We need more REAL in wrestling

[Ziggles]

Now more than ever.

With social media sites such as Twitter and Facebook, I think it's time. If WWE wants to stop losing viewers and ratings, I believe the only solution is to make the drama and storylines real. Let me give you an example. The Bella Twins dating John Cena and Daniel Bryan in REAL life. After the TMZ story WWE decided to put a hold on the AJ/Cena storyline. Why not use it to their advantage? Why not bring the Bella Twins back? Incorporate real TMZ type drama into the storylines. Cena can finally address and turn down AJ admitting his relationship with Nikki Bella. She comes out and they make out, only to reveal it was Brie Bella, etc. etc.
John Cena vs. Daniel Bryan feud for the World Heavyweight Championship, over the Bella Twins sounds like a good start.

WWE needs to start acknowledging their wrestlers personal lives, and where they came from. Obviously, the Bella Twins, Bryan/Cena scenario wouldn't work all the time but any ratio between fake and real would help. The same Legends, Respect, Streak, fake gimmick/feuds are getting old. In this day and age, I believe the "Smarter" fan needs this to become attached to the characters.

Or is this just a "smark" point of view?

What do you think?

[Kalyx triaD]

No.

[Shisen Kopf]

So what your saying is that the WWE should film an orgy? That's not tv-pg I don't think.

[Bad News Gertner]

They should focus more on Randy Orton shooting up steroids.

[Shisen Kopf]

They should have santino come out and admit to being Canadian and turn him heel b/c Canucks=villains

[Rhaps]

1) You're assuming The Bellas would *want* to come back. Pretty sure they made the decision to leave. WWE might be all-powerful, but I doubt even they have enough clout to say "You will come back, and that's an order" (obviously it would Sgt. Slaughter making such demands)

2) It's called 'suspension of disbelief', WWE has created their own fabricated universe (not to be confused with the 'WWE Universe') in which 99% of what they produce is fiction presented as fact much as with 90% of TV shows, movies, novels and video games. Our job as the viewers is to suspend our disbelief as much as we're able to and enjoy the product. If we're not enjoying it any more, our job is to then turn off and go do something else abandoning the belief some fans seem to have that the entire world of professional wrestling will fall to ruin if they and they alone stop watching.

3) Sometimes yes, the blurring of fact and fiction does make for some of the more compelling moments of TV; CM Punk's infamous 'pipe bomb' being a great example, but it needs to be subtle.

The example described above would be a bit like the never-ending romantic storyline between Leonard and Penny on The Big Bang Theory being suddenly dropped one day when Penny comes out and says "OK, can't do this no more, I've been banging Sheldon in real life all this time."

3) Some other stuff.

[Theo Dious]

Yeah, didn't the Bellas leave because they wanted to?

[MoFo]

Yeahhhhhh.....'real' wrestling has worked so well for ROH.

How many ppl watch their show again?

[Theo Dious]

Originally Posted by MoFo Yeahhhhhh.....'real' wrestling has worked so well for ROH. How many ppl watch their show again?

38, not including the parents of the wrestlers.

[MoFo]

Oh shit I just read the OP, I assumed he meant make it more like MMA.

Your idea is even worse.

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by Ziggles Or is this just a "smark" point of view?

Yes.

[Razzamajazz]

i think a similar scenario could have been done in the late 90s because it's "edgy". today, no.

[The Condor]

Didn't Hogan want TNA to have a TMZ-gritty reality type of style and the wrasslers revolted against it?

[Kris P Lettus]

[Kris P Lettus]

5 POINTS

[Perry Saturn]

Go Team Sheikie

[James Steele]

They opened Pandora's Box and there is no going back. Wrestling isn't real and no matter what WWE or any other company does they can't reproduce that old school environment when there was at least a little bit of doubt. I think WWE should do more realistic storylines, but just using real stories for the basis of most of your storylines is stupid.

[Wake Up Call]

Stupid idea.

The product is for children, to most of them, it is real. The kids from 6-12 believe.

The WWE could care less about what you, or anyone over the age of 15 thinks. That is fact.

[Kris P Lettus]

Originally Posted by Wake Up Call Stupid idea. The product is for children, to most of them, it is real. The kids from 6-12 believe. The WWE could care less about what you, or anyone over the age of 15 thinks. That is fact.

Actually, the most desired demographic is 18-35 year old males..

They are not producing SpoogeBob Squarepants..

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by Kris P Lettus Actually, the most desired demographic is 18-35 year old males.. They are not producing SpoogeBob Squarepants..

lol..

[Schlomey]

I'm not against his line of thinking and obviously he used The Bella Twins as just one such example. I do think that TNA is more apt to go down this road being that they love the "real world" filming style of some of their segments.


