What Dolph Ziggler needs is a good old fashioned worked-shoot.

[Xero]

If Ziggler is going to be a serious contender for the world title, WWE needs to do something drastic and shocking. He's beaten some big names, but WWE refuses to let him keep his momentum. He has the tools needed to be a good solid second-tier world champion, but they need to shake things up. So I say WWE needs to injure him.

Seriously. Have this man get "injured". Play it off like he tore his ACL or something in a spot that looked real at the Rumble. For example, he gets eliminated and "tweaks" his knee, but don't overplay it. Just have the refs come over and carry him out and have the announcers acknowledge it like a real injury "Ziggler may be hurt here...".

Have Dr. Andrews, a week or two after the incident, talk about the surgery on WWE.com and say he's going to be out 8 to 12 months. Keep him completely off television and play it up to the boys. Literally play it off like someone else that's legit injured.

Then, at Mania, after the WHC match...

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/kHnnfEbJU_8?feature=player_detailpage" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

This is just one example of what WWE could do to make Dolph's impending WHC win mean something and possibly slingshot him to being a true main eventer. How would you do it?

[Bad News Gertner]

I would just scrap it because Ziggler isn't main event material

[James Steele]

Is that really a "worked shoot"? He'd just be pulling a John Cena circa 08 Rumble.

[Razzamajazz]

that idea would probably mean he's a face. he sucks as a face

[Tazz Dan]

that idea would probably mean he's a face. he sucks as a face

That was my exact thoughts during his last face run.....

[Shadrick]

When was his last face run? the "Hi I'm dolph" shit?

[The Whole F'n Show]

I don't think going face will help him. He is just one of those guys that is better as a heel. Another thing (or two) that he doesn't need is big e langston and quite honestly, aj. He is a strong enough worker that he doesn't need any help. That being said, big e and aj would be a better pairing on their own. What I would like to see them do is rock wins at royal rumble, then punk wins it back at the elimination chamber ppv with ziggler taking it after that match with the mitb contract, followed by punk/ rock/ ziggler at wrestlemania. Probably a long shot, but I think that would be a great potential match

[Bad News Gertner]

Ziggler hasn't gotten over on his own. He's always had Vickie and now AJ. Vickie got him all his heat, so what on Earth makes you think he's a main eventer?

[Majunior]

Ziggler is in a spot right now... he could go the HBK route, but he could just as easily go the Billy Gunn route.

I will say I think the WWE needs to stop rushing to push people, and let them come into their own over time. Miz is a perfect example. Swagger is better. They both have a great deal of talent, albeit in different areas. (Swagger in the ring, Miz on the mic.) Both ended up as "big" title holders. But the "start/stop" crap killed both men.

The idea that giving someone a taste of the top, then taking it away so they are hungry and will work to get that back is stupid. I mean, in theory it sounds ok, but in reality it damages people in the perception of the typical fans.

That said, I think Ziggles needs to continue to grow like he has been. It feels a lot more organic and natural than a great deal of more recent "young" talent that got top straps. Hopefully, by doing so, when he finally does step into that upper tier of talent, he stays there.

[Innovator]

I would just scrap it because Ziggler isn't main event material

I figured it out, you're Cena.

[Tazz Dan]

When was his last face run? the "Hi I'm dolph" shit?

It was sarcasm. He hasn't had one.

[dingdongyo]

i dunno, maybe.
i like watching him do things. i don't really care about listening to him say things.

[Shadrick]

It was sarcasm. He hasn't had one.

I legit didn't know, I wasn't watching around that time period.

And why people keep saying that Dolph will cash in for the WWE Title just floors me. Sure, anything "can happen in the WWE" but I would just hope WWE keeps THAT consistent. Until then...

[Tazz Dan]

Yeah I agree :y:

[XL]

Don't see how faking a 10-12 month injury only to then return 2 months later to "steal" the WHC via MitB cash-in would turn someone face.

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

I don't think Dr. James Andrews would want to be part of a deception like this. He's a respected doctor.

[stultiloquy]

That's a good idea.

