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Old 08-23-2005, 05:26 PM   #41
Kane Knight
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Actually, if you're sucking, you're the bitch.
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Old 08-23-2005, 05:28 PM   #42
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Damn, I guess im not the man:\'(
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Old 08-23-2005, 06:03 PM   #43
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No, see, I don't think he sucks, that's the thing.
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Old 08-23-2005, 06:05 PM   #44
Kane Knight
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And since you're his only fan, that holds a lot of weight.
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Old 08-23-2005, 06:09 PM   #45
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Not that it makes a diffrence, Master hasnt been given the opportunity to shine (other than his three minits with Shelton), and im a fan until he does. Which should be soon considering the HBK angle theve got working.
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Old 08-23-2005, 06:09 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anybody Thrilla
No, see, I don't think he sucks, that's the thing.
That's fine. We're just wondering how you defend that position...what, exactly, do you see that makes you think he is such "a GREAT heel character?"
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Old 08-23-2005, 06:16 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by destor18
Not that it makes a diffrence, Master hasnt been given the opportunity to shine (other than his three minits with Shelton), and im a fan until he does. Which should be soon considering the HBK angle theve got working.
Ok..that's bullshit. This guy was given a segment on just about every single Raw, week after week, for the last few months. Jesus, you can even track his appearances using the fantasy stuff on WWE.com. He was getting more airtime than most of the roster.

As I said, if you are getting 10 minutes each week, doing something as generically straightforward heel as standing out there insulting the hometown and beating up on random nobodies, and you still can't get any sort of heel heat from the audience, you are not doing a good job.
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Old 08-23-2005, 06:19 PM   #48
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You call beating up people from the crowd a good way to get over? I dont. And its not his fault he was booked beating nobodies. You want to get a guy over put him in there with someone the people care about. Like HBK.
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Old 08-23-2005, 06:32 PM   #49
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OK...see, I'm of the mind that a brand new wrestler shoudl be booked to work his way up the ladder, at least a little. Have him start by working the crowd, and beating up on the under card, and once you can see fans reacting to him THEN you start feeding him to the upper midcard to better establish them. Even Goldberg's "monster push" took months of him beating up one the La Parka's and Lanny Lane's of the world.

My main gripe is that Mastes was given the golden gift of plent of airtime -not on Heat, mind you, on Raw - and an easy gimmick and he's fallen flat on his face. It's not like the crowd is undecided or split on Masters. They truly don't give a shit. So he's getting no reaction, he actually looks worse the more times he sets foot in the ring (his timing his awful and he can't sell to save his life ; his match with Shelton was the worst performance on raw since Jackie Gayda's debut ann no ...not hyperbole) and what happens? He's REWARDED for that by throwing him in a program with HBK.

I can only hope that this is a last ditch kind of thing; like if the Pistons were to start Darko for 40 games this year. A way to see once and for all, whether this guy is as bad as he reallly looks or whether there's something there worth salvaging.

To be honest, Masters at this point is worse than every single performer the WWE fired in the last few months, divas included. He's that bad.
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Old 08-23-2005, 06:44 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PureHatred
OK...see, I'm of the mind that a brand new wrestler shoudl be booked to work his way up the ladder, at least a little. Have him start by working the crowd, and beating up on the under card, and once you can see fans reacting to him THEN you start feeding him to the upper midcard to better establish them. Even Goldberg's "monster push" took months of him beating up one the La Parka's and Lanny Lane's of the world.

My main gripe is that Mastes was given the golden gift of plent of airtime -not on Heat, mind you, on Raw - and an easy gimmick and he's fallen flat on his face. It's not like the crowd is undecided or split on Masters. They truly don't give a shit. So he's getting no reaction, he actually looks worse the more times he sets foot in the ring (his timing his awful and he can't sell to save his life ; his match with Shelton was the worst performance on raw since Jackie Gayda's debut ann no ...not hyperbole) and what happens? He's REWARDED for that by throwing him in a program with HBK.

I can only hope that this is a last ditch kind of thing; like if the Pistons were to start Darko for 40 games this year. A way to see once and for all, whether this guy is as bad as he reallly looks or whether there's something there worth salvaging.