I do agree with the above statement that the WWE lives in their own fabricated world, much like Phase 1 of the Marvel Universe. The WWE is obviously moving toward some form of mixed reality with the partnership with TMZ and all the social media sites and here are some ACTUAL points that prove my mini-opinion:

1. Jerry Lawler's heart attack. It was obviously a real life incident and WWE wrote it into a story. I do realize he had the heart attack on air so in reality it IS already part of the WWE product but it does deserve a mention.

2. CM Punk's June 27th rampage "shoot" on the WWE. He def. broke the 4th wall that night.

3. CM Punk legitimizing Jeff Hardy's real life issues on air. Granted that happened before the onset of the social media wash campaign again I feel it deserves a mention.




On a side note, Bobby Heenan said it best about wrestling: "They (us fans) know too much. It has taken all the magic out of it."

I don't see wrestling EVER reaching the heights it did before kayfabe was broken. As Heenan said, "kayfabe does not exist anymore".


Just some rambling thoughts. I feel most of you were too quick to judge the initial post/poster because he is new. I, for once, feel like a newbie posted something that had some sort of merit, albeit slightly misplaced.

Going to try and enjoy TLC with you fellows tonight (barring I find a good stream). Have a good night.

[Kalyx triaD]

I didn't judge at all, I just think it would be a bad idea whether a newbie or veteran wrote it. WWE TV is a show, they said it as such. Ergo it is to be judged on the same metrics as other shows (which is why I no longer mind when people call out bad writing). There is no reason to meld in real life anymore than they already do. I do not give a fuck who they are all actually dating or get into nor do I wanna see storylines present this wholesale.

Yes I found CM Punk's 'shoot' epic. Yes I like the Edge/Matt Hardy/Lita thing entertaining. King's heart attack was a making the best out of a situation. But these events are few and far between and I rather things remain over the top fantasy.

[Wishbone]

I have no desire to ever see the Bellas again on my television. That being said NO WWE should not do anything remotely like what the OP said. Trying to be edgy will only lead to them failing miserably at it. Edgy things can be good, but they need to come naturally (i.e. Punk's pipebomb). Forcing them will just make it seem cheesy.

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by Schlomey On a side note, Bobby Heenan said it best about wrestling: "They (us fans) know too much. It has taken all the magic out of it."

I think that's bullshit. The notion that understanding and magic are mutually exclusive is ridiculous.

Besides, aren't most of the folks here more enthralled with the era that brought on the broken fourth wall than any other?

[Schlomey]

I don't know about most folks I only know what I like.

Personally, I loved not knowing the secrets when I was little. I remember RUNNING to the other room when Papa Shango made green slime spew out of Gene Oakerland. I was any number of the kids shown in the crowd in total awe of the Undertaker.

As an adult, I love having the info at my fingertips and I love having so much product available at my fingertips. Also, I love having places like TPWW where we can talk, argue, fantasy book etc.....


There is good and bad with everything, I think. While the magic is gone from when I was a kid I can appreciate this as a business and a sport which, as an adult, is way more appealing than following false gods.

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by Schlomey I don't know about most folks I only know what I like. Personally, I loved not knowing the secrets when I was little. I remember RUNNING to the other room when Papa Shango made green slime spew out of Gene Oakerland. I was any number of the kids shown in the crowd in total awe of the Undertaker. As an adult, I love having the info at my fingertips and I love having so much product available at my fingertips. Also, I love having places like TPWW where we can talk, argue, fantasy book etc..... There is good and bad with everything, I think. While the magic is gone from when I was a kid I can appreciate this as a business and a sport which, as an adult, is way more appealing than following false gods.

While ratings are not an end-all metric, I think it's worth pointing out that the Attitude Era did at the very least coincide with the hottest crowds and the biggest fanbase. I know that it wasn't exactly the social media era, but it was the start of this whole thing. With social media, I don't think reality has to take over anyway. Just a different market to "work." But even then, I don't think WWE should try and go the route of "Real," because other places do it better. That's why mimmicking MMA is probably a bad idea, too.

Personally, I find a good match today can still enthrall me, and I have to think that if that's the case, there has to be some other source of "magic."

To paraphrase Douglas Adams, isn't it enough that there is a remarkable performance going on, one that can make you cheer or sit on the edge of your seat, without also believing in some fantasy heroes who can punch people out with no repercussions and survive weapon attacks with nothing more than a cartoon band-aid on their head the next night?

[Curd]

I believe that performers' personal lives should be used in the storylines only when the talent are comfortable with it. Otherwise, you run the risk of ruining personal lives through too much lack of privacy or booking some undesired effect on personal lives such as the Sullivan-Benoit feud contributing to an eventual Kevin and Nancy divorce.

[loopydate]

Originally Posted by Kane Knight I think that's bullshit. The notion that understanding and magic are mutually exclusive is ridiculous.

