RIP Brian Pillman - Ten Years Later

[Xero]

It's been ten years since the death of Brian Pillman. I hadn't seen much of him until I saw his DVD and now think he was absolutely brilliant (I had seen his run with the Hart Foundation as a fan, but that was about it).

Talk about Pillman here.

[RP]

He's still dead

[FourFifty]

Classic RP right there....


Pillman was the goods. No one played a better pyscho than him. When he pulled a gun on Steve Austin I damn near pissed my pants.

[Rob]

It's all a work

[BigDaddyCool]

Never really saw much of him besides this run with the harts and golddust.

[Vastardikai]

In many ways, he and Eddie Gilbert should have been warnings. They were among the first to die of this current string due to Painkillers. Instead of learning from those mistakes, they continue to fall.

Also, fuck Vince because of that interview with Melanie

[BigDaddyCool]

If you need warning signs that doing massive amounts of painkillers while drinking, and beating you body up is bad, you are retarded. It isn't the fact that wrestlers don't know it is bad for them. There are other reasons that keep them on their path of self destruction. Just like everyone knows smoking is harmful to their health. It is more than informing them that it is bad for them.

[Hanso Amore]

Sid Fucked him up with that botched power bomb.....thats the only reaction I ever had to him. Tough guys though. I never seen much of his loose cannon work, doesnt seem that special to me. His ECW debut sucked, it was him swearing too much and trying to hard to be CRAZY. HE was like a Dad trying to be cool with the kids.

[Zen v.W.o.]

Trying too hard? Guess it worked, since he convinced everyone to the point they really thought he was. Talent.

One decade already..long time ago yet still seems like yesterday to me at times. Still miss him a lot.

"It's all a work you know....I'm not really the Loose cannon, it's all just their perception of reality".

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Pillman in the begining and end.

Maybe a few other tributes to the man:

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[Xero]

Besides JR, did Pillman ever admit that it was a work to anyone else in the business?

[Zen v.W.o.]

I always assumed Austin would have had to know, considering they used to phone each other often enough and talked about the business, but he even said he never really wanted to ask.

[Loose Cannon]

Sid Fucked him up with that botched power bomb.....thats the only reaction I ever had to him. Tough guys though. I never seen much of his loose cannon work, doesnt seem that special to me. His ECW debut sucked, it was him swearing too much and trying to hard to be CRAZY. HE was like a Dad trying to be cool with the kids.

god, there's always one in the bunch. judging from your first sentence, you've seen very little of his work if you're going to name that moment off. very ignorant post. whatever though. watch his work before making comments, that's all I'll say.

And that anology was really terrible considering the ECW fans were as old as he was.

[mrslackalack]

Pillman was awesome. Before his injury he had some great matches, and could def do a great promo. He also had that attitude edge to him before the era began.

[Lord-Of-Darkness]

Damn, 10 years already? Where the hell did it go. Also scary to note that its also over 8 years since Owen died.

All I ever saw of Pillman growing up was the WWF Hart Foundation stuff, and enjoyed it. Since then, I've sought out more of his work, from Flyin' Brian onwards, and the guy was a great talent, and made the most of his great charisma and mic work when he needed to.

[Mercury Bullet]

Did anybody see Pillman vs. Jushin Liger in WCW way back in the day...?

Awesome. He was one of my favorite wrestlers, no I retract that, still is one of my favorite wrestlers.

[FourFifty]

........would I be a total dick if I asked if you were talking about Liger or Pillman? They're both awesome.

[Destor]

Never cared for Pillman. The guy wasn't anything too special. He's like the Kurt Cobain of wrestling. Pretty good, called great. Good for him I guess.

[Xero]

Never cared for Pillman. The guy wasn't anything too special. He's like the Kurt Cobain of wrestling. Pretty good, called great. Good for him I guess.
So he's pretty much like every other talent humped by the IWC?

[Mercury Bullet]

........would I be a total dick if I asked if you were talking about Liger or Pillman? They're both awesome.

