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Old 07-03-2009, 04:12 PM   #1
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Frank Mir is going to make Lesnar tap again
I dont really care how good Lesnar might be. He cant become a BJJ fighter over night. He's going to go into this fight with 100% aggression and that will be his downfall. He'll get tapped again. Believe me. I was impressed with the Hearing win. I think Hearing is tough fighter. But where Hearing lacked, Mir doesnt. Lesnar is going to be left open for submissions this whole fight. He better knock Mir out in the first 2 minutes, or he's done. I just cant see him beating Mir. He's not even in his class as a fighter. His wrestling plays right into Mir's strenght and Mir isnt know soft chin. He cant take brute force. He'll tap the guy again.

Mark this down. Lesnar will get tapped again.

It dont matter who did what to who at this point. The fact is, we went to war. And now there aint no going back. It's what war is you know? Once you're in it, you're in it. If it's a lie, then we fight on that lie, but we gotta fight!
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Old 07-03-2009, 04:20 PM   #2
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Yeah, I think I'm with you on this one. If Lesnar doesn't bust out some crazy good striking and finish it quickly, he'll have to ground and pound him, and we all remember how that went last time.

The only things I can't be sure about are Mir's stand up and Lesnar's submission defence. Mir's stand up is vastly improved, but he's overestimating himself if he thinks punching out a deathly ill Nogueira is something to be proud of. On top of that, Lesnar gets better all the time. Guy's a freak the way he soaks stuff up. I highly doubt he's going to be a slippery eel on the ground, but I don't think it'll be as easy for Mir to trap a limb like last time.
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Old 07-03-2009, 06:10 PM   #3
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Mir beats one guy and all of a sudden people think he is some world beater. This is the same guy who Ian Freeman walked over. Marcio Cruz battered him and Steve Mazzagatti saved his life in the first fight. Mir is nothing.
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Old 07-03-2009, 06:56 PM   #4
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well hello extremists!

Thats pretty retarded to say mir is nothing and RP is giving lesnar way too little credit.

My guess is that there will be way less action in the first round of the fight compaired to the first one and once it does go to the ground, a lesser experienced lesnar will get caught.

Dont forget, outside of his losses after his injury, not a single person has survived mir on the ground.
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Old 07-03-2009, 06:57 PM   #5
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correction... i want to see mir sub lesnar. Im fairly certain lesnar will knock him out
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Old 07-03-2009, 08:05 PM   #6
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YAWN. Wake me when White Lesnar (Brock Lesnar) and Black Lesnar (Bobby Lashley) get to fight one another, and together transform into Gray Lesnar.
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Old 07-03-2009, 08:41 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Reavant View Post
well hello extremists!

Thats pretty retarded to say mir is nothing and RP is giving lesnar way too little credit.

My guess is that there will be way less action in the first round of the fight compaired to the first one and once it does go to the ground, a lesser experienced lesnar will get caught.

Dont forget, outside of his losses after his injury, not a single person has survived mir on the ground.
Dan Christison went the distance with him so he obviously did. Mir wanted nothing of Big Nog on the ground either.

I forgot how badly Brandon Vera murdered him too. Mir would never have KO'd Big Nog if he was staph and injury free. To me, all this fight is really saying to me is we will find out how good Brock Lesnar is. I'd take at least 5 other heavyweights to open Mir up on most nights if everyone was fighting fit.
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Old 07-03-2009, 09:04 PM   #8
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Brock has to finish Mir within the first two rounds. I just can't see anyone rolling with Frank for 5 rounds and not getting tapped.
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Old 07-03-2009, 11:54 PM   #9
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Brock has to finish Mir within the first two rounds. I just can't see anyone rolling with Frank for 5 rounds and not getting tapped.
Agreed.
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Old 07-04-2009, 04:12 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Rob View Post
Dan Christison went the distance with him so he obviously did. Mir wanted nothing of Big Nog on the ground either.

I forgot how badly Brandon Vera murdered him too. Mir would never have KO'd Big Nog if he was staph and injury free. To me, all this fight is really saying to me is we will find out how good Brock Lesnar is. I'd take at least 5 other heavyweights to open Mir up on most nights if everyone was fighting fit.
brandon was after his injury.

mir was dominating on the feet. to go to the ground would have likely caused a stale mate situation if both are so good. Why do that when you are in a dominant position and scoring knockdows. go on about the staph infection all you want but its not like nogieras two previous performances were very good either.

