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Old 09-20-2016, 08:32 AM   #321
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Originally Posted by Ruien View Post
Where is the Young vs Titus match?!?!
Rightfully shitcanned.
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Old 09-20-2016, 09:20 AM   #322
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Originally Posted by Dark One View Post
Don't really like Rollins saving Reigns after all the shit they've been through, but whatevs.
Yeah they could have booked it better to where he just wanted to attack Owens.

If they really wanted to get him over as face after pedigreeing Ownes he should pedigree reigns too. Crowd would eat that up.
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Old 09-20-2016, 09:21 AM   #323
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I miss the Curb Stomp. I didn't like it in NXT, but they worked hard to put that move over.
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Old 09-20-2016, 09:23 AM   #324
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I think the match should have ended no-contest instead of Roman defeating KO clean...seems like bad booking to make KO look weaker than Roman on go-home show of Owen's 1st title defense against the Demon Seth...
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Old 09-20-2016, 09:26 AM   #325
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sliksuke nakamura View Post
I think the match should have ended no-contest instead of Roman defeating KO clean...seems like bad booking to make KO look weaker than Roman on go-home show of Owen's 1st title defense against the Demon Seth...
I'm wondering if they fucked the ending up.... wonder if they were supposed to fall near the same time.
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Old 09-20-2016, 09:36 AM   #326
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Rusev should have electrified the cage as Reigns was climbing it, shocking Reigns and causing him to fall and allowing Owens to pin him. Instant ratings. Well, not really, but I want to see Rusev, animated as he is, running around with that sort of equipment.

If it were the Attitude era, Lana would have seduced the referee into giving her the key, Rusev would have entered the match to beat up Reigns with Owens. Rollins would have come out, but can't get into the cage, so he climbs to the top of it and dives onto Rusev and Owens. A massive brawl ensues, and in the chaos, Owens escapes through the door and cluthes the Universal Title he just retained for dear life as Rusev eats a Superkick/Spear combination as Lana's top gets caught on the cage, ripping off as she stumbles around in a panic. When Rusev arrives at the PPV, he notices Lana smiling at something. He gets her password off Goldust (who has placed cameras around the place) and discovers that Seth Rollins has been sending her pictures of his penis, to which he would explain "IT'S HUUUUGE!" in comical fashion. He'd drop the phone in a fury and Goldust would come back into the frame and send the photos to himself for later.

Rusev would get so frustrated during his match with Roman Reigns, he'd hand Roman the US Title in exchange for his help beating up "Stupid Seth." Roman agrees to take the belt, but Spears Rusev anyway. "WE HAD A DEAL, AMERICAN!" Lana comes out during the Rollins/Owens match despite her not having any connection to it at all. Owens would Powerbomb her onto the ring apron and Rusev would hit the ring and beat up both men. Reigns would then come out and Spear Rusev again to end the show and the main event of Hell in a Cell would be a two-fall Hell in a Cell match for the US and Universal Titles, with Sexy Lana as the Special Guest Referee.
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Old 09-20-2016, 11:29 AM   #327
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Having Reigns win sucks but I don't think it was done in a burial kind of way. Owens, being the champion of the galaxy should have won though.
Rollins coming in for he save, are you kidding me?
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Old 09-20-2016, 11:35 AM   #328
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noid View Post
I miss the Curb Stomp. I didn't like it in NXT, but they worked hard to put that move over.
I think it was a lawsuit waiting to happen.
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Old 09-20-2016, 12:07 PM   #329
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noid View Post
Rusev should have electrified the cage as Reigns was climbing it, shocking Reigns and causing him to fall and allowing Owens to pin him. Instant ratings. Well, not really, but I want to see Rusev, animated as he is, running around with that sort of equipment.

If it were the Attitude era, Lana would have seduced the referee into giving her the key, Rusev would have entered the match to beat up Reigns with Owens. Rollins would have come out, but can't get into the cage, so he climbs to the top of it and dives onto Rusev and Owens. A massive brawl ensues, and in the chaos, Owens escapes through the door and cluthes the Universal Title he just retained for dear life as Rusev eats a Superkick/Spear combination as Lana's top gets caught on the cage, ripping off as she stumbles around in a panic. When Rusev arrives at the PPV, he notices Lana smiling at something. He gets her password off Goldust (who has placed cameras around the place) and discovers that Seth Rollins has been sending her pictures of his penis, to which he would explain "IT'S HUUUUGE!" in comical fashion. He'd drop the phone in a fury and Goldust would come back into the frame and send the photos to himself for later.

