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Old 09-19-2011, 10:23 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Next Big Thing View Post
How can you say the WWE has fucked up if we haven't even had the payoff/ conclusion of the storyline yet?
How can someone say that WWE fucked up? CM Punk goes from being the hottest thing in wrestling in probably ten years, with people begging him to come on ESPN and getting into the likes of GQ magazine, to completely and utterly losing any and all mainstream coverage when WWE turns Punk from his self-made character and storyline into a WWE-style character in a WWE-style storyline. He was enormous, and WWE threw it away for their regular shit booking.

WWE fucked up. Did they ruin Punk for die-hard WWE fans? No. I still stand by my opinion that Punk will mean nothing come the Rumble, but I'm open to that not being the case. But they ruined him for fans who returned to watch him, and fans who ordered Money in the Bank and SummerSlam who normally wouldn't order PPVs. And that's a bigger problem, and shows a lack of willingness and wanting to expand away from their comfort zone to make money.
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Old 09-19-2011, 10:29 AM   #42
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I'm glad CM Punk didn't win.

He's the underdog, so who the fuck wants him to get over.

What would he have to BITCH about then?

Yeah, Cena won another championship, but noones fucking talking about that, now are they?

It's about CM PUNK, even if he LOST.

SEE MY POINT, PLAYA?

CM Punk is hot shit. WWE is doing it right.

They brought back JR, they are bringing back Vince, Austin, Nash, and Rock.

How can you still be BITCHING? Oh right, because it's the internet, SHUT THE FUCK UP!
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Old 09-19-2011, 10:32 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xero View Post
How can someone say that WWE fucked up? CM Punk goes from being the hottest thing in wrestling in probably ten years, with people begging him to come on ESPN and getting into the likes of GQ magazine, to completely and utterly losing any and all mainstream coverage
It's called flavour of the week. How long did you think Punk was going to be in the mainstream eye for? Wrestling needs more than one guy to get back to those levels of popularity again.
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Old 09-19-2011, 10:41 AM   #44
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Love how just because Punk loses people are fucking crying about this. Punk just main evented a PPV without a title involved, nothing is wrong with the storyline atm. And it looks like it still is going somewhere so its not like losing the match will matter.
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Old 09-19-2011, 10:41 AM   #45
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He would have lasted a while longer, and I think he could have been turned into another Miz-like guy for the media. I think that ship has sailed, though. I don't think it would have lasted forever, but I think the immediate cut off shows a problem, and not "flavor of the week" problem.

All I'm really saying here is there is a clear and stark contrast between Punk pre-MITB push/character and post-SummerSlam push/character. He went from being a true focal point of the show and being something different and unique to being WWE-ized and someone who could be replaced by any main eventer. And it's true. Anyone could have called Stephanie stupid and pissed off Triple H. Anyone could be playing fourth fiddle to Triple H, Nash and Laurinitis. That's the focal point of this feud, not Punk. And THAT'S the problem with Punk's booking. I don't even have a problem with the fact that Punk lost. Punk can lose and still be over. But he can't be booked like shit and be expected to stay over.

And I guarantee. I guaran-fucking-tee that Triple H and Punk will be buddy buddy by the time this is over. And it will make absolutely no sense whatsoever and complete the castration of Punk. I will eat my fucking hat if this doesn't happen, because it's honestly the only direction they've booked themselves into.
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Old 09-19-2011, 10:44 AM   #46
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Frankly, I think if the mainstream doesn't adore and cherish CM Punk then it's society's fault, not wrestling's.
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Old 09-19-2011, 10:45 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TL View Post
Love how just because Punk loses people are fucking crying about this. Punk just main evented a PPV without a title involved, nothing is wrong with the storyline atm. And it looks like it still is going somewhere so its not like losing the match will matter.
WRESTLING IS REAL, BITCH! THE RESULTS MATTER!
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Old 09-19-2011, 10:49 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xero View Post
And I guarantee. I guaran-fucking-tee that Triple H and Punk will be buddy buddy by the time this is over. And it will make absolutely no sense whatsoever and complete the castration of Punk. I will eat my fucking hat if this doesn't happen, because it's honestly the only direction they've booked themselves into.
Definitely. Nash is Hitler and HHH and Punk are Stalin and Roosevelt. The common hatred of Nash is going to unite the two after Yalta... I mean HIAC.