Id like to hear what heavyweights you would pick to beat him.

personally other than fedor, I wouldnt pick and of the top five guys. id say someone like ovareem or arlovski (headgeared of course) could kill mir because they have very fast and powerful striking, long reach, and good takedown defense.
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Old 07-04-2009, 04:14 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by HeartBreakMan2k View Post
Brock has to finish Mir within the first two rounds. I just can't see anyone rolling with Frank for 5 rounds and not getting tapped.
right, I dont care how hard brock works, there just isnt a way for him to get oxygen to all his muscles efficient enough to stay anywhere near as strong round to round
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Old 07-04-2009, 05:58 AM   #12
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brandon was after his injury.

mir was dominating on the feet. to go to the ground would have likely caused a stale mate situation if both are so good. Why do that when you are in a dominant position and scoring knockdows. go on about the staph infection all you want but its not like nogieras two previous performances were very good either.

Id like to hear what heavyweights you would pick to beat him.

personally other than fedor, I wouldnt pick and of the top five guys. id say someone like ovareem or arlovski (headgeared of course) could kill mir because they have very fast and powerful striking, long reach, and good takedown defense.

Arlovski? With that glass jaw? Get your head out your ass man

I'd put money on Carwin, Gonzaga, Valesquez, Lesnar, Couture, a fit Nog and probably Kongo against Mir. I wouldn't see a fight with Brandon Vera being any different from the last one either.

You mention "since his injury" but since it, he is 4-2 and in the 4 wins, he looked impressive in 1 of those fights. The Christison fight was an embarrassment, he was getting killed by Lesnar who was in his second pro fight and he should have looked ten times better against Hardonk. Some people have been super impressed by him in this time, I personally don't see what the big deal is. Even if he beats Lesnar this time, he still needs to prove more in my eyes. That's just my opinion though.
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Old 07-04-2009, 12:26 PM   #13
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I think Lesner will walk right through Mir. Mir said something along the lines that the first fight was like having a truck on top of him.

That said, I would not be surprised to see this fight go exactly like the first one. Lesner dominate and Mir pulling a sub out of nowhere. If Mir gets a sub, I think he breaks a bone.
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Old 07-04-2009, 01:02 PM   #14
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Arlovski? With that glass jaw? Get your head out your ass man

I'd put money on Carwin, Gonzaga, Valesquez, Lesnar, Couture, a fit Nog and probably Kongo against Mir. I wouldn't see a fight with Brandon Vera being any different from the last one either.

You mention "since his injury" but since it, he is 4-2 and in the 4 wins, he looked impressive in 1 of those fights. The Christison fight was an embarrassment, he was getting killed by Lesnar who was in his second pro fight and he should have looked ten times better against Hardonk. Some people have been super impressed by him in this time, I personally don't see what the big deal is. Even if he beats Lesnar this time, he still needs to prove more in my eyes. That's just my opinion though.
well of course he'd have to be wearing head gear

Carwins punches are still relativly slow and if he does get to the ground, I see him lasting less than a minute.

Gonzaga is one of the guys id see beating him unless mir gets on top.

How on earth does Cain have a chance his strinking is mediocre and he didnt have the strength to put kongo away on the ground how would he be able to compete with Mir who has an active ground game?

We get to see lesnar fight him. Id say the big difference between this time and last is that we get to see mir put an actual gameplan in for lesnar. So its almost gauranteed that we wont see leg kicks to start the match off haha.

Couture, I wouldnt bet against him but lets see how he handles a ground game like nogieras first. Healthy nog/sick nog have both been performing like shit since they got in the ufc so i dont agree with you there.

Kongo? No way... I mean his striking is superb, but its just not that fast. Its incredanly accurate, but the second mir gets his hands on him, kongo has less than a minute left.

You gotta remember the Vera that fought Mir was a very different Vera than as of late. Depends which one shows.

Thats why they fight the fights tho
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Old 07-04-2009, 01:34 PM   #15
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right, I dont care how hard brock works, there just isnt a way for him to get oxygen to all his muscles efficient enough to stay anywhere near as strong round to round
See I'm not even talking about from a conditioning stand point, I just honestly don't think there are many people in the world with the ability to roll on the ground with Frank Mir for 5 rounds and not get caught at least once.

That being said, I do have Lesnar winning this one.
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Old 07-04-2009, 04:21 PM   #16
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well of course he'd have to be wearing head gear

Carwins punches are still relativly slow and if he does get to the ground, I see him lasting less than a minute.

Gonzaga is one of the guys id see beating him unless mir gets on top.

How on earth does Cain have a chance his strinking is mediocre and he didnt have the strength to put kongo away on the ground how would he be able to compete with Mir who has an active ground game?