I think the issue with Ziggler for me is that he's a bit overexposed without really doing anything truly noteworthy - he just kinda floats around, posing, talking, and selling the hell out of everyone's moves.
Run the 'injured' story, keep him out of the limelight for a bit while playing up the angle, and then have him return with a slightly more serious/credible tweak to his persona.

If he could then come back and defeat someone like Cena cleanly, it would do wonders for his viability as a main event threat.

[XL]

I like the idea of "making people forget about the briefcase" by taking him/it offscreen. In theory, it should add to the surprise of a cash-in.

Alternatively, you go the whole way and write him off, have the briefcase put up for grabs in a tournament or another MITB and then have Ziggler cost the new holder his match when he cashes in. As long as that new holder is someone high up the food chain (Orton, Cena) it should lead to an elongated Rudd where Ziggler eventually goes over.

In the meantime, have AJ and Big E break off on their own.

I feel like Ziggler needs something to launch him over the top, give him enough momentum to where he should be competing for the top titles without the cheap cash-in. Get him over enough to be champ instead of making him champ and hoping he gets over. Put the cart after the horse, if you wiiiiilllllllllll.

[Tom Guycott]

Ziggler hasn't gotten over on his own. He's always had Vickie and now AJ. Vickie got him all his heat, so what on Earth makes you think he's a main eventer?

The problem here, aside from you blatantly trolling this issue, is that he's in a dangerous spot of becoming face by accident. He's a damn good heel, he was able to catch up and surpass needing Vickie as a crutch... but with all the heat generated by Vickie, any attempt at leaving her straight up (which was teased a few times) was being treated like an impending face turn by the fans. The only way to keep him heel was to make him look like AN EVEN BIGGER ASSHOLE with the whole AJ thing.

To tell you the truth, this angle with Cena isn't helping as well as even probably Cena thinks. On paper, Ziggler eventually going over "the man" seems like a way to elevate him, but given the "love/hate" aspect of Cena, and the "next huge thing" aspect to Ziggler, fans are getting behind him.

But honestly, if WWE gets behind something enough, it will be bought. Seriously. Look at ADR's and Miz's face turns. They were completely shoehorned. They didn't just scrap it- well, they kind of did with Miz for a few weeks, then went ahead with the face push anyway- and they're starting to get over, even though they're kinda "meh" so far on the good guy side of things.

If the machine gets behind something wholeheartedly, it can work. Especially with someone with all the tools Ziggles has.

On topic: he doesn't really need to pull an "Austin 3:16" or a take this job and shove it "pipebomb". I think he just needs braggable wins. Preferably clean ones. Yeah, it's the heel thing to do to have help from a big black guy and a hot, crazy bitch... and hell, even a couple wins could come that way, and he spins it to "singlehandedly" when it clearly wasn't. But the best would be if Mr. "overcome the odds" Cena eventually loses clean. Ziggler could brag about that until doomsday, AND it would be true. Another high profile win could solidify that he "belongs".

Something to think about: 10 years ago, this conversation would be about how belivable John Cena would be if he were pushed to the main event. Remember how laughable that was?

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/857/228/images_display_image.jpg?1302667232
Jesus, just LOOK at this vanilla midget? He'll be future endeavored soon.

[Tom Guycott]

Point is, if WWE wasn't in a tight spot with top draws aging/leaving/injured/retiring, they likely wouldn't have bothered to have taken the chance on the guy who eventually became top draw.

They need to stop looking for the next musclebound freak who will likely either fuck up his own push by doing something monumentally and publicly stupid, or become fodder for creative having nothing for him past "Look how big he is people! Oh, no reaction? Oh well, we got no other plan for him than the shock and awe of being a huge monster... so... yeah, we'll just sweep him under the rug and look for the next guy we can point at and say LOOK HOW BIG HE IS PEOPLE!"

Ziggler not only could have been a main-eventer by now without any "monumental" promo, but he could have helped elevated someone like Kingston to believably square off against him by now. The tools are there, the machine needs to be there too.

