Root of the problem(s)?

[BigCrippyZ]

Love WWE or hate it currently, even with the financial and industry status, I think there's no doubt that WWE has some serious problems that need to address. Poor writing, lack of consistent creative direction, suspension of Jericho for doing a common heel tactic, release of AW for a poorly chosen joke, lack of creating new popular superstars and characters, these are some of the problems I think they're having. My question is what is the root cause of these issues?

Is it the fact that the company is publicly traded and now more worried about shareholders, sponsorships, partnerships and public perceptions? Is it Vince losing his faculties, management abilities or something else? Is it the fact that WWE is now focusing on too many other things, movies, their network, social media, etc.? Is it Linda McMahon's political and career ambitions (either direct or indirect) negative influence? Or is it some combination of the above?

Personally, I thinks it's a combination of all the above. However, I believe it's really all poor management by Vince, as he could and should, as CEO, deal with and solve the other causes and issues. Whether it's intentionally his fault or not, it is ultimately, Vince's fault and responsibility. I think he's losing his touch or effectiveness as a manager and executive.

I'm curious to know what do you guys think. Thoughts?

[#1-norm-fan]

Shit writing, lack of direction and no concept of long term character development.

It all pretty much revolves around writing I guess. It's not even just bad writing... the writers literally don't seem like they even try. They write a few boring pain by numbers storylines and then fill PPVs with three filler matches that could easily be seen on free TV.

[Tom Guycott]

^ that right there ^

I mean, if you had to try to point out ONE thing out of all initally listed.

Having "creative teams", and two* shows, you would think they could have some sort of divisional umbrella of people in charge of certain aspects. For example, instead of merely a circle jerk of people in a room deciding the fate of the 5 people the head writer can be assed to remember, how about one focusing on the main event picture, somebody making sure the midcard has something to do, someone taking care of the show openers, etc.

Also, they too often do the obvious. The obvious is fine in most cases, but it's pretty tireless in their case. They're the opposite of TNA, where creative tries to swerve everyone with damn near every angle on a bi-weekly basis.

I know this will make me sound like tireless internet fanboy living in the past, but this was one of the beauties of ECW: interconnected storylines. Taz vs. Shane Douglas or Raven vs. Dreamer were huge collaborations that led to matches between people even associated with the two in the primary feud. This is a cue WWE could take from their aquired archive instead of just saying "you know what, long term booking is hard" and just refusing to do it.

[Emperor Smeat]

Incompetent writers in terms of long term stuff combined with the WWE is basically afraid of elevating anyone else to the level of Cena for the long term.

In terms of having an equal to Cena, Orton has been the closet but even he could not reach the same status nor was the WWE able to really recreate the Stone Cold vs Rock rivalry they wanted.

In terms of long term stuff, the writers tend to ruin anything that might be great after a while because of general incompetence. The WWE is also to blame for being too reliant on Cena to the point it hurts everything else. Instead of letting things develop gradually, they pull the plug too quickly and just make everything about Cena again because of how huge the youth market is tied to him.

[#1-norm-fan]

Orton has been booked amazingly well at times too. But it's mainly been on Smackdown where there's a ceiling now for how over someone can truly get. Plus the wellness issues don't help.

[Kane Knight]

Hey, if you can write shit, week-in week-out, and get 4-5 million viewers, why not?

I'm not saying I think this is a good thing, but needs to be addressed? Nah.

What incentive do they have to push for anything competent?

[drmayberry7]

Simple, it's Linda's campaign.

[Road Warrior]

Originally Posted by BigCrippyZ Is it the fact that the company is publicly traded and now more worried about shareholders, sponsorships, partnerships and public perceptions? Is it the fact that WWE is now focusing on too many other things, movies, their network, social media, etc.?

These reason's imo. The wrestling aspect of the company is completely secondary at this point and in a way reflects the evolution of society. Also a lot of it has to do with the fact that wwe is basically a monopoly at this point. With no suitable competition in the wrestling part of their company they really have no reason to improve in that aspect. Look at a company like EA, for example, with EA owning the exclusive license's to the NFL and NCAA they have no real motivation to improve that particular line of their products. I've said it before and I'll say it again, no competition equals no motivation.

[#1-norm-fan]

Originally Posted by drmayberry7 Simple, it's Linda's campaign.

Linda's campaign is primarily responsible for the PG product.