I'm going to stop the metaphor there before someone mentions the Cold War, because I got nothing for that.
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:20 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by Xero View Post
He would have lasted a while longer, and I think he could have been turned into another Miz-like guy for the media. I think that ship has sailed, though. I don't think it would have lasted forever, but I think the immediate cut off shows a problem, and not "flavor of the week" problem.

All I'm really saying here is there is a clear and stark contrast between Punk pre-MITB push/character and post-SummerSlam push/character. He went from being a true focal point of the show and being something different and unique to being WWE-ized and someone who could be replaced by any main eventer. And it's true. Anyone could have called Stephanie stupid and pissed off Triple H. Anyone could be playing fourth fiddle to Triple H, Nash and Laurinitis. That's the focal point of this feud, not Punk. And THAT'S the problem with Punk's booking. I don't even have a problem with the fact that Punk lost. Punk can lose and still be over. But he can't be booked like shit and be expected to stay over.

And I guarantee. I guaran-fucking-tee that Triple H and Punk will be buddy buddy by the time this is over. And it will make absolutely no sense whatsoever and complete the castration of Punk. I will eat my fucking hat if this doesn't happen, because it's honestly the only direction they've booked themselves into.
Why are you blaming wwe? Didn't punk say himself he has the power to say no if it's stupid. Dude, it's wrestling. People got excited because he said things about the company ,yeah, but how much more could he say? He said everything in that first promo really the next two ppv's he was riding that wave of momentum. It's not punk's character that has any particular thing wrong with it it's WWE as a whole not taking advantage and riding that wave of momentum.

Imho the steam that would've powered punks character would be if WWE actually made a change and we got a new main eventer out of it or a new youth movement.

Punk's character was and is still based on change and slowly we see some of that change coming to fruition
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:28 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blak23 View Post
Why are you blaming wwe? Didn't punk say himself he has the power to say no if it's stupid. Dude, it's wrestling. People got excited because he said things about the company ,yeah, but how much more could he say? He said everything in that first promo really the next two ppv's he was riding that wave of momentum. It's not punk's character that has any particular thing wrong with it it's WWE as a whole not taking advantage and riding that wave of momentum.

Imho the steam that would've powered punks character would be if WWE actually made a change and we got a new main eventer out of it or a new youth movement.

Punk's character was and is still based on change and slowly we see some of that change coming to fruition
I agree with you. It's WWE not taking advantage of it. And I agree that the "shooter" character had to be toned down. There was no way he would have continued with it at the level he was. But that doesn't mean he couldn't have leveled out and still appeared important in the story.

Like I said, my whole point is that WWE is making Punk an insignificant part of the storyline by the week, and also WWE-izing him (for example, that minute of him doing the "gagging" sounds was Cena-esq).
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:30 PM   #51
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Really don't agree with you Xero but can't be bothered getting into this discussion. So ridiculous.
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:35 PM   #52
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Red face
Yeah, I quite often disagree with Xero but I usually see where he;s coming from. Not at all really here, the Nash/HHH fall-out feels very much like a side-story compared to the main focal point, which is Punk's quest for change. Nash and Johnny Ace now also want change, but for their own gain in a different way from Punk.

The side-stories are nice, they stop things from getting stale when this could go on for quite a while, but there is no way Punk isn't the focus of the whole thing. HHH's nose isn't taking too much of the spotlight here, for a change.
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:42 PM   #53
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Each week I say I'm not going to watch Raw because it annoys me staying up late to watch about an hours worth of adverts throughout the programming, but then they keep making me want to tune in to find out what's going on.
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:44 PM   #54
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I disagree I think that was Phil Brooks being Phil Brooks. And I really think the story is centered around Punk. As in This is what I'm doing this is why I'm doing it
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:45 PM   #55
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Each week I say I'm not going to watch Raw because it annoys me staying up late to watch about an hours worth of adverts throughout the programming, but then they keep making me want to tune in to find out what's going on.

I know. Fuck having a job though, need to do things tomorrow so I can't stay up and watch them like I want.
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:49 PM   #56
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:49 PM   #57
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GUYS, I HAVEN'T READ THIS THREAD, BUT LEMME TELL YOU WHY IT SUCKS!
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:51 PM   #58
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I'm so hungry for answers though, I may see if I can sleep now though, watch Raw, then get a nap before work.
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:57 PM   #59
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How DARE someone disrespect HHH's nose!
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Old 09-19-2011, 01:07 PM   #60
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Typical people, not satisfied.

Did you think CM Punk was magical, and would make WWE bring back the Attitude Era!?!

