05-29-2020, 05:36 PM | #1441 | |
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And I’m not even saying that’s as much praise of AEW as it is damning on WWE’s part. Putting their A-show stars on a primetime version of Velocity in the early 2000s and making them “Velocity champions” would have led to Velocity smoking any new competition. They’ve lost that luxury. That’s a pretty big deal in the grand scheme of things. |
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05-29-2020, 05:38 PM | #1442 | |
Former TPWW Royalty
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Network likely does skew older considering how much its been struggling to grow compared to other streaming services and a lot of its content caters towards older WWE and wrestling fans. |
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05-29-2020, 05:40 PM | #1443 |
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Basically, WWE’s “niche of a niche” audience is becoming a higher and higher percentage of their overall audience because they’re losing the rest. And that “niche of a niche” audience now prefers something else.
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05-29-2020, 06:09 PM | #1444 | |
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05-29-2020, 06:33 PM | #1445 | ||
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If NXT really wanted to beat AEW in the ratings, they'd have some a really big fucking angle by now. Daniel Bryan would have gone back to try and win the NXT Championship. Rey Mysterio and Ricochet would be having a best of seven series. The Bullet Club would have been feuding with The Undisputed Era. John Cena would have come back to humble Tomasso Ciampa for talking shit about the main roster and been the outside heel coming in. All those things are easy. Having Charlotte Flair win the NXT Women's Championship is...yeah, that's not them busting it. And I personally think AEW could be doing much better. There's no reason you can't get the eyeballs that float around cable looking for wrestling onto you with a decent product. I honestly think the quality does matter, as it did with TNA. Quote:
I'm sure the Network has been struggling to grow, but what does that have to do with age and not just a market cap? And what content actually caters to older fans? I'm not fucking Ride Along, haha. What's to suggest younger people aren't watching NXT, 205 Live, old PPVs and documentaries on there? I mean, until we have the data we can't really say that it skewers towards old people. That's just what you want it to do, haha. |
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05-29-2020, 08:40 PM | #1446 | |
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We can argue exactly how important it is but if you don’t think they’re trying given everything they’ve done, you’re in denial. |
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05-29-2020, 08:43 PM | #1447 |
Resident drug enabler
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05-29-2020, 08:58 PM | #1448 |
Former TPWW Royalty
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Don't think so since outside of that brief time Impact went against RAW, TNA/Impact usually avoided the days WWE had their shows on.
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05-30-2020, 12:57 AM | #1449 | |
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05-30-2020, 12:05 PM | #1450 |
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05-30-2020, 12:25 PM | #1451 |
Trickster Demon
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2.14 for SD
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05-30-2020, 12:27 PM | #1452 |
Trickster Demon
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For the week:
SD - 2.14 million RAW - 1.73 million AEW - 827k NXT - 731k |
05-30-2020, 12:46 PM | #1453 |
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Wow, Smackdown more than doubling AEW on a notoriously terrible night for t.v.
R.I.P |
05-30-2020, 12:47 PM | #1454 |
boop/bop/beep
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05-30-2020, 05:21 PM | #1455 |
Former TPWW Royalty
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Found that to be pretty interesting since a similar thing happened with Mondays becoming the new top day for wrestling after the Nitro vs. RAW rivalry had time to cement itself and kick things into a new gear. |
05-31-2020, 05:39 PM | #1456 | |
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I really wouldn't argue too much with Bryan, Mysterio, Ricochet, etc. being just cogs in the machine. But that's why it's amazing to people act like Charlotte was sent there like it was some revolutionary attempt to encourage 200k more people to watch NXT. It's kind of the point, haha. There is no way anyone can look at NXT and think "Man, WWE have really tried to make that show a priority." Charlotte Flair winning the Women's Title is not that thing, as much as a bunch of dolts with 15-year-old boy syndrome want to pretend it is. Adam Cole beating Daniel Bryan on SmackDown one week isn't that thing either. You'll know when NXT becomes the priority, if that happens. All roads will lead there instead of from there. It's AEW and AEW fans that think Vince McMahon is paying them any attention at all. They're 800k viewers on a Wednesday and a $45 million TV rights deal. And because Dave Meltzer talks to them, and possibly to keep subscribers coming back and because the guy running AEW was an Observer guy, it's important to push the narrative that AEW is a threat. That's why you get things like Dave setting expectations for their TV low. And him conflating domestic PPV buys with international PPV buys in order to say things like "AEW does better on PPV than anyone since WCW." Never mind ECW used to get 99k PPV buys quite regularly from domestic and terrestrial PPV. AEW can be ordered virtually anywhere in the world via a smart phone and it only gets 100k and about two thirds of that from the US. It's why you hear the "key demo" (in 2020 in relation to an ageing medium, mind you) is mentioned almost exclusively when it comes to Dynamite, whereas it's largely ignored when it comes to Raw and SmackDown. It's also why he reports their production cost TV deal being extended like it's a major shocking new development, whereas when WWE re-announces the Saudi deal, Vince comes under fire from the same sources. I've got no problem with Vince coming under fire, but when Tony Khan pulls the same shit he should get the same shit. And I don't mind Dave being biased -- I really don't. It's a very American thing to expect journalists to be unbiased, I think. I just think it's frustrating that the other more realistic doesn't get as much playtime. And it doesn't make Dave's perspective true. Sorry to go on that tangent, but I'm just sick of the bullshit narrative that Vince McMahon gives two flying fucks about AEW being pushed. Fucking Meltzer couldn't even keep their names out of his mouth when the XFL folded, haha. |
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05-31-2020, 05:47 PM | #1457 |
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I appreciate the blue sky thinking when it comes to AEW. I was right there until they started chopping and changing booking plans for reasons that made ZERO sense and no one called them out on it. Then they did that Casino Battle Royale and it was done for me. First match. World Title shot. Glacier. Fucking idiots. I'm sorry, but it's just bad. There's no two ways around it. It's not "not perfect." That's absolutely atrocious booking -- and it was the first thing they did. And they loved it so much they did the same thing with ladders a year later -- even after the owner said it was a mistake to do it in the first place.