Shitty writers are responsible for making it a SHITTY PG product.

PG does not automatically equal bad.

[Sepholio]

I feel a strong desire to shit in Lindas shoes right about now.

[DLVH84]

I've been a wrestling fan for nearly 25 years, and I've seen a lot of ups and downs over the years, and right now, I believe WWE is at their lowest point so far, because of, like BigCrippy says, a combination of several things and Vince is getting up there in age. I believe it's almost time for him to step down and let The Game take over. I know my main man James Steele can't wait for Hunter to take over.

[KIRA]

Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan Linda's campaign is primarily responsible for the PG product. Shitty writers are responsible for making it a SHITTY PG product. PG does not automatically equal bad.

Case and point Coraline PG childrens film and easily one of my all time favorite films

WWE just has shitty writers and whenever they manage to do something interesting its a safe bet itll be ruined or forgotten a week later but they don't have to care because they are pretty much the only show in town it would take a mass exodus of fans to see them truly start to care about the product. To me it looks like the WWE is so focused on expansion that theyve neglected the very thing that brought them to the dance.

I mean they spend more time promoting tout, twitter and whatever the hell else I could care less about than they do the matches in the ring

[rockman725]

A serious lack of risk taking in developing storylines, booking matches, executing outcomes and transitioning feuds are some things that have been hurting them for years. It's not entirely PG/Linda's campaign, but it definitely has something to do with it. One thing that I liked about the product 10 years ago is that in special gimmick matches like Hell In The Cell, Street Fight, No DQ, etc... there was an emphasis on the fight & not the "entertainment." I always thought that they over did the blading from time to time, but in those matches, blood tells the story (even fake blood if need be). At the same time (or on the same show), the wrestling matches (one on one, tag teams) focused on the wrestling. Aside for a few guys in the company that have the ability to give us wrestling, we don't have that any more. Even looking back at when I started watching in 1993, there was clear emphasis on keeping the story in the ring and not outside of it. Nothing was over the top back then, but the transitions worked well for the time.

If they take more risks like the Nexus angle that they destroyed and the CM Punk angle that they destroyed, just to name 2, it would be a much better product. I don't think competition (or lack there of) is the focal point of the problem.

[Heisenberg]

I'm still sweating the Spring Cleaning.

I'll get attached to upcoming/mid-card talent and WWE will release them and we all know it's coming soon after this campaign shit stops. Might be around after next Wrestlemania so wrestlers need to start saving up.

Crazy shit

[Mr. Nerfect]

The writers get too much shit from the IWC. You hear from a lot of them that they have all these good ideas and want to create interconnected storylines and all that jazz, but someone from above shoots them down. A good idea for Yoshi Tatsu to get serious and represent Japan will be taken from the writer and transformed into Wade Barrett going "super British" and squashing Yoshi Tatsu, which would be all well and good, except that Wade would be dropping an eloquent bad-ass gimmick and no one has been made to care about Yoshi Tatsu.

That's just a hypothetical example, of course, but I think the writing team is far more capable than what people think. It's certain people doing things for the sake of doing things. As much as Vince tries to take professional wrestling into the mainstream, certain things happen that help you understand why the mainstream continues to reject professional wrestling.

For every RAW where CM Punk cuts a promo talking about changing the way we think about professional wrestling, there is a RAW where Vince mocks people with illnesses. Has anyone noticed the hypocrisy in the Triple H/Brock Lesnar angle, with it apparently being terrible that Paul Heyman mention Triple H and Stephanie McMahon's kids, but it's totally cool for Steph to tell Paul that his children are ashamed of him? The morality in wrestling is weak, and that's fine -- if it weren't trying to aspire to be a moral code.

[Sepholio]

Look on the bright side. If Linda was running for President or something we'd be entering the G-rated era where all the wrestlers hug and talk out there problem like civilized chaps.

[Rammsteinmad]

The "problem" with WWE, is that this isn't 1999, times have changed, as have people and their attitudes. The boom period during the Attitude Era came at the right time where the social climate and storylines managed to cross at the right time. The internet wasn't as prominant as it is today, which meant that more people were tuning in on TV to watch.

People on here have been complaining about the writing for around ten years now, yet continue to tune-in week in and week out. So where's the problem? I mean, if it was as bad as everyone says, why watch it for ten years? Having interconnected storylines or breaking away from the PG rating isn't suddenly going to boost WWE's ratings back up to the 7's and 8's that they were making twelve years ago.

