Triple H still drawing?

[Joe Kerr]

OK Basically I think HHH is by far the best Heel on RAW he still has Mic skills and is very entertaining (this past RAW's Highlight reel showed that) He can definatly still draw heat WHICH IS IMPORTANT FOR A HEEL!! I beleive a lot of people didnt order the PPV for Benoit vs. Kane but for The Hell In A Cell.

http://raw.wwe.com/superstars/tripleh/images/19.jpg
http://raw.wwe.com/superstars/tripleh/images/17.jpg
http://raw.wwe.com/superstars/tripleh/images/14.jpg

[#1-norm-fan]

Yeah. Triple H is still the man. :y:

[Anybody Thrilla]

I especially enjoyed his little bit with Eugene on RAW.

[Lara Emily]

He hasn't drawn really since 2000. Of course lots of people order the PPV for the HIAC, it got build up. :|. Others ordered it because they order every PPV. What's your point? Doesn't indicate that HHH is draw, if Benoit was in the HIAC would you then claim Benoit was a draw? If anything the draw in the HIAC was well the HIAC itself.

[Joe Kerr]

Yeah. Triple H is still the man. :y:


And is still a safe Wrestler...Ive been arguing with "Lara Emily" Who does not beleive that the wrestlers feel safe in the ring with HHH. Even though Kurt said it plain and clear when he had neck problems that he would feel safer and more comfortable in the ring with a expereinced HHH. If you have the Wrestlemania XX dvd you know what Im talking about or if you saw Mania of Wrestlemania

[Kane Knight]

Timmmmmmmme to fall asleeeeeeeeeep...

[Joe Kerr]

He hasn't drawn really since 2000. Of course lots of people order the PPV for the HIAC, it got build up. :|. Others ordered it because they order every PPV. What's your point? Doesn't indicate that HHH is draw, if Benoit was in the HIAC would you then claim Benoit was a draw? If anything the draw in the HIAC was well the HIAC itself.


No HHH never lost a Hell in A Cell thats what made the Match even better. Benoit and Kane in the Hell in a cell still wouldnt have drawn as much as the HBK/ HHH match. Benoit is a great wrestler but come on matching him with Kane? Two complete differnt styles? HHH can cut a promo a lot better than Benoit HHH can draw more from the crowd (like I said HHH is the Best Heel right now on RAW)

[Lara Emily]

And is still a safe Wrestler...Ive been arguing with "Lara Emily" Who does not beleive that the wrestlers feel safe in the ring with HHH. Even though Kurt said it plain and clear when he had neck problems that he would feel safer and more comfortable in the ring with a expereinced HHH. If you have the Wrestlemania XX dvd you know what Im talking about or if you saw Mania of Wrestlemania
Whether he is safe in the ring (I do recall him giving Angle a conccussion once but maybe that was the table's fault) or not is irrelvant to the question on whether he's still entertaining and drawing a crowd. LOL why my name in quotations?

[Loose Cannon]

I don't mind Trips at all when he's with Evolution. When he's just by himself he can be rather boring. I like the Evolution Stable and they entertain me. Trips si still a good heel, but I can't wait for Orton to turn on his ass. That's top ten all-time wrestling moments for me right there if it happens.

[Anybody Thrilla]

Lara, Joey...you two better start playing nice or you're going to be on time out.

I think Triple H catches a lot of flak, perhaps rightfully so, because of his backstage pull and how many times he's screwed other people over for his own game. I believe it's hard to appreciate when he does good work because of those reasons, however I still believe that he actually DOES do good work sometimes. I'll agree with Joey with him being the best heel on Raw.

[Lara Emily]

No HHH never lost a Hell in A Cell thats what made the Match even better. Benoit and Kane in the Hell in a cell still wouldnt have drawn as much as the HBK/ HHH match. Benoit is a great wrestler but come on matching him with Kane? Two complete differnt styles? HHH can cut a promo a lot better than Benoit HHH can draw more from the crowd (like I said HHH is the Best Heel right now on RAW)
Well he did lose one, the fact that he wasn't pinned is irrelevant. That and really I don't see how that was the selling point, if anything that hinted at who was going to win :p. Benoit hasn't been given a chance to draw that my whole point. Watch the standing ovation he got after his RR 03 match with Angle, and tell me Benoit doesn't draw from the crowd.

