wtf? -About Christian

[Watson]

Originally Posted by Loose Cannon You really obviously don't know the wrestling market. Read Melzer's Observer. He mentions the Internet fans and the Casual Fans all the time. And always mentions that Internet fans are such a small minority of the wrestling population, that Vince doesn't bother with what we think. I bet anything most of the fans you see at Raw have no clue Raven is the World Champion in TNA. Even people on here didn't even know.

I don't know the wrestling market? LOL. Saying that I don't know the wrestling market is like saying you don't know who Randy Orton is. I've studied the business as long as I've been able to walk. I was a "smart mark" back when there was no Internet and the only source for wrestling news was Pro Wrestling Illustrated magazine (as well as others). I'm not just an "Internet fan" who bitches about the things that we should be seeing on RAW and Smackdown. I'm more than just a fan as I've worked matches and booked shows. I eat, sleep, and breath professional wrestling because I have long term plans in the wrestling business. I'm not just some smartass wrestling fan that thinks they know what's best for the business.

I realize Vince doesn't care what the Internet fans want or even the casual fans for that matter. But the fact is today's casual wrestling fan would respond more to Raven than the casual fans of the last 90s-early 2000s. Whether or not the casual WWE fans are aware of Raven's recent NWA World title win is irrelevant. The fact is if he were in WWE today he would be more over than he was the last time he was in WWE and he would be more over than some of WWE's current workers. Today's wrestling fans, casual or Internet, would appreciate Raven alot more than they did 5 or 6 years ago.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Originally Posted by The Prodigy I don't know the wrestling market? LOL. Saying that I don't know the wrestling market is like saying you don't know who Randy Orton is. I've studied the business as long as I've been able to walk. I was a "smart mark" back when there was no Internet and the only source for wrestling news was Pro Wrestling Illustrated magazine (as well as others). I'm not just an "Internet fan" who bitches about the things that we should be seeing on RAW and Smackdown. I'm more than just a fan as I've worked matches and booked shows. I eat, sleep, and breath professional wrestling because I have long term plans in the wrestling business. I'm not just some smartass wrestling fan that thinks they know what's best for the business. I realize Vince doesn't care what the Internet fans want or even the casual fans for that matter. But the fact is today's casual wrestling fan would respond more to Raven than the casual fans of the last 90s-early 2000s. Whether or not the casual WWE fans are aware of Raven's recent NWA World title win is irrelevant. The fact is if he were in WWE today he would be more over than he was the last time he was in WWE and he would be more over than some of WWE's current workers. Today's wrestling fans, casual or Internet, would appreciate Raven alot more than they did 5 or 6 years ago.

I wouldn't test LC's knowledge of marketting. I'm pretty sure the guy's studied it (legitamately).

Anyway, when you get to the WWE (and I hope you do, because I wish you the best), it will be ironic if you're out there busting your ass day in and day out only to find some people on the internet talking about how you're "only average".

Watch any of the high profile matches Christian has been in and tell me he isn't making it an entertaining match. Watch the TLC 1, TLC 2, TLC 3, TLC 4, his Ladder Match with Rob Van Dam, his Ladder Match with Chris Jericho or his Triple Threat at Vengeance, and tell me that guy doesn't go above and beyond for us.

You mentioned Raven was never over in the WWE because he wasn't push right? Christian has never been pushed right and he is MASSIVELY over. The guy was more over than The Undertaker, Booker T or Chris Benoit on SmackDown! (I wish they didn't edit SmackDown!'s crowd reactions), and that is saying something.

I don't think the guy should be World Champion immediately, but by the end of the year, sure. He's got perfect mic skills (that's not an exaggeration). Everything he says comes out sounding perfectly, and his promo a few weeks ago with Jericho was top stuff. The only reason he would have been saying "Problem Solver" a lot (which I don't remembr happening) is probably because he was trying to help Tomko get over, which is something that probably sounds strange since we don't usually hear Triple H spout off names.

Christian's ring skills may no be perfect, but he's one of eht more solid performers on either brand, and he knows how to string together a match. I'm looking forward to him beating Booker T at The Great American Bash, and eventually moving on to Dave Batista.

[Loose Cannon]

Originally Posted by The Prodigy I don't know the wrestling market? LOL. Saying that I don't know the wrestling market is like saying you don't know who Randy Orton is. I've studied the business as long as I've been able to walk. I was a "smart mark" back when there was no Internet and the only source for wrestling news was Pro Wrestling Illustrated magazine (as well as others). I'm not just an "Internet fan" who bitches about the things that we should be seeing on RAW and Smackdown. I'm more than just a fan as I've worked matches and booked shows. I eat, sleep, and breath professional wrestling because I have long term plans in the wrestling business. I'm not just some smartass wrestling fan that thinks they know what's best for the business. I realize Vince doesn't care what the Internet fans want or even the casual fans for that matter. But the fact is today's casual wrestling fan would respond more to Raven than the casual fans of the last 90s-early 2000s. Whether or not the casual WWE fans are aware of Raven's recent NWA World title win is irrelevant. The fact is if he were in WWE today he would be more over than he was the last time he was in WWE and he would be more over than some of WWE's current workers. Today's wrestling fans, casual or Internet, would appreciate Raven alot more than they did 5 or 6 years ago.

