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Old 11-27-2023, 11:35 AM   #41
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You know what’s amazing? That this could happen and Dave Meltzer was told nothing about it by the AEW camp. At what point knowing Punk could show up, do you not spoil it for your enemy?
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Old 11-28-2023, 10:03 AM   #42
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"Fans, don't even think about changing the channel, because we've learned that at our competition, Mick Foley, who used to wrestle here as Cactus Jack, is going to win their world title! Heh, talk about putting asses in the seats."
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Old 11-28-2023, 11:38 AM   #43
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Pretty good promo. Nothing earth-shattering. WWE just produces safe, generic, sustainable television. It doesn’t insult your intelligence as much anymore (which is crazy if you think about). I mean, it’s mildly goofy in that Akira Tozawa dancing and people talking like no one actually would way. But things are generally pretty logical there now.

I’m curious to see the number. I don’t wonder how many viewers were disappointed he didn’t scorch earth as opposed to how many people were just pleasantly surprised they didn’t hate WWE anymore.
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Old 11-28-2023, 11:45 AM   #44
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Triple H definitely makes things flow together week-to-week better than Vince. He’s also doing a really cool thing and rewarding you for paying attention.

Shinsuke Nakamura will make references to rain next week, you watch.
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Old 11-28-2023, 11:49 AM   #45
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I'm sure it'll take Punk some time to find his voice in this vastly more sanitized environment (if he finds it at all). I also heard he won't be addressing AEW, per Punk whisperer Nick Hausman (aka Punk himself). So fans wanting the scathing, petty AEW-related pipebomb will be left disappointed.
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Old 11-28-2023, 11:49 AM   #46
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So fans wanting the scathing, petty AEW-related pipebomb will be left disappointed.
AKA me. I'll be left disappointed.
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Old 11-28-2023, 01:52 PM   #47
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I will tune in to RAW for the first time in forever. Many years.
That will be the last time. Geez that was tough. That Punk promo was so off. Everything else was a slog. Not for me. Rumble I’ll try.
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Old 11-28-2023, 02:25 PM   #48
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I will tune in to RAW for the first time in forever. Many years.
That will be the last time. Geez that was tough. That Punk promo was so off. Everything else was a slog. Not for me. Rumble I’ll try.
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Old 11-28-2023, 04:33 PM   #49
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I will tune in to RAW for the first time in forever. Many years.
That will be the last time. Geez that was tough. That Punk promo was so off. Everything else was a slog. Not for me. Rumble I’ll try.
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Old 11-29-2023, 07:04 AM   #50
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Eh, I wasn’t expecting a pipe bomb. I have a feeling they are “saving” him. He’s not even advertised for SmackDown. The most I expected about AEW was something like running with wolves instead of playing with puppies. But I don’t think they even want to acknowledge them. And Punk has friends there.

I agree that the promo didn’t really have a “point.” It just like “listen to how eloquent this man is on the mic.” It wasn’t a money promo, it was he’s the money. We’ll see.
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Old 11-29-2023, 07:34 AM   #51
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Holy shit, okay, I watched NXT today though. Totally different vibe to Raw. Was that a normal episode, or did they really kick it up?

SPOILER: show
Shows starts with two teams brawling out for an NXT Tag Title match. They have a really good match. Stacks and Tony D’Angelo are both REALLY good. Stacks got what Jim Cornette would describe as a hot tag. He sells like a motherfucker and was doing the modern trick of kicking out of everything in a tag match. The Garzas were the challengers by the way. They started out fighting because apparently the heels attacked the babies last week, so the faces are getting tougher because Booker T thinks they are too nice as champions.

Great finish too. Worth letting it catch you by surprise if you plan to watch, which I STRONGLY recommend.

There’s LOTS of bad acting on the show, but some promos are “decent” in that weird WWE way. Wes Lee, Trick Williams and Carmelo Hayes are REALLY good. Roxanne Perez is REALLY bad.

They feature lots of women’s wrestling, but it’s not THAT bad. Jerry Lawler is choosing matches for the Iron Survivor and chooses Kelani Jordan vs. Kiana James. Kelani is athletic as hell and a natural babyface. Kiana has one of those annoying “I’m a boss” gimmicks. This wasn’t bad.

The other one Lawler picked was Bron Breakker vs. Eddy Thorpe. This was really good. Thorpe was in New Japan’s Strong dojo thing. He was selling ribs here and worked well as a face. Bron Breakker is special. Between the dog imagery, the Spear, the Heyman connection — I don’t know they don’t wait until Mania 41 to king Bron by beating Roman.

Commentary is better than most main roster stuff. Vic Joseph feels more organic than Michael Cole, even with Vince allegedly gone. I’ve never been a Booker T fan, but he’s really not offensive anymore. There was a match he referenced that a day never goes past he doesn’t remember his loss to Triple H. I believe him, lol.

