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Old 07-05-2010, 02:50 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathtotheSwiss
In ECW it made sense to have blood in a normal match between two guys who didn't hate each other because the entire company's gimmick was to be the most hardcore wrestler.
This was the point where I stopped reading the thread, just in case anyone was curious. Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go back and watch 2 Cold Scorpio vs. Pitbull II vs. Chris Jericho vs. Shane Douglas for the TV Title from '96 to figure out who was trying to be the most hardcore wrestler, because I must have missed that the first 15 times I watched it.
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Old 07-05-2010, 04:23 PM   #42
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I can't help but feel that DttS has overthunk a little there.

Pretty sure the average wrestling fan doesn't really consider hardcore wrestling/ECW in the regard and detail that you went into there Swiss. The stuff about Dreamer "turning heel"/teaming with Raven after being his blood nemesis for years seems particularly overthought. We are forced to buy heel/face turns and alliances every other week in wrestling, most are a stretch of reality.

Still, thanks for taking the time though Swiss.
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Old 07-05-2010, 04:29 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathtotheSwiss View Post
They have started it...Taz is denying knowledge of it, ECW guys are showing up at shows.
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Originally Posted by Razzamajazz View Post
it's TNA, history repeats itself.


DeathToTheSwiss - The initial groundwork MIGHT be getting laid down by having the ECW guys sit up in the crowd but you (and everyone else) should NOT immediately dismiss the storyline before it even gets started.


Razzamajazz -So your a fan of WWE never having competition? Your a fan of a product that MIGHT eventually be a top contender losing steam and dying?




I was NEVER pro TNA until recently. Why? Because the WWE product has been pitiful as a whole and I had to get my fix somewhere else.

RAW has been awful for several months now with only random weeks of actual goodness.

Smackdown was the best actual wrestling program until recently and even it is starting to feel the sting of monotony.


TNA has screwed up on a lot of occasions but so has WWE and we are all still pretty much loyal to them. But, for me, immediately dismissing a program before it even gets started is not only dumb, but it is bad for the business of pro wrestling as a whole.

WWE has no competition and in return has done nothing edgy or risky ......



so obviously everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and mine is, wait and see how it plays out before you write it off. It just may be good...chances are it won't be and it will die a very fast death...But I'm not going to be a snob and call it bullshit just yet..........



btw, i say this with peace and love.
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Old 07-05-2010, 04:49 PM   #44
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To be fair I am giving TNA more credit than a lot of people right now. I don't think ECW is the "big surprise" that is going to change wrestling forever.

However, TNA has already done an ECW stable, possibly twice. New Jack and Sandman were both in it if I recall correctly.

Again though, WWE is alive and well, we're just not their target audience anymore. Kids love that shit.
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Old 07-05-2010, 05:02 PM   #45
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Razzamajazz -So your a fan of WWE never having competition? Your a fan of a product that MIGHT eventually be a top contender losing steam and dying?

Competition is a GREAT thing, however, TNA isn't providing any. I've given it several chances, ordered a couple ppv's way back, even been to a house show. I just can't get into it. They've done so many stupid things that believing this next one is going to be any different and actually boost the company is a stretch. There's things I like about it sure, but the bad far outweighs the good and just I can't sit through the shit to see what I like.

WWE is also horrible lately. The majority of the time I dvr it and fast forward through a good bit (divas, guest host, comedy things) but in my view the good stuff, however rare, is worth sifting through the shit to get to. It's still the top company for a reason, and it's not coming down anytime soon, especially because of TNA.
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Old 07-05-2010, 05:09 PM   #46
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Why does RAW get such a huge rating?
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Old 07-06-2010, 02:20 AM   #47
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wwe : a musician who was great in the old days but is now in severe decline. After drugs, women, sex, alcohol (atitude era) they went to rehab and found Jesus (PG era)

Fans still remember the good old days and follow this artist out of nostalgia.


TNA : a white guy trying hard to be black to break into the business.