[Kane Knight]

That's it. time-out chair for you.

[Lara Emily]

Lara, Joey...you two better start playing nice or you're going to be on time out.

I think Triple H catches a lot of flak, perhaps rightfully so, because of his backstage pull and how many times he's screwed other people over for his own game. I believe it's hard to appreciate when he does good work because of those reasons, however I still believe that he actually DOES do good work sometimes. I'll agree with Joey with him being the best heel on Raw.

He's basically the only heel whose name isn't Kane who gets any quality airtime .

[ilt_undertaker]

What Loose Cannon said :y:

[Anybody Thrilla]

He's basically the only heel whose name isn't Kane who gets any quality airtime .

Orton

[Joe Kerr]

Well he did lose one, the fact that he wasn't pinned is irrelevant. That and really I don't see how that was the selling point, if anything that hinted at who was going to win :p. Benoit hasn't been given a chance to draw that my whole point. Look at after RR 03, and tell me Benoit doesn't draw from the crowd.


Sure that was great that a new Number 1 contender was crowned. Wrestlemania XX got huge pops that a new Champion was crowned. But now 3 months later He's Stale, Benoit isnt entertaining anymore and people enjoy his wrestling but he doesnt have a character that gets cheered anymore. When you think of next week RAW what comes to your head? Not Benoit but...Triple H and Eugene. Just like Bad Blood wasnt about Kane and Benoit it was about HBK and HHH.

[Lara Emily]

Sure that was great that a new Number 1 contender was crowned. Wrestlemania XX got huge pops that a new Champion was crowned. But now 3 months later He's Stale, Benoit isnt entertaining anymore and people enjoy his wrestling but he doesnt have a character that gets cheered anymore. When you think of next week RAW what comes to your head? Not Benoit but...Triple H and Eugene. Just like Bad Blood wasnt about Kane and Benoit it was about HBK and HHH.
Hello, it's called build up. Benoit isn't getting any because they are as per usual giving it all to Triple H, that's been my point all along, they haven't given Benoit a chance to do anything because he continually plays second fiddle to HHH.

[Joe Kerr]

Hello, it's called build up. Benoit isn't gettign any because they are as per usualy giving it all to Triple H, that's been my point all along, they haven't given Benoit a chance to do anything because he continually plays second fiddle to HHH.


And why do you think that is?

[Lara Emily]

And why do you think that is?


LOl wait so your entire arugment is that HHH draws because he gets more TV time than anyone else?

[Anybody Thrilla]

LOl wait so your entire arugment is that HHH draws because he gets more TV time than anyone else?

It sounds like his argument is that HHH gets more TV time because he's better than everyone else. Or something like that.

[Joe Kerr]

It sounds like his argument is that HHH gets more TV time because he's better than everyone else. Or something like that.


close...The Argument is HHH gets more t.v. time because he is a better draw.

[Joe Kerr]

And Lara you didnt answer my question

[The CyNick]

HHH is NOT a big draw anymore, thats fact.

However, he's not much worse than any of the other main event guys they have, and he's seen as the last star from the boom period so he gets the benefit of the doubt. But if you look at business, he's been on top since 2002, and business has only went down under his leadership. So any claims of him being a draw in the current landscape are just plain false.

[Lara Emily]

close...The Argument is HHH gets more t.v. time because he is a better draw.Which is tantamount to saying he's the better draw because he's the better draw. It's circular. It also ignores the fact that HHH never gives anyone else a chance to draw, the fact that he is married to Stephanie McMahon cannot be ignored, not to mention that he is known to have pull, so really just saying he's the better draw because he's on TV more, is not that great of an argument.

[Lara Emily]

HHH is NOT a big draw anymore, thats fact.

However, he's not much worse than any of the other main event guys they have, and he's seen as the last star from the boom period so he gets the benefit of the doubt. But if you look at business, he's been on top since 2002, and business has only went down under his leadership. So any claims of him being a draw in the current landscape are just plain false.
:y:


I agree that no one is really drawing right now, of course no one else is really being given a chance either.