I was meaning Pillman...but Liger is awesome as well, and still going pretty strong :D

[Kane Knight]

So he's pretty much like every other talent humped by the IWC?

Naw. Pillman's popular because he's dead.

[Hanso Amore]

One thing I noticed in that tribute to Pillman, is how many guys at that show followed him too early.

Hawk
Owen
Bulldog
Rude

[Hanso Amore]

Naw. Pillman's popular because he's dead.


Nailed it on the head.

[Hanso Amore]

Pillman is the Bo Jackson of wrestling.

He could have been one of the greatest ever, but injuries and the such ended those chances earlly, and they ended up just being average afterwards.

[Loose Cannon]

he's not even that popular though. I don't know more then a handful of guys on here who really like him and no casual fan I know mentions him.

But the WWE must of saw something to put his DVD out ahead of lots of guys.

Most Pillman fans liked Pillman when he was a wrestler, not afterwards. I started liking him when he was with Austin.

[Blue Demon]

I never got to see a lot of his early stuff, but I was still a bit of a fan.

[What Would Kevin Do?]

There's was always something about Pillman I just loved. He was a damn good wrestler, a great high flier for his time, and all in all damn well rounded. When he became the loose cannon, it was pretty damn obvious he had what it took to be a big time player. Of course, a car accident, and a lot of pain meds can change a lot of things.... :(

[Zen v.W.o.]

Pillman was one of those guys who had a presence about him. You only had to look at him and say "that guy has IT". In fact, when teamed with Austin Pillman was the better of the two, Pillman had more potential, and Pillman sort of carried the team.
Pillman was a natural in anything he ended up doing. He pushed boundaries and was way ahead of his time. He moved things forward, whether it be from the start of his career, pushing the cruiser division forward with the high flying, or later on when he kicked the doors down with the attitude he possessed. Much like Piper, he was advanced and very intelligent towards the business.

You dont make a dvd of a guy that lasted about a year with a company all while injured without knowing that the reason why was simply because he was special enough for it.

People who talk like Matthew admitted they knew nothing about him so when he talks about him you can see that it's true, with all the ignorance he displayed.

[redoneja]

Agree with Destor. Watched him in WCW and WWE. Saw his ECW stuff years after the fact. And I do own his DVD.

He was alright. Not one of the greatest of all time, but still noteworthy.

[Hanso Amore]

You can play the special card, but th only reason he got a DVD is not because he was special, or he has IT and he didnt get a chance to show it, it is because he DIED and his LATE career was surrounded with controversy.

Give me a fucking break, you expect me to believe the YELLOW DOG and the guy who lost a DRESS match gimmick was the diamond in the rough?

Dying made his career. IF he had just gotten fired and not died, where to you think his career would be today, or his Legacy be, HONESTLY?

[Hanso Amore]

Without a death, his career has as much impact as DOug Furnas and Phil LaFon.

[Destor]

I'd say the DVD is just another attempt to cash in on controversy and death. I mean "suicidal wrestler" is pretty marketable on it's own. If Spike Dudley blew his head off I could see a DVD made where they only talked about how tough he was.

[Xero]

So you're saying WWE will be releasing another Benoit DVD?

[Destor]

So you're saying WWE will be releasing another Benoit DVD?Give it 20 years and hell yeah they will.

[Kane Knight]

So you're saying WWE will be releasing another Benoit DVD?

Given time, I can all but guarantee you they will. They won't do it in 2007 or 2008 or 2009, but once some time has passed, they will cash in.

[FourFifty]

Not Pillman related, but found this while looking up vids of Pillman.

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[Loose Cannon]

You can play the special card, but th only reason he got a DVD is not because he was special, or he has IT and he didnt get a chance to show it, it is because he DIED and his LATE career was surrounded with controversy.

Give me a fucking break, you expect me to believe the YELLOW DOG and the guy who lost a DRESS match gimmick was the diamond in the rough?

Dying made his career. IF he had just gotten fired and not died, where to you think his career would be today, or his Legacy be, HONESTLY?

come on? Yellow dog and Dress? Is that what we are supposed to remember Brian Pillman by? jesus, shut the fuck up already. You know nothing.

