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Old 07-24-2008, 07:12 PM   #81
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Let the face off begin
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Old 07-24-2008, 07:18 PM   #82
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Its not about masks, its about the gimmicks and the in-ring "aura". Ultimo Dragon attempted to recapture Rey Mysterio's aura and failed miserabely! There are plenty of guys that have been with masks such as Hurricane and it is okay because it was obvious not an attempt to recapture the aura of Rey Mysterio.
And the part where Ultimo came first? You WWE marks act lie if you haven't seen it on RAW it never happend.

Quote:
Deep down you realize that what I am saying is true and you point out one fact that proves it and act like its a joke, its not. You know what the truth is and the truth is on my side in this debate. The videos you have posted are of Ultimo Dragon in Japan and he wrestled a different kind there because in the WWE, the WWE told him to wrestle a certain way and thats what he did, he was more similar to Rey in the WWE, but he is similar even in Japan. I cant believe you are not seeing it, come on!
Excpet for that one where they were in WCW...and even there his style was completely different. And there's still the part that he crafted his style before Rey...

Seriously you going on about Rey being some innovator in the ring is very laughable and only shows how little your exposure to Lucha is. Rey's in ring stlye is a dime a dozen. The only thing Rey has innovated is how to disguise using the same match structure a 1,000 times and having no one catch on. What sets Rey apart is his charisma and nothing else.
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Old 07-24-2008, 07:21 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian View Post
Because he's not close to what Rey Mysterio is. Rey is an innovator in the ring and a charismatic wrestling machine that pulls in thousands if not millions of fans!
Millions of 8 year olds and mexican's maybe

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian View Post
Some of you make fun of him but the truth is the truth and when you go to a WWE show, besides John Cena and Batista, chances are, the guy getting the third or second best reaction on the show is going to be Rey Mysterio!
Even Punk's been getting bigger pops then Rey lately.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian View Post
To those of you who are making fun of his injuries and damages he has are obviously not real wrestling fans. You know WHY he has all these injuries? Do you know why he is hurt so much? Because when Rey Mysterio goes out there to put on a show, he puts it ALL OUT. He leaves no limitations, he doesnt hold back and he does sick moves that other wrestlers may be too scared to try to do.

He sacrifices all of this not for himself but for the FANS! Rey was injured so much in the past few years because he has been sacrificing himself for your entertainment. Unlike a lot of wrestlers, Rey goes out there and puts on the best show he can and he destroys his body in the process for you. Real fans appreciate this and know this because this is what it is.
Shawn Michaels, a 42 year old man whom is just as hard of a worker as rey if not more, has suffered less injures in the past few years then mysterio.

In short, that whole post was rubbish.
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Old 07-24-2008, 07:23 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian View Post
It is easy to understand the psychology of some of you. You realize that you cant hang with the fact that are on my side so you instead be little me and make fun of me to make my points sound less valid, well guess what, that doesnt mean your points are any more valid then mine because they arent get real and adress the points I am making.

"Fact" was a perfect typo. The only fact you have on your side is WWE's interest in Ultimo being based on their desire for another Rey Mysterio.

The problem there is that it doesn't back up your notion that they are similar. Quite to the contrary, he was then let go primarily because he wasn't similar. Vince doesn't pay attention to shit like that, and he probably doesn't know the differing styles out there very well. You know, since his only real understanding of wrestling seems to come down to "Hoss" or "Midget."

Interesting hearing talk about psychology from someone who is showing none, who is almost certainly a sock, and who tries to insist the mountain of flaws in his "logic" amount to some sort of iron clad case.
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Old 07-24-2008, 07:24 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MCEazy View Post
Even Punk's been getting bigger pops then Rey lately.
Especially sad when Punk's getting outpopped by Divas.
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Old 07-25-2008, 03:45 AM   #86
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Sebastian, you are so close to getting banned right now... you don't even know kid.

NO ONE disses Ultimo Dragon here.
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Old 07-25-2008, 06:15 AM   #87
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Damn, man let the beast out
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Old 07-25-2008, 06:37 AM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funky Fly View Post
Sebastian, you are so close to getting banned right now... you don't even know kid.

NO ONE disses Ultimo Dragon here.
Let me ask you a question:

As an Ultimo Mark, I can assume you've seen a lot of his work. Yes? K. How similar are their styles?

