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Old 08-12-2012, 04:27 PM   #1
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Originally Posted by Wishbone View Post
"Fat Virgin Fantasies"... real original there. Gertner, Kane Knight if you're going to be douche bags at least come up with some new material. Seriously guys I know you're trolls, but if you're gonna troll at least take some pride in it. I had expected so much better from you.
This seems like a good time to throw this out there. While Gertner can be douchey about his opinions, I don't think he's a troll as much as people claim. I think he just gets people so worked up with the way he presents an opinion that they jump to "troll" any time he posts a differing opinion in a dickish manner. He hates guys with the "indy stench" on them. That's pretty much it. I actually agree with a lot of the things he says. I'm much more on his side about a lot of the guys the IWC typically wants to be pushed to the moon than most.
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Old 08-12-2012, 04:33 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
This seems like a good time to throw this out there. While Gertner can be douchey about his opinions, I don't think he's a troll as much as people claim. I think he just gets people so worked up with the way he presents an opinion that they jump to "troll" any time he posts a differing opinion in a dickish manner. He hates guys with the "indy stench" on them. That's pretty much it. I actually agree with a lot of the things he says. I'm much more on his side about a lot of the guys the IWC typically wants to be pushed to the moon than most.
For every "IWC Darling" he claims to hate he seems to come out of left field with a guy who is the exact opposite in every way to them and claims to love them to death. I just don't buy that any human being could come across as such a dick without doing it intentionally.

I'll agree that some of the IWC guys don't deserve pushes, but Gertner "Hates" them all and seems to see absolutely no redeeming qualities in any of them. Sorry, but from ever point he's made Gertner qualifies as a troll.
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Old 08-12-2012, 05:54 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Wishbone View Post
For every "IWC Darling" he claims to hate he seems to come out of left field with a guy who is the exact opposite in every way to them and claims to love them to death.
Well if he hates IWC darlings, wouldn't it stand to reason that he would love guys who are the exact opposite? lol

What is so "coming out of left field" about that?
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Old 08-13-2012, 02:02 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
Well if he hates IWC darlings, wouldn't it stand to reason that he would love guys who are the exact opposite? lol

What is so "coming out of left field" about that?
He says he adores Heath Slater, and seems to think Ryback is the second coming of Jesus from his posts. Don't get me wrong Ryback could be interesting if given the time to develop, but to hear Gerty's point of view the guy is one billion times more entertaining than Daniel Bryan or CM Punk just because he's not a "Vanilla Midget". As for Heath Slater well... do I even have to come up with an argument as to why he must be trolling on that one?
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Old 08-13-2012, 01:13 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Wishbone View Post
For every "IWC Darling" he claims to hate he seems to come out of left field with a guy who is the exact opposite in every way to them and claims to love them to death. I just don't buy that any human being could come across as such a dick without doing it intentionally.

I'll agree that some of the IWC guys don't deserve pushes, but Gertner "Hates" them all and seems to see absolutely no redeeming qualities in any of them. Sorry, but from ever point he's made Gertner qualifies as a troll.
Question : which wrestlers "out of left field" do I claim to love?
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Old 08-14-2012, 12:39 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Gertner View Post
Question : which wrestlers "out of left field" do I claim to love?
Um, Slater? Either way it doesn't matter you're entitled to your opinion regardless of how ignorant it is. Though I doubt that any of this is your real opinion, and you're probably just laughing that I'm commenting back to you at all so I'm gonna go ahead and stop feeding the troll now.
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Old 08-14-2012, 01:14 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
This seems like a good time to throw this out there. While Gertner can be douchey about his opinions, I don't think he's a troll as much as people claim. I think he just gets people so worked up with the way he presents an opinion that they jump to "troll" any time he posts a differing opinion in a dickish manner. He hates guys with the "indy stench" on them. That's pretty much it. I actually agree with a lot of the things he says. I'm much more on his side about a lot of the guys the IWC typically wants to be pushed to the moon than most.
Would be a good point if he didn't turn around and jack off to Tyson Kidd and Michael Mcgillicutty.

He likes Daniel Bryan and CM Punk, and probably many other "vanilla midgets" out there. He just likes fucking with all of you too much to admit it.
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Old 08-14-2012, 02:03 AM   #8
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Your tears are the best tasting tears of all.
More tinfoil hat logic.

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Originally Posted by Wishbone View Post
Oh yeah I totally agree that it doesn't matter. WWE won't change because like I stated in an earlier post we're all sheep that keep watching ME included. You're also right that they are doing fine business wise, but again that's only because we all keep watching regardless of how bad it is. Really it's pointless to argue this because both sides are right. WWE as it is now sucks, period. WWE also has a stranglehold on wrestling fans because they are THE wrestling company so they'll continue to make money. So basically this thread is a big waste of time...
Wait, what's the other side of the coin? It looks like you're arguing the same thing twice, really.

