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Old 11-26-2015, 03:35 PM   #1
DAMN iNATOR
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Sting is better than Triple H...maybe not by a ton, but enough so that him beating Triple H wouldn't have hurt Triple H.

And you have no room to talk about people being partial to anybody or anything, since you're EXTREMELY partial and biased towards WWE. Bet that's why you think Trips is so much better than Sting: he's WWF/WWE, Sting was WCW.
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Old 11-26-2015, 03:43 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAMN iNATOR View Post
Sting is better than Triple H...maybe not by a ton, but enough so that him beating Triple H wouldn't have hurt Triple H.

And you have no room to talk about people being partial to anybody or anything, since you're EXTREMELY partial and biased towards WWE. Bet that's why you think Trips is so much better than Sting: he's WWF/WWE, Sting was WCW.
I just think Trips had a bigger impact and drew more money. A lot more.
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Old 11-26-2015, 04:47 PM   #3
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I just think Trips had a bigger impact and drew more money. A lot more.
And I'm telling you, you think wrong.
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Old 11-26-2015, 05:30 PM   #4
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I love Triple H, but there is no way you are critiquing certain people for not having quotes or stats to back up some of their arguments, when surely you have made the same error with that statement.

There is absolutely no way to prove that Hunter made more money than Sting. There were very view events where Hunter was the main attraction (and by that I mean the reason the majority bought their ticket) and it would be impossible to count the money he made.

Same with Sting, but he was doing great business when Hunter was a jobber on his show. He did amazing business just by sitting in the rafters and watching matches. Sting is iconic and the face of WCW. If your opinion is that Hunter drew more due to his position and big matches, that's fine, but there is no way you can say he drew a lot more than Sting.

Sting is iconic and comfortably top 10 in GOAT debate, Hunter isn't IMO.
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Old 11-27-2015, 12:54 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maluco View Post
I love Triple H, but there is no way you are critiquing certain people for not having quotes or stats to back up some of their arguments, when surely you have made the same error with that statement.

There is absolutely no way to prove that Hunter made more money than Sting. There were very view events where Hunter was the main attraction (and by that I mean the reason the majority bought their ticket) and it would be impossible to count the money he made.

Same with Sting, but he was doing great business when Hunter was a jobber on his show. He did amazing business just by sitting in the rafters and watching matches. Sting is iconic and the face of WCW. If your opinion is that Hunter drew more due to his position and big matches, that's fine, but there is no way you can say he drew a lot more than Sting.

Sting is iconic and comfortably top 10 in GOAT debate, Hunter isn't IMO.
Sting in the rafters was the only period you could argue he made huge money for the company. Until Goldberg came along, he was the #1 face in WCW, without working. An amazing feat.

However, HHH has worked near or at the top of the card for call it 10+ Wrestlemanias, many of those were 60k+ fans in attendance. Sting headlined ONE PPV that did massive business, without looking I would say HHH probably was a key draw in 10+ PPVs that did way more than that, many doing in the million range.

HHH headlined with Austin and Rock on house show runs. I dont know what those did in terms of dollars, but no way Sting had a better run than that.

Business wise, I dont even think its close to be honest.
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Old 11-27-2015, 12:47 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAMN iNATOR View Post
And I'm telling you, you think wrong.
Buyrates HHH dummies

House show revenue HHH dummies

Merchandise HHH dummies

Number of all time great moments and matches HHH dummies

Curious where you think Sting has HHH beat. Most TNA matches?
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Old 11-27-2015, 01:21 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
Buyrates HHH dummies

House show revenue HHH dummies

Merchandise HHH dummies

Number of all time great moments and matches HHH dummies

Curious where you think Sting has HHH beat. Most TNA matches?
Do you have actual numbers to back up these claims? I'm not debating with whether or not they're true. Just curious if there's factual evidence to support this.
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Old 11-27-2015, 01:24 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
Buyrates HHH dummies

House show revenue HHH dummies

Merchandise HHH dummies

Number of all time great moments and matches HHH dummies

Curious where you think Sting has HHH beat. Most TNA matches?
Overall career quality. I guess you've never considered that Sting EARNED the right to be called "The Icon".
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Old 11-26-2015, 05:45 PM   #9
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Sting has been face most his career while HHH has been a heel most of his. I'm sure Sting made more money from selling merchandise and being the face at the top of the card. But I could be wrong, is that how the business works CyNick?
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Old 11-26-2015, 08:18 PM   #10
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My opinion Os that Barry hrowitz is better than the rock
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Old 11-27-2015, 01:54 AM   #11
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I've said it before and I'll say it again It does not matter how many times Triple H has been champ and as bad as the WWE would love for us to think so no matter how many DVDs they put out proclaimng how great he is, HHH is NOT ON THE SAME LEVEL as Taker,Austin,Rock,HBK or Sting. there is a reason no one was clamoring to see Taker V Triple H at mania there is a reason People regarded Sting v Taker as a dream match.