[Bad News Gertner]

How am I trolling? He HASN"T gotten over on his own. Vickie HAS gotten him his heat, and now he's with AJ. He hasn't proven that he can get over on his own, so what exactly did I say that was "trolling". People are too quick to call someone a "main eventer".

This is what gets me, people accuse me of trolling, but down the line they spout off the same thing I did months ago. I'm pretty much the best poster in the Wrestling Forum, and I'm always right, sos top it.

[James Steele]

Hulk Hogan never got over as a heel without Eric Bischoff.

[Bad News Gertner]

Bischoff came aboard long after Hogan turned.

So your claim is about as wrong as HHH not sleeping his way to the top.

[MoFo]

Whats "drastic and shocking" about a worked shoot?

Happens more or less every week on Raw, and in every CM Punk promo.

[James Diesel]

Ziggler doesn't go against the grain. It wouldn't be a legitimate worked shoot, because he loves whatever the fuck it is he's doing. He doesn't have complaints, he doesn't wanna speak up to the boss, and more importantly he has shit to lose.

He's a company guy and he's not gonna take a risk.

Plus he can't run as a face.

[Shadrick]

Ziggler doesn't go against the grain. It wouldn't be a legitimate worked shoot, because he loves whatever the fuck it is he's doing. He doesn't have complaints, he doesn't wanna speak up to the boss, and more importantly he has shit to lose.

He's a company guy and he's not gonna take a risk.

Plus he can't run as a face.

You personally can't see it? Or he just can't do it? Because I dont remember his previous face run. Unless I somehow missed it.

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Ziggler doesn't go against the grain. It wouldn't be a legitimate worked shoot, because he loves whatever the fuck it is he's doing. He doesn't have complaints, he doesn't wanna speak up to the boss, and more importantly he has shit to lose.

He's a company guy and he's not gonna take a risk.

Plus he can't run as a face.

He's been a caddy and a male cheerleader. I think he knows not to do anything to fuck this up.

Remember when they had him dye his hair and then he looked like Evan Bourne?

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

You personally can't see it? Or he just can't do it? Because I dont remember his previous face run. Unless I somehow missed it.

He is saying he can't run face because he looks like a huge douchebag. Which is why the Miz's face turn isn't working out well yet.

[Tazz Dan]

Miz's face turn isn't working because he's being too fucking cheesy.

[Wishbone]

He is saying he can't run face because he looks like a huge douchebag. Which is why the Miz's face turn isn't working out well yet.

Miz's face turn isn't working because he's being shoehorned to hell and gone, and being made to just use the same formula of "Pander to the fans, mention sports team, team up with legend" schtick over and over. If they'd give him some real material he'd do just fine as a face. Play up the underdog who worked his way to the top thing instead of having him be a generic, happy go lucky baby face.

As for Ziggy, he's got the charisma and in ring ability that he could easily pull off a Chris Jericho type face. It might not be his best work, but he could pull it off without a single hitch.

All of this being said though, as you can see with Del Rio ANYONE and I mean absolutely ANYONE can make it as a face in WWE today. The fans will cheer you and bust out the signs so long as you just smile and say something about their home town. And if WWE backs you enough you'll sell, because let's face it the average fan just buys whatever Vince tells them to.

[James Diesel]

He is saying he can't run face because he looks like a huge douchebag. Which is why the Miz's face turn isn't working out well yet.

Essentially this.

The best thing Ziggler can do with his career is run the Show Off gimmick till the flame dies. He shouldn't ever have to go face. Not only is he fantastic as a heel, but as we've already begun to see, over time no one gives a shit that he's a heel because he's a great performer.

In Miz's case, he's not a great performer, so he needs this little nugget of a face run to climb up the ranks, and then just go back to being a dickhead. Hell, if anything, this face run is the worst thing for Miz, cause it has a very high potential for sending him to irrelevance.

[James Diesel]

Though I suppose Miz was already on his descent to obscurity as a heel. So this face run may save him, but it's really iffy. He needs to stay the fuck away from Cena, and come up with his own face style

[Shadrick]

I can see Ziggler as a believable face way faster than I can see Miz. But hey, we all see different things.