As someone who gives a shit about wrestling and wants it to get better, I just can't stand that people still stand by a company that is making Vince McMahon more powerful. And there is a time to call a spade a spade. AEW is PWG with a budget and some real late-stage WCW style booking. If we're lucky we might get someone else giving it a shot in another 20 years. Have fun with anyone worth a shit in AEW jumping ship to the WWE within the next five, by the way, haha. If you want to be recognized at an airport, you still need Vince McMahon more than ever. |
05-31-2020, 08:39 PM | #1458 | ||
Former TPWW Royalty
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Seems SD's increase with last week's episode might not be accurate due to issues with FOX's broadcast. Some stations were not airing SD and instead were covering the riots during that time slot.
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Also based on some new data, AEW managed to hit 1 million viewers at one point during last week's episode. Think it would be the first time since launch month or so where AEW had that happen during the middle of a show. Quote:
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05-31-2020, 09:01 PM | #1459 | |
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And I knew nothing about Adam Cole beating Daniel Bryan. But again, they wouldn’t have the C-show start and WIN a brand war against Raw and Smackdown at Survivor Series if they weren’t trying. |
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05-31-2020, 09:04 PM | #1460 | |
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05-31-2020, 09:05 PM | #1461 |
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Fucker was one of the most credible guys in that thing.
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05-31-2020, 09:27 PM | #1462 | |
Posts: 60,919
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He's just the example I use. Because it's fucking Glacier. There were way worse people in that match, true. But it's fucking Glacier. Also, Tommy Dreamer and Billy Gunn were there. In a match with World Title implications. In 2019. And it's fucking Glacier. |
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05-31-2020, 11:35 PM | #1463 |
Resident drug enabler
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It was their first show. It’s not like they had time to build up a bunch of stars. I don’t think having some older wrestlers fill out the 21 guys fighting to be your first champion is that offensive.
I’m just saying if I were you, I’d have gone with the fucking legless dude or the fucking fat backyard wrestler to make my point WAY before fucking Glacier. |
06-01-2020, 12:08 AM | #1464 |
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If it's your first show, maybe don't book a Battle Royal for a World Title shot? Why not use all of the to make my point. I don't use Glacier to exclude anyone else. By the way, not sure if you remember, but Glacier actually froze someone during the match.
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06-02-2020, 04:36 PM | #1465 |
Trickster Demon
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RAW took a beating from news last night, I don't think I've ever seen it at 12, 13 & 17 before.
Avg - 1.728 million (credit - showbuzzdaily) Most watched on YT: Drew vs MVP - 514k Rey & Dominick Mysterio - 474k Asuka vs Charlotte - 384k |
06-02-2020, 04:41 PM | #1466 |
Trickster Demon
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4.178 million for the Rock/Titan Games on NBC
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06-02-2020, 04:48 PM | #1467 |
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That’s what I’m telling you. If The Rock started up a pro-wrestling company, it would do huge numbers. It’ll be massive. AEW can keep their 800k on a Wednesday or whatever, and Rock can do 3 or 4 million on a Tuesday.
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06-02-2020, 04:50 PM | #1468 |
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The Rock has the Midas touch
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06-02-2020, 04:51 PM | #1469 | |
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It's true though, one man's brand is several times stronger than WWE as a whole. |
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06-02-2020, 04:55 PM | #1470 |
Trickster Demon
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Looks like SD didn't do as well as originally thought
(OTIS still bringing those ratings tho, #oWo)
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06-02-2020, 05:29 PM | #1471 |
Former TPWW Royalty
Posts: 66,588
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FOX being more than willing to pre-empt SD for news is probably a bit worrying on WWE's end.
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06-02-2020, 06:52 PM | #1472 |
Posts: 60,919
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Jesus Christ, Dave Meltzer is so full of shit these days. An estimated 100k from an audience of 2 million? And Dave felt “weird” looking at? Double it and it still wouldn’t be a big deal for anyone who looks at Nielsen numbers.