We get to see lesnar fight him. Id say the big difference between this time and last is that we get to see mir put an actual gameplan in for lesnar. So its almost gauranteed that we wont see leg kicks to start the match off haha.

Couture, I wouldnt bet against him but lets see how he handles a ground game like nogieras first. Healthy nog/sick nog have both been performing like shit since they got in the ufc so i dont agree with you there.

Kongo? No way... I mean his striking is superb, but its just not that fast. Its incredanly accurate, but the second mir gets his hands on him, kongo has less than a minute left.

You gotta remember the Vera that fought Mir was a very different Vera than as of late. Depends which one shows.

Thats why they fight the fights tho
Kongo does have superb striking and has only ever been stopped once in his career and it wasn't in the UFC (5-6 years ago). I can't see much that Mir offers that would make this change. Guys with better grappling than Mir have failed to take Kongo down.

Velasquez's striking is being hugely underrated here. Mir's chin is being even more overrated. I don't care if Carwin punches at the speed of Pacquiao or Foreman, he hits Mir and it's over.

I can see your point on Nogueira but I believe the guy who beat Herring and Sylvia who under performed would still beat Mir. And the Brandon Vera who smashed Mir the last time or the Brandon Vera who put on a clinic last time out would spell the end of Frank Mir.

Again, my opinion only.
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Old 07-04-2009, 07:20 PM   #17
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That being said, I do have Lesnar winning this one.
me 2
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Old 07-04-2009, 07:33 PM   #18
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Kongo does have superb striking and has only ever been stopped once in his career and it wasn't in the UFC (5-6 years ago). I can't see much that Mir offers that would make this change. Guys with better grappling than Mir have failed to take Kongo down.

Velasquez's striking is being hugely underrated here. Mir's chin is being even more overrated. I don't care if Carwin punches at the speed of Pacquiao or Foreman, he hits Mir and it's over.

I can see your point on Nogueira but I believe the guy who beat Herring and Sylvia who under performed would still beat Mir. And the Brandon Vera who smashed Mir the last time or the Brandon Vera who put on a clinic last time out would spell the end of Frank Mir.

Again, my opinion only.
What heavyweight has kongo fought with better grappling than mir? I can see maybe a case for assuerio silva but if you go back and look at the match, kongo got taken down at will and won a majority decision. Other than him looking at his resume he has not fought tough grapplers.

Valezques has been in the sport two years. His striking is phenominal for the length of time hes been in it, but I just dont think its good enough yet. Plus hes not that strong of a guy.

To say if carwin hits mir its over is missing the point. given ten times, how many times would carwin KO gonzaga in one punch? Now nothing against carwin especially because he got up from under gonzaga, but if you want to play the one punch card, then you could pull any HW out of a hat to Serra his ass.
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Old 07-04-2009, 07:57 PM   #19
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Serra never KO'd GSP with one punch though.
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Old 07-04-2009, 08:10 PM   #20
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I've got to go with Rob on this, I haven't been too impressed with Mir since his return from injury.
I seriously see Lesnar coming out and going through him.
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Old 07-04-2009, 08:21 PM   #21
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Serra never KO'd GSP with one punch though.
Stop it
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I've got to go with Rob on this, I haven't been too impressed with Mir since his return from injury.
I seriously see Lesnar coming out and going through him.
in all honesty i do too... i still think hes better than most the guys out there tho
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Old 07-04-2009, 08:33 PM   #22
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Tell you the truth I've never seen a Mir fight from before his injury, only heard about him.
Someone tell me what he was like.
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Old 07-04-2009, 09:17 PM   #23
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World of talent, not enough heart to fulfill it.

And Reavant, I thought you'd know what a one punch KO was by now. You've followed Arlovski's career long enough.
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Old 07-04-2009, 10:09 PM   #24
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Frank Mir is easily one of the most talented heavyweights in the game, phenomenal ground game, good stand up, the problem is that he knows it all too well. If he had the work ethic for competition there would probably be a lot of arguments for him being THE best, but he doesn't so he will be questioned and the underdog in almost every fight he takes.
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Old 07-05-2009, 09:00 AM   #25
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Mir will beat Lesnar. That is all.
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Old 07-05-2009, 02:24 PM   #26
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World of talent, not enough heart to fulfill it.

And Reavant, I thought you'd know what a one punch KO was by now. You've followed Arlovski's career long enough.
haha u peice of shit
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Old 07-05-2009, 04:06 PM   #27
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Honestly, had it not been for the bullshit reffing in the first fight (Stand up and point deducted for a punch that hit the back of Mir's Head because Mir TURNED AWAY from the punch.), Lesnar would have stopped Mir the first time around.