Did you not see his matches with Liger, which were voted some of the top matches of the year, did you not see his work with Steamboat and Douglas, did you not see his work with Luger in 89, did you not see his work with Zenk in the tag divisions, his work with the Blondes and then of course being the most talked about wrestler in 1995 and 1996.

Either your being stupid to be stupid or you are the most ignorant poster I've ever seen on these forums before and that's saying a hell of a lot

[Loose Cannon]

Without a death, his career has as much impact as DOug Furnas and Phil LaFon.

lol wow. are you just being an idiot or do you seriusly mean that? if this is serious and your not just trying to get a rouse out of people in this thread, then you really are dumb. Furnas and Lafon and Brian Pillman. wow.

[Loose Cannon]

Give me a fucking break, you expect me to believe the YELLOW DOG and the guy who lost a DRESS match gimmick was the diamond in the rough?

by the way, The Ringmaster, Rocky Maivia, Hunter Hearst Helmsley.... hmmm. who lost a Hog Pen match again? Who feuded with Savio Vega in strap matches? hmmm.

[Kane Knight]

WTF? Yellow dog and Dress? Is that what we are supposed to remember Brian Pillman by? jesus, shut the fuck up already. You know nothing.

Yes, the general population of wrestling knows who Liger is, and remembers Pillman's matches with him.

No, wait, that's the Smarktards and pretty much nobody else in America.

Smarks seem about as in-touch with the average viewer as Trekkies are with the general population of TV viewers.

[Xero]

I'd say anyone who was a fan back then would remember Pillman more for the Hart Foundation and especially the Gun incident.

If they weren't (which seems like the majority of WWE fans nowadays) they either don't know of him or know of the stupid shit he did.

[Loose Cannon]

Kane Knight: I here what your saying, but Matthew up there mentions Yellow Dog. Yellow Dog is so minor in all that Pillman has done in his career and that's his case for how people remember Pillman. Yellow dog and Dress. It's like he's trying to pick apart Pillman by mentioning two of the worst angles he was a part of. Not even a mention of Hart Foundation, XXX Files, Gun Incident...which is what most fans, like Xero said, would remember Pillman by.

[Loose Cannon]

and I mentioned all those other moments to him because he mentioned Yellow Dog, which is around the same time, when all those moments happened. So if he's got to at least know about them or chooses not to

[Kane Knight]

Say what you will, but the dress bit stuck in a lot of people's heads at the time.

People tend to remember the worst, they tend to remember the most notable, and that was arguably both in terms of what garners attention.

[Destor]

I don't like saying this, but KK's got a strong point.

I feel dirty.

[Zen v.W.o.]

lol wow. are you just being an idiot or do you seriusly mean that? if this is serious and your not just trying to get a rouse out of people in this thread, then you really are dumb. Furnas and Lafon and Brian Pillman. wow.

He's being a jackass basically.

Pillman at least agreed to do what was asked of him. That also says alot.

As for his Furnas and Lafon comment, none of them knocked down any doors. Pillman brought the attitude into the company. In fact, they signed Pillman clearly with the intention in mind that he was going to help pave the road to where they wanted to be.

Great on the mic, great in the ring, great overall. Death means shit in this case. You know why? Because the people who knew of him and who are interested in quality are going to buy his dvd. Those fucktards who enjoy Batista and Shannon Moore today arent going to care.

It's like a sports athlete who has so much potential and skill dying early or injuring himself sometime in his career..he had the stats while around and the potential to get better, but it was all ended. Thus, the HOF numbers and acheivements arent all there, but when you look back upon him, you go, that guy was fucking great while he was playing(Pavel Bure, for example, in hockey).

Then again he's simply reading up on Pillman and some of the parts of his career and making uninformed comments about them. He stated he barely saw the man...so ya know, that says it all.

[hb2k]

First saw Pillman in the Hollywood Blondes during the series with Steamboat and Douglas and thought he was the most annoying dick I'd ever seen. Him and Austin were such good heels that if I saw a team like them now, I'd love them instantly, but back then, I wanted to see them get shitkicked.