[Joe Kerr]

Which is tantamount to saying he's the better draw because he's the better draw. It's circular. It also ignores the fact that HHH never gives anyone else a chance to draw, the fact that he is married to Stephanie McMahon cannot be ignored, not to mention that he is known to have pull, so really just saying he's the better draw because he's on TV more, is not that great of an argument.

HHH has given many superstars a chance a lot of low card wrestlers have main evented because of Triple H. Who says he has pull? Last I saw that was still just internet gossip. No solid facts have been shown that HHH has pull. HHH does have creative control as well as most of the vetern wrestlers. Bret Hart even had control over his character.

[Lara Emily]

HHH has given many superstars a chance a lot of low card wrestlers have main evented because of Triple H. Who says he has pull? Last I saw that was still just internet gossip. No solid facts have been shown that HHH has pull. HHH does have creative control as well as most of the vetern wrestlers. Bret Hart even had control over his character.Many? Do you mean Taka, Jeff Hardy,the Brooklyn Brawler and Shelton?


So you are you claiming he as the same amount of pull backstage as say Edge or Benoit?

[Joe Kerr]

A lot? Do you mean Taka, Jeff Hardy,the Brooklyn Brawler and Shelton?


So you are you claiming he as the same amount of pull backstage as say Edge or Benoit?



You forgot He feuded with Hurricane as well


Read it again Im saying there is no solid proof that he has any pull. Stop rewording what i say.

[Lara Emily]

You forgot He feuded with Hurricane as well


Read it again Im saying there is no solid proof that he has any pull. Stop rewording what i say.

Yes which is the same thing as saying he pretty much as the same pull as Edge or Benoit, that being none (that's what I was getting at). Small feuds with mid carders who will never be maineventers isn't really giving anyone a chance. Or are you going to tell me all these guys then just failed to run with the ball?

[Joe Kerr]

Yes which is the same thing as saying he pretty much as the same pull as Edge or Benoit, that being none (that's what I was getting at). Small feuds with mid carders who will never be maineventers isn't really giving anyone a chance. Or are you going to tell me all these guys then just failed to run with the ball?


If you read my Hurricane thread I posted erlier youll see my opionon on why he failed/is failing...Taka left,Jeff Hardy left,Brooklyn Brawler is a jober and Shelton is Doing really well since his HHH push I dont see how you can even argue that.

[Funky Fly]

Anybody can draw when an entire show is focused mainly on you.

[Anybody Thrilla]

Anybody can draw when an entire show is focused mainly on you.

Tell that to Parker Lewis. He thought he couldn't lose.

:shifty:

[Lara Emily]

If you read my Hurricane thread I posted erlier youll see my opionon on why he failed/is failing...Taka left,Jeff Hardy left,Brooklyn Brawler is a jober and Shelton is Doing really well since his HHH push I dont see how you can even argue that.

Jeff left way after his mini fued with Triple H (You do remember he won then got killed the next week, hardly what I call putting someone over), Taka I believe also left way after. Shelton is doign fine I admit, that's about the only guy that's a decent example.

I'll be honest I don't remember Hurricane feuding with Triple H, I remember him feuding with The Rock though, but that's probably just my memory on this particular situation.

[Fox]

HHH has given many superstars a chance a lot of low card wrestlers have main evented because of Triple H. Who says he has pull? Last I saw that was still just internet gossip. No solid facts have been shown that HHH has pull. HHH does have creative control as well as most of the vetern wrestlers. Bret Hart even had control over his character.

To try and pretend that Triple H doesn't have backstage pull is stupid, and only makes your arguments look more weak, and makes you look even more ignorant.

Why don't you stick with what you're good at and post some pictures.

[Kane Knight]

close...The Argument is HHH gets more t.v. time because he is a better draw.
Right. Does that also work for Hulk Hogan (Who doesn't draw shit these days)?

[Joe Kerr]

To try and pretend that Triple H doesn't have backstage pull is stupid, and only makes your arguments look more weak, and makes you look even more ignorant.

Why don't you stick with what you're good at and post some pictures.


coming from someone who has yet to make a decent Ill ignore your ignorance and inform you to read the post closer...It states

"Who says he has pull? Last I saw that was still just internet gossip. No solid facts have been shown that HHH has pull. HHH does have creative control as well as most of the vetern wrestlers. Bret Hart even had control over his character."