Ilja Dragunov is fucking awesome. One of those wrestlers that you watch and just think “he’s the best today.” He’s got a match with Corbin at the PPV, and Corbin is being a total fucking cunt. Ilja gets into it with fellow babyface Nathan Frazer because Frazer is talking in front of a magic camera in a phoney WWE way about how Baron does have the better life than Ilja, who can’t see his kid because he sacrifices so much to be in the United States as NXT Champion.

I’m actually not doing it justice, but Ilja being frazzled by Corbin’s shit and rubbing in how he’s the pampered athlete is actually really good. Ilja went fucking nuts in his consequent match with Frazer and just fucking…he’s special, man. Frazer fights and you get a Phoenix Splash. They look way more like they are trying to win matches than AEW entertainers though.

Andre Chase did a segment that was not…good, but it was clearly a satire of AEW. He talked about reckless spending, scandals behind the scenes, internal investigations. Andre has let Chase U down. The entire talent roster is unhappy.

If you knew, you knew. It was at this point I wondered if CM Punk was helping put this together. Just the way some of these guys worked. It was better than when I last watched AEW. Felt a lot more like Collision, but more kinetic.

Lexis King is a massive shit-stirrer lol. Ben Buchanan was always good, but he looked way better. He was like a more impressive Adam Page. So many stories, so much to recap. Another women’s match between Arianna Grace and some woman who carries a sword with Joe Gacy under the ring hiding and talking about how shit he is lol. Grace has got a good look. She is descended from a former Miss WrestleMania, I guess.

Then you got to the main event. Wes Lee vs. Johnny Gargano vs. Cameron Grimes vs. Bronson Reed. I don’t like even Johnny Gargano man. Check this out. They just try to make the spots look *somewhat* organic. But this got two “holy shit” chants. They built the match up all night with videos of the former champions, then current champion Dom was there to watch Wes Lee hopefully fail. Really simple stuff, but really appreciated.

Lots of wrestlers appeared multiple times, either to set up their match or intertwine their personal issues.


Felt WAY different to Raw. Completely different shows. Anyway, I just have a theory Punk might get involved lol. If that’s what NXT is every week, then no wonder it’s beating Dynamite some weeks.
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Old 11-29-2023, 07:35 AM   #52
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Too long didn’t read:

They made fun of AEW on NXT.
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Old 11-29-2023, 07:40 AM   #53
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One thing that I hate about modern WWE faces is that they don’t sell…life. Like Bianca Belair comes out dancing and twirling her hair for War Games. That shit helped John Cena irritate people. When a heel does something shit, you get more over if you actually react to it. And not cry or hold your head in despair. Like get mad and start kicking the shit out of people.

You saw wrestlers do that on NXT. Is that something Shawn Michaels lets them do, or is that a new thing? Or maybe something fairly recent? Like, say…maybe the last 2 months or so?
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Old 11-29-2023, 08:17 AM   #54
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Oh, and another thing I thought was weird:

Nathan Frazer vs. Ilja Dragunov. Frazer is like this cruiserweight looking kid. He’s quite good in the ring, but he’s got this long hair and has a very similar build to Jack Perry actually (same height). The more I think about it, the weirder that segment seemed.

I wonder if during the incident at Wembley, Perry made some sort of comment about Punk’s family? Because Vic Joseph really drilled the point in that you shouldn’t do that.
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Old 11-29-2023, 09:32 AM   #55
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That will be the last time. Geez that was tough. That Punk promo was so off. Everything else was a slog. Not for me. Rumble I’ll try.
I didn't think the show was bad, but they kept saying it was "must-see" and it definitely wasn't that lol
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Old 11-30-2023, 04:29 AM   #56
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If this makes Punk happy more power to him. The stuff in AEW became all consuming and now hopefully a line can be drawn under it for good.

I didnt watch Survivor series but saw a clip on social, was there a context for why he came out after the main event? Kinda felt like it shit on Randys big return a little. I saw the crowd on Raw caught some heat on social as well for being flat for his promo like they should just cheer by default which felt weird but its wrestling social media so not a lot else to expect from it I guess. I wondered if that was just the "Philly sports" element.

Also Ryback... are we worried yet? Like all these cries for attention I kinda fear that guys gonna be a bad headline in 2024.
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Old 11-30-2023, 09:14 AM   #57
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I don’t thibk coming out after the big babyface win was an accident. If they wanted him to return as the babyface hero you have JD win and then have him come out. He came out to “rain on the babyfaces parade”. He’s being positioned as a disruptive force who’s changed the hierarchy. The dynamic with Seth should be really interesting.
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Old 11-30-2023, 09:16 AM   #58
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And yeah the crowd probably was a bit flat for his promo on Raw. They wanted “pipebomb Punk” and got “ah shucks Punk”. Stupid to criticise the crowd though. LOLIWC
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Old 11-30-2023, 11:37 AM   #59
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The show kind of built. Smart to realize you couldn’t top it. There was that energetic buzz around it all night. I can’t remember if it came up in here, but there’s an “insider” account that I am pretty sure is a WWE burner. They said something like “Nakamura hints decoy, Orton won’t be there, Punk is in.” Or something like that. You think “no way” but then it turns out to be scarily accurate.