Rusev would get so frustrated during his match with Roman Reigns, he'd hand Roman the US Title in exchange for his help beating up "Stupid Seth." Roman agrees to take the belt, but Spears Rusev anyway. "WE HAD A DEAL, AMERICAN!" Lana comes out during the Rollins/Owens match despite her not having any connection to it at all. Owens would Powerbomb her onto the ring apron and Rusev would hit the ring and beat up both men. Reigns would then come out and Spear Rusev again to end the show and the main event of Hell in a Cell would be a two-fall Hell in a Cell match for the US and Universal Titles, with Sexy Lana as the Special Guest Referee.
I'm pretty sure Noid just outed himself as Vince Russo.
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Old 09-20-2016, 01:37 PM   #330
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Big Cass went from wrestling for the Universal Title to jobbing to the Shining Stars.
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Old 09-20-2016, 04:00 PM   #331
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I feel that Raw was pretty bad this week. It really felt like a chore to sit through and watch.

There wasn't really much to talk about really as the show was that bad. But I did like the 10-man Tag Team Match and the promo the came before it.

I'm sure like most people, the main talking point is the return of the Cruiserweights. Also, I'm sure I'm the only one here who thinks this, but I felt that the Cruiserweight match was pretty boring, but I did find it funny when Mick Foley said "....we did that last week, in crowning the first ever WWE Cruiserweight Champion....T.J. Perkins" and then only around six people cheered.

Also, is it just me or does the beginning of Rich Swann's theme sound a little bit like the beginning of the "Level Clear" theme from Sonic Adventure 2? Just for a split second. When I heard his theme, I actually thought I was about to listen to the "Level Clear" theme.

And why was one of the first things Micheal Cole told us about Swann was that his parents are dead? What was the point of that? Was it to make us think "Oh, he's smiling and dancing, but his parents are dead. What a happy guy. Even his parents being dead can't stop him smiling, dancing and having fun!". I dunno.

On to Kendrick now and I'm so happy that he's back. I've always liked Kendrick and I really hope he goes somewhere and isn't just the "returning jobber" for the Cruiserweight Division like Mahal has been so far and what I think Hawkins will also be on SmackDown. Sure, he has a title match but I really can't see him winning. Why crown a new champion after a long tournament only to have him drop the title around ten days later?

Also, talking of the title and again, I'm sure I'm the only one here who thinks this as I haven't seen anyone mention it, but the Cruiserweight Championship looks horrendous. It looks like a toy, or a championship some twelve year old made on a SvR game. It makes the Universal Championship look like a work of art. I'm not a fan.

On to the match itself though and I must be getting old as there was a time where I loved watching Cruiserweights, but watching the match last night and all I thought was "Flippy Shit".

There were some good moments, but there were also things that we had already seen earlier in the night or have seen quite recently or regularly, but a small portion of the crowd and Micheal Cole acted like it was some kind of insane feat that we had never seen before. For example, when Cedric Alexander and then Gran Metalik jumped from/over the ropes to the outside, Cole and a portion of the crowd went crazy, but Kofi Kingston did that about forty-five minutes prior with no "orgasm" coming from Cole or the crowd.

I understand that Cole has to sell the match and the division, but I just find it a bit annoying.

Overall, Raw was pretty bad and the Cruiserweight Division is "meh". Roll on SmackDown.
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Old 09-20-2016, 04:00 PM   #332
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I will also say that I find Epico's impressions of Enzo hilarious.

So hilarious that I even made this hilarious gif.
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Old 09-20-2016, 04:09 PM   #333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cool King View Post
II'm sure like most people, the main talking point is the return of the Cruiserweights. Also, I'm sure I'm the only one here who thinks this, but I felt that the Cruiserweight match was pretty boring, but I did find it funny when Mick Foley said "....we did that last week, in crowning the first ever WWE Cruiserweight Champion....T.J. Perkins" and then only around six people cheered.