Pillman was great. As for the "nothing without a death" point, hey - if Kurt Cobain meant little to music, his death wouldn't have meant much anyway. Lead singer of Drowning Pool dies, no immortal legacy just because of a death. The end of Pillman's life is a really sad story, how he became the talk of the business and a red hot commodity, but things just not going his way, ultimately spinning downhill for good, throwing it to the curb. Unbelieveable character that I wish we could have seen more of.

And if anybody has a FULL copy of the Brian Pillman WWF Contract Signing, complete with his flip-out that they'd like to sell, please PM me...

[Zen v.W.o.]

Yeah that contract signing was immense. Still recall it to this day. I have an audio file of it.

But that's another thing. He was fucking intelligent. The dude fooled everyone. He worked everybody. The boys. He worked Bischoff so well he managed to get himself released from his contract so that he could sign his most lucrative contract he's ever had to that point. He became the biggest free agent in the business up to that time, and the most sought after and talked about. That kind of buzz isnt just thrown towards anybody. A healthy Pillman like you saw say in ecw, right before the crash, is a huge coup for anyone who nabs him.

[Hanso Amore]

So because I find Pillman's Amazing legacy less than stellar, I know nothing? I have seen all his "great Work". I still find nothing amazing. Wow, he had a few match of the year candidate matches, that does not make him an all time great. Its much more in that business than I ever did, but how many guys have had the same thing. How many match of the years have been had by guys like Daniels and AJ Styles. They are big names to SmarkTards, but in the grand scheme of Wrestling History, they dont even get a chapter.

Pillman brought so much attitude to the WWE that he really did nothing, and easnt over until the Hart Foundation. While that is due to injury, he still did fuck all. Maybe they intended him to change the face of the WWF, but that didnt happen, and Stone Cold took the lead and changed it, that is why he is a legend, and Pillman is a guy who wasnt even talked about on these boards until his DVD came out.

How many of you tards are even old enough to remember him? Seeing a DVD and a few youtube clips does not count. I have seen Pillman Live in WCW and the WWE. I watched every show he was on in ECW first airing. I was at the shows he missed. and this huge BUZZ he made was a foot note to bigger happenings on those nights. I find is hilarious that a bunch of 15 year old kids who were.....5 when this ICON died are telling me that I dont know anything about him. You guys know what you have been told to know.

I guess Kane Knight is the only other sane person on this board.


You guys like to throw out moments in his career that make him great, but lets break them down.

Matches whith Liger - A few good matches that meant nothing in the end, there was no story behind them, and after they were done, he was still nothing.

Yellow Dog - Nuff Said

Tagging with Zenk - Your really going to use this as a defense of his greatness? They were Strike Force 8 years later.

Dress - Nuff Said

Being A horseman - Such a big deal most people wouldnt have even known. Nearly killed the group again by leaving.

The gun Incident - Created BAd Press for the WWE but got some fans....About the same effect as CHuck and Billy.

Hollywood Blondes - a Solid team I enjoyed, but without looking at what these 2 became, it was a short lived tag team in a down era in the number 2 brand. Americas Most Wanted 10 years earlier.

XXX Files - Gimme a break

HArt Foundation - They never really got him going enough in this, could have been great. HE was kind of just 2nd fiddle to the rest, its hard getting over big in a group with 3 hall of famers.

Loose Cannon Years - While they could have been huge, nothing much happened with it because the guy got hurt. It sucks, but thats what happened. A Gimmick that died too soon. Sean O-Haire ring a bell.

He had a SOLID career, but nothing amazing. When you break it down like this, no moment is that important, and overall it makes a solid but not legendary career. Before that DVD, Pillman was basically the guy who's ankle Austin broke (coining a term-Pilmanizing), the Guy with the gun, and the guy who died too soon. the WWE tries to cash in, and now all you sheep are on his nuts.

But hey, "I dont know anything" right? It's funny how anyone who dis-agrees with you is not only wrong, but doesnt know anything.