To be honest, Masters at this point is worse than every single performer the WWE fired in the last few months, divas included. He's that bad.
I see where youre coming from. He should wrestle people lower in the card befor moving up, but random nobodies isnt gonna do anything, and I can proboly list the names of the guys hes has faced on the roster on one hand. Is the program with Micheal to soon? Hell yeah. If he does 15% of the work in this fued (cause we all no he will be carried) it will be a success and I will stay on the band wagon. Hes not in HBK's league, I know that. But what he could learn and gain from this fued could really send him in the right direction. Shawn could lite fire under the ass of Masters. We will see...
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Old 08-23-2005, 07:39 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by destor18
Not that it makes a diffrence, Master hasnt been given the opportunity to shine (other than his three minits with Shelton), and im a fan until he does. Which should be soon considering the HBK angle theve got working.
You're a fan until he does something good?

Man, no wonder people are Tard slapping you.
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Old 08-23-2005, 07:39 PM   #52
Kane Knight
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Quote:
Originally Posted by destor18
I see where youre coming from. He should wrestle people lower in the card befor moving up
No, he should learn to wrestle or cut a promo or get a fan reaction.
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Old 08-23-2005, 07:47 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
You're a fan until he does something good?

Man, no wonder people are Tard slapping you.
No, im a fan until hes givin the opportunity to do something good, and then doesnt. Pardon me for not hating a guy who has only wrestled "fans." He hasnt done anything to earn hatred. YET
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:14 PM   #54
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:14 PM   #55
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Stevie Richards is a fan?

Anyway, he's been crap in the ring. He doesn't DESERVE to wrestle anyone above the "fan" level. He can't cut a promo. He's been handed one of the EASIEST gimmicks in the world, and had it spoonfed to him, and he STILL can't get fan reaction. He's already dropped the ball.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:16 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PureHatred
Ok..that's bullshit. This guy was given a segment on just about every single Raw, week after week, for the last few months. Jesus, you can even track his appearances using the fantasy stuff on WWE.com. He was getting more airtime than most of the roster.
And that's why the "no chance to shine" argument is pretty retarded.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:19 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Stevie Richards is a fan?

Anyway, he's been crap in the ring. He doesn't DESERVE to wrestle anyone above the "fan" level. He can't cut a promo. He's been handed one of the EASIEST gimmicks in the world, and had it spoonfed to him, and he STILL can't get fan reaction. He's already dropped the ball.
What's so easy about his gimmick? There's really nothing to it, he come's out and put's people in a lock, the segment sucks and they book him in it week after week.
If there was more to him then he could get a reaction, but he isin't booked in any possible way to evolve his character.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:26 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThruTheWire
What's so easy about his gimmick? There's really nothing to it, he come's out and put's people in a lock, the segment sucks and they book him in it week after week.
If there was more to him then he could get a reaction, but he isin't booked in any possible way to evolve his character.
Exactly, I blame the amazing ability of the writing team. Its like I was saying, beating up fans isnt going go far. And Stevie Richards aint much better. Once Shawn gets him over he will be able to take that steam on into another fued and who knows. A years time he COULD be something to brag about.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:28 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by destor18
Exactly, I blame the amazing ability of the writing team. Its like I was saying, beating up fans isnt going go far. And Stevie Richards aint much better. Once Shawn gets him over he will be able to take that steam on into another fued and who knows. A years time he COULD be something to brag about.
And in a year's time the WWE could have fired his ass. You're forgetting that the WWE isn't trying to build stars anymore. They want the flavor of the month to go on and on and on. If a guy can't get over immediatly nowadays...he's as good as fired.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:30 PM   #60
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That's what were saying Shadow.. Masters has potential... He's just being fucked like 75% of new stars, courtesy of the writing team.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:34 PM   #61
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OK, now where on the same page.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:35 PM   #62
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It's not just the writing team folks. That's an easy blame and rather cowardly to just blame the writing team. Sometimes the gimmick doesn't fit the wrestler.

But nowadays it's compleatly right to say the writing team is fucking over the new guys so....hehehe.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:38 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow
It's not just the writing team folks. That's an easy blame and rather cowardly to just blame the writing team. Sometimes the gimmick doesn't fit the wrestler.