Also, is it just me or does the beginning of Rich Swann's theme sound a little bit like the beginning of the "Level Clear" theme from Sonic Adventure 2? Just for a split second. When I heard his theme, I actually thought I was about to listen to the "Level Clear" theme.

And why was one of the first things Micheal Cole told us about Swann was that his parents are dead? What was the point of that? Was it to make us think "Oh, he's smiling and dancing, but his parents are dead. What a happy guy. Even his parents being dead can't stop him smiling, dancing and having fun!". I dunno.

On to Kendrick now and I'm so happy that he's back. I've always liked Kendrick and I really hope he goes somewhere and isn't just the "returning jobber" for the Cruiserweight Division like Mahal has been so far and what I think Hawkins will also be on SmackDown. Sure, he has a title match but I really can't see him winning. Why crown a new champion after a long tournament only to have him drop the title around ten days later?

Also, talking of the title and again, I'm sure I'm the only one here who thinks this as I haven't seen anyone mention it, but the Cruiserweight Championship looks horrendous. It looks like a toy, or a championship some twelve year old made on a SvR game. It makes the Universal Championship look like a work of art. I'm not a fan.

On to the match itself though and I must be getting old as there was a time where I loved watching Cruiserweights, but watching the match last night and all I thought was "Flippy Shit".

There were some good moments, but there were also things that we had already seen earlier in the night or have seen quite recently or regularly, but a small portion of the crowd and Micheal Cole acted like it was some kind of insane feat that we had never seen before. For example, when Cedric Alexander and then Gran Metalik jumped from/over the ropes to the outside, Cole and a portion of the crowd went crazy, but Kofi Kingston did that about forty-five minutes prior with no "orgasm" coming from Cole or the crowd.

I understand that Cole has to sell the match and the division, but I just find it a bit annoying.

Overall, Raw was pretty bad and the Cruiserweight Division is "meh". Roll on SmackDown.
So I kind of agree as a massive fan of the CWC, the Cruiserweight match was just there. I mean, I get it, they made it a fatal 4 way with guys that haven't wrestled that much on the indies with one guy who doesn't even speak English and they were basically told to geth their shit in. All 4 of them had excellent singles matches in the CWC if you want an actual introduction to some of them.

Give Kendrick and TJ Perkins at least 20 minutes at Night of Champions though and it could be match of the night. Both of them had amazing matches in the tournament and I'm looking forward to seeing them go against each other.

The belt looks good on TJ Perkins. Kind of makes it look like a boxing belt.
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Old 09-20-2016, 04:15 PM   #334
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It did enter my mind that it looked a bit like a boxing belt.
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Old 09-20-2016, 04:17 PM   #335
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So much purple though with the Cruiserweights.

If he wasn't dead, you would be forgiven for thinking Prince was involved with the division.
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Old 09-20-2016, 04:34 PM   #336
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I mean, with how short he was, he would have been a cruiserweight.
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Old 09-20-2016, 04:34 PM   #337
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I turned Raw on and the same 4 Divas were on. I am tired of watching them already. There is literally no variety to that boring division. I turned it off after the second set of commercials and they were still on.
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Old 09-20-2016, 04:54 PM   #338
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I'm with Cool King in the belt. I like the centerpiece and side plates but it's just to much purple. Would look cool on a traditional black belt. Also why not have TJP on Raw with the title?
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Old 09-20-2016, 05:45 PM   #339
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Didn't even get through the first hour. Nasty migraine, light and tv screens hurt.

Judging from what I'm reading, a lot of bullshit and they put the cruiserweights in at the last hour? I didn't miss much then.
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Old 09-20-2016, 05:52 PM   #340
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Quote:
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I think it was a lawsuit waiting to happen.
I don't get it though. If kids Tombstone each other, what is going to happen? Punching each other could potentially kill. Are they going to ban punching? What about the sledgehammer?