[Loose Cannon]

dude, you already said you've seen very little of him, so I ain't reading whatever shit you just wrote there

[Loose Cannon]

So because I find Pillman's Amazing legacy less than stellar, I know nothing? I have seen all his "great Work"..


never seen much of his loose cannon work, doesnt seem that special to me.

fuck off ok :wave:

[Destor]

So...um yeah, he hasn't seen much of his Loose Cannon work and somehow he knows nothing of his career.

K, I didn't know Pillman had such a lackluster career that if you missed the 8 month span, you missed it all.

Thanks for the heads up. :y:

[Loose Cannon]

did you choose to glance over the word "all" there Destor? I guess so. your mask probably blinded you.

and I can only think that "great Work" (capital w) meant when he Worked everyone as the Loose Cannon.

so fuck off too, go work a $5 match and go by some meth, dick.

[Destor]

Really? That's your entire argument? Holy fuck.

As far as personal pot shots go, brother, I'm living my dream. Do you really think you can hurt me?

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Pillman had something special. If you couldn't see that, you're blind. Very few wrestlers who have died young, especially at his place on the card, have gained this kind of recognition. Did dying young help his legacy? Hell, it nearly created his legacy, but only because he WAS something special. I don't see any Louie Spicolli DVD's or memorial shows.

[FourFifty]

I don't like saying this, but KK's got a strong point.

I feel dirty.

At least it's KK and not RP.

[Hanso Amore]

Now you guys are Grasping. I have seen ALL OF THE THINGS you have mentioned as his GREAT work.

I however have not seen alot of his Loose Cannon stuff. Just the few moments, and if that is everything, your lost.

So sad, you guys can't even have conversations. If somone disagrees, you tell them they are wrong and stupid. Then they tell you why they think what they do, and you have to look for some little loophole to try to make them look wrong. So there we go, if you read what I said, I Saw his great work, but I also said I only saw a bit of Loose Cannon. So unless all his GREAT work = Loose Cannon, what happens to all the great WCW stuff you guys have been jerking off too?

[hb2k]

I'll gladly debate the career of Pillman.

Saying he had a lackluster career is pretty simple minded, and I'm actually surprised if you legitimately followed it all the way through. A great talker, a great wrestler and a brilliant mind, he had so many highlights that while there he was saddled with some goofy crap like the dress and the Yellow Dog, they're total footnotes given how he was constantly evolving and finding new ways to be a highlight of the show, first his style and the matches with Liger, then as the raspy voiced chicken shit heel, to forming a team with Austin that is still talked about as an awesome unit despite only being around for eight months. Even when there was zero intent to try and use him, or put him in bad positions in this period he'd have matches that would steal the show, carrying guys like Alex Wright and Johnny B Badd to the best matches of their lives. His run as a Horseman took a group that hadn't meant anything for years and rejuvanted it with his new persona, and the Loose Cannon was not only the first of its kind and a groundbreaker when it came to what would ultimately result in the business getting hot again - real life edgy personalities instead of cartoon characters, but it also resulted in the most captivating promos and creative skits of the time. Clearly his worth was pretty significant, being the first wrestler of the period to become subject to a bidding war between Bischoff and McMahon, and taking himself out of midcard status to get a big money contract.

And while the car crash took away his in-ring ability, he was still banging out awesome promos, and the Gun and XXX Files angles, as much as you want to discredit them, when you try to make a point about people remembering the Yellow Dog, these aren't thought of in the same vain, and the fact you remember them goes lengths to showing how impactful they were at the time.

[Hanso Amore]

I just dont see it. While a bigger name in WCW, he was never a top guy. He was around for years, and a hard worker, had some nice moments, but that is it. He was on the Val Venis Level. Solid.

His horseman run did nada for the group, they were crap with him, after and they never really got running ever again. he created stirs with the Loose Cannon, but he was just bringing a bigger name to what ECW had already been doing. His WWF run may be remembered by you, but overall, it was nothing.

[Kane Knight]

LC, it really does seem like you're grasping at straws. MAH may or may not be after a reaction, but going after him for technicalities of diction won't really help much.

