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Old 08-23-2021, 12:49 AM   #321
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Lesnar has lost to Cena, Rollins, Taker, Reigns and McIntyre during his run. One of those guys is retired, two of them are working in the midcard and failed at being top babyfaces and aren’t anywhere near the title picture, one was already a star and even bigger now they didn’t need to beat him to get there while the other needed a complete character change to get where he was supposed to be 6 years ago.

Lesnar is an amazing talent that’s been wasted to help create new stars through no fault of his own.
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Old 08-23-2021, 01:11 AM   #322
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So, is this argument being made that no one in the history of ever is worth following because, at some point, they lost a match? Wins and losses matter, but sometimes the losses don't matter as much because of "Long Term Storytelling." I mean the actual kind.

Hell, let's replace Brock Lesnar with Minoru Suzuki. Suzuki is a legitimate badass and has lost a LOT more than Lesnar. Does that mean people don't follow him? No. Because the guy is also a legitimate bad ass who carries himself like such. He has that same aura and is also charismatic as fuck.

Folks can take losses and it not hurt them if they have something that makes people care about them. They do have to win eventually, else you get the Ryback thing, but the Rock lost to the fucking Hurricane. Did that end him? Hell no, he was STILL the biggest deal in the WWE, and was the god damned Rock. And the loss to the Hurricane led to Hurricane getting "buried" by Triple H The Rock having a banger of a match with Austin at Wrestlemania, IIRC.

What I am saying is, the occasional loss shouldn't affect a guy unless there was nothing there in the first place.
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Old 08-23-2021, 05:45 AM   #323
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Brock has not lost to a weak opponent. He lost his aura because he has been around for a long time.
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Old 08-23-2021, 05:46 AM   #324
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I still get excited to see him toss people around though.
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Old 08-23-2021, 07:42 AM   #325
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruien View Post
Brock has not lost to a weak opponent. He lost his aura because he has been around for a long time.
You can’t have a guy job in the majority of his feuds, including losing clean as a whistle to SETH ROLLINS in a few minutes multiple times and still seriously act like “OMG WHO CAN STOP THIS BEAST?!?!”
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Old 08-23-2021, 07:49 AM   #326
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Gotta say, I agree with xrodmuc
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Old 08-23-2021, 07:52 AM   #327
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Old 08-23-2021, 08:01 AM   #328
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Originally Posted by Lord Gertner of TPWW View Post
Gotta say, I agree with xrodmuc
Feels like Fan is just being antagonistic for the sake of it here.
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Old 08-23-2021, 08:16 AM   #329
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We were having a nice civil discussion and I asked xrod a question. He realized the honest answer would prove my point and did everything to divert and not actually answer the question. Fuck him.
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Old 08-23-2021, 08:17 AM   #330
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Feels like you're still doing it and making excuses now.
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Old 08-23-2021, 08:22 AM   #331
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... Why do I feel like there was some “Let’s just troll the wrestling forum” agreement in casual that I missed?
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Old 08-23-2021, 08:27 AM   #332
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There was no deal. This is all organic. It's happening and you can't stop it.

This is kinda weird though as I was under the assumption you were the one trolling here.
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Old 08-23-2021, 08:43 AM   #333
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I can actually KINDA see how asking a simple question to someone I know deep down will be unwilling or unable to answer it given their history can be seen as some form of trolling.

Fair point.
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Old 08-23-2021, 09:50 AM   #334
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Seeing Lesnar step up to Reigns was really cool. I think the 3rd or 4th or whatever honeymoon with Lesnar will end quickly though. I feel like everyone couldn't wait till he finally left last time. I think they'll book Reigns to go over him clean (which they should) and Lesnar can stay out of the title picture and maybe just wrestle in attraction matches for his new deal. Kind of like a way better Goldberg.

I did actually enjoy the Goldberg angle brining his son into the equation. It did add another layer to the feud and makes me want to see at least one more match between him and Lashley.
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Old 08-23-2021, 09:59 AM   #335
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If Brock gives a damn, maybe. He got lazy and boring last time, that was his problem.