ROH : an underground band with lots of promise

CZW : is this even music?
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Old 07-06-2010, 05:34 AM   #48
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wwe : a musician who was great in the old days but is now in severe decline. After drugs, women, sex, alcohol (atitude era) they went to rehab and found Jesus (PG era)
So Shawn Michaels?
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Old 07-06-2010, 08:14 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loopydate View Post
This was the point where I stopped reading the thread, just in case anyone was curious. Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go back and watch 2 Cold Scorpio vs. Pitbull II vs. Chris Jericho vs. Shane Douglas for the TV Title from '96 to figure out who was trying to be the most hardcore wrestler, because I must have missed that the first 15 times I watched it.
lol, were you not around in the late 90s? Coma?
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:25 PM   #50
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For those who aren't aware of it, Heyman said he would only join TNA if he could earn 25-30 million dollars from the company, and that's obviously a lot of money, which TNA doesn't have... but if they get rid of Hogan or have less of him around they'll have more money to pay Heyman! How much of an asset is Hogan to TNA, anyway? He obviously isn't doing much for them.
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:33 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathtotheSwiss View Post
To be fair I am giving TNA more credit than a lot of people right now. I don't think ECW is the "big surprise" that is going to change wrestling forever.

However, TNA has already done an ECW stable, possibly twice. New Jack and Sandman were both in it if I recall correctly.

Again though, WWE is alive and well, we're just not their target audience anymore. Kids love that shit.
when was sandman in tna, was it when they had the weekly ppv deal? i have been watching tna since they were on fox sports, i never saw sandman, now sabo was there, but i never saw a ecw angle. though i said for a few years they need a ecw stable with all the former ecw guys there.
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:34 PM   #52
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This TNAECW venture is going to have the appeal of a car wreck.
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:35 PM   #53
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TNA has already done an ECW stable, possibly twice. New Jack and Sandman were both in it if I recall correctly.
Paul Heyman wasn't
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:38 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by Haze FX View Post
This TNAECW venture is going to have the appeal of a car wreck.
Maybe not if it's done correctly, with Heyman in control of it.
Granted, the people who loved ECW may have moved on already, and bringing the promotion back doesn't guarantee better ratings. In fact, I think TNA (and WWE) are living in a time warp if they believe things that were successful in the past will automatically be successful for them once more.

However, Heyman made something out of nothing with the original ECW. And remember his years as the head booker of Smackdown? He even made me watch OVW, for crying out loud. TNA needs Heyman, and they need to make getting him and let him be in control their top priority, because what they've got now sure as hell isn't working.
Last edited by Providence Peep; 07-06-2010 at 01:00 PM.
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:40 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erickman View Post
when was sandman in tna, was it when they had the weekly ppv deal? i have been watching tna since they were on fox sports, i never saw sandman, now sabo was there, but i never saw a ecw angle. though i said for a few years they need a ecw stable with all the former ecw guys there.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sandman_%28wrestler%29

Quote:
He also had stints in World Championship Wrestling, Total Nonstop Action Wrestling, and World Wrestling Entertainment. He currently works for independent wrestling promotion, Pro Wrestling Unplugged, and is also scheduled to appear for 1PW in the UK.
Quote:
In late 2002 and early 2003, The Sandman had a tenure in Total Nonstop Action Wrestling (TNA), joining former-ECW wrestlers Justin Credible and Raven, along with New Jack and Perry Saturn in a stable known as "Team Extreme" and later "Extreme Revolution". He also competed in the Hard 10 Tournament, where he partly feuded with Sonny Siaki before winning the overall event.
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:41 PM   #56
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Paul Heyman wasn't
He was working with the WWE at the time.
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:44 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathtotheSwiss View Post
He was working with the WWE at the time.
You missed the point. What I was saying was that maybe the ECW in TNA (or in WWE, for that matter) would have worked well had Heyman been a part of it.
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:46 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by erickman View Post
when was sandman in tna, was it when they had the weekly ppv deal? i have been watching tna since they were on fox sports, i never saw sandman, now sabo was there, but i never saw a ecw angle. though i said for a few years they need a ecw stable with all the former ecw guys there.
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Old 07-06-2010, 12:53 PM   #59
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ok so it was before they got the tv deal with fox sports during the weekly ppv days.
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:09 PM   #60
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Can someone please tell me what Hogan and Bischoff have done for TNA? Made Orlando Jordan a freak of nature? Signed RVD and Jeff Hardy? And what good are Hardy or RVD or anyone else if they aren't used right? My God, aren't Hogan and Bischoff the same guys who brought Bubba The Love Sponge and the Nasty Boys into the company?!