[hb2k]

Val Venis has never ever had a show stealing match, let alone several. Plus when factoring in his style and how different it was, and how he kept adapting his persona, he's leagues ahead of Val.

The Horsemen of Flair/Arn/Pillman/Benoit was far and above any incarnation in the at least six years prior, and as they were given promo time, they were the highlight of Nitro at the time. And nobody really said anything about ECW, that was the beauty of the entire Loose Cannon character, whether we was showing up on Nitro or ECW, it wasn't about them, it was about him. That was the point. As for his WWF run - he was primed for a really special run before the humvee wreck, and while I agree his time there was nowhere near what it could have been, it still had a number highlights that, as much as you want to say they aren't memorable, even a Pillman detractor like yourself doesn't need to ask for details on what "The Gun angle" was.

[Loose Cannon]

I just dont see it. While a bigger name in WCW, he was never a top guy. He was around for years, and a hard worker, had some nice moments, but that is it. He was on the Val Venis Level. Solid.

His horseman run did nada for the group, they were crap with him, after and they never really got running ever again. he created stirs with the Loose Cannon, but he was just bringing a bigger name to what ECW had already been doing. His WWF run may be remembered by you, but overall, it was nothing.

he's looking for a reaction. Val Venis? come on. he's being stupid. I could go into a long debate and give lots of arguments, but I would be wasting my time. it's a lost cause.

[Hanso Amore]

Im not looking for a reaction, I am telling it how I see it. Ever think maybe you guys think Pillman is better than he is, like most of you give Noid crap for doing for Venis, or the Bashams?

[hb2k]

Comparing Pillman's career with Val Venis or the Bashams is pretty absurd.

[Hanso Amore]

Comparing Pillman's career with Val Venis or the Bashams is pretty absurd.


Why?

[Hanso Amore]

Pillman is popular amongst Smarks. Casual Fans have no idea who he is.

Venis is Over with the Marks, and as you can see from the WWE Poll, the Smarks too. He was at one time a top 3 face in the WWE long ago, has been in major storylines, was a character that helped change the attitude era, and has crated controversy.

Sounds alot like Pillman. Val also held a major singles title....

[hb2k]

Really, have you asked them all? Go back and watch some of those Pillman matches and moments throughout his career and listen to the crowd. They're all reacting, they're all responding. Venis' career is mired in apathy from the casuals, and if you think he was ever a top 3 face, you're kidding yourself. Meanwhile Brian Pillman Vs. Ric Flair was the single highest rating TBS ever did for a wrestling show, and they broadcasted WCW for years and years and years. While Pillman has a record of high quality matches, promos and innovative personality changes, Val Venis, well, he doesnt. And I guarantee if they release a Val Venis DVD in ten years, it won't do nearly as well as Pillman's did.

[Kane Knight]

We're using crowd reactions as proof of popularity, now? Because Scotty 2 Hotty has gotten bigger pops than main eventers.

[hb2k]

As proof that the casuals cared - saying Pillman only appealed to a small minority is dumb when looking at the facts, and while that was only one point of a few to disspell that notion, hey, Too Cool were a hot act in 2000. The rest of their record doesn't back them up in terms of being remembered as anything special, but that's besides the point.

[Hanso Amore]

Well, usually a crowd reaction is a good indication of being over.

When people cheer, they tend to like what they see.

When Rob COnway comes out, nothing.

Venis is over.

And during his IC reign, I would say he was top 3. It was during a time when there were injuries if I remember correctly, and there werent many top faces. this was pre-redicalz/invasion, things were a little more diluted back then.

[Hanso Amore]

As proof that the casuals cared - saying Pillman only appealed to a small minority is dumb when looking at the facts, and while that was only one point of a few to disspell that notion, hey, Too Cool were a hot act in 2000. The rest of their record doesn't back them up in terms of being remembered as anything special, but that's besides the point.


I am trying very hard to understand what your trying to say, but is this english? You lost me.