The father//son thing was done to death with the Mysterios over the last decade and a half. Eh.
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Old 08-23-2021, 10:39 AM   #336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damian Rey 2.0 View Post

Lesnar is an amazing talent that’s been wasted to help create new stars through no fault of his own.
Or he WOULD be if he actually gave a shit about the match and didn't resort to doing 2 moves over and over. His matches got stale long ago, and it's not like he doesn't have anything else in his repertoire, he just chooses to do the bare minimum.
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Old 08-23-2021, 11:16 AM   #337
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I think that Lesnar's loses don't matter as much to the non-Twitter/forum addicted wrestling fan. He's a draw to the larger portion of the WWE audience.
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Old 08-23-2021, 11:52 AM   #338
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And that's all that really matters.
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Old 08-23-2021, 12:20 PM   #339
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Right. That portion of the WWE audience gets smaller and smaller every year though. And poor storytelling/character development is the main reason why. That’s the exact shit that matters to a mainstream audience. The IWC is gonna watch and spend money even WHILE ACKNOWLEDGING the show is technically awful. Normal people are gonna tune out.

There’s only so long that putting a name on a marquee can stay special simply because it’s a name people recognize.
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Old 08-23-2021, 12:29 PM   #340
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Yeah I think that WWE is in big trouble when it comes to this tactic of promoting "the legend returns". I mean what legends do they have that can fit that bill? Sure Randy Orton one day can play that role but I'm struggling to find others.

Bobby Lashley who has finally hit his character and career stride is already at the age where you'd want for "the legend returns". Maybe he will still be able to pull it off in his 50's but he's already talking about wanting the "Goldberg schedule".

No argument from me that WWE has got to make some relevant young stars ASAP. I think they are trying but it's just not working, at least for me.
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Old 08-23-2021, 12:49 PM   #341
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
We were having a nice civil discussion and I asked xrod a question. He realized the honest answer would prove my point and did everything to divert and not actually answer the question. Fuck him.
There it is, my answer was not the answer you wanted, and that pissed you off.
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Old 08-23-2021, 12:53 PM   #342
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I wanted an answer to the question I was asking so we could move forward with the discussion.

You constantly answered different questions that weren’t being asked.

So... TECHNICALLY, you are correct.

It’s more annoying because I really wanted to get into why your Kurt Angle analogy was terrible but constantly letting you off the hook to go to another topic doesn’t do any good.
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Old 08-23-2021, 01:05 PM   #343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
I wanted an answer to the question I was asking so we could move forward with the discussion.

You constantly answered different questions that weren’t being asked.

So... TECHNICALLY, you are correct.
Just because I didn't answer it as "yes" or "no" does not mean I did not answer.

If the ONLY 2 acceptable answers to you are "yes" or "no", then are you really trying to move a discussion forward, or are you trying to end the discussion?
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Old 08-23-2021, 01:15 PM   #344
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1) Just because it was a yes or no question doesn’t mean the answer HAS to just be “yes” or “no”. You’re free to elaborate.

2) If you don’t elaborate, a yes or a no doesn’t = the end of a discussion. It’s a new step toward the point I’m trying to make. It’s really fucking weird that you think answering a question within an argument with “yes” or “no” ends the entire discussion.

The problem wasn’t the lack of a “yes” or “no”. The problem was the lack of an answer that actually addressed the question being asked. Do you need me to try one last time to make the question more clear for you?
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Old 08-23-2021, 01:31 PM   #345
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I may regret this because it’ll probably just muddle things more.... but fuck it. Gonna try to kill two birds with on stone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xrodmuc316 View Post
Kurt Angle lost his last match to Baron Corbin, we all thought that was dumb. That said, if Kurt showed up in lets say Impact, so as not to get any "but AEW" anger, would fans pop and want to see him, or would they shit on it because he lost to Baron Corbin?
Why did you knock Kurt Angle down to Impact in this analogy? Why not keep him in WWE and have him come back to face Roman? He’s an Olympic gold medallist, ffs. It’s almost as if you’ve decided his fake fights have knocked him down a peg in the world of fake fighting.

Also, why was it dumb for him to get beaten quickly by Corbin? Job him to whoever. Who cares? He’s still Kurt Angle.
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Old 08-23-2021, 01:48 PM   #346
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Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
I don’t think he ever actually dropped Lesnar as a client. Lesnar just went away and a Heyman took on Reigns as a client.
If that's the case, then Heyman running away like a chicken shit heel doesn't make sense. If there was never a falling out, then you'd think he'd try to mediate rather than just run away.
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Old 08-23-2021, 01:54 PM   #347
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The clip I saw just had him looking worried and putting his head in his hand as if to say “Oh fuck. I thought he was gone for good. Now he’s gonna wanna be top dog again. How am I gonna fix this?” I didn’t see him running away.

Did he drop Lesnar as a client officially at any point though?

