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Old 05-05-2007, 07:35 PM   #1
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The OFFICIAL "Evey Indie Wrestler is Overrated" Thread
YEAH!

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Old 05-05-2007, 07:39 PM   #2
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Maybe.
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Old 05-05-2007, 07:40 PM   #3
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I agree. Pretty much everyone who is ever mentioned is hyped beyond their capacities.
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Old 05-05-2007, 07:40 PM   #4
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Except Tyson Dux.

Although he is only mentioned by me.
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Old 05-05-2007, 07:41 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
I agree. Pretty much everyone who is ever mentioned is hyped beyond their capacities.
Exactly.
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Old 05-05-2007, 07:44 PM   #6
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Especially Bryan Danielson.
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Old 05-05-2007, 07:44 PM   #7
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If they've never worked for WWE or TNA, they are automatically better than the WWE upper-midcard by most sMARK's standards.
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Old 05-05-2007, 07:51 PM   #8
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A majority of today's indy guys are overrated.

Older guys like Reckless Youth, Mike Quackenbush, Don Montoya, etc. - though still around, are actually quite underrated / overlooked by most.
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Old 05-05-2007, 07:53 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Instant Classic
Especially Dennis Stamp
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Old 05-05-2007, 08:15 PM   #10
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Especially Bryan Danielson.
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Old 05-05-2007, 08:46 PM   #11
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I finally watched Somoa Joe vs Kenta Kobashi (ROH) and I hated it. The fans shit themsleves for every fucking thing Joe did. Jesus Christ. The match wasn't bad, but it wasn't good. They were chanting this is awesome 3 minutes into the fight. Bah!
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Old 05-05-2007, 09:43 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorkchop
I finally watched Somoa Joe vs Kenta Kobashi (ROH) and I hated it. The fans shit themsleves for every fucking thing Joe did. Jesus Christ. The match wasn't bad, but it wasn't good. They were chanting this is awesome 3 minutes into the fight. Bah!
I like Kobashi and Homicide Vs Samoa Joe and Low-Ki myself, I prefered it to Joe Vs Kobashi.
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Old 05-05-2007, 11:34 PM   #13
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Thanks for agreeing with something I've been saying for years. Fuck the indies.
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Old 05-05-2007, 11:36 PM   #14
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Yes, Fuck them indeed.
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Old 05-06-2007, 12:20 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KayfabeMan
A majority of today's indy guys are overrated.

Older guys like Reckless Youth, Mike Quackenbush, Don Montoya, etc. - though still around, are actually quite underrated / overlooked by most.
I'm glad Quack is finally starting to get recognition. I think he also has one of the best schools in the Northeast.
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Old 05-06-2007, 12:47 AM   #16
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Overhyping indie guys>>>>>>>>>>>>>>bitching about overhyped indie guys.
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Old 05-06-2007, 12:54 AM   #17
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I agree with Blitz
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Old 05-06-2007, 01:14 AM   #18
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Blitz is right. Independent workers are like independent filmmakers. Sure, you have a few guys who aren't making movies in Hollywood because you are shit, but the WWE and TNA put so many cliches, restrictions, "consumer friendly" bullshit into their product that it makes me want to throw up.

The independent guys have my respect, because they are doing something they want to do, how they want to it, with tact and style (most of the time). I admire guys who dream of working in Japan. Sure, when they have experienced that, it will obviously be on to the bigger promotions, but I admire people who can enjoy the journey of life, and can turn each stop into a destination.

Oh, and independent guys aren't overrated. Hardly ever, in my opinion. The WWE/TNA guys are underrated. People bitch about how shit guys like, just throwing an example out there, Lance Cade are, but if Cade went to the indies, everyone would talk about how he's "improved". If he went to Japan, the magazines would shit themselves for his arrival, people would make jokes that "Jobber McJobber" is always over in Japan, but his work will be good, and people will overlook the fact that he was capable of it prior to his stint the WWE.

The thing is, the WWE waters down their product so much that talent is eroded, invisible and left unused. The guys in the indies may not necessarily be better, but they actually use their's to their hearts content. Of course I'd love Carlito more if he was working in ROH rather than WWE. His matches would be his own, they'd be less predictable, and he'd be able to do what he feels like.