[hb2k]

In an era with Rock, Austin, Foley, Taker, Kane, Triple H, X-Pac, Outlaws, Vince, Big Show and tons of other big names, I don't buy for a second that Val Venis was even in the top 5. He was a popular gimmick, but he never had fans behind him to that degree where he was red-hot or anything.

[Loose Cannon]

Im not looking for a reaction, I am telling it how I see it. Ever think maybe you guys think Pillman is better than he is, like most of you give Noid crap for doing for Venis, or the Bashams?

I don't really care how you see it. I listen more to the guys in the business that worked with Brian and saw his preformances each and every night. Those guys will tell you how special he was. How much he contributed to the industry at a time when the industry was in the shitter. I remember having a brief conversation about Pillman with Terry Funk once at a fan fest because they were close. I'll never forget what he said. Being Terry, he asked me if I'd ever read the bible before.

"Yes sir."

"Well you know all those stories about people who did great things"

"Yea"

"Well none of them ever saw Brian Pillman"

I just nodded and smiled.

[Hanso Amore]

I don't really care how you see it. I listen more to the guys in the business that worked with Brian and saw his preformances each and every night. Those guys will tell you how special he was. How much he contributed to the industry at a time when the industry was in the shitter. I remember having a brief conversation about Pillman with Terry Funk once at a fan fest because they were close. I'll never forget what he said. Being Terry, he asked me if I'd ever read the bible before.

"Yes sir."

"Well you know all those stories about people who did great things"

"Yea"

"Well none of them ever saw Brian Pillman"

I just nodded and smiled.

.......Touching?

[Lord-Of-Darkness]

All due respect LC, I'm not gonna take sides because I agree with different points on both sides here. But Funk would say something about Pillman, he knew him. If someone I knew died years ago, and someone asked me what he was like, I'd say "Yeah he was a really great guy" and say good things about them.

I'm not saying he was lying or anything, just when you look back at people you knew and reminisce, you're going to think of the better things.

[Loose Cannon]

.......Touching?

no, the truth

[Loose Cannon]

All due respect LC, I'm not gonna take sides because I agree with different points on both sides here. But Funk would say something about Pillman, he knew him. If someone I knew died years ago, and someone asked me what he was like, I'd say "Yeah he was a really great guy" and say good things about them.

I'm not saying he was lying or anything, just when you look back at people you knew and reminisce, you're going to think of the better things.

it's Terry Funk. Terry Funk is not guy that's afraid to say shit about people, even when thier dead. are you seriously trying to tell me that Funk's opinion does not matter because he knew Brian Pillman. christ

[Lord-Of-Darkness]

it's Terry Funk. Terry Funk is not guy that's afraid to say shit about people, even when thier dead. are you seriously trying to tell me that Funk's opinion does not matter because he knew Brian Pillman. christ

No I'm not trying to say his opinion doesn't matter exactly. Just saying if he was close to him or whatever then he'd probably say something good. I even said that doesn't mean he's lying or whatever.

[Hanso Amore]

Yes Funk says shit about people. He isnt affraid to. But you aid they were close, so of course he says something nice about him. If your friend died you would remember him as a great person. Now if Funk hated Pillman and said that, it would carry tons of weight.

[Lord-Of-Darkness]

Yes Funk says shit about people. He isnt affraid to. But you aid they were close, so of course he says something nice about him. If your friend died you would remember him as a great person. Now if Funk hated Pillman and said that, it would carry tons of weight.

Thats exactly what I'm trying to say :y:

[Loose Cannon]

is this a joke? seriously, did Xero PM people to fuck with me when he made this thread? I feel like Ashton Kutcher is going to flash on my screen soon.

[Kane Knight]

As proof that the casuals cared - saying Pillman only appealed to a small minority is dumb when looking at the facts, and while that was only one point of a few to disspell that notion, hey, Too Cool were a hot act in 2000. The rest of their record doesn't back them up in terms of being remembered as anything special, but that's besides the point.

Which part of this do you think helps your argument at all?

Venis, Long as a REFEREE, Scotty and company...