[Tazz Dan]

James Diesel is a much better poster when he doesn't make bad posts.

[James Diesel]

Ziggler's best face would be akin to the anti-hero.

Doesn't work too well with bleach blondes though

[James Steele]

Bischoff came aboard long after Hogan turned.

So your claim is about as wrong as HHH not sleeping his way to the top.

And he wasn't over. Nash/Hall carried him until Bischoff came in and sucked his cock live on Nitro every week.

[Tazz Dan]

Ziggler's best face would be akin to the anti-hero.

That's everyone's opinion when someone who has been a heel their whole run is discussed regarding a face turn. I think it's a cop out IMO.

[James Diesel]

It may be a cop out but unfortunately it's the best case scenario in terms of a face run for this particular person.

Miz is worst case scenario.

[Optimus Bone 69]

He reminds me of Mr Perfect, can make anyone look good but there is just something missing
Dont know what

[Optimus Bone 69]

Miz's face turn isn't working because he's being too fucking cheesy.

Proof that the biggest successes are just exaggerations of there own personalties
if your a c*nt ur a c*nt

[Shisen Kopf]

He needs to reform the spirit squad and be the leader. Kenny was no leader but Nicky would be a great leader. Also, bring back the Bushwhackers.

[Tazz Dan]

It may be a cop out but unfortunately it's the best case scenario in terms of a face run for this particular person.

Miz is worst case scenario.

I don't believe that.

[itsmeJD]

Proof that the biggest successes are just exaggerations of there own personalties
if your a c*nt ur a c*nt

Why did you censor ****? Just curious.

[Tazz Dan]

I just censored a c*nt

[Tazz Dan]

:shifty:

[Tazz Dan]

;)

[Ziggles]

Ric Flair should take Ziggler under his wing. Ziggler should start WINNING matches. Ziggler wins the World Heavyweight Championship without the briefcase (at WM?). Then Ziggler thanks Flair for nothing and beats the holy living crap out of him on Raw. Spits on the World Title and throws it in the trash. Ric Flair will NOT, even as old as he is, sit back and watch someone DISRESPECT the World Heavyweight Championship like that... and by the way, he would love to become World Champion for the 17TH TIME!!!!! A heated exchange results in Ziggler somehow agreeing to put the MITB briefcase on the line against Flair. Flair wins, cashing in on the next PPV (Summerslam?) setting up Dolph Ziggler vs. Ric Flair for the World Heavyweight Championship. Can Ric Flair become champion once again?

No. Dolph Ziggler wins clean against Ric Flair, and sets the World Heavyweight Championship on FIRE. He's been wanting to do that for a long time. WCW died a LONG time ago, and he will not disgrace himself by wearing that belt any longer. He got what he wanted out of it, FLAIR! He only wants one title, and John Cena has it.

John Cena vs. Dolph Ziggler for the WWE Championship. Ziggler wins clean against Cena for the first time in his career.

The End.

[XL]

Put Flair back in the ring? Get rid of the "good looking" World Title belt?

[Ziggles]

Of course, the belt could be saved by another former WCW champion on the roster, or anyone for that matter. Also, Ric Flair could be replaced with someone else.

[James Diesel]

While he's at it, why doesn't Dolph just go to TNA to be closer to the WCW guys and get to the top of the company in a matter of weeks? Hell, he could be with the Hulkster, and the Stinger, and all those wonderful guys who still believe in the spirit of WCW. By now, you have may have guessed that I am speaking ironically and having nothing but terrible things to say about your idea. Ziggles, change everything you said. Dictated, but not read.

http://images.tvrage.com/screencaps/18/3506/403111.jpg

[Ziggles]

While he's at it, why doesn't Dolph just go to TNA to be closer to the WCW guys and get to the top of the company in a matter of weeks? Hell, he could be with the Hulkster, and the Stinger, and all those wonderful guys who still believe in the spirit of WCW. By now, you have may have guessed that I am speaking ironically and having nothing but terrible things to say about your idea. Ziggles, change everything you said. Dictated, but not read.

http://images.tvrage.com/screencaps/18/3506/403111.jpg


:eek:

Everything I said, changed.