If you need it explained to you just ask.

[Joe Kerr]

Right. Does that also work for Hulk Hogan (Who doesn't draw shit these days)?


That may be why Hogan wont be back.

[Back Stabbed]

HHH w/o title = :y:
HHH w/ title = :n:

[Joe Kerr]

HHH w/o title = :y:
HHH w/ title = :n:


Its not really about the titles, Im more about the character. I do agree he shouldnt have the title for awhile and by awhile I mean at least until Wrestlemania 21.

[Head]

To answer the question, yes and no.

Yes, he does draw, possibly more than anybody else on Raw right now, but that's to be expected with the amount of airtime and hyping up he gets.

He definatly doesn't draw what he should be drawing given these factors.

Although I must admit, I have enjoyed Triple H a lot again since Wrestlemania. The whole Evolution thing gives him somewhat of a new niche I think.

[Kane Knight]

That may be why Hogan wont be back.
No, it's not. Because it didn't stop them from pushing him, despite its effect on ratings.

[Londoner]

You knowim gonna immediately shit on any arguments defending HHH right now. joey radd's argument is basically HHH still draws and is the best heel on Raw.
Well there are simple things to counter your argument with:

1) The reason why he is he top heel on raw is because basically he is the only heel on raw apart from Kane/Randy Orton who get like one show before each PPV to draw heat.

2)The reason why he still draws(in your opinion) is mainly down to the fact he gets the most hype, just look at how overhyped his match was with HBK, and look at how shit it turned out to be.I do have a problem with overhyping matches, just look at Lesnar V Goldberg.

3)Please do rememeber he is married to the bosses daughter, but let me guess that hardly gives an advantage does it?Hmmm.

4) The fact you even asked this question must put some doubt in your mind abotu whether he still draws or not.

I'm sure there are more arguments, just can't think of them right now so I'm done.

[HankScorpio]

Timmmmmmmme to fall asleeeeeeeeeep... ...ahhh

Fixed :lol:

[c4g2]

Triple H doesn't draw.

His nose does.













:shifty:

[LK]

Originally posted by ThugLife

You knowim gonna immediately shit on any arguments defending HHH right now. joey radd's argument is basically HHH still draws and is the best heel on Raw.
Well there are simple things to counter your argument with:

1) The reason why he is he top heel on raw is because basically he is the only heel on raw apart from Kane/Randy Orton who get like one show before each PPV to draw heat.

2)The reason why he still draws(in your opinion) is mainly down to the fact he gets the most hype, just look at how overhyped his match was with HBK, and look at how shit it turned out to be.I do have a problem with overhyping matches, just look at Lesnar V Goldberg.

3)Please do rememeber he is married to the bosses daughter, but let me guess that hardly gives an advantage does it?Hmmm.

4) The fact you even asked this question must put some doubt in your mind abotu whether he still draws or not.

I'm sure there are more arguments, just can't think of them right now so I'm done.

I can't disagree with anything that you have said.

[Kane Knight]

You knowim gonna immediately shit on any arguments defending HHH right now. joey radd's argument is basically HHH still draws and is the best heel on Raw.
Well there are simple things to counter your argument with:

1) The reason why he is he top heel on raw is because basically he is the only heel on raw apart from Kane/Randy Orton who get like one show before each PPV to draw heat.

2)The reason why he still draws(in your opinion) is mainly down to the fact he gets the most hype, just look at how overhyped his match was with HBK, and look at how shit it turned out to be.I do have a problem with overhyping matches, just look at Lesnar V Goldberg.

3)Please do rememeber he is married to the bosses daughter, but let me guess that hardly gives an advantage does it?Hmmm.

4) The fact you even asked this question must put some doubt in your mind abotu whether he still draws or not.

I'm sure there are more arguments, just can't think of them right now so I'm done.
1) Kane doesn't even really count as a top heel. His history of being squashed, his inability to survive a rollup. Orton's so vanilla it's not funny. Triple H is the only one with some believability (mostly because he refuses to job so often), and some personality (Though not much, but he beats out ORton).

Still, being the king of a pile of shit isn't really much better than just being in the pile of shit for any other reason.