Cause thats really the only thing that gets me about this whole thing. It's like he doesn't understand what a style is. AJ Styles and Jeff Hardy do not have simialr style. Just because they both fly doesn't mean they work the same stlye, and I think that's where he coming from. Which is ludicris, but please: in your opinion do they have similar styles and why/or why not.
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Old 07-25-2008, 10:39 AM   #89
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I love how everyone is disagreeing with him but somehow we are all still wrong.
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Old 07-25-2008, 02:20 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool View Post
I love how everyone is disagreeing with him but somehow we are all still wrong.
He has the fact on his side.

No, but seriously, here's one way I can tell them apart.

Ultimo is awesome. Rey is flashy.
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Old 07-25-2008, 02:32 PM   #91
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Mistico > Rey at his peak > Rey now

They should drop him, get on their hands and knees for Mistico, and by the end of the week all the kiddies will buy Mistico's mask, and no one will remember Rey as anything more than a decent lucha who by virtue of his small stature even by lucha size and charisma happened to get a push by WWE.
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Old 07-25-2008, 03:31 PM   #92
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Ultimo Dragon does kind of look like Rey Mysterio.

I mean they're both cruiserweights of non-white or black nationality, both wear colorful masks and tights, and both CAN fly.

I can see the WWE wanting to bring him into the company in light of Rey Mysterio's success, sure.... but I can also see them wanting to bring him in based on his illustrious career and reputation as a great wrestler.

And the latter seems more realistic.
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Old 07-25-2008, 03:32 PM   #93
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Also, Rey Mysterio should go to TNA. I wouldn't mind seeing him mix it up with some of the young guys over there, and maybe he can teach them a thing or two.
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Old 07-25-2008, 09:27 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor View Post
Let me ask you a question:

As an Ultimo Mark, I can assume you've seen a lot of his work. Yes? K. How similar are their styles?

Cause thats really the only thing that gets me about this whole thing. It's like he doesn't understand what a style is. AJ Styles and Jeff Hardy do not have simialr style. Just because they both fly doesn't mean they work the same stlye, and I think that's where he coming from. Which is ludicris, but please: in your opinion do they have similar styles and why/or why not.
Ultimo Dragon is a former luchadore. His botched surgery pretty much grounded him for the most part. He can still fly and do 20 flips per match like any other guy in a mask, but he has enough substance (by that I mean psychology, mat skills, martial arts and a pretty fucking big moveset) to go for an hour without taking to the air once. If you watch most of his matches, it's mostly ground-based work with minimal flying outside of moves he innovated or popularized.

Rey has a pretty standard luchadore moveset, plus a few leg kicks here and there. His appeal is that he is a colourful little guy that kids can relate to because he beats up bigger guys.

Someone tell me I'm wrong.
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Old 07-25-2008, 10:13 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funky Fly View Post
Ultimo Dragon is a former luchadore. His botched surgery pretty much grounded him for the most part. He can still fly and do 20 flips per match like any other guy in a mask, but he has enough substance (by that I mean psychology, mat skills, martial arts and a pretty fucking big moveset) to go for an hour without taking to the air once. If you watch most of his matches, it's mostly ground-based work with minimal flying outside of moves he innovated or popularized.

Rey has a pretty standard luchadore moveset, plus a few leg kicks here and there. His appeal is that he is a colourful little guy that kids can relate to because he beats up bigger guys.

Someone tell me I'm wrong.
You're wrong.

Nah, not really. And that's the thing. Dragon works awesome matches and wrestles in a style where he doesn't need to throw in 9000000 top rope moves to keep a match interesting. I doubt I'm even close to the biggest Dragon fan on the board, but I do very much enjoy him.

Then again, the criticism of him comes from a guy who won't vote for "a nigger," so it could very well be the fact that they're both non-white foreigners in masks that made him draw the conclusion.
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Old 07-26-2008, 09:57 PM   #96
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How much do these wrestlers make in merchandise sales and whatnot?

If those numbers already posted are relative ballpark estimates as to how much the top guys make, a six figure/low seven figure salary really isn't that much compared to athletes in other sports, or even to other entertainers. Even some of the mid card guys in the WWE are more well known than most of the top players in the NFL. Surely many of these wrestlers make more money off of action figure sales?
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Old 07-26-2008, 10:24 PM   #97
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Mysterio generally makes 1.7 million a year on merch.
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Old 07-27-2008, 12:31 AM   #98
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edit: nevermind

I don't care for Ray
Last edited by NYDon; 07-27-2008 at 12:35 AM.
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