...The fact that so many people, including Venus, got strong reactions, and were considered "hot," though they are no longer viewed that way? The fact that you more or less relegated Pillman to Venus status depsite your argument? Or what?

[hb2k]

I wrote everything already to make the point about Pillman being over with the masses, 4.5 rating on TBS, etc...so go and read all that. You took one part of it and said that crowd reactions aren't a way to determine whether they're over or not, when that really has nothing to do with anything. The point I'm addressing was the dumb idea that Pillman never appealed beyond the smart fans, which anybody with an ounce of common sense, or ears, can disspell, because it was more than a minority. His standing with all-time greats or whatever isn't the issue.

[Hanso Amore]

Im sure everyone tuned in just for Pillman....which is why he never main evented a show after that. he happened to be in a match with the biggest draw on their big show at the time and alot of people watched. That is like saying that People used to watch the big rated Nitros for Ricky rachman.

[hb2k]

Yeh, turns out you were right LC.

[blake639raw]

Pillman hadn't solidified his status as a top guy yet, but he was getting there. He would have been a big name in the attitude era. The Loose Cannon character was just as groundbreaking and over the top as Stone Cold's character, the only problem being that he wouldn't heal his injuries before coming back, so he never reached his full potential. Its a shame really.

[Kane Knight]

I wrote everything already to make the point about Pillman being over with the masses, 4.5 rating on TBS, etc...so go and read all that. You took one part of it and said that crowd reactions aren't a way to determine whether they're over or not, when that really has nothing to do with anything. The point I'm addressing was the dumb idea that Pillman never appealed beyond the smart fans, which anybody with an ounce of common sense, or ears, can disspell, because it was more than a minority. His standing with all-time greats or whatever isn't the issue.

Errrr...No.

a 4.5 rating on TBS. So what. Cheers? So what? You cannot make an argument that he was unlike Val Venis and then use a good reaction to indicate how over he was, because it goes right back to the Venis bit.

You've got a very nice thread of convenient logic going here. The point you're addressing doubles back on itself, because it's a shite argument.

I think you know that, maybe you don't.

[Zen v.W.o.]

Pillman hadn't solidified his status as a top guy yet, but he was getting there. He would have been a big name in the attitude era. The Loose Cannon character was just as groundbreaking and over the top as Stone Cold's character, the only problem being that he wouldn't heal his injuries before coming back, so he never reached his full potential. Its a shame really.


That's the thing. His potential, which was huge, got snuffed out. People here for some reason like to degrade dead people and claim death somehow taints our thoughts on the man, but his talent was there. It was that of an elite superstar, there can be no denying that. He didnt have a weakness, except his health.
We shouldnt be arguing about what Pillman was, because he was what he was..a great talent with untapped potential that could have attained that elite status, and quite easily.

Being booked for a time like shit...derrr Yellow Dog, like the ignoramus pointed out, isnt a fault to Pillman. It takes nothing away from what was being buried...which was more talent than most other wrestlers could ever hope to claim.

[Hanso Amore]

That's the thing. His potential, which was huge, got snuffed out. People here for some reason like to degrade dead people and claim death somehow taints our thoughts on the man, but his talent was there. It was that of an elite superstar, there can be no denying that. He didnt have a weakness, except his health.
We shouldnt be arguing about what Pillman was, because he was what he was..a great talent with untapped potential that could have attained that elite status, and quite easily.

Being booked for a time like shit...derrr Yellow Dog, like the ignoramus pointed out, isnt a fault to Pillman. It takes nothing away from what was being buried...which was more talent than most other wrestlers could ever hope to claim.

You just supported your argument....with mine.

I have been saying that Pillman is not a legend, just a guy with talent that never got big, and in the end, his potential got "snuffed Out" and he is Yellow Dog that never lived up to his potential.

[Loose Cannon]

why do you keep saying Yellow Dog? what the fuck?

[Hanso Amore]

...........






.............







.............


Yellow Dog

[Loose Cannon]

dick

[Hanso Amore]

Seriously though, when talkign about someone's bads, you have to use their worst.