Honestly, I'd rather see Lashley vs. Lesnar.
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Old 07-05-2009, 05:28 PM   #28
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I dunno... Lashley has been real unimpressive. Especially because he couldnt finish jason guida. Brock would prolly walk through him.

He doesnt have real good power in his hands, and he looks like an amature fighter where he tries to go strait to the takedown.
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Old 07-05-2009, 06:49 PM   #29
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I hope Lesnar wins. I'm much more interesting in seeing Lesnar match up as champion against the heavyweights in the division. Even though I recognize his talent, Mir makes me snooze almost as much as Tim Sylvia.
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Old 07-05-2009, 07:10 PM   #30
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I dunno... Lashley has been real unimpressive. Especially because he couldnt finish jason guida. Brock would prolly walk through him.

He doesnt have real good power in his hands, and he looks like an amature fighter where he tries to go strait to the takedown.
I agree with the Lashley comment but I don't know about him not having power in his hands. He hasn't shown enough standing up to show me if he has or hasn't either way.
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Old 07-05-2009, 07:17 PM   #31
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Well to show power you have to land the punches and have good enough technique to get the power to deliver... He doesnt have that yet
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Old 07-08-2009, 11:40 PM   #32
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I just don't see Mir winning this. He's a smart fighter and is going to be looking for the submission as much as he can but you have to think that Lesnar has had to of been pretty much only training submission defense for months. I don't see him falling for on of Mir's tricks again and the only reason Mir ever got the submission opportunity in the first place is because the ref made a bad call and broke them up on the ground for a shot to the back of the head that MIR TURNED INTO. The stars were just aligned perfectly for Mir that night and I do not see it happening again.
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Old 07-09-2009, 11:32 AM   #33
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I dunno, mir was going for an armbar as the ref stopped it the last time. He was even a little pissed about it.
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Old 07-09-2009, 11:41 AM   #34
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I just don't see Mir winning this. He's a smart fighter and is going to be looking for the submission as much as he can but you have to think that Lesnar has had to of been pretty much only training submission defense for months. I don't see him falling for on of Mir's tricks again and the only reason Mir ever got the submission opportunity in the first place is because the ref made a bad call and broke them up on the ground for a shot to the back of the head that MIR TURNED INTO. The stars were just aligned perfectly for Mir that night and I do not see it happening again.
I called BS about the same thing. Lesnar also admitted he rused into it, and tried to Donky Kong him. Now that he has a little more patience, I think he can get Mir in the right position, and finish the fight hands down.
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Old 07-09-2009, 06:49 PM   #35
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I feel that Mir is letting his Lesnar/Nog wins get to his head a bit too much. He said in on the Countdown show that he would dominate Lesnar in a standup fight. He also said that if he were to face Lesnar in a stand-up fight 100 times, that he would win 99 of those fights. I know thrash talking is all apart of the show and all but I really think he believes it. I hope Lesnar megaton punches him and his head explodes.
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Old 07-09-2009, 07:27 PM   #36
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Hes hyping the fight and trying to piss lesnar off... why doesnt anyone get this. Its like when lesnar was calling randy an old man that needs to retire, but after the fight he said what a great fighter he is and how honored he was to fight him.
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Old 07-10-2009, 08:17 AM   #37
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Dan Christison went the distance with him so he obviously did. Mir wanted nothing of Big Nog on the ground either.

I forgot how badly Brandon Vera murdered him too. Mir would never have KO'd Big Nog if he was staph and injury free. To me, all this fight is really saying to me is we will find out how good Brock Lesnar is. I'd take at least 5 other heavyweights to open Mir up on most nights if everyone was fighting fit.
Oh come on Rob, it's clear the Mir as improved greatly since those string of fights after his injuries. Don't be so narrow minded.
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Old 07-10-2009, 08:58 AM   #38
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How is it clear? Since his injuries, he fought like shit in 3 fights and had his life saved in a 4th. The Nog fight he looked great but it doesn't look as impressive when you find out Nog was in hospital 5 days before with staph infections. Okay and he beat Hardonk. Big deal. In 6 fights, he looked good in 1.
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Old 07-10-2009, 09:10 AM   #39
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When Mir wins, Rob will pipe down. Just like when he swore up and down that Gonzaga would beat Couture
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Old 07-10-2009, 10:18 AM   #40
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Not really. Lesnar is still an untested fighter. Mir would need to KO him to start winning me over. I already mentioned I don't think Mir could take most of the top heavyweights. If he beat 2 or 3 of them then I'd change my tune on him.
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