Then you get apostles like Smeat spreading all this wank about how WWE should be concerned about their 0.7 key demo share (usually the best of the night). If it were AEW getting a 0.35 and still getting smashed in terms of overall viewership, Smelly Meatball wouldn’t be saying that shit. So fucking annoying. I know people are biased and believe everything they read, but 2.17 million people looked weird to Dave Meltzer? 2.05 million, ah, there we go. Come off it lol. |
06-02-2020, 07:00 PM | #1473 |
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He's saying he thought it was weird because when the overnight SmackDown number came out (2.15m), he said that the final number is going to probably drop when it figures in the news coverage. Then the "final" number came out and it was initially listed as more than the overnight number, that's why he "thought it was weird"... When it was corrected, his prediction that it would drop was right
Calm down man... |
06-02-2020, 07:08 PM | #1474 |
Former TPWW Royalty
Posts: 66,588
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The fuck did I do to deserve this shit from Noid.
Since he thinks he's better, he can handle the sheet news for the forums from now on. |
06-02-2020, 07:34 PM | #1475 |
Trickster Demon
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I have a feeling both NXT and AEW are going to take a beating from Cable News this week too.
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06-02-2020, 08:15 PM | #1476 | |
Posts: 60,919
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What's wrong with saying "2.15 million to 2.07 million," or whatever the number is, "not much of a drop"? Smeat, I'm not blaming you for what Dave said, lol. It's just the bullshit sentiment that he's anything other than completely biased one way at this point. Not so much all the news he gets -- I'm absolutely not echoing the line that he's always just guessed and whatever -- but anything as it pertains to AEW/WWE he's just waaaaaay off on all the time, and that extends to his commentary on the ratings. SmackDown kills it in the "key demo" every week. I personally think that's an antiquated way to look at television in 2020, since TV audiences are no doubt going to skewer older and there are way more effective ways to market to younger people (react videos on YouTube). But they're an antiquated as advertisers want them to be. But that key demo is never talked about. Nor is Raw's, which absolutely slaughters AEW's on basic cable. Nah, that ruins the narrative that WWE's audience is a bunch of old fogies and AEW's got the cool, hip crowd -- which they just don't. They only beat NXT in that demo because, and I guarantee this, the younger audience either DVRs or Network watches it, because that's just easier when they're doing the whole "support the new guys" thing. If you got those numbers, I bet you'd find there isn't much a difference between the people who watch AEW and the people who watch NXT. But that doesn't suit the Meltzer agenda, which is to help get his newsletter over by appealing to the hardcore fans, and by making the promotion run by a guy who has admitted to reading him look more competent and deliberate than it is. And because he likes them. People are going to be biased. Even Meltzer. He really doesn't have any obligation not to be. He's forced himself to watch boring, bland, shit WWE for hours and hours each week long after most of us have given up. Of course he's going to like the wrestling equivalent to a cat shitting on a toilet. But it would just be nice if people would -- not "call it out," per se -- but acknowledged it. * Vince McMahon didn't get involved in NXT. * WWE didn't try to completely steamroll AEW. They slowed it down and are waiting it out. * $45 million would have covered production costs for a show in 2016. AEW says their shows are cheaper, but there's something fishy going on there when they had that production deal and it suddenly gets "increased" to $45 million, per Dave's reporting on it. * WWE are idiots when they don't promote NXT that heavily on their main roster so as to not go for broke right out the gate. This is all the while they are definitely, completely going for broke out the gate, but rushing programs like Adam Cole vs. Tommaso Ciampa, which finally led to a match between the two, what, four months after NXT started on USA? * They were definitely trying to get the jump on AEW by starting earlier on USA. It couldn't just be that they wanted to piggy-back off the final episodes of Suits and debut programming unopposed to anything else in the genre in order to promote their scope to networks when they inevitably decide they want a new show another $100 million per year or so. Nope. Definitely thought that no one would watch a brand new wrestling promotion on TNT outside their umbrella hard over those first months. I get it's fun to call the WWE idiots and think of them as the evil empire. A lot of the shit they do is completely evil. But there's this false level of incompetence assigned to a promotion that has set itself up to generate over $500 million in revenue every year, all designed to make Vince McMahon a billionaire. No one really gives a shit if Tony Khan gets to send $2.5 million back to his dad every year because TNT rounded up production costs. Yet we have to put up with Dave saying "I'm not saying they're winning, but they've won." Come off it. |
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06-02-2020, 08:18 PM | #1477 | |
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I mean, more people are going to watch the news with all this stuff going on, but I doubt they were people who were watching AEW and NXT anyway. Not in any significant movement, anyway. People can watch AEW or NXT and look at their phones. Or they can flick over to the news before and after. They'll be down in the overall placements, but I just think the idea that the news "cuts into" wrestling is a bit exaggerated, and was used in the early stages of the pandemic to explain away boring shows. |
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06-03-2020, 12:18 AM | #1478 |
World Class References
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I'd just like to say that I too immediately thought "Fuck off Meltzer, you look weird to me!" when I read the Tweet.
He's a gimp. |
06-04-2020, 05:21 PM | #1479 |
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June 3, 2020
AEW 730,000 NXT 715,000 |
06-04-2020, 05:22 PM | #1480 |
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Wow, that's what happens when you put on a lackluster show
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