Wrestling forum threads are all pretty much wastes of time, so that's kind of stupid. Doesn't change the fact that wrestling junkies are in here arguing about the shit they watch weekly....Which is just fucking funny.

WWE is not the product you demand, but the one you deserve. The fans are the biggest issue that needs addressing, but nobody really wants to turn that critical eye on their own watching habits. They're too busy manufacturing conspiracy theories about politics or scapegoating PG or whatever.

Anyway, while we're talking pointless, this thread has kind of been beaten to death time and time again, and is generally populated with the same people firing off said complaints in an echo chamber ad nauseum. Of course, expecting you to not employ a double standards would be expecting too much, so instead I'll say this:

As long as people keep saying stupid things, I will call them stupid for it. Nobody's taking away their ability to state their opinions and nobody's calling them pointless (except you), since that would somehow indicate that this was somehow more or less important than anything else on the internet.

Complain about how I'm a big meanie all you want.
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Old 08-14-2012, 02:35 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Kane Knight View Post
More tinfoil hat logic.



Wait, what's the other side of the coin? It looks like you're arguing the same thing twice, really.

Wrestling forum threads are all pretty much wastes of time, so that's kind of stupid. Doesn't change the fact that wrestling junkies are in here arguing about the shit they watch weekly....Which is just fucking funny.

WWE is not the product you demand, but the one you deserve. The fans are the biggest issue that needs addressing, but nobody really wants to turn that critical eye on their own watching habits. They're too busy manufacturing conspiracy theories about politics or scapegoating PG or whatever.

Anyway, while we're talking pointless, this thread has kind of been beaten to death time and time again, and is generally populated with the same people firing off said complaints in an echo chamber ad nauseum. Of course, expecting you to not employ a double standards would be expecting too much, so instead I'll say this:

As long as people keep saying stupid things, I will call them stupid for it. Nobody's taking away their ability to state their opinions and nobody's calling them pointless (except you), since that would somehow indicate that this was somehow more or less important than anything else on the internet.

Complain about how I'm a big meanie all you want.
Um, I was agreeing with you on my last post... but whatever. I'm not saying that we deserve anything better I stated twice that I'm to blame too for watching. Basically I was trying to say that us arguing was pointless because you and I have the same opinion to some degree here. *shrug* Oh well.
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Old 08-14-2012, 04:59 AM   #10
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More tinfoil hat logic.
Mmm. Kane Knight tears.
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Old 08-14-2012, 05:02 AM   #11
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Would be a good point if he didn't turn around and jack off to Tyson Kidd and Michael Mcgillicutty.
How does him enjoying Tyson Kidd and Michael McGillicutty have anything to do with it? Not seeing the link. If anything, wouldn't the fact that he's praised McGillicutty-Kidd matches right along with the IWC lend credence to the fact that he does hate the guys he says he hates?
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Old 08-12-2012, 04:34 PM   #12
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It's time they start blatantly ripping off our favorite storylines from the past thirty years. Like, match for match, ripping off.
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Old 08-12-2012, 04:39 PM   #13
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It's time they start blatantly ripping off our favorite storylines from the past thirty years. Like, match for match, ripping off.
Why not just go all the way and do the exact same feud with the exact same guys? Most of the guys who mattered back then are still around today. Just fire all the new talent and make a few calls. I'm sure anyone who's not in the E now who was 3 years ago would jump at a chance to come back.
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Old 08-12-2012, 04:35 PM   #14
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As for Kane Knight he's just a dick.
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Old 08-12-2012, 05:28 PM   #15
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WWE is making a shitfuckload of money right now. Thats essentially what businesses do. Thats what keeps people in jobs and makes economies work, Sure the TV product isn't as entertaining as it once was but we are still watching and they are still trading.

From a business standpoint (The most important standpoint) WWE is performing effectively despite the TV/PPV product not being as exciting as it once was. Why would they as a business strive for more? You can blame Linda/Vince/PG/Bad writing all you like but what it really comes down to is us the viewers.

I wouldn't expect to see any changes until we give them an incentive to change by switching off and stopping them functioning as a business. Which won't happen. people always say we are on the verge of another 'Boom Period'. We aren't, because of the reason I've stated.