In my experience studying drama and stand-up comedy, the best performances are the ones that the audience can connect with, because they sense they are honest. Tom Cruise playing a poor man will just not do it, although that is analogically accurate to what the WWE has its talent do a lot of the time.

John Cena is a wrestler. People often overlook his past in OVW and his early days on SmackDown!. The WWE have tried to turn him into a brawler. No wonder he's a flop. And yes, I know he is WWE Champion, and he technically gets everyone on their feet. I ask you this, though: John Cena disappears tomorrow; does anyone miss him?

Guys on the independent scene get to be themselves. They get to script their own matches, they get to pull off their own moves, and they get to write their own promos. Sure, some of them may not be great, but at least they are honest.
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Old 05-06-2007, 01:52 AM   #19
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I do agree that the majority of indie guys are overrated...Danielson, Joe, and Styles are the main offenders.

There have been only three, well four if you want to put Steve Corino in that category, guys that I've really enjoyed in the indie scene over the years. CM Punk, Chris Daniels, and Colt Cabana.

Now none of those guys will ever break sales records or anything, but they do deserve a chance in WWE. Punk is defiantely a guy that could be a solid upper midcarder, someone who can go out there and make the main eventers look good while at the same time keeping himself looking strong while fighting over the US and IC Titles.

Chris Daniels would make an excellent midcard guy, I don't think he could be an upper midcarder though. He should be used as a guy who can go toe to toe with anyone on the roster, but comes out in defeat more often than not. Not saying his jobber or anything, but his wins should come against guys like Val Venis or someone he could be feuding with at the time like say Chavo Guerrero.

Colt Cabana is the perfect guy to have in the comedy role, well that's what he does best. He could be the 2007 version of the 2002 version of Goldust. Stick Cabana with a serious wrestler like Carlito, Elijah Burke, or the obvious choice in CM Punk. While Cabana would be tag champ at best, he's still someone who is entertaining and can wrestle at the same time.
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Old 05-06-2007, 01:53 AM   #20
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I agree with the whole conparison of Indy Filmakers to Indy Wrestlers, but if they have wanna make real make money or have any real accomplishment there gonna have to step up to the big time.
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Old 05-06-2007, 01:54 AM   #21
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I Also like Alex Shelley alot, he has potentiel.
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Old 05-06-2007, 01:58 AM   #22
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I wouldn't say a majority of them are overhyped at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingofOldSchool
I do agree that the majority of indie guys are overrated...Danielson, Joe, and Styles are the main offenders.
I wouldn't even include Styles in that, as he probably has at least as many who hates his guts as those who praise him.
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Old 05-06-2007, 02:01 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blitz
I wouldn't say a majority of them are overhyped at all.


I wouldn't even include Styles in that, as he probably has at least as many who hates his guts as those who praise him.
Outside of TPWW, most IWC fans go out of their way to suck Styles's dick.
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Old 05-06-2007, 05:06 AM   #24
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Yeah, those damn indies being the training grounds for next generation's stars.
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Old 05-06-2007, 08:34 AM   #25
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Overhyping indie guys>>>>>>>>>>>>>>bitching about overhyped indie guys.

Agreed.
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Old 05-06-2007, 09:55 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blitz
Overhyping indie guys>>>>>>>>>>>>>>bitching about overhyped indie guys.
Fag.
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Old 05-06-2007, 11:31 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingofOldSchool
Outside of TPWW, most IWC fans go out of their way to suck 98% of the indie circuit's dick.
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Old 05-06-2007, 11:42 AM   #28
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Every indie wrestler sucks.

Except Dave Mercy.

to use the independent film metaphor, it's like they use their indie status to bolster them beyond their own means. In other words, that their status is a large issue than their actual skills. People promote them because they're underground, and any talent gets lost in the shuffle.
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Old 05-06-2007, 11:59 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Every indie wrestler sucks.

Except Dave Mercy.

to use the independent film metaphor, it's like they use their indie status to bolster them beyond their own means. In other words, that their status is a large issue than their actual skills. People promote them because they're underground, and any talent gets lost in the shuffle.


That needs a rewrite.

I think what you are trying to say is that they use independent status to alter the perceptions of the smart wrestling fan. A mediocre wrestler will work the indies, because then he will be able to say he is good, because he was on the indies.

