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Old 11-18-2021, 02:47 AM   #6761
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and if you look at their last year to the year prior there's very little growth so this year is trending in healthy direction
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Old 11-18-2021, 02:48 AM   #6762
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tbh I was expecting it to go back down to their "normal" past PPV levels or maybe a little more, like 115 or something, since the last two Full Gears did like 80k

the CM Punk PPV did like double of what their average is, for a clear very special rare draw that's basically impossible to duplicate
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Old 11-18-2021, 02:52 AM   #6763
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i dont disagree that expecting 100% is unreasonable but 10% is below reasonable too. a good draw id hope to keep 70% but if im to even consider a guy a draw id expect him to keep 40% of what is explicitly, empirically, his own audience. which punk, or the booking, failed to do. I dont know what these people thought, perhaps they loved the punk segment and hated everything else. I cant say. but 10% is very low retention. 100k die hard punk fans dropped IRL money to see him and they clearly didnt think it was worth it to do it again. Thats a truth.
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Old 11-18-2021, 02:52 AM   #6764
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but again the YTD is very healthy
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Old 11-18-2021, 02:54 AM   #6765
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and 60k new paying customers from all out to all out if they can maintain that growth theres nothing bad about that
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Old 11-18-2021, 02:54 AM   #6766
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i dont disagree that expecting 100% is unreasonable but 10% is below reasonable too. a goo draw id hope to keep 70% but if im to even consider a guy a draw id expect him to keep 40% of what is explicitly, empirically, his own audience. which punk, or the booking, failed to do. I dont know what these people thought, perhaps they loved the punk segment and hated everything else. I cant say. but 10% is very low retention. 100k die hard punk fans dropped IRL money to see him and they clearly didnt think it was worth it to do it again. Thats a truth.
What's the 10% thing based on?
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Old 11-18-2021, 02:55 AM   #6767
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AEW is better a position ofr having punk but im not convinced punk is a draw. hes part of an ensemble and it validates how he was booked throughout his career
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Old 11-18-2021, 02:58 AM   #6768
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im rounding, its slightly more than 10%. 135k was the previous peak. so thats max AEW without punk. show after his debut drops to 145k. so thats 10k new customers generated. the punk draw was up 90k MTD. so the 145k is 11.11% retained
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Old 11-18-2021, 03:01 AM   #6769
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i'll say this: based on these figures i wouldnt pay punk any more than he's getting now any time soon.
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Old 11-18-2021, 03:04 AM   #6770
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The 135k one also had an unusual draw with the "exploding barbed wire death match" and them hyping the signing of a "huge" star (Christian...) which is why it was a lot higher than the typical number

The average of all the PPVs before the CM Punk one is 98k... Punk one did 205, and this one was 145k so idk if 10% is a fair assessment
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Old 11-18-2021, 03:11 AM   #6771
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every show has a reason it works or doesnt work
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Old 11-18-2021, 03:12 AM   #6772
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they havent had a show sub 100k this year and thats a good sign so i think at least we can agree on that
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Old 11-18-2021, 03:45 AM   #6773
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Why would any rational person expect the next PPV to do the same as the one with CM Punk's first match in years...
That’s not what anyone’s said, and you know it. There is actually the possibility of PPV-to-PPV growth too.

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It was the PPV that was supposed to be the culmination of the "Long Term Storytelling."
Yep. And it was also Danielson’s first PPV match with the company, and Cole’s first PPV match at that level ever. It didn’t keep people as interested as All Out did. Pretty simple.

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every show has a reason it works or doesnt work
Destor talking some sense. They’ve bought their way to a higher “normal” buyrate than what they were on, but does that slight increase justify the costs? And what does it say about the product that it cannot retain off its spikes?
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Old 11-19-2021, 12:16 AM   #6774
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but again the YTD is very healthy
I wrote a decent breakdown of this a few days back in response to Damien also making that claim.

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WWE gets $16 million+ a month from Peacock for those PPVs they "devalued". After the PPV providers cut, AEW would need to sell about 2.5 million for their quarterly PPVs to come close to the money WWE makes from their PPVs. Or in other words, AEW would need to get 12 times more people to buy their PPVs that bought All Out when they had all the buzz possible.

I guess if they could get every person who watches Dynamite to buy each PPV three times for no reason, well then they might be able to actually brag about their PPV revenue.

Of course, that would not make up for the money they do not make from their TV deal. $45 million a year for 3 hours of weekly TV is about $285,000 per hour. Or in other words, WAAAAAAAY less than what Tony Khan is paying his roster.

AEW is able to put on a good product because they are alright losing a ton of money. They are only successful because they do not have to run as a sustainable business. If AEW had to run only on the money they earn, they would have to cut the expenses a lot. That would mean guys taking big pay cuts, or being outright released.

Look, I like what AEW is doing far more than when they started. They still do odd things, but the good outweighs the bad. That said, no they are not a successful company. Its the opposite of what you said, regardless of how much wrestling fans like us may enjoy AEW, they are undeniably a unsuccessful money losing company and to say otherwise it’s just being willfully blinded by fandom.
The truth is either every wrestler is lying about getting "the best contract and money" of their careers, or AEW is undeniably losing money. I also think I gave AEW more credit, assuming they get a 50%/50% split of the PPV money (that was the deal WWE had when the Network came out, based on the goal of a million subs). As a new company, AEW probably doesnt have that good of a deal, but for arguments sake that is what I based my post off of.

