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Old 09-06-2010, 08:09 PM   #1
JEPW
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Aye. I do agree in a way I guess. But you go down that route and the Taker character would never be able to exist; at least, not the one we know these days.

Also, it would perhaps lead people to say: why the hell should I watch these guys slug it out in a UFC style when there is REAL UFC on the other channel? Sports entertainment is glorious because of the ridiculous drama it is able to create. Take that away... I worry that it'd become dull and well, pretty much die.

As a post-it note here: I don't want to see guys being put in unnecessary danger. Chair shots to the head which go unblocked SHOULD be banned. Cutting oneself with a tiny razor on the forehead probably shouldn't, so long as it is used sparingly and safely. I'm more bothered by the idea that the 'edge' of rivalries is not always there because these guys cannot let loose in promos etc.

I accept this is a tricky topic to discuss and am in no way committed to my own convictions, as I know relatively little about the business.
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Old 09-06-2010, 08:12 PM   #2
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Then Danielson tries to inject raw emotion into things by choking a guy on RAW during a brutal attack, and gets fired. But until then, the feud had been brewing nicely, I agree.

Also Xero, good point about Vince's real wrestling vision. I guess when I consider how AMAZING his own TV work was during the Attitude era, I just presume he liked how things were. Maybe not.
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Old 09-06-2010, 09:11 PM   #3
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Then Danielson tries to inject raw emotion into things by choking a guy on RAW during a brutal attack, and gets fired. But until then, the feud had been brewing nicely, I agree.

Also Xero, good point about Vince's real wrestling vision. I guess when I consider how AMAZING his own TV work was during the Attitude era, I just presume he liked how things were. Maybe not.
1. The tie choking thing was understandable. I don't agree with them firing Danielson for it, but I get why they felt they had to. The fued still has steam behind it becuase Danielson is still trying to prove he's better than the Miz and indirectly prove to Cole he belongs.

2. WWE was amazing in the 80s too. The crowds were hot, you had a hot midcard and the main event featured some of the greatest heels and most memorable matches of the time. The thing is back then, and in the Attitude Era, Vince was gunning for something. He wanted to mainstream wrestling in the 80s and had to bust his ass and pull out all the stops to do so.

He then had to save his sinking ship of a company and regain control of the market in the mid and late 90s becuase WCW was taking over and hurting Vince's wallet.

What we see now may be Vince's vision, but it doesn't have the same driving force behind it becuase Vince pretty much owns the market. There is no real competition, and with no one to push Vince's limits, he has no reason to push hard for the current era. That's why what we see now is likely what we are going to be seeing for the forseeable future.
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Old 09-07-2010, 08:05 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by JEPW View Post
Then Danielson tries to inject raw emotion into things by choking a guy on RAW during a brutal attack, and gets fired.
of course, how could I not see it? That attack wouldn't have worked at all without the tie choke!
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Old 09-06-2010, 08:20 PM   #5
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-We get more half-naked divas (i.e return of bra and panties matches)
-Return of blood
-More cursing (doesn't have to go overboard though)
-Better wrestling.
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Old 09-06-2010, 09:16 PM   #6
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-We get more half-naked divas (i.e return of bra and panties matches)
-Return of blood
-More cursing (doesn't have to go overboard though)
-Better wrestling.
1. You can get that elsewhere.
2. The return of blood would be welcomed so long as it was built to mean something and not made to be commonplace.
3. Cursing doesn't exactly equal bette, more intense promos. Would cursing really help Punk's promos? I think wreslters with mic time being given more freedom to say what they want, so long as it followed PG guidelines, would be better than just allowing cursing.
4. Like someone said, how would the wrestling be better? If anything, the current era challenges the roster to step up and really learn how to tell a story since the matches are not as fast paced and hard hitting as before.
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Old 09-06-2010, 09:16 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by BizarroKing View Post
-We get more half-naked divas (i.e return of bra and panties matches)
That was usually piss-take time so it's amusing seeing this as a want.

Quote:
-Return of blood
You Roman or something?

Quote:
-More cursing (doesn't have to go overboard though)
You 12 or something?

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-Better wrestling.
What?
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Old 09-06-2010, 08:23 PM   #8
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Better wrestling? Do you mean, in technical terms? How?
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Old 09-06-2010, 09:50 PM   #9
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The removal of the PG stamp would not equate better wrestling. More fast paced maybe, but definitely not better. Because when you just blast through things, people can get hurt, severely.

The return of blood would be welcomed, like many have said though. As long as it fits the story and gets a point across, not just used willy nilly and irresponsibly.

Allowing the superstars more freedom during promos would be awesome. It is much easier to show raw emotion (anger, excitement, etc.) when you aren't reading from a script.

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I like your beard.
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I like how you build your whole persona around a fuckin' beard.
Must be the highlight of your life.
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Old 09-07-2010, 09:26 AM   #10
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Kane Knight, you seem to just pick bits of what I say out of context and then make some smarmy statement about them which really has no significance in terms of what I was actually discussing. Thanks for your input, though.
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Old 09-07-2010, 10:40 AM   #11
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Kane Knight, you seem to just pick bits of what I say out of context and then make some smarmy statement about them which really has no significance in terms of what I was actually discussing. Thanks for your input, though.
Try not being so stupid, then.

