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Old 01-27-2009, 01:29 PM   #1
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What counts in wrestling, i.e. what is Canon?
So I was discussing with Kane Knight about how there seems to be a few ways to look at what counts story line wise and what doesn't. This comes from Noid saying Swagger cut a promo a while ago against Tommy Dreamer on ECW which explains Swaggers character and stuff like that.

Now to me, it seems like Noid (and a lot of others like him) count every little thing that happens on WWE tv, WWE.com, and possibly some radio spots as actually happening. Which reminds me of the way Russo would book, if you didn't watch everything, read everything, and just stay completely in the loop, you would miss key parts of storylines.

While I understand where this mindset is coming from, I disagree that simply because something happened, doesn't mean it is important. In my eyes, the only things that count are things that happen or are mentioned on Raw, Smackdown, PPV, or Impact! in TNA's case. What happens on ECW, House Shows, or the Website doesn't count unless it is mentioned later on Raw, Smackdown, Impact! or a PPV.

Now some of you will easily agree house shows and the website easily doesn't count, but why ECW? Well because ECW is an after thought of a show that is a glorified house show. This isn't a knock against ECW, it just doesn't count unless WWE says it counts on a mainshow. I mean seriously, when is the last time ECW was recapped on Smackdown or Raw if it didn't have to to with a Smackdown or Raw title or superstar?

Anyhow, discuss.
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Old 01-27-2009, 02:28 PM   #2
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Nothing is Canon, because in a few years they will just do something to change what happened.
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Old 01-27-2009, 02:42 PM   #3
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I forgot to mention that after 6 months to a year, if they don't bring it up, it doesn't count anymore. I think the only thing that still counts is like Piper cracking Snuka in the head with a coconut and Untertaker's streak at Mania. Everything else is uncertain until they decide to bring it up again.
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Old 01-27-2009, 02:50 PM   #4
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Correct.

Also, you forgot Hogan slamming Andre.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:16 PM   #5
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No, that is only Hogan Canon. WWE hasn't mentioned this for a few years, therefore we can't be sure this happened.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:19 PM   #6
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Quote:
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I mean seriously, when is the last time ECW was recapped on Smackdown or Raw if it didn't have to to with a Smackdown or Raw title or superstar?
Last week.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:21 PM   #7
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Shut up Juan.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:21 PM   #8
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Was the recap involving Matt Hardy? If it was, i wouldn't count that as they were about to do a massive SWWWEEERRRVVVVEEE the week after.

I bet Matts not on ECW until after WM now.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:37 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hasney View Post
Was the recap involving Matt Hardy? If it was, i wouldn't count that as they were about to do a massive SWWWEEERRRVVVVEEE the week after.

I bet Matts not on ECW until after WM now.
Verily. Also Miz, Morrison, and Matt Hardy are canon, but if the rest of ECW doesn't count unless mentioned on Raw or Smackdown.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:40 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool View Post
Verily. Also Miz, Morrison, and Matt Hardy are canon, but if the rest of ECW doesn't count unless mentioned on Raw or Smackdown.
I really don't understand this kind of mentality. Yeah, ECW is the least watched show, but that's WWE's fault. Also, you're argument troubles me because almost nothing that happens on Smackdown ever gets mentioned on Raw.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:23 PM   #11
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Off the top of my head, I can remember Shane confirming that Kane once tombstoned Linda and hooked a car battery up to his testicles, and that was probably about 5 years ago now. That was still when Adamle was GM, but they still talk about him being GM so I guess that still happened.

Eric Bischoff was never GM of Raw, though...they haven't mentioned that recently.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:32 PM   #12
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Shane McMahon is the biggest threat to any wrestler ever.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:41 PM   #13
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ECW gets mentioned on Smackdown, Raw gets mentioned on ECW and Smackdown, but neither ECW or Smackdown get mentioned on RAW.
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Old 01-27-2009, 04:11 PM   #14
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Quote:
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ECW gets mentioned on Smackdown, Raw gets mentioned on ECW and Smackdown, but neither ECW or Smackdown get mentioned on RAW.
Yeah, Raw and Smackdown are canon.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:43 PM   #15
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No one seems to remember that Shane used to be Vince's arch enemy, and now he is so angered by an attack on Vince that he is in tears before beating their top guy down.
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Old 01-27-2009, 04:13 PM   #16
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This is absurd.
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Old 01-27-2009, 04:14 PM   #17
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At least I'm trying.
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Old 01-27-2009, 10:06 PM   #18
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Quote:
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I really don't understand this kind of mentality. Yeah, ECW is the least watched show, but that's WWE's fault. Also, you're argument troubles me because almost nothing that happens on Smackdown ever gets mentioned on Raw.
Just an aside, how is it WWE's fault? People on here keep saying it's the best written, best booked, etc., of WWE's programs, so where's the problem, aside from it being on a network even Trekkies on marginally care about?

Anyway, it's not about being the least watched show. ECW is essentially Velocity/Heat and is treated with roughly the same level of "continuity" within the WWE "universe." I wouldn't be surprised to find they'd retuned wrestlers like they did with Velocity/Heat, either (Misterrrrrrrrr...ANDERSON!).