I know it hurts but its true He's second banana at best 3rd tier support character at worst.
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Old 11-27-2015, 02:16 PM   #12
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I have paid to see Triple H.
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Old 11-27-2015, 04:10 PM   #13
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I have paid to see Triple H.
I have paid to see Triple H
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Old 11-27-2015, 04:10 PM   #14
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There's a shocker
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Old 11-27-2015, 10:51 PM   #15
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Old 11-27-2015, 10:56 PM   #16
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There were only so many of these, you will run out quickly.
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Old 11-27-2015, 11:09 PM   #17
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There were only so many of these, you will run out quickly.
Vince only has one ass and you kiss it a lot.
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Old 11-27-2015, 11:17 PM   #18
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That is simply nonsense perpetuated by the dirtsheets.
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Old 11-27-2015, 11:25 PM   #19
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Don't forget the mom and pop shop gimmick that was poached of talent by the evil Ted Turner, even though Vince was buying out territories and poaching talent while loading up for and supporting his new global vision of a wrestling company.
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Old 11-27-2015, 11:26 PM   #20
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What are you talking about? That just sounds like more malarky put forth by that hack David Q. Meltzer.
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Old 11-28-2015, 07:19 PM   #21
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I could be and have been wrong before, but I have often heard claims that WM3 attendance numbers were overinflated.
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Old 11-28-2015, 11:29 PM   #22
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I could be and have been wrong before, but I have often heard claims that WM3 attendance numbers were overinflated.
drastically
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Old 11-28-2015, 10:03 PM   #23
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WCW really should have just let DX roll into the arena with a fucking tank live on Nitro. Would have ensured 100% viewership for that particular segment.

But the fact that WWE acts like that was the turning point of the Monday Night Wars is comical.
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Old 11-28-2015, 10:36 PM   #24
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WCW really should have just let DX roll into the arena with a fucking tank live on Nitro. Would have ensured 100% viewership for that particular segment.

But the fact that WWE acts like that was the turning point of the Monday Night Wars is comical.
They should have sent Meng and Barbarian out there to confront them. Worst case scenario, you lose Meng and Barbarian on manslaughter charges.
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Old 11-28-2015, 10:48 PM   #25
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They should have sent Meng and Barbarian out there to confront them. Worst case scenario, you lose Meng and Barbarian on manslaughter charges.
As if the cops could arrest them.
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Old 11-29-2015, 06:01 PM   #26
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WCW really should have just let DX roll into the arena with a fucking tank live on Nitro. Would have ensured 100% viewership for that particular segment.

But the fact that WWE acts like that was the turning point of the Monday Night Wars is comical.
Turning point is a stretch, but they were there on WCW turf, and the fans saw them as big stars. So it was something.
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Old 11-28-2015, 10:31 PM   #27
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This whole "WWE does shit to dampen someone; LOOK AT HOW DAMP THEY ARE!" bullshit you do, Cynick, is getting boring. Change your gimmick up, man.
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Old 11-28-2015, 10:56 PM   #28
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The WWE should put out a "Legend of Haku" special on the WWE Network.
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Old 11-28-2015, 11:02 PM   #29
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Wonder if Haku could still easily fuck people up to this day.
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Old 11-28-2015, 11:20 PM   #30
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Now he just scares them into buying a car, even if they were bringing someone else to buy a car.
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Old 11-29-2015, 02:32 PM   #31
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CyNick, I'm trying to think more scenarios for you too book. The only thing I can think of now is Montrel. I'm not trying to beating a dead horse just want to see how you would handle it.

So let's go back in time. Will keep every situation the sam. Bret refuses to do the job, and Vince is worried what Bret will do with the title... The only thing that we are going to change you can't stop the match and "Screw Bret." How do you handle the situation?
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Old 11-29-2015, 06:14 PM   #32
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CyNick, I'm trying to think more scenarios for you too book. The only thing I can think of now is Montrel. I'm not trying to beating a dead horse just want to see how you would handle it.

So let's go back in time. Will keep every situation the sam. Bret refuses to do the job, and Vince is worried what Bret will do with the title... The only thing that we are going to change you can't stop the match and "Screw Bret." How do you handle the situation?
People will just roll their eyes, so I probably shouldnt bother, but I feel Vince handled that masterfully.

To me, you couldnt let Bret walk out of Survivor Series as champion. I'm sure we have all heard interviews with Bret, and realize he takes the business and his character really seriously. Maybe too seriously. As a result, it clouded his judgment and he acted selfishly and refusing to drop to Shawn in Montreal.

From Vince's POV, you have Bret going to Turner, and you have this big grudge match booked. Standard wrestling booking is when a guy is leaving a territory, he does the favours. It was perfectly reasonable for Vince to EXPECT Bret to put over someone of his choosing. Bret and Shawn were rivals, and if Bret is leaving, you want Shawn to look like the superior talent. Bret acted childish, and refused, so Vince was backed into a corner.