Don't get me wrong, I have my grievances too. There are times when WWE make decisions that I hate, but that's not so much a "problem with WWE" as it is a personal opinion of mine. I mean, WWE still bring in millions of viewers every week, so it can't be all that bad. There's a lot of undercard guys who never get used that I wished they would, I mean, now they've gone to a three-hour Raw, whilst guys like Zack Ryder still struggle to get televised matches, but ultimately the WWE machine will still roll on. It sucks, but I'll live, and it's certainly not what I'd call "the problem" with WWE.

The truth is that the problem isn't in the WWE, it's in us fans who sit here on the internet thinking we know everything and demanding too much.

[Wishbone]

No doubt things have gotten stale. I won't lie I still enjoy the product, but allot of the time I'm more afraid to admit to people I'm a wrestling fan than that I'm a brony. Thing is PG can be great. Like someone said earlier the movie Coraline was amazing, it's all about the writing. At the same time though it's not all the writers' fault especially when management won't let them do anything edgy that pushes the envelope. Linda's political crap has allot to do with it, but it's not just that WWE is trying to impress the share holders and is more focused on making them happy than making the fans happy. In the end it doesn't matter though because most of the WWE fans are sheep (me included) who will watch no matter what because there just isn't any alternative.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Originally Posted by Rammsteinmad The "problem" with WWE, is that this isn't 1999, times have changed, as have people and their attitudes. The boom period during the Attitude Era came at the right time where the social climate and storylines managed to cross at the right time. The internet wasn't as prominant as it is today, which meant that more people were tuning in on TV to watch. People on here have been complaining about the writing for around ten years now, yet continue to tune-in week in and week out. So where's the problem? I mean, if it was as bad as everyone says, why watch it for ten years? Having interconnected storylines or breaking away from the PG rating isn't suddenly going to boost WWE's ratings back up to the 7's and 8's that they were making twelve years ago. Don't get me wrong, I have my grievances too. There are times when WWE make decisions that I hate, but that's not so much a "problem with WWE" as it is a personal opinion of mine. I mean, WWE still bring in millions of viewers every week, so it can't be all that bad. There's a lot of undercard guys who never get used that I wished they would, I mean, now they've gone to a three-hour Raw, whilst guys like Zack Ryder still struggle to get televised matches, but ultimately the WWE machine will still roll on. It sucks, but I'll live, and it's certainly not what I'd call "the problem" with WWE. The truth is that the problem isn't in the WWE, it's in us fans who sit here on the internet thinking we know everything and demanding too much.

Sometimes the WWE violates the rules of storytelling, though, and often purposely avoid scenarios that could potentially stand to make them money. I don't think it's always smarks thinking they know best. Sometimes it is, but sometimes the stuff they put forward is just stupid, and shows that they no longer know their own audience.

Off on a bit of a tangent, your avatar reminded me -- the way they pushed Christian to the top last year, while rewarding in that they were actually doing it, kind of made Christian look shitty at the same time. At the time I quite enjoyed the rivalry between him and Orton, as did many others, and I ignored the criticisms of "Randy Orton wins all the time." Christian managed to get quite a few wins and falls over Orton. He was never made to really look like he was on Orton's level, though. And while I maintain that Christian was the heel, is much older than Orton, and probably not the guy the company should be investing in long-term, and that Orton beating him clean whenever they fought made total sense -- I do think that Christian's face push was aborted by the company way too quickly.

Instead of ending Christian's initial World Title run in four days, how about having Christian beat Orton with a roll-up in a hard fought match. The two respect each other and then Sheamus and Henry become involved. Christian & Orton beat them in a tag team match and then face each other again. This time the match goes to a double disqualification due to Henry and Sheamus. Cue a Fatal 4-Way, which Christian wins when he pins one of the heels. The money is still there in Orton challenging Christian, but you've made Christian stand out as a performer who is doing surprisingly well as World Champion. And at this point, you can properly gauge how well Christian is doing commercially as World Champion, as well as gauging critically.

It comes time to do Orton vs. Christian again, and that time Orton beats Christian like he did four days after Extreme Rules and is the new World Heavyweight Champion. Christian then turns heel on Orton in the coming weeks and you get the same essential story as what we got, except that Christian looks like more of a player against Orton, and actually poses some sort of threat to Orton's dominance, given that Christian has proven he can beat Orton in the past (although never decisively).