Or is it some sort of racial thing? I know there's the iconic Curb Stomp scene in American History X, but surely kicking someone in the back of the head hasn't been reserved for African-Americans over the course of history? Might be underestimating its significance though.
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Old 09-20-2016, 05:53 PM   #341
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So I kind of agree as a massive fan of the CWC, the Cruiserweight match was just there. I mean, I get it, they made it a fatal 4 way with guys that haven't wrestled that much on the indies with one guy who doesn't even speak English and they were basically told to geth their shit in. All 4 of them had excellent singles matches in the CWC if you want an actual introduction to some of them.
Probably didn't help Cole didn't match the same excitement of Mauro and Bryan which really helped the CWC feel special. Was also pretty dumb to not provide subtitles or have someone explain what Gran Matelik was saying for his promo considering he doesn't speak English.

Also them pretty much repeating some of the same mistakes done with the debut and start of the Women's Revolution.
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Old 09-20-2016, 05:55 PM   #342
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It was just a showcase of 4 "new" people to the Raw audience. Let them settle into the groove of singles matches, and the cruisers will be shit hot.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:00 PM   #343
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I actually really like the Cruiserweight Title. Something about the octagon shape is a bit too symmetrical, but the general design suits it, I think. Normally I don't like the colored belts they do, but the scheme coming from the CWC makes sense and actually gives it some history. I think it being different actually makes sense too, because the whole thing is that their style is meant to be different. There's something aesthetically okay with the cruiserweights fighting over a "World Title" that chooses silver instead of gold and purple instead of black.

That same thing bothers me with the Universal Title though. The Uni Title is supposed to be a World Title, so it should look like a World Title. Not look like the other World Title, but like its own World Title. I think that is where you should stay traditional with the black strap and gold plates.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:01 PM   #344
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It was just a showcase of 4 "new" people to the Raw audience. Let them settle into the groove of singles matches, and the cruisers will be shit hot.
Do you think they'll get that way if they're just doing the spotty matches every week, or do you think they'll need proper storylines and development? Sincere question.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:05 PM   #345
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I think Kendrick is a good choice to be TJ Perkins' first challenger. They never fought in the CWC, they both wrestled Kota Ibushi, Kendrick's the old, steady hand. I do worry that when you see the flippy shit every week, eventually no one will care, and that these multi-man matches eventually blend together and no one gets over because everybody beats everybody.

I think the overall idea might be just "send them out as filler because they will keep the kids with ADHD because they're moving fast and shit" to simply fill a quarter-hour. I think they're functional like that, but I do think it's a novelty that could wear off if they don't take their time to really protect and hone some legitimately personalities to sort of sign-post the division. TJ Perkins is obviously one, and I hope that Gran Metalik is another, but he just lost.

Kota Ibushi is in such a good position, because he gets to sit back, wait and see if these guys get over and are booked decently, and then come in later once the dust has settled and basically be the biggest attraction in there. Ricochet also has that advantage, provided that he still wants to sign with WWE down the line.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:07 PM   #346
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Quote:
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Do you think they'll get that way if they're just doing the spotty matches every week, or do you think they'll need proper storylines and development? Sincere question.
Storylines and development would be nice, but it may be hard to showcase a bunch of different talent in the division if they are only given one segment a week. I don't feel like a lot of the WCW cruiserweight matches had too much behind them outside of the title picture, and even that was mostly just based on wins and losses. I don't think that the goal here is for compelling storytelling as much as it is a special attraction. Regardless, we should at least get a good to great match out of it each week.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:07 PM   #347
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Oddly enough, if you make the cruiserweights too much of stars, you're going to have to start mixing them in with the rest of the roster, and things start to get hairy.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:09 PM   #348
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Then again, the CWC only showcased two matches a week and made me care about a lot of people along the way. I suppose it can be done.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:10 PM   #349
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Ugh, don't start me on that. Finn Balor, 190lbs, Heavyweight Division; Cedric Alexander, 205lbs, Cruiserweight Division. So obviously Finn Balor is pound-for-pound way better than Alexander, right? I don't get it.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:14 PM   #350
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Quote:
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Ugh, don't start me on that. Finn Balor, 190lbs, Heavyweight Division; Cedric Alexander, 205lbs, Cruiserweight Division. So obviously Finn Balor is pound-for-pound way better than Alexander, right? I don't get it.
Yeah, that is kinda bizarre. Also, how much does Enzo Amore weigh? Kayfabe-wise, they should explain that competitors have a choice of which division to compete in...or something. I dunno. Anything to help it make sense, I suppose. I'm gonna try not to think about it too hard, though.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:21 PM   #351
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I looked this up the other day. His Wikipedia bills him as...200lbs, which is heavier than the dude they just put the World Title. Geez. He seems smaller. Probably because they put him next to Cass all the time.
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Old 09-20-2016, 06:35 PM   #352
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Oddly enough, if you make the cruiserweights too much of stars, you're going to have to start mixing them in with the rest of the roster, and things start to get hairy.
Depends on how the WWE handles that issue. Needs to be better than the last time they had a Cruiser division and also not follow the same mistakes WCW did when they were around.