I mean, you can complain about the latter comment being "picked" out of context, but the prior one, I ran with going with the line of logic you were putting forth.

Complain about "smarmy" comments all you want (And by the way, lrn2english), but your statements are overwhelmingly stupid in context.

Now, back to your "convictions...."
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Old 09-07-2010, 11:10 AM   #12
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lol
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Old 09-07-2010, 12:08 PM   #13
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I still love that people blame Linda for PG. It always makes me laugh.
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Old 09-08-2010, 12:32 AM   #14
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Again the problem is the lack of talent. Everybody is talking about HBK/Taker, Sting, Randy Savage, Stone Cold, ect. These guys don't need to swear or be violent, they are just incredibly talented. The wrestlers now a days are shit. Guys would get over if they could go in the ring, show a little psychology and be able to talk on the mic. I don't know where I read it but somebody mentioned how back in the day guys spent years on the road learning their craft, now it's 9 months and you're hired.

PG, 14A, R, doesn't mean shit if the talent isn't there.
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Old 09-08-2010, 05:25 PM   #15
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Again the problem is the lack of talent. Everybody is talking about HBK/Taker, Sting, Randy Savage, Stone Cold, ect. These guys don't need to swear or be violent, they are just incredibly talented. The wrestlers now a days are shit. Guys would get over if they could go in the ring, show a little psychology and be able to talk on the mic. I don't know where I read it but somebody mentioned how back in the day guys spent years on the road learning their craft, now it's 9 months and you're hired.

PG, 14A, R, doesn't mean shit if the talent isn't there.
I'm not buying that talent comment at all. With the way WWE restrains their roster from going all out in the ring that statement has no validity. If we were actually allowed to see what these guys could actually do in the ring then you may have a point. But right now, unless they have a well documented past for putting on great matches elsewhere (Danielson, Punk, Kaval) then I don
t feel we can make that sort of judgement.
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Old 09-08-2010, 05:52 PM   #16
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I'm not buying that talent comment at all. With the way WWE restrains their roster from going all out in the ring that statement has no validity. If we were actually allowed to see what these guys could actually do in the ring then you may have a point. But right now, unless they have a well documented past for putting on great matches elsewhere (Danielson, Punk, Kaval) then I don
t feel we can make that sort of judgement.
It has to do with the way guys come up. Twenty years ago you went around the world and honed your craft against all different kinds of opponents before you got the call up. Now you spend a year or two in FCW and that may be it.
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Old 09-08-2010, 07:02 PM   #17
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It has to do with the way guys come up. Twenty years ago you went around the world and honed your craft against all different kinds of opponents before you got the call up. Now you spend a year or two in FCW and that may be it.
I was wondering if something had changed in that aspect, seems it has.
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Old 09-08-2010, 07:11 PM   #18
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It has to do with the way guys come up. Twenty years ago you went around the world and honed your craft against all different kinds of opponents before you got the call up. Now you spend a year or two in FCW and that may be it.
I do agree with that point to a certain extent seeing as how many guys the WWE tried to homegrow didn't pan out. But I still think it's hard to judge who really has in ring ability and talent and who doesn't. For example, Cena's a homegrown product, and I think he is miles better than what he's allowed to be.

If being brought up too quick is your (well founded gripe) then I think itLs more of a case of WWE rushing their prospects and not taking enought time to develop them than it is the lack of talent and ability.
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Old 09-08-2010, 07:02 PM   #19
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Again the problem is the lack of talent. Everybody is talking about HBK/Taker, Sting, Randy Savage, Stone Cold, ect. These guys don't need to swear or be violent, they are just incredibly talented. The wrestlers now a days are shit. Guys would get over if they could go in the ring, show a little psychology and be able to talk on the mic. I don't know where I read it but somebody mentioned how back in the day guys spent years on the road learning their craft, now it's 9 months and you're hired.

PG, 14A, R, doesn't mean shit if the talent isn't there.
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Old 09-08-2010, 01:22 AM   #20
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If I owned the WWE, I would immediately fire Johnny Ace and hire someone who knows wrestling talent and focus the promotion into more wrestling and less talking.
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Old 09-08-2010, 05:13 PM   #21
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People blame the "PG rating" for the tame WWE product nowadays, but they were PG in the past - even during the Attitude era in its early stages - and still used weapons, blood and mild profantities.

The WWE's current on-screen product isn't really to do with matching the criteria of a PG rating per se (they could probably be a little more risque and remain "PG"), it's to do with the megabucks deal they cut with Mattel. A PG rating is simply the byproduct of adhering to the policies and rules laid out by Mattel as part of the deal.

Linda's campaign has fuck all to do with it, because it's not as though there isn't a decade of Attitude archive material for her opposition to use against her anyway, and she is no longer officially working for WWE in any capacity.

If anything, it could be construed as more detrimental. After all, to the uninformed observer it seems that when Linda McMahon runs WWE, it's a sexed-up haven of violence and swearing. As soon as she leaves, it morphs into a family friendly tame television show.
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Old 09-08-2010, 05:14 PM   #22
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By the way, the Mattel deal is 5 years I believe so you can bank on a PG product for at the very least the next half a decade.
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Old 09-08-2010, 05:27 PM   #23
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If PG ended people would complain about how hard WWE tries to be edgy.
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