[Mr. Nerfect]

I guess my point there is that while I do believe that the role of the heel is to put over the babyface in the end, the heel should also be interesting and pose some sort of real threat to the babyface, or else there is no conflict worth really investing in.

[Juan]

The writing (and a few other things) in WWE has been a problem for almost 10 years.

I've grown to accept it and just enjoy the things they actually do right and not dwell on things like why Hornswoggle was revealed as the anonymous GM, almost a year since the whole gimmick was even dropped.

[Juan]

As in life, you have to let things just slide.

There are so many things you can pick apart and scrutinize in WWE on a weekly basis, but I feel that if I did that, I would enjoy it a lot less.

[Rammsteinmad]

Originally Posted by Noid Sometimes the WWE violates the rules of storytelling, though, and often purposely avoid scenarios that could potentially stand to make them money. I don't think it's always smarks thinking they know best. Sometimes it is, but sometimes the stuff they put forward is just stupid, and shows that they no longer know their own audience. Off on a bit of a tangent, your avatar reminded me -- the way they pushed Christian to the top last year, while rewarding in that they were actually doing it, kind of made Christian look shitty at the same time. At the time I quite enjoyed the rivalry between him and Orton, as did many others, and I ignored the criticisms of "Randy Orton wins all the time." Christian managed to get quite a few wins and falls over Orton. He was never made to really look like he was on Orton's level, though. And while I maintain that Christian was the heel, is much older than Orton, and probably not the guy the company should be investing in long-term, and that Orton beating him clean whenever they fought made total sense -- I do think that Christian's face push was aborted by the company way too quickly. Instead of ending Christian's initial World Title run in four days, how about having Christian beat Orton with a roll-up in a hard fought match. The two respect each other and then Sheamus and Henry become involved. Christian & Orton beat them in a tag team match and then face each other again. This time the match goes to a double disqualification due to Henry and Sheamus. Cue a Fatal 4-Way, which Christian wins when he pins one of the heels. The money is still there in Orton challenging Christian, but you've made Christian stand out as a performer who is doing surprisingly well as World Champion. And at this point, you can properly gauge how well Christian is doing commercially as World Champion, as well as gauging critically. It comes time to do Orton vs. Christian again, and that time Orton beats Christian like he did four days after Extreme Rules and is the new World Heavyweight Champion. Christian then turns heel on Orton in the coming weeks and you get the same essential story as what we got, except that Christian looks like more of a player against Orton, and actually poses some sort of threat to Orton's dominance, given that Christian has proven he can beat Orton in the past (although never decisively).

But this is the exact point I was making. This is what you want to see (and maybe others). I for one, loved the Orton/Christian feud, and rank it as the top feud of 2011. Do I wish Christian had a stronger run with the title? Hell yeah! But overall it was a great angle, and I'm happy with it.

Anyway, my point, is that what you wrote is what you'd have wanted to see. And that's fine, everyone has their own opinions and expectations. But if the WWE had done it your way, it wouldn't have instantly taken the ratings up to the high 7's they were hitting in 2000.

It's not so much about the actual product or the writing, it's about todays social climate. People just aren't into wrestling nowadays.

[Rammsteinmad]

Originally Posted by Juan As in life, you have to let things just slide. There are so many things you can pick apart and scrutinize in WWE on a weekly basis, but I feel that if I did that, I would enjoy it a lot less.

Pretty much this. You could pick apart and scrutinize anything in any television show, ever. Nobody is being forced to watch wrestling, if it was really as bad as everyone makes it out to be, then why are they still watching?

They problem in wwe is that they have writing bad. Someones I does think need to come fromThe Hollywood and write stories like in tv and the like. Movies? Yes

[dingdongyo]

some of the "greatest moments of all time" were from crappy writing.

"let's have austin come down... and... SPRAY EVERYONE WITH A BEER TRUCK!"
"... a beer truck with a hose on it? is that even, like, real?"
"i dunno."
"... whatevs. let's do it."