If that is what you are trying to say, that is asinine. Where the fuck did anyone come from if it weren't from the independent scene? Not everyone is great, but not everyone is overrated. You don't too many people jumping on Bobby Fish's dick (yet). When he gets more exposure, and gets to make good impressions, maybe.

You'll have to forgive some people for taking talent as they come, and not seeing every independent promotion the same way.
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Old 05-06-2007, 12:00 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M-A-G
Yeah, those damn indies being the training grounds for next generation's stars.
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Old 05-06-2007, 09:38 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alienoid06


That needs a rewrite.

I think what you are trying to say is that they use independent status to alter the perceptions of the smart wrestling fan. A mediocre wrestler will work the indies, because then he will be able to say he is good, because he was on the indies.

If that is what you are trying to say, that is asinine. Where the fuck did anyone come from if it weren't from the independent scene? Not everyone is great, but not everyone is overrated. You don't too many people jumping on Bobby Fish's dick (yet). When he gets more exposure, and gets to make good impressions, maybe.

You'll have to forgive some people for taking talent as they come, and not seeing every independent promotion the same way.
I agree. I support Independent Wrestling. A show I went to last night, had two guys Cali Casanova & HallowWicked. It was a big man match that sufferred because it moved at a snail's pace.

I also got to see a tag match with Referee David Garrick and Wildfire Tommy Rich vs. the team of Jean Pierre Flex and the Masked Mountie (both Canadian guys, with the Hooded guy having the added joke benefit of wearing a Yellow Mask.) Rich looked like shit (Age has caught up with him), but wrestled decently. Garrick made the Mighty Macabee look like Chris Benoit. Flex tried, but isn't that good. The Mountie is your typical lousy spotfester. Basically, the Canadians got squashed.

Next match had Xavier Night and Insane Assylum vs. Mack Truck and Glutteus Maximus. Mack Truck is a decent worker, but is an older guy. Maximus didn't sell enough at times, but put forth a passable effort with his comedy gimmick (he was a "Roman" from "Mount Olympus" who wore a bed sheet to the ring). Night and Asylum were solid, as they usually were. Finish worked: Valet distracts the ref and one of the guys got in a Knucks shot. It only took forever to set up and I was waiting on the valet to go to Second Base with the Ref.

Then we had Adam Owens vs. Chris Mayne in what was the best match of the evening. I think both guys should be on to bigger and better things. Mayne had some ugly spots, and I feel Adam (one of my best friends) could improve on his facial expressions, but all in all a great match that sets up their feud.

Last match I saw (left before the M.E.), was Team Macktion vs. Malachi and Josh Magnum (tag champions.) Malachi and Josh are feuding over the Cruiserweight Title (held by Malachi), so their team work is shoddy at best. Team Macktion are, if you're one of the lucky folks who never heard of them, Kirby and T.J. Mack, a couple of backyarders who showed up on TNA one time. Kirby constantly tried to leach off of Josh's heat (who is one of the biggest faces in this promotion.), while T.J. was kind of working it as a face vs. face affair with Magnum. Malachi (one of the promotions biggest heels, because of his feud with Magnum) worked well with both. At the finish, I think Kirby got legit knocked out when he tried to do the Ultimo Headstand and Josh kicked him off top rope. He then took down T.J. with a backbreaker before he and Malachi hit their finishers (Malachi has a huge Swan Dive headbutt before the 450 of Magnum.)

Before I left, I asked Josh. "What happened, did you kill Kirby?" He said "No." I replied "Next time, Try Harder."

The point of all that, you get a mixed bag at Indy Shows. But you do see some good workers.
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Old 05-06-2007, 10:43 PM   #32
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I agree that a lot of them are overrated, but I also support the indie scene, especially ROH. I liked Joe back in 04, Punk around the same time, Paul London, Austin Aries, Christopher Daniels, The Briscoes, and I like Bryan Danielson too.

But, I don't even pretend to believe that any of these guys are the end all be all greatest thing in wrestling history. It's more the promotions than the wrestlers, the IWC says WWE sucks because they make up shit characters and then bring up guys from the indies and say "Well, now that you're here, here is a list of things you cannot do/say during matches/promos."

So that's why most of the IWC doesn't like the WWE and loves the indies.



For the record, I think AJ licks balls. Literally.
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