Unless TNA can somehow find a way to challenge the WWE like WCW did or millions (and millions) of people switch off and stop buying the merchandise we are stuck with wrestling in it's current state for the long haul.
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Old 08-12-2012, 06:13 PM   #16
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WWE can lay down (More so than they seem to be doing now at time) and TNA wouldn't make it interesting. They just don't have any way of getting the mainstream recognition to be a serious contender to WWE.
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Old 08-12-2012, 11:56 PM   #17
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WWE can lay down (More so than they seem to be doing now at time) and TNA wouldn't make it interesting. They just don't have any way of getting the mainstream recognition to be a serious contender to WWE.
Yes, they could. The fact that they're still around and on TV and employing guys 10 years later instead of being just another indy fed or bankrupt shows they can. Their problem is that it would take time to do so, and they take the "HOLY SHIT WE HAVE TO BE SUCCESSFUL RITE FUCKING NAO!!1!!" route too much.


WWE didn't even get to where WWE is now overnight. WCW didn't reach its peak in 1 to 2 years and suddenly kick everyone's ass. Every WWE castoff is the "biggest aquisiton ever" and only recently seem to be starting to break away from screwjob finishes every other match and no clean title switches that was the hallmark of their shows. Every regime change is a new turning point where they blow everything up and start over... now, they've relaxed on that shit. They're starting to build some stars, start their own trend (like with the BFG point system). If they keep things like this up, they could, one day, be seen as a true second place fed. They just need to ditch the notion that they're going to overtake Vince in 6-12 months anytime they do something considered big.


On topic:

I've said before, some of us keep watching- or suffering, as it may be depending on the product at the time- through shows partially out of habit, and partially because that next hot angle, next big moment, next amazing promo, next tear-the-house-down match might be that turning point we're waiting for. Waiting for the promise of something better that is sure to come, we just don't know when.

Then we get that angle, or moment, or promo, or match, and hope we get more, as opposed to being cockteased into watching months worth of more shit because that moment was a one-off and not a trend.
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Old 08-13-2012, 12:14 AM   #18
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Simple: lack of stars. Most of this imo is because they ask wrestlers to be actors now. but thats up for debate.
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Old 08-13-2012, 01:08 AM   #19
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The trouble is the WWE is too focused on pushing people that sell merchandise rather than pushing people so they can sell merchandise.

Back during the Attitude Era like 10 or more guys were able to sell merch and most of them weren't main eventers. Which leads right into the second problem the WWE is too focused on having 3 or 4 storylines going on at a time instead of 6 to 8. If you're watching back the attitude era their storylines aren't so much better than today's it's just their were more of them and they were all slightly diffrtent than one another and sometimes they collided with one another. Nowadays we have 3 or 4 storylines that when they do interact with one another are only for tag team, 6-man or 8-man matches.
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Old 08-13-2012, 01:10 AM   #20
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Honestly the obsession with Cena is what is holding down WWE product. If you put the focus back on wrestling (see sig) you would get back to what wrestling used to be.


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Old 08-13-2012, 02:09 AM   #21
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Anyway though back on topic. TNA won't ever be a threat to WWE unless like someone else said they get over the "We gotta be popular now" thing. TNA is on the right track, tonight's PPV proved that they can put on a great show they just need to keep it up and stop trying to push things too fast.

None the less WWE won't change until something major happens like a mass exodus of fans on the scale of the millions. Until Raw drops to like a 1.0 rating they'll keep shelling out the same crap because they know we'll watch it.

I'd like to think that with HHH coming into power things will change, but to be honest he was groomed by Vince. Honestly I don't see WWE ever going back to it's former glory. The days of Professional Wrestling and Sports Entertainment are gone all hail the era of "Entertainment".
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Old 08-13-2012, 02:27 PM   #22
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Linda's campaign isn't the problem. It kinda is the problem, to a degree. Along with a few other things.

I'm from Connecticut and we got the primary tomorrow, Linda's probably gonna get the nod by a fucking landslide. Haven't seen any Shays ads and I don't know whoelse is running on the republican side. It's pretty much a fist fight on the democratic side. Anyway, my point is short leading to WWE making television a bit edgy like now and aiming for the 18-49 adult demographic instead of the 9-17 children's demographic. They can't vote anyway. I know, I know, their parents can. "Shitting on Blumenthal" last year wasn 't a good idea.

Also are the obvious points. Weak writing and no direction. The obilgatory "turn Cena heel" idea. Lack of tag teams. Blah blah blah.

However, something to think about tonight and tomorrow. What happens if Linda loses the primary?
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Old 08-13-2012, 02:46 PM   #23
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The problem WWE has is the following:

They have no competition, so there's no real drive to produce at a high level week in and week out.

