeline, and what would continue to go on in the future.

If it's not that, I felt like talking about this anyways.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:21 AM   #21
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I'm interested to hear why he says it was pointless. I'm guessing it has to do with the fact that everyone ends up in an afterlife anyways?
He began saying stuff like "How is it all possible though? If there can be smoke monsters, then why can't other stuff happen? Like why can't Sawyer fly for example, their science fiction makes some stuff possible and others not"

After that I told him he was utterly ridiculous and he stopped talking.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:23 AM   #22
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He began saying stuff like "How is it all possible though? If there can be smoke monsters, then why can't other stuff happen? Like why can't Sawyer fly for example, their science fiction makes some stuff possible and others not"

After that I told him he was utterly ridiculous and he stopped talking.
Well that is just ridiculous. Every show, every story has to have its own borders and boundaries.
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:56 AM   #23
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Something I overlooked when watching but Lostpedia brought to my attention, the relation to Juliet's "It worked" at the beginning and end of the season
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:57 AM   #24
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Something I overlooked when watching but Lostpedia brought to my attention, the relation to Juliet's "It worked" at the beginning and end of the season
Yeah it was pretty cool writing I thought because everyone at the time assumed she meant the bomb.

I also completely forgot that Jack's appendectomy scar was actually where Locke stabbed him.

Also, I couldnt figure out why they called Desmond's episode "Happily Ever After"...but I get it now
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Old 05-25-2010, 10:58 AM   #25
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I'm just glad they stuck with a meaningful ending rather than a forced one that tried to cram answers
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:00 AM   #26
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I'm just glad they stuck with a meaningful ending rather than a forced one that tried to cram answers
me too. The more I think about it the more I liked it. Especially that last scene of Jack dying.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:02 AM   #27
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I could understand the people wanting more about the ancient temple dwellers, but there's plenty of information to be gathered about them. It's just scattered around.
It's also cool to have at least one chapter of island history that isn't fully explored.
They went back and showed everything about Dharma, and The Black Rock, and WWII, and even went B.C and showed the life of Jacob and MIB.
There's really not much more to learn about the temple people. I like it being kept to clues and imagination. Ultimately it's not really important anyways. We just know they came along and worshipped the mysteries of the island, and MIB apparently fucked with them.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:14 AM   #28
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Also, we knew there was such thing as an afterlife in Lost anyways, since it's a heavily spiritual and supernatural show, and there are multiple characters who can commune with the dead.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:21 AM   #29
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Also, we knew there was such thing as an afterlife in Lost anyways, since it's a heavily spiritual and supernatural show, and there are multiple characters who can commune with the dead.
Agree 100%.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:26 AM   #30
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They set the rules pretty good too. It's not like Smokey and the Island just have their powers because they feel like it.
Characters like Hurley, Miles and Walt are clearly just gifted individuals. The rest is stuff happening on the island, not superpowered characters.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:30 AM   #31
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:33 AM   #32
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lol I remember thinking he was cutting it a bit close with that hiding spot. The angle could make the bush seem closer to Locke than it really is though
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:38 AM   #33
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lol, true. But still, come on. Surely there must have been a better spot to have him hide
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:39 AM   #34
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What did the bomb do exactly? Is that the reason why the island is at the bottom of the ocean? Because it's "dead" in this afterlife? The bomb "killed" it?

Do I have that right?
Last edited by RoXer; 05-25-2010 at 11:42 AM.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:43 AM   #35
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What did the bomb do exactly? Is that the reason why the island is at the bottom of the ocean? Because it's "dead" in this afterlife? The bomb "killed" it?

Do I have that right?
Bomb knocked them back to 2007, but they still crashed on the Island. So what really brought the plane down?
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:47 AM   #36
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What did the bomb do exactly? Is that the reason why it's at the bottom of the ocean? Because it's "dead" in this afterlife? The bomb "killed" it?

Do I have that right?
In the afterlife the island is a distant memory, and I guess that's why it's dead and not a factor. That's just a way of showing it.

The Bomb didn't have anything to do with anything in the afterlife though. The Bomb either never went off, or was neutralized by the electromagnetic pocket.
Whatever happened there was The Incident, and the Dharma initiative just sealed the area off and finished the hatch, and remembered it all as a bunch of crazy bastards causing mayhem.
Jack and Co. magically travelled back to 2007 right after. I don't know if The Incident caused that, or just The Island's will. Probably both.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:51 AM   #37
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Funny to think that they caused the need for the button, which in turned caused their plane to crash on the Island.

I also loved how everyone who came to the Island crashed their in one way or another. Jacob brought them there, and then they were forced to stay there.
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Old 05-25-2010, 03:06 PM   #38
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In the afterlife the island is a distant memory, and I guess that's why it's dead and not a factor. That's just a way of showing it.

The Bomb didn't have anything to do with anything in the afterlife though. The Bomb either never went off, or was neutralized by the electromagnetic pocket.
Whatever happened there was The Incident, and the Dharma initiative just sealed the area off and finished the hatch, and remembered it all as a bunch of crazy bastards causing mayhem.
Jack and Co. magically travelled back to 2007 right after. I don't know if The Incident caused that, or just The Island's will. Probably both.
Also, Richard says he "watched them die" regarding Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Sayid, Jin, Juliet, Hurley and Miles in 1977.
He was definitely referring to The Incident. Him and Eloise Hawking helped them find the bomb to use, but then split up from them because Eloise was pregnant.
She is the one who insisted on going with them, but Richard knocked her out to protect her. He said he was going to bring her out of that cave through the main entrance, instead of going through Dharmaville with them.
It's highly likely that when she woke up, she wanted to go see what was going on and her and Richard went to watch The Incident from a safe place.

Richard obviously thought this meant they were dead, since they were gone afterwards.
When they came along in 2004, he knew that was the versions of them that would go to 1977, but thought they would die there since that's what he saw, and didn't know they would be coming back to 2007 soon after.

Pretty awesome stuff. Time travel is great, but tough to pull off. I think they did a damn good job in Season 5.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:39 AM   #39
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I agree, it's awful. It's not like he couldn't see them from those thick woods further back.
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Old 05-25-2010, 11:54 AM   #40
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what was the origin of the ship Jacob and MIB's real pregnant mother came on? That was also the same boat that the society MIB joined up with came on, I gathered.
It was around 2000 years ago, so was it Romans or something?

I know they spoke English, but that was obviously to prevent having the entire episode subtitled.
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