He's full of tattoos, he's surely not going to be the media darling that the Miz is.

Xero, you're starting to get off your knocker and resemble my rants.

Your credibility as a poster is getting weak like our economy.

Stop bitching and tune in tonight.
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Old 09-19-2011, 01:09 PM   #61
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Typical people, not satisfied.

Did you think CM Punk was magical, and would make WWE bring back the Attitude Era!?!

He's full of tattoos, he's surely not going to be the media darling that the Miz is.

Xero, you're starting to get off your knocker and resemble my rants.

Your credibility as a poster is getting weak like our economy.

Stop bitching and tune in tonight.
..............
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Old 09-19-2011, 01:11 PM   #62
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Your credibility as a poster is getting weak like our economy.

...your jokes are pretty weak, too.
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Old 09-19-2011, 01:35 PM   #63
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He would have lasted a while longer, and I think he could have been turned into another Miz-like guy for the media. I think that ship has sailed, though. I don't think it would have lasted forever, but I think the immediate cut off shows a problem, and not "flavor of the week" problem.
Most of that main stream attention came from wrestling haters like Jim Rome and Colin Cowherd at ESPN and other mainstream reporters getting a hard on because they thought a wrestler actually shot his mouth off about WWE on live television and were looking for a story to bury wrestling, not because they suddenly gave a shit about pro wrestling or looked at Punk and immediately saw his star potential as an A List Hollywood celebrity. He dropped off in the mainstream media because they had no use for him once it was revealed that it was a work.

Miz has crossover appeal in the same way Otunga has crossover appeal. People are familiar with them and show marginal interest in them because of their reality show experiences and spouse (in Otunga's case). If they were regular wrestlers it would be a different story.

Yes, Punk delivered an amazing promo but you fail to give WWE credit for giving him the platform to cut that promo and say the things he said. I guarantee you if Vince, Stephanie or even Hunter had a problem with it, we never would have heard it. Also, perhaps the most brilliant part of it was them concluding it by cutting his mic, because that's what made it seem real.

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Like I said, my whole point is that WWE is making Punk an insignificant part of the storyline by the week, and also WWE-izing him (for example, that minute of him doing the "gagging" sounds was Cena-esq).
Why do you give Punk credit for that brilliant "shooter" promo we all love, but say he's being WWE-ized for promos that don't go over as well? I think he has the same amount of influence over his promos as he did then, but they're not having the same effect because the shock value in what he is saying is gone.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:27 PM   #64
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The mysterious Blakeamus has an opinion...at least it took 3 Pedigrees and a Jackknife powerbomb for him to lose. I would rather have that than Triple H just coming out of nowhere with just ONE pedigree and striking the nail in the coffin towards CM Punk's hot position. All in all, CM Punk still looked strong and I am more interested in seeing what tonight's RAW will bring.

The shock value has settled down when it comes to Punk's promos. But you have to agree that he hasn't become stale like John Cena.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:31 PM   #65
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I've said it before and I'll say it again, WWE is not letting Punk do all that he could do...they are holding him back.

Also, the minute he turned full-fledged face and started playing up to the crowd, that was the moment where all this build-up went to waste. After that "shoot" he did on RAW, his best bet was to remain heel, or at the very least, a "tweener".
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:32 PM   #66
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So what else do you suggest they let Punk do then, Aguakate?

Loving these know it all rants about Punk being wasted.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:32 PM   #67
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I've said it before and I'll say it again, WWE is not letting Punk do all that he could do...they are holding him back.

Also, the minute he turned full-fledged face and started playing up to the crowd, that was the moment where all this build-up went to waste. After that "shoot" he did on RAW, his best bet was to remain heel, or at the very least, a "tweener".

well it wasn't since he was playing to the crowd at MITB. And you can't really keep a guy heel that almost every person in the building is cheering for.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:33 PM   #68
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The mysterious Blakeamus has an opinion...at least it took 3 Pedigrees and a Jackknife powerbomb for him to lose. I would rather have that than Triple H just coming out of nowhere with just ONE pedigree and striking the nail in the coffin towards CM Punk's hot position. All in all, CM Punk still looked strong and I am more interested in seeing what tonight's RAW will bring.

The shock value has settled down when it comes to Punk's promos. But you have to agree that he hasn't become stale like John Cena.
The 2nd Pedigree and subsequent kick out meant more in terms of how they're booking Punk (to me) than anything else. You knew Triple H was gonna win when they announced the stip, and it took Miz, Truth, and almighty Nash AND 3 Pedigrees to keep him down.