Agreed. I know a lot about my favorite movies and television shows. I read interviews with the creators and the actors and - in several cases - like to think I have a fairly solid understanding of their creative process. My degrees are both in the media/broadcasting field, so those things fascinate me. That knowledge does not in any way hamper my ability to enjoy the product I'm given.

What does hamper it is an awkward story arc, bad casting, or a desperate attempt at grabbing ratings with a ridiculous stunt. Those are the moments that take me out of what I'm watching. "Wait, whose brilliant idea was this?"

The same can hold for wrestling. I enjoy the product, so I learn about it. Despite (and, at times, because of) that knowledge, I can appreciate good wrestling matches and stories. It's the far-too-frequent moments where a story takes a turn for the nonsensical or a performer acts way out of character when the angry smark comes out. "Wait, whose brilliant idea was this?"

[BigCrippyZ]

Originally Posted by loopydate Despite (and, at times, because of) that knowledge, I can appreciate good wrestling matches and stories. It's the far-too-frequent moments where a story takes a turn for the nonsensical or a performer acts way out of character when the angry smark comes out. "Wait, whose brilliant idea was this?"

Agreed. This is where I think the WWE's kids target demographic has become an issue. It quite often seems like someone (the writers/Vince/both?) have an attitude of "Kid's aren't smart enough/don't care enough to notice these flaws in the writing, so fuck it. The adult's don't make us as much money and they should just appreciate and love what we give them, so fuck them." They treat the kids AND us like we're all stupid and we should just eat the shit they give us and like it.

[Bad News Gertner]

And the Attitude Era didn't? There were many storylines that were flat out stupid as hell. Mae Young giving birth to a hand. John Wayne Bobbit saving Val Venis from getting his cock chopped off, numerous storyline holes and obvious conclusions.

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Originally Posted by Tedious 38, not including the parents of the wrestlers.

So the total is 38. The parents are too embarrassed to watch.

[Theo Dious]

Well some of them do because they have to know when it's time to pick them up.

[Ziggles]

Originally Posted by Schlomey I'm not against his line of thinking and obviously he used The Bella Twins as just one such example. I do think that TNA is more apt to go down this road being that they love the "real world" filming style of some of their segments.

Thanks for understanding the point. It was just an exaggerated opinion of an opinionated thought.

and James Steele is right.

[Ziggles]

Originally Posted by James Steele They opened Pandora's Box and there is no going back. Wrestling isn't real and no matter what WWE or any other company does they can't reproduce that old school environment when there was at least a little bit of doubt. I think WWE should do more realistic storylines, but just using real stories for the basis of most of your storylines is stupid.

[loopydate]

Originally Posted by Gertner And the Attitude Era didn't? There were many storylines that were flat out stupid as hell. Mae Young giving birth to a hand. John Wayne Bobbit saving Val Venis from getting his cock chopped off, numerous storyline holes and obvious conclusions.

God yes. Some great stuff came out of those four years, but Attitude had arguably more crap than any period in wrestling history.

[Kane Knight]

Originally Posted by loopydate Agreed. I know a lot about my favorite movies and television shows. I read interviews with the creators and the actors and - in several cases - like to think I have a fairly solid understanding of their creative process. My degrees are both in the media/broadcasting field, so those things fascinate me. That knowledge does not in any way hamper my ability to enjoy the product I'm given. What does hamper it is an awkward story arc, bad casting, or a desperate attempt at grabbing ratings with a ridiculous stunt. Those are the moments that take me out of what I'm watching. "Wait, whose brilliant idea was this?" The same can hold for wrestling. I enjoy the product, so I learn about it. Despite (and, at times, because of) that knowledge, I can appreciate good wrestling matches and stories. It's the far-too-frequent moments where a story takes a turn for the nonsensical or a performer acts way out of character when the angry smark comes out. "Wait, whose brilliant idea was this?"

Yeah, could you imagine if people tried this argument elsewhere? People complain that wrestling is called fake, saying you don't say it about other TV, but....

Yeah.

Wikipedia has never hurt my interest in Breaking Bad or Doctor Who or Hitler on Ice....

I don't know why it should be different here.

I think the attitude exists because wrestling was so reticent to embrace new avenues.

Originally Posted by Gertner And the Attitude Era didn't? There were many storylines that were flat out stupid as hell. Mae Young giving birth to a hand. John Wayne Bobbit saving Val Venis from getting his cock chopped off, numerous storyline holes and obvious conclusions.

Yeah, but the rest of the show was so hot it was easier to forgive stupid shit. I used to roll my eyes and keep watching because Austin/Undertaker/DX/whatever!!!!!!!!

Now I just turn it off.

Not saying the Attitude Era was all gold, just that the more invested in a show you are, the easier it is to dismiss a certain level of shit. That's not necessarily an endorsement of quality, mind.