AEW is not a public company, neither is any of Shad's other ventures, so they can say whatever and we cannot disprove it, but based on the numbers we do get like PPV buys and TV deal, well they just do not support the claim that they are doing anything but bleeding money.

Its fine, im glad Shad is willing to let Tony lose money because it gives us more wrestling, but no amount of smoke and mirrors is going to validate the idea that this company is anywhere close to profitable.

All of your other posts in this thread are spot on, but I think you are giving them more benefit of doubt on the YTD.
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Old 11-19-2021, 12:21 AM   #6775
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in business your first few years should be assumed losses out side of some innovation or what have you. this is why most businesses dont make it their first five years. (this is also why workers dont deserve the bulk of the profits.) I dont think AEW is turning a profit but i think if they can continue to nurture growth they will later.
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Old 11-19-2021, 12:23 AM   #6776
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and to that end not being able to retain those viewers really hurts. they need growth because the business model demands it. theyre far from sustainable long term.
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Old 11-19-2021, 12:38 AM   #6777
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and to that end not being able to retain those viewers really hurts. they need growth because the business model demands it. theyre far from sustainable long term.
Agreed. I also worry about the ratings, because they have backed themselves into a corner with the whole 18-49 demo being the end all be all.

I have heard Tony Khan allude to the fact that AEW should get a massive deal in 2024 when their current TV contracts are up. That is wishful thinking though because AEW's average viewer age today is 48, so if they cannot get new younger viewers, by 2024 their average fan age will be 51. What happens when they are getting 900,000 viewers but their 18-49 demo is significantly lower because the majority of those people are now in the 50+ demo, which AEW has basically claimed does not matter.

That massive TV deal they are just assuming will come will certainly change the outlook of the company if it doesn't.
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Old 11-19-2021, 12:41 AM   #6778
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well lets not rule out how in dire straights TV is right now. Live TV has a lot of clout and thats only looking to rise. 18-49 or not. im not dismissing your point because its valid but hey could still pen a deal thats better than the one they have now in 5 years time based strictly on the shrinking market
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Old 11-19-2021, 01:05 AM   #6779
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well lets not rule out how in dire straights TV is right now. Live TV has a lot of clout and thats only looking to rise. 18-49 or not. im not dismissing your point because its valid but hey could still pen a deal thats better than the one they have now in 5 years time based strictly on the shrinking market
Very true, live is always going to command a premium.
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Old 11-22-2021, 09:30 PM   #6780
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I know the timing isn't great for it right now, but at some point, we'd better fucking get Tomohiro Ishii vs Bryan Danielson.
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Old 11-23-2021, 12:12 AM   #6781
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id buy that match
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Old 11-23-2021, 12:22 AM   #6782
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I don't think Ishii has gone to a doctor in the last decade. Man looks stiffer than a two dollar steak.
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Old 11-23-2021, 05:18 AM   #6783
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I watch AEW because I crush hard on Britt Baker.
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Old 11-24-2021, 07:23 PM   #6784
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AEW superfan Jessi having rough health, wishing a fast recovery for her


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Old 11-24-2021, 08:52 PM   #6785
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Who's that chick?
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Old 11-24-2021, 10:44 PM   #6786
Slik
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Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)Slik makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)
she's popular on twitter and I think is also sort of popular on only fans, she's a big rasslin fan and goes to a bunch of shows
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Old 11-24-2021, 11:13 PM   #6787
weather vane
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Poor girl.
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Old 11-25-2021, 10:21 PM   #6788
Slik
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Old 11-26-2021, 01:37 AM   #6789
Mr. JL
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Queen Darlene View Post
I don't think Ishii has gone to a doctor in the last decade. Man looks stiffer than a two dollar steak.
There is appears to be something seriously wrong with his right arm. It looks severely atrophied.
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Old 11-29-2021, 05:20 PM   #6790
Mr. Nerfect
 
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898k for Dynamite. Down, as predicted. Whodathunk that turning a beloved babyface heel and vowing to destroy a bunch of good-hearted bums would encourage people to tune out?
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Old 11-29-2021, 08:42 PM   #6791
Queen Darlene
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Nerfect View Post
898k for Dynamite. Down, as predicted. Whodathunk that turning a beloved babyface heel and vowing to destroy a bunch of good-hearted bums would encourage people to tune out?
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Old 11-29-2021, 08:56 PM   #6792
The God of TPWW
He is risen
 
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The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)The God of TPWW makes a lot of good posts (200,000+)
R.I.P
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Old 11-29-2021, 09:13 PM   #6793
Slik
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Old 11-30-2021, 12:51 AM   #6794
Slik
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Old 11-30-2021, 12:51 AM   #6795
Slik
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Old 11-30-2021, 12:53 AM   #6796
Weapon X
the heartbreak king
 
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Question

wait hold up what?
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Old 11-30-2021, 09:12 AM   #6797
weather vane
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Barney: I like it.
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Old 11-30-2021, 10:59 AM   #6798
xrodmuc316
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Tony Khan is awkward and creepy "AF".
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Old 11-30-2021, 11:07 AM   #6799
Destor
I am the cheese
 
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water isnt wet
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Old 11-30-2021, 11:28 AM   #6800
weather vane
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Seems pretty wet.
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