WWE ignores a lot that happens even on their flagship show, but that's at least kept as an integral part of the loops. It's no stretch to say "ECW; doesn't count."
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Old 01-27-2009, 10:21 PM   #19
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It is definitely a stretch to say ECW doesn't count. For the record, they recapped ECW on SmackDOWN! when Swagger won the title just a few weeks ago. Anything televised counts. Seems pretty simple, really.
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Old 01-28-2009, 07:50 AM   #20
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It is definitely a stretch to say ECW doesn't count. For the record, they recapped ECW on SmackDOWN! when Swagger won the title just a few weeks ago. Anything televised counts. Seems pretty simple, really.
We both know that's not true.
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Old 01-28-2009, 11:40 AM   #21
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ECW counts, god damn it.
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Old 01-28-2009, 11:46 AM   #22
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This thread is retarded. That is all.
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Old 01-28-2009, 11:54 AM   #23
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Also, how is calling ECW a 'glorified house show' not a knock on ECW? Just because you don't like ECW is no reason to say it doesn't count. It has its own roster, general manager, and champion. It counts, and you'd be absolutely silly to assume anything otherwise.

If ECW was NEVER mentioned outside of its own show, it's superstars weren't advertised as ECW superstars, and their title was never defended on PPV (it was even defended on RAW before when Kenny Dykstra challenged Bobby Lashley), then you MAY have a point. But none of those things happen.

House shows don't count unless mentioned. That's true. Same for the internet...but to put ECW in that category is...well, stupid, really.
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Old 01-28-2009, 11:57 AM   #24
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Okay, ECW counts, but it's still pretty much a glorified VelociHeat. And it sucks, because that ECW Title is taking up card-room that should be given to the IC and US belts.
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Old 01-28-2009, 12:03 PM   #25
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Were you saying that when the ECW title matches were CM Punk versus Elijah Burke or John Morrison? Even Hardy versus Swagger is a good match to me. Just because that title is on the card doesn't mean it's going to be a shitty match, and it also doesn't mean that something better would have replaced it. Maybe a Khali Kiss Cam or something.
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Old 01-28-2009, 12:16 PM   #26
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Were you saying that when the ECW title matches were CM Punk versus Elijah Burke or John Morrison? Even Hardy versus Swagger is a good match to me. Just because that title is on the card doesn't mean it's going to be a shitty match, and it also doesn't mean that something better would have replaced it. Maybe a Khali Kiss Cam or something.

And just because you go out of you way to fellate* everything doesn't lend validity to either the quality or status of the show or matches. It's not about quality, but treatment. Come now.

*You're the one who preaches it, brotha, not me.
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Old 01-28-2009, 12:26 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Kane Knight View Post
And just because you go out of you way to fellate* everything doesn't lend validity to either the quality or status of the show or matches. It's not about quality, but treatment. Come now.

*You're the one who preaches it, brotha, not me.
I'm not going out of my way at all here. ECW counts. Is that really such a ridiculous thing to say? You're not even quoting the post where I gave my reasons as to why. I agree, it's not about quality. But they DO acknowledge that it exists and that its results ACTUALLY HAPPENED.
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Old 01-28-2009, 12:59 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Anybody Thrilla View Post
I'm not going out of my way at all here. ECW counts. Is that really such a ridiculous thing to say? You're not even quoting the post where I gave my reasons as to why. I agree, it's not about quality. But they DO acknowledge that it exists and that its results ACTUALLY HAPPENED.
In the same sense they've acknowledged what happened on the web, house shows, and Heat/Velocity. You know, it counts when it's convenient.
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Old 01-28-2009, 12:14 PM   #29
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Which part of I like ECW but it is a developement territory don't you understand?
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Old 01-28-2009, 12:17 PM   #30
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Which part of I like ECW but it is a developement territory don't you understand?
The part that mandates an understanding of a line of thought that is not binary.
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Old 01-28-2009, 12:27 PM   #31
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Which part of I like ECW but it is a developement territory don't you understand?
I don't recall you saying you like ECW, nor does that matter. It still counts.
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Old 01-28-2009, 12:52 PM   #32
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I've said I like it many times. I just don't watch it because I have other things to do that watch wrestling all the time.
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Old 01-28-2009, 12:53 PM   #33
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Old 01-28-2009, 01:05 PM   #34
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Not really. It's part of PPVs and interpromotional storylines. This is really a pointless argument.
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Old 01-28-2009, 04:58 PM   #35
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Not really. It's part of PPVs and interpromotional storylines. This is really a pointless argument.
Thank you.
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Old 01-29-2009, 04:23 PM   #36
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Not really. It's part of PPVs and interpromotional storylines. This is really a pointless argument.
Yeah, but pretty much any argument on an internet wrestling board is pointless. The more people who accept that, the better. None of us are going to affect policy by debating the merit of a wrestler or storyline. People bitching about Cena? Pointless.

Now that we've gotten the commentary out of the way, it's not really any more pointless than the usual range of discussion and commentary that goes on here. It's simply an example of wrestling as a form of fiction.

ECW is part of interpromotional storylines primarily because of the other promotion. ECW's inclusion in PPVs kind of has its origins in a band-aid solution.
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Old 01-28-2009, 07:04 PM   #37
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I STILL REMEMBER!
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Old 01-28-2009, 10:15 PM   #38
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I STILL REMEMBER!
No you don't
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Old 01-28-2009, 10:22 PM   #39
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No you don't
Because it's not canon.
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Old 01-28-2009, 10:23 PM   #40
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Exactly, thank you.
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