Like I said, Heyman is the interesting part of the story. If they’re smart they’ll keep him playing the fence until the match itself before begrudgingly turning on Brock. Outside of that story, Brock jobs to lesser guys. I don’t buy him vs Roman as the epic showdown they’ll make it out to be. It’s just Roman vs a slightly more credible 50/50 booking guy.
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Old 08-23-2021, 01:57 PM   #348
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By the way, when I saw you had replied after a page-and-a-half of arguing, I was sure your post would just read “boola boola”. Missed opportunity.
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Old 08-23-2021, 02:13 PM   #349
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I was likewise disappointed that your long argument with xrod did not end with boola boola.

We need to be better.
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Old 08-23-2021, 02:24 PM   #350
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They’ve done Roman and Brock to death. Hopefully with the rules reversed, they change up their match formula and just have two tanks near the tar outta each other back and forth until Heyman inevitably turns on Lesnar.
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Old 08-23-2021, 02:34 PM   #351
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The crowd shat on so many Brock/Roman matches....dunno how different they can really expect it to be this time but maybe face Brock helps offset that a bit.
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Old 08-23-2021, 02:57 PM   #352
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I think there’s still some post pandemic good will for wwe with their audience and Roman being heel will probably also help the reaction be more what they’re looking for this time around.
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Old 08-23-2021, 03:18 PM   #353
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
I may regret this because it’ll probably just muddle things more.... but fuck it. Gonna try to kill two birds with on stone.



Why did you knock Kurt Angle down to Impact in this analogy? Why not keep him in WWE and have him come back to face Roman? He’s an Olympic gold medallist, ffs. It’s almost as if you’ve decided his fake fights have knocked him down a peg in the world of fake fighting.

Also, why was it dumb for him to get beaten quickly by Corbin? Job him to whoever. Who cares? He’s still Kurt Angle.
It is right in the comment, "if Kurt showed up in lets say Impact, so as not to get any "but AEW" anger" because when I talked about Tyson in AEW, you said I was just doing a "desperate “But AEW!” diversion."

Sure, he could come back to WWE and if he is able to go, I would have no problem with him having a match with Reigns.

And it wasnt dumb that he lost to Corbin, it was dumb that he lost his retirement match.
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Old 08-23-2021, 03:20 PM   #354
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SETTLE DOWN
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Old 08-23-2021, 03:31 PM   #355
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I knew introducing the Angle issue was a bad idea. I knew it would lead to another set of non-answers while also allowing xrod to skate by on the previous non-answers because two issues at once is too much. (Answering “Why did you knock him down to TNA instead of just keeping him in WWE in your analogy?” with “Because I couldn’t knock him down to AEW.” Would actually be kind of a clever joke if he wasn’t being serious.)

Yet I still tried. Because I am stubborn. And I still believe good can come from attempting to reason with people no matter the evidence to the contrary.

Boola boola
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Old 08-23-2021, 03:42 PM   #356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
I knew introducing the Angle issue was a bad idea. I knew it would lead to another set of non-answers while also allowing xrod to skate by on the previous non-answers because two issues at once is too much.

Yet I still tried. Because I am stubborn. And I still believe good can come from attempting to reason with people no matter the evidence to the contrary.

Boola boola
LOL, again I explained why, as a direct reply to bringing up AEW. I used Impact instead. That was solely to avoid an acquisition of "But AEW" from you.

Then I again answered your question about Kurt returning to WWE to face Roman, saying I would be fine with it. I WOULD HAVE NO PROBLEM BELIEVING A HEALTHY KURT ANGLE WOULD BE A WORTHY CONTENDER.

Lastly you wanted to know why it mattered that Kurt lost to Corbin since you mistakenly believed my problem was that he lost to Corbin. I again clarified that my issue was that he lost his retirement match, not WHO he lost to.

And again, it lead you to saying I didn't answer you. I answered you, it's all right here in this thread.

Let's move on, you tell me what answer you would like me to post, and ill copy it word for word so we can be done.
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Old 08-23-2021, 03:54 PM   #357
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I’m trapped in an endless “Who’s on first?” routine.

Boola boola, baby.

Fucking boola boola.
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Old 08-23-2021, 04:17 PM   #358
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I’m trapped in an endless “Who’s on first?” routine.

Boola boola, baby.

Fucking boola boola.
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Old 08-23-2021, 04:17 PM   #359
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SPOILER: show
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boola boola
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Old 08-23-2021, 04:19 PM   #360
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faboola boola
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