I know your not a smart ass fan who bitches. I've seen you post. But if you've studies wrestling, you would know that the Internet fans are just a little piece of the pie of wrestling fans. A real little piece. That's why all those ridiculous shoots WCW tried to pull never worked. Because 95% of those fans didn't have a clue what was going on.

Alienoid said it perfectly. Why would anyone care about Raven when all he did was job and appear on Heat in the WWE? Even in TNA, they didn't have enough faith in Raven to make him a long-term champ right when he came in. Now they give him the belt when they aren't even on TV anymore.

Like I said, I like Raven. I loved him in WCW. He has a unique character and solid mic skills. But the character can only be taken so far in big companies like WCW and WWE.

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by Loose Cannon I know your not a smart ass fan who bitches. I've seen you post. But if you've studies wrestling, you would know that the Internet fans are just a little piece of the pie of wrestling fans. A real little piece. That's why all those ridiculous shoots WCW tried to pull never worked. Because 95% of those fans didn't have a clue what was going on.

And, of course, the net fanbase is the same now as it was during the WCW days.

It's not as though the internet is more prevalent, access is easier, more affordable, and possible in multiple locations.

It's not as though the numbers have changed for viewership either. As those are fixed, the percentage who are net fans is also fixed.

It's not as though most of the people who make this argument are using outdated " proof" and "facts" that are 5+ years old and hold no relavence to the current state of the market...

[Loose Cannon]

Originally Posted by Kane Knight And, of course, the net fanbase is the same now as it was during the WCW days. It's not as though the internet is more prevalent, access is easier, more affordable, and possible in multiple locations. It's not as though the numbers have changed for viewership either. As those are fixed, the percentage who are net fans is also fixed. It's not as though most of the people who make this argument are using outdated " proof" and "facts" that are 5+ years old and hold no relavence to the current state of the market...

so do you agree with Prodigy that Raven will be mega-over in the WWE today because most fans are Internet fans?

I brought up the Matt Hardy/Edge/Lita storyline to make it "current" More then half of WWE's fanbase don't have a clue Edge cheated with Lita.

And yea more people use the Internet now, but that doesn't make them smart-makrs. Proof is right on this site in that thread linking to another site with a bunch of marks. Just read thier comments. Sure, they might read WWE.com all the time, but WWE.com is not a smark site.

yea, the net fanbase is bigger then 4 years ago, maybe, but it's still a small portion.

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by Loose Cannon so do you agree with Prodigy that Raven will be mega-over in the WWE today because most fans are Internet fans?

Nope.

I disagree with the use of SIGNIFICANTLY out-of-date facts which have not been updated or researched in a time period where internet access has gone way up and wrestling viewing has gone down.

I think Raven gets Hogan/Taker pops. I think that while those people are still synonymous with wrestling to the core fanbase, Raven is not.

I also think you are wrong to make dated statements in an attempt to prove him wrong.

I think a lot of things. One of which is that Raven has about as much business being in the ring right now as Hogan/Nash, and is only accepted by people ' round here because they're Raven fanboys, so it's okay for THIS has-been to dominate, and SURELY he would have the same name recognition.

[AJHayes]

Originally Posted by The Prodigy I don't know the wrestling market? LOL. Saying that I don't know the wrestling market is like saying you don't know who Randy Orton is. I've studied the business as long as I've been able to walk. I was a "smart mark" back when there was no Internet and the only source for wrestling news was Pro Wrestling Illustrated magazine (as well as others). I'm not just an "Internet fan" who bitches about the things that we should be seeing on RAW and Smackdown. I'm more than just a fan as I've worked matches and booked shows. I eat, sleep, and breath professional wrestling because I have long term plans in the wrestling business. I'm not just some smartass wrestling fan that thinks they know what's best for the business. I realize Vince doesn't care what the Internet fans want or even the casual fans for that matter. But the fact is today's casual wrestling fan would respond more to Raven than the casual fans of the last 90s-early 2000s. Whether or not the casual WWE fans are aware of Raven's recent NWA World title win is irrelevant. The fact is if he were in WWE today he would be more over than he was the last time he was in WWE and he would be more over than some of WWE's current workers. Today's wrestling fans, casual or Internet, would appreciate Raven alot more than they did 5 or 6 years ago.

No need to cut a promo, kid. You're not going to change anyones mind. You get an A for effort though.

If you are, in fact, a promoter, and have worked shows, I have questions. "Who trained you? Where do you Promote? And how does a steady diet of pro wrestling treat your intestines? WHERES THE FIBER MAN!!??"