They can push it hard when they're trying to promote a PPV, and then back off and ride out a couple weeks, because no one is pushing them.

That is it.

Good afternoon.
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Old 08-13-2012, 02:48 PM   #24
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The problem is people who overanalyze everything in wrestling.
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Old 08-13-2012, 02:54 PM   #25
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Well, that too.

I remember the good ol' days (circa 1994, for example) where we'd just consume whatever WWF and WCW gave us and enjoy it.

Damn internet.
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Old 08-13-2012, 03:15 PM   #26
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I see nobody has contradicted or questioned anything I said in my post. I claim that I am now the rightful King of the Muties.
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Old 08-13-2012, 04:20 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClockShot View Post
However, something to think about tonight and tomorrow. What happens if Linda loses the primary?
Odds are almost 100%: absolutely nothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith View Post
The problem WWE has is the following:

They have no competition, so there's no real drive to produce at a high level week in and week out.

They can push it hard when they're trying to promote a PPV, and then back off and ride out a couple weeks, because no one is pushing them.

That is it.

Good afternoon.
*ahem*

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Don't be an idiot. They were capable of drawing these numbers with WCW around, so competition is clearly not the issue. At least, not with other wrestling companies. As a TV show, they have more important things to worry about, like competition from other shows. but hey, the same number of retards will watch the shows every week (and then the half that's not 8-10 probably logs on here and bitches about it), so they really don't have any imperative to up their game. But that's not competition related, no. At least, as I said, not with wrestling companies.
Good day to you, sir.

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The problem is people who overanalyze everything in wrestling.
Troll! Troll! Troll!
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Old 08-13-2012, 05:34 PM   #28
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I'd say lack of competition is an issue.
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Old 08-13-2012, 09:53 PM   #29
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I'd say lack of competition is an issue.
I'd tell you not to be an idiot, but I'm pretty sure that's inescapable.
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Old 08-13-2012, 11:59 PM   #30
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I'd tell you not to be an idiot, but I'm pretty sure that's inescapable.
Your tears are the best tasting tears of all.
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Old 08-13-2012, 06:49 PM   #31
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The problem that WWE has is the sub par writing. PG isn't a really huge of an issue with the product, in fact you can put out a good wrestling show regardless of the rating. It all has to do with the quality of the writing.
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Old 08-13-2012, 09:56 PM   #32
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In all honesty, WWE has gone down ever since they released The Undefeated Snitsky.

So,

Snitsky.
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Old 08-14-2012, 12:00 AM   #33
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Anyways, back on topic. If I had to pick one thing that was the root of the problems within WWE, it would probably have to be lack of competition.
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Old 08-14-2012, 09:59 AM   #34
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No, because his reasons for hating Bryan and Punk contradict his appreciation of Kidd and McGillicutty.
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Old 08-14-2012, 01:48 PM   #35
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Here's the difference

Me: I really enjoyed that Kidd vs MCGillicutty match

IWC: OMG KIDD AND MCGILLICUTTY SHOULD BE WORLD CHAMPS AND THE WWE KNOWS NOTHING FOR MISUSING THIS TALENT


I don't put unrealistic expectations on people I enjoy. Those two should never hold a title other than tag champs.
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Old 08-14-2012, 02:27 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gertner View Post
Here's the difference

Me: I really enjoyed that Kidd vs MCGillicutty match

IWC: OMG KIDD AND MCGILLICUTTY SHOULD BE WORLD CHAMPS AND THE WWE KNOWS NOTHING FOR MISUSING THIS TALENT


I don't put unrealistic expectations on people I enjoy. Those two should never hold a title other than tag champs.
They could both be good IC/US champs.
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Old 08-14-2012, 02:03 PM   #37
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Kidd should unify all the titles and you know that Gertner!
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Old 08-14-2012, 03:08 PM   #38
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They have no mic skills at all. They put on good matches, but mic skills hold them back from being singles champs
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Old 08-15-2012, 01:10 AM   #39
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Quote:
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They have no mic skills at all. They put on good matches, but mic skills hold them back from being singles champs
The mid card belts are for the guys who cant talk but who can work. They're always used as the workrate titles.
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Old 08-15-2012, 01:43 AM   #40
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The mid card belts are for the guys who cant talk but who can work. They're always used as the workrate titles.
Meh. I still don't know if I could buy Kidd as an IC/US champion. He's a poster child for why WWE should have bring back a cruiserweight division/title though. He'd be perfect for it. Save the IC/US title as a stepping stool for a guy potentially on his way to the top ala Bret Hart, John Cena, Austin, Rock, etc.
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