WWE did little things to cultivate the moment. Triple H has been into it since the White Rabbit stuff with Bray. I’m pretty sure he got Nash to shit on LA Knight to help get him more over. You just had Daniel Cormier come out and say Gunther is his favorite wrestler ever, replacing Randy Savage.
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Old 11-30-2023, 11:39 AM   #60
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See if this Okada stuff comes to fruition.
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Old 12-01-2023, 05:47 AM   #61
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I don’t thibk coming out after the big babyface win was an accident. If they wanted him to return as the babyface hero you have JD win and then have him come out. He came out to “rain on the babyfaces parade”. He’s being positioned as a disruptive force who’s changed the hierarchy. The dynamic with Seth should be really interesting.
Kinda makes sense I guess. Makes the promo on Raw all the weirder to me but I don’t watch it so open to mute idea I’m just not seeing key parts. Easy to judge out of context if you’re not actually following it.
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Old 12-01-2023, 07:30 AM   #62
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Nah, for me at least, the promo on Raw tells the same story. He literally said “I’m here to make money, not friends” and spoke about how some people in the back are scared of him because he’s the best in the world and it changes the pecking order.

It’s working towards an immediate programme with Seth clearly but can go in so many directions. Seth is gonna point out the hypocrisy of Punk, the whole locker room leader thing (Seth did his whole company man thing that people shit on him for, the whole “Saudi blood money” tweet, etc).

One of the best things about Punk is he works so well in both babyface/antihero and heel roles. This run - if he can keep himself issue free and healthy- could be the best of his career.
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Old 12-06-2023, 03:19 PM   #63
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If Cm Punk goes to Saudi for the next crown jewel - will you riot?
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Old 12-06-2023, 03:37 PM   #64
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Nah. Nobody cares about the optics of going to Saudi anymore. Punk should cut a vignette swimming in his blood money Scrouge McDuck style.
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Old 12-08-2023, 08:47 AM   #65
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Cena went back to Saudi recently right?
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Old 12-10-2023, 04:22 AM   #66
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Nice CM Punk appearance on NXT with Shawn Michaels.
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Old 12-11-2023, 02:15 PM   #67
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Pretty sure CM Punk has been helping Shawn Michaels with NXT, either in an official capacity or not. Fuck AEW is stupid.
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Old 12-12-2023, 04:58 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Nerfect View Post
Pretty sure CM Punk has been helping Shawn Michaels with NXT, either in an official capacity or not. Fuck AEW is stupid.
A locker room of young wrestlers who listen to veterans. What a concept!

Another great promo by Punk on RAW. First time I've cared about Seth Rollins since the Shield.
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Old 12-12-2023, 10:45 AM   #69
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Yeah, the NXT locker room has got to be dream after doing time in AEW.
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Old 12-12-2023, 11:13 AM   #70
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Just watched the Raw promo. Punk’s finding a flavor, isn’t he? A bit weird to connect Cleveland to Raw, but whatever. I appreciate the history. Can’t get into Seth though.
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Old 12-12-2023, 11:15 AM   #71
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He’s just so forced. And his gimmick as the WWE’s boot licker who dresses weird just misses for me. I don’t know why they need to play into this idea that Punk is “controversial.” Makes everyone seem like giant pussies.
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Old 12-12-2023, 12:00 PM   #72
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No mention of how he hyped up Cleveland and THAT building for his UFC debut
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Old 12-12-2023, 12:11 PM   #73
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The Punk/Rollins story will obviously evolve, but there’s something about Hangman Rollins that just feels so dry.
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Old 12-13-2023, 11:21 AM   #74
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Punk is hitting his stride. Add in the fact that he is not only at NXT but he is helping is a huge thing. He can compare the way AEW tried to do things with Collision and then help WWE make their product stronger. Everything he has done since he came back has shown that the guy does have leadership but its also a huge middle finger to AEW.

Win win for me.
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Old 12-13-2023, 03:35 PM   #75
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This is so great. Next thing is he'll play a part in getting Bret Hart signed as a coach for NXT.
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Old 12-13-2023, 04:17 PM   #76
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I thought Bret signed something with WWE earlier this year, but that mustn’t have happened/fallen through.
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Old 12-14-2023, 04:45 AM   #77
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Did not know this. If that's the case bring him to NXT and let him work with the younger guys. Learning from both Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels. Wow.
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Old 12-14-2023, 07:02 AM   #78
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Old 12-14-2023, 07:28 AM   #79
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Old 12-14-2023, 08:14 AM   #80
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I have a feeling Punk has been helping out with NXT creative too. I didn’t really watch much prior to Punk coming back, but I just get that vibe from it.
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