The epic thing was Vince had the foresight to put himself on TV as an authority figure in the angle. This was perfect, because it set up the next decade plus of TV as him as the evil authority figure. Really smart booking, a genius move.
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Old 11-29-2015, 07:10 PM   #33
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People will just roll their eyes, so I probably shouldnt bother, but I feel Vince handled that masterfully.

To me, you couldnt let Bret walk out of Survivor Series as champion. I'm sure we have all heard interviews with Bret, and realize he takes the business and his character really seriously. Maybe too seriously. As a result, it clouded his judgment and he acted selfishly and refusing to drop to Shawn in Montreal.

From Vince's POV, you have Bret going to Turner, and you have this big grudge match booked. Standard wrestling booking is when a guy is leaving a territory, he does the favours. It was perfectly reasonable for Vince to EXPECT Bret to put over someone of his choosing. Bret and Shawn were rivals, and if Bret is leaving, you want Shawn to look like the superior talent. Bret acted childish, and refused, so Vince was backed into a corner.

The epic thing was Vince had the foresight to put himself on TV as an authority figure in the angle. This was perfect, because it set up the next decade plus of TV as him as the evil authority figure. Really smart booking, a genius move.
I think Vince handled it the best way possible way to especially considering how every turned out for WWE.

I'm doing this in total fantasy world which is going to be unrealistic. I would do Money in the bank/WM 9 style.

I would end the Bret/HBK match in a double DQ, and then I would have someone let's say Owen Hart (it can be anyone I don't care) challenge Bret after the match, and then Owen wins the belt. However he loses it at the next PPV to Shawn, and maybe not that much of the future is changed.

That way everything ends up amicable between Vince and Bret. It's unrealistic, but I think it kind of works.
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Old 11-30-2015, 09:04 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post

The epic thing was Vince had the foresight to put himself on TV as an authority figure in the angle. This was perfect, because it set up the next decade plus of TV as him as the evil authority figure. Really smart booking, a genius move.
Minus him trying to be a babyface after it al happened. No foresight but stil smart to go heel when he realized the fans didn't buy him as a face
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Old 11-30-2015, 04:19 PM   #35
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Minus him trying to be a babyface after it al happened. No foresight but stil smart to go heel when he realized the fans didn't buy him as a face
That promo was designed to babyface the direction the company was going, not Vince himself.
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Old 11-30-2015, 04:35 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
People will just roll their eyes, so I probably shouldnt bother, but I feel Vince handled that masterfully.

To me, you couldnt let Bret walk out of Survivor Series as champion. I'm sure we have all heard interviews with Bret, and realize he takes the business and his character really seriously. Maybe too seriously. As a result, it clouded his judgment and he acted selfishly and refusing to drop to Shawn in Montreal.

From Vince's POV, you have Bret going to Turner, and you have this big grudge match booked. Standard wrestling booking is when a guy is leaving a territory, he does the favours. It was perfectly reasonable for Vince to EXPECT Bret to put over someone of his choosing. Bret and Shawn were rivals, and if Bret is leaving, you want Shawn to look like the superior talent. Bret acted childish, and refused, so Vince was backed into a corner.
I think this was the post where you jumped the shark, for me anyway
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Old 11-30-2015, 04:50 PM   #37
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I think this was the post where you jumped the shark, for me anyway
He was backed into a corner

You have your champion leaving and refusing to put over the guy you want to be the heir apparent.

Nash put over HBK and Taker on his way out. Why couldn't Bret put over HBK?

Bret left Vince with no choice. Well, no good choice anyway.
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Old 11-29-2015, 03:44 PM   #38
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If you can't screw Bret I guess you let him show up on Nitro with the WWF Heavyweight Championship. Let's see what the CyNick has to say.
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Old 11-29-2015, 04:11 PM   #39
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Or you have a verbal agreement with him to do it the next night to another opponent. I don't think there was any risk of Bret showing up on Nitro with the belt.

Was it childish that he didn't want to drop it to HBK? Yes. Did he have his reasons not to? Also, yes. But he would have dropped it the next night on RAW to anyone else. It shouldn't have been the big drama that it was, but people love a good drama!
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Old 11-29-2015, 06:15 PM   #40
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Or you have a verbal agreement with him to do it the next night to another opponent. I don't think there was any risk of Bret showing up on Nitro with the belt.

Was it childish that he didn't want to drop it to HBK? Yes. Did he have his reasons not to? Also, yes. But he would have dropped it the next night on RAW to anyone else. It shouldn't have been the big drama that it was, but people love a good drama!
The next night TV was in Canada, whats different between dropping on Sunday or Monday? The issue was dropping to Shawn and in Canada. On both issues, Bret acted unprofessional.
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