"hey, what can we do with foley and rock now?"
"...uhhh... let's have them do 'this is your life'!"
"...what?"
"yeah! we can bring out a bunch of people nobody has ever seen before or cares about, and pretend that they were part of the rock's life!"
"... whatevs. let's do it. is there any more pot?"


and prob the best example of all:
"hey, austin and rock... um... we have 20 minutes to fill, and absolutely no idea what to do with it. just go do something, k?"

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by drmayberry7 Simple, it's Linda's campaign.

Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan Linda's campaign is primarily responsible for the PG product.

LOL

Never let a lack of correlation interfere with a good conspiracy theory.

Originally Posted by KIRA Case and point

Case in point.

Regardless, the point that PG doesn't have to be bad is completely legit, yes. We've already seen wrestling doesn't need to be hardcore to be good. Thing is, there will always be people who correlate it (much like people who hold a correlation between Linda McMahon's political ambitions and WWE's rating, or between the lack of an F in their name and quality of show).

The IWC is retarded. It's a business and the company is making money. Just because it doesn't fulfill your fat virgin fantasies, doesn't mean it's broken.

[Indifferent Clox]

It's gotten a hell of a lot better over the last year

Yes, because Ryback debuted.

Ryback scares me. He has that eye of scarryness

[Pintint]

The root of the problem is that there is no (real) competition for the WWE at the moment. So why try, when you don't have to worry about a competitor seizing the spotlight?

[#1-norm-fan]

Originally Posted by Juan The writing (and a few other things) in WWE has been a problem for almost 10 years. I've grown to accept it and just enjoy the things they actually do right and not dwell on things like why Hornswoggle was revealed as the anonymous GM, almost a year since the whole gimmick was even dropped.

Oh, I could have cared less about Hornswoggle being named the GM. It didn't ruin any storylines as the storyline was already dead and gone in my mind. The comedy segments like that are corny and awful but I'm more concerned with the time they waste when they can't even build more than the main event matches for PPV.

When everything below the main event including the titles is just being ignored to the point that they're randomly throwing lower level matches on a PPV with no build, no heat, no drama, it can only come down to pure laziness. Plain and simple.

[#1-norm-fan]

Originally Posted by Kane Knight LOL Never let a lack of correlation interfere with a good conspiracy theory

[Wake Up Call]

vs







You tell me what the root of the problem is after watching those two vids

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by Gertner The IWC is retarded. It's a business and the company is making money. Just because it doesn't fulfill your fat virgin fantasies, doesn't mean it's broken.

The IWC? Hold stupid beliefs about the state of a company because they don't enjoy it?

You must be kidding!

Originally Posted by Indifferent Clox It's gotten a hell of a lot better over the last year

It's always getting/gotten a hell of a lot better over the last (time period).

Originally Posted by Pintint The root of the problem is that there is no (real) competition for the WWE at the moment. So why try, when you don't have to worry about a competitor seizing the spotlight?

Don't be an idiot. They were capable of drawing these numbers with WCW around, so competition is clearly not the issue. At least, not with other wrestling companies. As a TV show, they have more important things to worry about, like competition from other shows. but hey, the same number of retards will watch the shows every week (and then the half that's not 8-10 probably logs on here and bitches about it), so they really don't have any imperative to up their game. But that's not competition related, no. At least, as I said, not with wrestling companies.

Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan

And it is a conspiracy theory.

[KyleEmmott]

Linda's campaign & PG rating.

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by Wake Up Call vs Couldn't wait for that Austin/Rock promo to end. Besides, current TV is much better. You should have shown a clip of CM Punk dropping PIPE BOMBS. You tell me what the root of the problem is after watching those two vids

[Wishbone]

"Fat Virgin Fantasies"... real original there. Gertner, Kane Knight if you're going to be douche bags at least come up with some new material. Seriously guys I know you're trolls, but if you're gonna troll at least take some pride in it. I had expected so much better from you.

[Dat Fool Train]

The problem is the writing. The storylines are all about lawsuits and shit we don't care about. Who cares if AJ likes Punk but Punk doesn't like her and Daniel Bryan's in there somewhere when they're having a match for the goddamn title at the next PPV?? The booking has gotten so much worse because they're trying to go so much further than they should or need to. I was watching my Summerslam 2002 DVD and I was blown away at how a Flair-Jericho feud could be recapped in 2 minutes and the build was 400 times better than any dumb "I'm gonna sue you!" storyline. The WWE is completely out of touch with their fanbase and they need to get grounded in what people really want.