TNA took a chance on Hogan and Bischoff, and look where it got them. It's time to take a chance with Heyman and let him run things the way he wants to, or risk having to close its doors forever. Yeah, TNA is doing the Hammerstein Ballroom... but if Heyman isn't there, involved in some significant capacity, then so what?
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:12 PM   #61
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Can someone please tell me what Hogan and Bischoff have done for TNA? Made Orlando Jordan a freak of nature? Signed RVD and Jeff Hardy? And what good are Hardy or RVD or anyone else if they aren't used right? My God, aren't Hogan and Bischoff the same guys who brought Bubba The Love Sponge and the Nasty Boys into the company?!

TNA took a chance on Hogan and Bischoff, and look where it got them. It's time to take a chance with Heyman and let him run things the way he wants to, or risk having to close its doors forever.
They're pushing Abyss, Jay Lethal and Kazarian. Good enough for now.
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:15 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Perfect View Post
They're pushing Abyss, Jay Lethal and Kazarian. Good enough for now.
Yeah, watch out WWE! You're in BIG trouble NOW! Look at TNA's ratings soaring!
Of course, "creative" isn't the ONLY problem - "marketing" is another, and Heyman realizes that.
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:20 PM   #63
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Yeah, watch out WWE! You're in BIG trouble NOW! Look at TNA's ratings soaring!
Of course, "creative" isn't the ONLY problem - "marketing" is another, and Heyman realizes that.
I never said WWE should be nervous... WTF
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:22 PM   #64
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I never said WWE should be nervous... WTF
I never said you said that. I just was trying to make a point. TNA needs to do something huge (for real this time) and make some very significant changes to its product if they really want to gain viewership. It needs better writers/management, better marketing, and new and better ideas. Dixie Carter, Eric Bischoff and Hulk Hogan aren't cutting it.
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:28 PM   #65
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...why is it getting so hostile in here?
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:31 PM   #66
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I never said you said that. I just was trying to make a point. TNA needs to do something huge (for real this time) and make some very significant changes to its product if they really want to gain viewership. It needs better writers/management, better marketing, and new and better ideas. Dixie Carter, Eric Bischoff and Hulk Hogan aren't cutting it.
Hogan as an authority figure sucks...
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:40 PM   #67
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i would like to see paul-e come in but he is not getting 20-30 mil that is hogan wcw 1998 money no one gets that.
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:42 PM   #68
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Hogan as an authority figure sucks...
Hogan anywhere near a wrestling ring in 2010 sucks.
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:50 PM   #69
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At least they can't ruin ECW memories for me because I will never see it.

Seriously, if they couldn't make RVD entertaining on his arrival, I will never give them a chance again.
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Old 07-06-2010, 03:05 PM   #70
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Seriously, if they couldn't make RVD entertaining on his arrival
Paul Heyman could have.
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Old 07-06-2010, 03:24 PM   #71
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...I am TIRED of hearing and reading about how "great" Paul Heyman was, how "awesome" ECW was, how "If Paul Heyman was in TNA or WWE, it would be so great, he would change things around"...

...NEWSFLASH...

...Heyman WAS in charge of ECW and what happened? IT WENT UNDER. IT DOESN'T EXIST. If Heyman was so "great", why did he FAIL? If ECW was so "great and innovative", and people loved it so much, why is it not around?

...let it go, people. It's like when someone dies...no matter what he did when he was alive, everyone's like "He was so great, so nice, so helpful, what a kind human being"...