Best case is the division being used as a launching pad for the big stars of the division to move on to potential greater things. Sort of like what the WWE did with Rey Mysterio except with more guys benefiting.
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Old 09-20-2016, 10:39 PM   #353
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Universal Championship isn't really a heavyweight title though. Has it nowhere on the title and is never called one. More of a openweight championship I guess.
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Old 09-20-2016, 10:44 PM   #354
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Quote:
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I will also say that I find Epico's impressions of Enzo hilarious.

So hilarious that I even made this hilarious gif.
Stolen from Owens. He should be fired.
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Old 09-20-2016, 10:45 PM   #355
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So why wasn't the top crusierweight (the champ) featured in a match or at all?
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Old 09-21-2016, 03:19 AM   #356
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Quote:
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Kota Ibushi is in such a good position, because he gets to sit back, wait and see if these guys get over and are booked decently, and then come in later once the dust has settled and basically be the biggest attraction in there. Ricochet also has that advantage, provided that he still wants to sign with WWE down the line.
Ibushi apparently doesn't want to. He doesn't want to be tied down anywhere so he can do whatever he wants and he quit NJPW because of the schedule. With WWE's being even worse, I don't think he'll ever sign full time.
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Old 09-21-2016, 07:08 AM   #357
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So why wasn't the top crusierweight (the champ) featured in a match or at all?
PPV attraction, I reckon.

Not really, but he comes with a built in rub. He'll defend successfully at the PPV, I presume. Final boss type shit.
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Old 09-21-2016, 07:16 AM   #358
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Do you think they'll get that way if they're just doing the spotty matches every week, or do you think they'll need proper storylines and development? Sincere question.
This was one of the questions I asked myself; I prefer storyline-driven wrestling where you're given a reason to care about one guy over the other, but, having watched the CWC final with my wife (a casual fan, I suppose) she was impressed, so maybe there is merit in just sending them out to wow the crowd.

The pitfall of that is that the style of the guys at the top of the card is very cruiserweight-ish so what sets the CW Division apart?

Maybe a more sports-like presentation, with rankings or a league based on round robin style match ups (3 points for a win, 1 point for a draw, 0 for losing) where you can do short promos during intros to allow the guys to talk about what motivates them going into the match (whether they've been on a losing streak, or are desperate to gain "points" or move up the rankings, you can have the guys talk about how the previous match with the guy their facing - presuming you're having everybody face off twice). Maybe a small tweak to the presentation by calling it the Cruiserweight League? You could have the guy(s) finishing bottom of the League get "demoted" (to NXT or snapped up by SDL?) and some new guys bought in every 6 months or so?
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Ibushi apparently doesn't want to. He doesn't want to be tied down anywhere so he can do whatever he wants and he quit NJPW because of the schedule. With WWE's being even worse, I don't think he'll ever sign full time.
Has he left NJPW? I was imaging a WWE Cruiserweight Champion vs. IWGP Junior Heavyweight Champion match at WM.
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Old 09-21-2016, 07:48 AM   #359
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Has he left NJPW? I was imaging a WWE Cruiserweight Champion vs. IWGP Junior Heavyweight Champion match at WM.
He's left his full time deal, but I bet he'll still be used. He's too damn good for him not to work on occasion here and there and I'll bet he has a match on the pre-WM NXT even.
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Old 09-21-2016, 11:13 AM   #360
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Stolen from Owens. He should be fired.
You're right.

Owens should be fired.
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