Remember, the Pedigree is the truth.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:38 PM   #69
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Your credibility as a poster is getting weak like our economy.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:39 PM   #70
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So what else do you suggest they let Punk do then, Aguakate?

Loving these know it all rants about Punk being wasted.
Act the same way he eas acting as leader of Nexus, and when he did the promo. That's what got him the audience's support and attention, so there was no need to change it up.

Right now, he's the same as he was when he was ECW Champion and WHC as a face, except that he throws "little jabs" here and there to make us go like "Whoa, he's shooting!"
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:40 PM   #71
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The 2nd Pedigree and subsequent kick out meant more in terms of how they're booking Punk (to me) than anything else. You knew Triple H was gonna win when they announced the stip, and it took Miz, Truth, and almighty Nash AND 3 Pedigrees to keep him down.

Remember, the Pedigree is the truth.
Agreed.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:41 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by Aguakate View Post
Act the same way he eas acting as leader of Nexus, and when he did the promo. That's what got him the audience's support and attention, so there was no need to change it up.

Right now, he's the same as he was when he was ECW Champion and WHC as a face, except that he throws "little jabs" here and there to make us go like "Whoa, he's shooting!"
He's not the same at all as then(ecw/whc champ). I think people are just nitpicking here.

I'm liking him more now anyway than when he was leader of the nexus. If anything he was being held back then, not now.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:43 PM   #73
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He's not the same at all as then(ecw/whc champ). I think people are just nitpicking here.

I'm liking him more now anyway than when he was leader of the nexus. If anything he was being held back then, not now.
I really hope the WWE didn't just build him up as he wanted so that he'd re-sign with them, and now, slowly but surely, they'll begin to change things again.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:46 PM   #74
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I do enjoy this notion that the guy that has main evented the last 3 PPV's, pinning John Cena in 2 of them and has been involved in weekly segments and a storyline with the most powerful "performer" in the company and future boss is somehow being held down or underused
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:47 PM   #75
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I'm liking him more now anyway than when he was leader of the nexus. If anything he was being held back then, not now.
He really was. It made no sense for Punk to be associated with Nexus, but even then he was shining though. He did some of his best heel work in the WWE at the time. The following being a perfect example



SPOILER: show
"Aaaahhhhh, SHUT UP!"
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:51 PM   #76
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Act the same way he eas acting as leader of Nexus, and when he did the promo. That's what got him the audience's support and attention, so there was no need to change it up.

Right now, he's the same as he was when he was ECW Champion and WHC as a face, except that he throws "little jabs" here and there to make us go like "Whoa, he's shooting!"
I can see how you look at it, if it ain't broken, don't fix it. But hes going through a different approach, more like a rebel or tweener who wants to see change and got the attention of the fans who are also craving the same thing. It is really hard to continue what he was doing back in Nexus because the crowd was behind him even when he would declare how pathetic they were. And at that point, was he main eventing PPV's? Was he trending WWE Ice Cream Bars? Was he a hot media attraction from that time. No. He's evolving his character and I really don't see how the current CM Punk is anywhere similar to his ECW/WHC title run as a face? Maybe I'm missing something. Enlighten me.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:54 PM   #77
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I really hope the WWE didn't just build him up as he wanted so that he'd re-sign with them, and now, slowly but surely, they'll begin to change things again.
Hope so too because CM Punk has the goods.
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Old 09-19-2011, 03:03 PM   #78
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I do enjoy this notion that the guy that has main evented the last 3 PPV's, pinning John Cena in 2 of them and has been involved in weekly segments and a storyline with the most powerful "performer" in the company and future boss is somehow being held down or underused
...I know, ain't that a "B"?

Imagine what it'd be like if they REALLY gave him the green light?
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Old 09-19-2011, 03:04 PM   #79
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I just feel sorry for Alberto Del Rio, The guy's buried for weeks since winning the title (you're not a true champ etc..) and loses it right away, essentially proving everything that was said and killing momentum in his first reign.

and no one cares; it's all about CM Punk losing after 4 finishers and three people interfering and how terrible that is.
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Old 09-19-2011, 03:04 PM   #80
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I'm so hungry for answers though, I may see if I can sleep now though, watch Raw, then get a nap before work.
Slept for an hour and now feel wide awake. My have to abandon this, you fucks.
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