NFL 2009 Off Season Thread

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I am baffled as to why so many people think the receivers are what make a QB good. Did you not see what happened when Ryan Fitzpatrick replaced Carson Palmer? Did you not see what happened when Brad Johnson replaced Tony Romo? Do you not see what happens every time Random Hack QB replaces Donovan McNabb? Same receivers, yet all of sudden everybody's terrible. Gee, I wonder why?

Quick, name Drew Brees' top receiver last year. How many years has Tom Brady had a 1000 yard receiver? What about McNabb? I mean fuck, Trent Green used to put up 4000 yard seasons throwing to his WR core made up of Eddie Kennison and Johnnie Morton.

Yeah Cutler doesn't have a receiving core in Chicago. He also doesn't have an ungrateful fan base. Now let's remember what he does have in Chicago: a running game and a defense who won't force him into shootouts. I bet Denver fans can't wait to see how Kyle Orton responds to playing with a defense that gives up 28 points a game. I'm sure his arm and QB skills will really flourish.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Originally Posted by Supreme Olajuwon I am baffled as to why so many people think the receivers are what make a QB good. Did you not see what happened when Ryan Fitzpatrick replaced Carson Palmer? Did you not see what happened when Brad Johnson replaced Tony Romo? Do you not see what happens every time Random Hack QB replaces Donovan McNabb? Same receivers, yet all of sudden everybody's terrible. Gee, I wonder why? Quick, name Drew Brees' top receiver last year. How many years has Tom Brady had a 1000 yard receiver? What about McNabb? I mean fuck, Trent Green used to put up 4000 yard seasons throwing to his WR core made up of Eddie Kennison and Johnnie Morton. Yeah Cutler doesn't have a receiving core in Chicago. He also doesn't have an ungrateful fan base. Now let's remember what he does have in Chicago: a running game and a defense who won't force him into shootouts. I bet Denver fans can't wait to see how Kyle Orton responds to playing with a defense that gives up 28 points a game. I'm sure his arm and QB skills will really flourish.

It's not that receivers make a QB, it's that Cutler is taking an enormous step down in terms of quality to throw to. If you took Kurt Warner out of Arizona he wouldn't be half the QB he is at the moment, and that's down to the system and who he has to throw to. Similar thing here. Cutler might prove himself but at this point it's just as likely he will stink it up next year as pull the whole Bears offence up a notch.

Also about 1/4 of Trent's yards came from throwing to Gonzalez Quite a bit from Priest Holmes as well if you want to go back that far.

[Hanso Amore]

Originally Posted by Mr. Monday Morning It's not that receivers make a QB, it's that Cutler is taking an enormous step down in terms of quality to throw to. If you took Kurt Warner out of Arizona he wouldn't be half the QB he is at the moment, and that's down to the system and who he has to throw to. Similar thing here. Cutler might prove himself but at this point it's just as likely he will stink it up next year as pull the whole Bears offence up a notch. Also about 1/4 of Trent's yards came from throwing to Gonzalez Quite a bit from Priest Holmes as well if you want to go back that far.

Its far more often that a QB makes WRs great than the other way around.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Originally Posted by Mr. Monday Morning It's not that receivers make a QB, it's that Cutler is taking an enormous step down in terms of quality to throw to. If you took Kurt Warner out of Arizona he wouldn't be half the QB he is at the moment, and that's down to the system and who he has to throw to. Similar thing here. Cutler might prove himself but at this point it's just as likely he will stink it up next year as pull the whole Bears offence up a notch. Also about 1/4 of Trent's yards came from throwing to Gonzalez Quite a bit from Priest Holmes as well if you want to go back that far.

1418 of the Bears' 3229 receiving yards, 44%, were collected by Matt Forte, Greg Olsen, and Desmond Clark last season so you can take your little wink face and shove it up your ass.

I'm not saying Cutler will have another 4,500 yard 25 TD season, and with Forte he shouldn't have to, but the assumption that because Chicago's receiving core was bad under Orton and Grossman, it will be bad under Cutler is ludicrous. Cutler's stats will be down next year because he won't be pressured to score 30+ points every game. In fantasy terms, Cutler will have a bad year. But in actual football, where it matters, he will have as good a year or better.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Originally Posted by Supreme Olajuwon 1418 of the Bears' 3229 receiving yards, 44%, were collected by Matt Forte, Greg Olsen, and Desmond Clark last season so you can take your little wink face and shove it up your ass.

So? Your point was that Green threw for 4000 to Kennison et al when you missed out mentioning that he also had a genuine 1000 yard a season TE, maybe even a hall of famer in Gonzalez, and Holmes, one of the best receiving backs, used to go for 600-700 as well. So that kind of dampens down the numbers for those other receivers.

As good as Forte is he's not Priest Holmes. And Olsen & Clark combined don't come close to Gonzo at his peak. What Cutler has to work with is even less than Green had.

Look Chicago will probably go .500 this year. They still play the Lions twice, and they play the NFC West too. Oh and they also play the AFC North. So that's probably 8 wins there, given that the Browns and the Bengals play in the North

Outside of that they have Philly, Atlanta, and of course Green Bay and Minny twice apiece plus Pittsburgh and Baltimore. At this point I don't see them winning more than 1 of those, honestly. Which would basically put them at the same level they were last year.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Originally Posted by Mr. Monday Morning So? Your point was that Green threw for 4000 to Kennison et al when you missed out mentioning that he also had a genuine 1000 yard a season TE, maybe even a hall of famer in Gonzalez, and Holmes, one of the best receiving backs, used to go for 600-700 as well. So that kind of dampens down the numbers for those other receivers. As good as Forte is he's not Priest Holmes. And Olsen & Clark combined don't come close to Gonzo at his peak. What Cutler has to work with is even less than Green had.

No, I was responding to people immediately writing off Cutler because Chicago didn't have wide receivers. Just like Kansas City didn't have wide receivers. But they had other options, just like Chicago has now. And how do you know how good Forte will be? He had a far better rookie season than Holmes did and had almost 500 receiving yards. Imagine what he'll do without 8 or 9 guys playing up in the box.