[Bad News Gertner]

Yeah, that was terrible.

[Shisen Kopf]

Of course, the belt could be saved by another former WCW champion on the roster, or anyone for that matter. Also, Ric Flair could be replaced with someone else.

He should talk crap about all the former WCW champions and Flair, Big Show, and Booker T form a stable called "Wooooo Big Nigga" and they won't have any of Ziggler bashing the wcw belt. So every week they run in and beat up Ziggler. This goes on all the way until Rasslemania where Ziggler and his two mystery partners take on them three. Out comes "woooo big nigga" and then comes Ziggler and he says he's got two dudes who hate wcw as his partners and out come The New Age Outlaws. They lose.

[mike adamle]

While he's at it, why doesn't Dolph just go to TNA to be closer to the WCW guys and get to the top of the company in a matter of weeks? Hell, he could be with the Hulkster, and the Stinger, and all those wonderful guys who still believe in the spirit of WCW. By now, you have may have guessed that I am speaking ironically and having nothing but terrible things to say about your idea. Ziggles, change everything you said. Dictated, but not read.

http://images.tvrage.com/screencaps/18/3506/403111.jpg

Jesus Christ. At least like 3 people like my post. No one read that and didn't cringe.

[mike adamle]

Thanks for the rep on my post, Shisen :)

[James Diesel]

At least like 3 people like my post.

Gertner, Shisen, and Ruien.

The people you have recently modified yourself after.

You want them to be so proud of you. And yet everyone else thinks you're a fucking attention-starved dipshit who was probably abused as a youngen and only feels safe with the blanket of anonymity.

You're fucking pathetic. But you already knew that.

[mike adamle]

Gertner, Shisen, and Ruien.

The people you have recently modified yourself after.

You want them to be so proud of you. And yet everyone else thinks you're a fucking attention-starved dipshit who was probably abused as a youngen and only feels safe with the blanket of anonymity.

You're fucking pathetic. But you already knew that.

Better to know what you are than be ignorant and continue making the shittiest posts on TPWW :wave: 3 More than you ;)

[James Steele]

You're fucking pathetic. But you already knew that.


http://cdn2.sbnation.com/imported_assets/1370653/alberto-del-o.gif

[Shisen Kopf]

James Steele>James Diesel

[whiteyford]

I'd just get him away from the never ending feud with Cena, he's the kiss of death to pretty much everyone.

[mike adamle]

I think a WrestleMania feud and victory with Triple H and then cashing in that same night would send him over the top. Then maybe lure Shawn Michaels out of retirement at WrestleMania 30 for a match after beating Triple H last year.

[Shadrick]

shawn isnt coming back...

[mike adamle]

Fineeee replace HBK with Ric Flair :roll:

[Rollermacka]

Nah, a worked shoot would make him seem too Punk-ish for my taste. I think he should become even more self absorbed and obsessed with money. Think Million Dollar Man meets Mr Perfect..... Million Dollar Perfection :yes:



Side Note, and lose AJ and Big E. Don't really see a point in keeping them around with Ziggler anymore. Possibily, build up E with a mid level feud (maybe with a Santino or Ryder)

[Shadrick]

Fineeee replace HBK with Ric Flair :roll:

your predictions are always interesting

[Keith]

I think a WrestleMania feud and victory with Triple H and then cashing in that same night would send him over the top. Then maybe lure Shawn Michaels out of retirement at WrestleMania 30 for a match after beating Triple H last year.

You know wrestling's just entertainment, right? It's not real or anything.

You're aware of this, yeah?

[Tazz Dan]

James Diesel, mike adamle, and Keith all posting on one page. Must be time to CLOSE THE THREAD

[Bad News Gertner]

SHUT IT DOWN!!!

[Shadrick]

*razor ramon stomps*

[Mister King]

SHUT IT DOWN!!!

LET'S GO HOME!!!

[Mister King]

What Dolph Ziggler needs is to finally cash in that damn briefcase.