...if ECW was so great, it would still be around, because the FANS would've supported it 100% and the ratings would've been THROUGH THE ROOF and the money would've been flowing into the company and there would be NO WAY it would go under...

...and if Paul Heyman was "so great", his ECW would not have gone under.

Now, Vince...say what u want...but he IS great. WWE IS great.

End of story.
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Old 07-06-2010, 04:16 PM   #72
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Aguakate, (the original) ECW went bankrupt because they couldn't get sponsors. Paul Heyman admitted that. However, that doesn't change the fact that he's a creative genius, that what he created with his ECW was unique and hugely popular (despite not being "mainstream"), or that he has the potential and ingenuity to help fix what's wrong with TNA. Do you know that his success with ECW is what led WWE to create a "Hardcore Championship," and led WCW to create more violent story lines? Do you know that, despite having no advertising and a low budget, ECW became (for a time) TNN's highest rated TV show? I suspect there's a lot you don't know about Heyman or the positive impact (no pun intended) he could have on TNA, but I and other people here can assure you that he can't screw up TNA any more than Dixie Carter, Hulk Hogan and Eric Bischoff already have.
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Old 07-07-2010, 12:47 AM   #73
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Aguakate, (the original) ECW went bankrupt because they couldn't get sponsors. Paul Heyman admitted that. However, that doesn't change the fact that he's a creative genius, that what he created with his ECW was unique and hugely popular (despite not being "mainstream"), or that he has the potential and ingenuity to help fix what's wrong with TNA. Do you know that his success with ECW is what led WWE to create a "Hardcore Championship," and led WCW to create more violent story lines? Do you know that, despite having no advertising and a low budget, ECW became (for a time) TNN's highest rated TV show? I suspect there's a lot you don't know about Heyman or the positive impact (no pun intended) he could have on TNA, but I and other people here can assure you that he can't screw up TNA any more than Dixie Carter, Hulk Hogan and Eric Bischoff already have.

...THAT'S a positive way to view things..."Hey, can't get any worse, what the heck?! Try it!"
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Old 07-07-2010, 01:12 AM   #74
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He could quote easily screw it up more than Dixie. At least Dixie has her dads money to pump into the company.

But yeah, ECW had comparable ratings to TNA, with TNN treating them like shit and not backing or advertising them and with 2 other, much bigger companies competing for mind-share.
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Old 07-07-2010, 01:24 AM   #75
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He could quote easily screw it up more than Dixie. At least Dixie has her dads money to pump into the company.

But yeah, ECW had comparable ratings to TNA, with TNN treating them like shit and not backing or advertising them and with 2 other, much bigger companies competing for mind-share.
Of course, when wrestling was famous amongst a bigger crowd which the post attitude era of WWE killed.
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Old 07-07-2010, 11:03 PM   #76
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Time for Dixie to realize that Hogan needs to go, he has not done shit for the company like he said he would do. He stated he would walk away if he couldn't turn TNA around In which he has not. If Heyman did not join I would put Bischoff in total control, am I wrong?
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Old 07-07-2010, 11:08 PM   #77
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Time for Dixie to realize that Hogan needs to go, he has not done shit for the company like he said he would do. He stated he would walk away if he couldn't turn TNA around In which he has not. If Heyman did not join I would put Bischoff in total control, am I wrong?
I guess you're wrong, look at your rep....
*Actually Hogan did say that though.
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Old 07-07-2010, 11:10 PM   #78
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Old 07-07-2010, 11:28 PM   #79
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sick burn, Dr. Perfect!
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Old 07-08-2010, 01:04 AM   #80
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You dumb fucks, all I hear on this forum is "this shit sucks" or "why are they bringing back old guys?!?!" Now, in this particular thread, I read let's bring back Paul Heyman. Are you fucking smarks Bi-polar? Maybe what TNA needs is some fresh new ideas from new people. Bring back Paul Heyman, yeah that will work...... how is his creation ECW doing.... Ohh wait, it fucking went under. You smarks are fucking retarded.:foc:
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