2) In relation, it's like saying the BAckstreet Boys or Linkin Park are the best/most entertaining bands because they "draw" a lot. Well, when someone is aggressively pushed, they're gonna be big, not because they are great, but because they're a well-known name. Triple H doesn't draw on ability anymore, he draws on the fact that it's the Triple H show, even without the title.

3) Totally irrelevent. :shifty:

4) :lol:

In other words, good post. :y:

[tucsonspeed6]

So for all of the people who think that if HHH wasn't the main focus of the show he wouldn't draw a single guy, what would happen if he were a jobber? If the world were turned upside down and the only main eventers out there were highflying luchadores, while all of the jobbers were the heavyweights and the hosses, this site would be full of whining about "Rey Mysterio doesn't even do legitimate moves anymore!" and "What ever happened to old school wrestling?" and "They should push the submission style wrestlers more!" Well....I think Shadow would be happy at least. But this still doesn't answer the question about HHH.

To quote Thuglife:

1) The reason why he is he top heel on raw is because basically he is the only heel on raw apart from Kane/Randy Orton who get like one show before each PPV to draw heat.

2)The reason why he still draws(in your opinion) is mainly down to the fact he gets the most hype, just look at how overhyped his match was with HBK, and look at how shit it turned out to be.I do have a problem with overhyping matches, just look at Lesnar V Goldberg.

3)Please do rememeber he is married to the bosses daughter, but let me guess that hardly gives an advantage does it?Hmmm.

4) The fact you even asked this question must put some doubt in your mind abotu whether he still draws or not.

1: I can't say that you're wrong here. YOu could be right, but your logic is "This magic rock keeps away tigers" which is supported by the fact that there are no tigers around. Main Eventers will always get more airtime because they're such big draws. Hence why Eddie Guererro got the push to main event recently. So the question is whether or not HHH was a draw before he was a main eventer. It's kinda a "duh" question because we all know that he was. Hell, he was my favorite wrestler for the longest time (up until his injury). So it's more likely here that HHH gets his airtime because he's a draw, rather than the other way around.

2: You just mentioned my arguement against this one. Was Goldberg/Lesner overhyped? It was deffinately hyped, but there's no way in hell it was hyped more than HHH/HBK. And I doubt that one feud can have a "hype capacity" that is any different from another. So why does HHH continue to draw where as Goldberg would eventually lose his heat? It's because we, the fans are not idiots (well...except for Shadow and Goldbird maybe...) We understand that a match between two guys who won't perform is going to suck. Even the marks know that much. HHH has been going on as strongly as he has because he can perform in the ring, while Goldberg would eventually fizzle once people stopped carrying him through his matches.

3: He was drawing even while he was dating the man-beast, Chyna. There were months there where he had retained his push even whilst being lazy in the ring that your arguement would hold up better, but he's shown some change in recent months. I believe he's been more entertaining than before, and even though he's still fat and slow, he can still cut a promo and can hold his own in the ring. Main Event status? sure...but hopefully they'll keep the title off of him for a while. It's refreshing to see him humbled.

4: Or is it the fact that you defend it so ferociously that shows that you're stuck in old ways of thinking that you can't adapt to changes in the wrestling world? What I'm saying here is that your last arguement doesn't hold water. Maybe he asked the question to get people to reassess their old stereotypes of HHH. Maybe by throwing out the question he could get some lively debate on the issue and freshen up this damn wrestling forum from the old "Grumble grumble...Vince is ruining wrestling...grumble grumble... push Maven... grumble grumble... titles don't carry the image they used to..."

[Kane Knight]

which is why Benoit's gotten so much airtime of late, right? :lol: Weak argument at best there.

[John la Rock]

Yes Trips is still a draw. He's the most established wrestler in the WWE and still is the best heel. His promo this past week was arguably his best ever. I agree with Joey when it comes to HHH. He deserves to be where he's at. HHH/HBK should have been the main-event for Bad Blood. I think more people wanted to see that match then Benoit/Kane even if it was HIAC or not. Evolution is also great :y:

And buy the way Chris Benoit should have lost the belt by now. The guys is a wrestler and ONLY a wrestler. There is no way Benoit should get more air time unless he wrestlers 5 matches a night.