But nowadays it's compleatly right to say the writing team is fucking over the new guys so....hehehe.
Look, its clear your just trying to make the noobs look bad instead of making a valid point so im just going to move on.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:40 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by destor18
Look, its clear your just trying to make the noobs look bad instead of making a valid point so im just going to move on.
No you guys did a good job of that all by yourselves. But keep thinking you're cool.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:44 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThruTheWire
What's so easy about his gimmick? There's really nothing to it,
Why ask a question, then answer yourself?
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:44 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Why ask a question, then answer yourself?
I meant as in getting over.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:50 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThruTheWire
I meant as in getting over.
Seems to have worked for THOUSANDS of wrestlers, but okay, we'll ignore all the prior success with the gimmick and let the fault lay with the gimmick, instead of the guy failing to pull it off.

I mean, it's not like even Jindrak managed to get more over with this gimmick a short time ago, but that's okay. Bad gimmick. Bad writers. Bad fans. This is everyone's fault but his.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:50 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Stevie Richards is a fan?

Anyway, he's been crap in the ring. He doesn't DESERVE to wrestle anyone above the "fan" level. He can't cut a promo. He's been handed one of the EASIEST gimmicks in the world, and had it spoonfed to him, and he STILL can't get fan reaction. He's already dropped the ball.
You act as if you were in Masters position, then you would instantly get over.

It's easy to act like he's real shit, and say that he's fucking up so bad, meanwhile he is in the WWE and he is on RAW every week, he hasn't exactly dropped the ball. He just hasn't had a chance to get his hands on it yet.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:50 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThruTheWire
I meant as in getting over.
Seems to have worked for THOUSANDS of wrestlers, but okay, we'll ignore all the prior success with the gimmick and let the fault lay with the gimmick, instead of the guy failing to pull it off.

I mean, it's not like even Jindrak managed to get more over with this gimmick a short time ago, but that's okay. Bad gimmick. Bad writers. Bad fans. This is everyone's fault but his.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:52 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Seems to have worked for THOUSANDS of wrestlers,
mm hmm.. THOUSANDS......

gg double post.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:52 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThruTheWire
You act as if you were in Masters position, then you would instantly get over.
I wouldn't. Not with my build or public speaking skills.



I'm acting as though this is a simple gimmick to do, one that is straightforward and traditional and has been used successfully numerous times.

So don't try and pretend I'm saying something I'm not. No gimmick's magic, it can't turn shit into gold. And that is why MAsters has failed.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:53 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Seems to have worked for THOUSANDS of wrestlers
Who has WORKED for? you already admitted Jindrak didnt pull it off.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:54 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThruTheWire
mm hmm.. THOUSANDS......
1) It's called hyperbole (Get Destro to look it up, he's good with the dictionary)

2) IT's probably true, though not within the WWE. There are TONS of these promotions, wrestling is over a century old, and this is one of the STAPLE heel types. A Hundred years with tons of promotions, including numerous countries, and it's been largely successful, which is how it trickled into the mainstream WWF/E and similar TV feds.

So yeah.
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:55 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
I wouldn't. Not with my build or public speaking skills.



I'm acting as though this is a simple gimmick to do, one that is straightforward and traditional and has been used successfully numerous times.

So don't try and pretend I'm saying something I'm not. No gimmick's magic, it can't turn shit into gold. And that is why MAsters has failed.
What the fuck are you on? He hasn't even be around that long, not every star comes in day one with the GOLDEN GIMMICK. Give it some time, you talk all this shit while he's beginning a fued with one of the bigger stars in WWE history.

Only the shittiest wrestlers in the WORLD get to step into the ring with Shawn Michaels right?
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Old 08-23-2005, 08:57 PM   #75
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Im begining to see why wrestlers hate the internet...
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Old 08-23-2005, 09:02 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThruTheWire
What the fuck are you on? He hasn't even be around that long, not every star comes in day one with the GOLDEN GIMMICK.
Errr, yeah. Please try and stay with us.

He. DOES. Have. A. Golden. Gimmick.

Large amounts of production on his entrance. LOTS of TV time. More than many of the regular stars. Lots of exposure.

Quote:
Only the shittiest wrestlers in the WORLD get to step into the ring with Shawn Michaels right?
Now who would be stupid enough to say that? Oh right, it's a strawman argument, useful only if you ignore the fact that it goes the other way as well. Just getting in the ring with Michaels doesn't mean you're good. Working a program with him doesn't make you good. All it means is that someone's pushing to continue his exposure.
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Old 08-23-2005, 09:03 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by destor18
Im begining to see why wrestlers hate the internet...
Because people apply reasoning, and choose who they like, not who they're told to like?

Yeah, I can see it too.
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Old 08-23-2005, 09:05 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Errr, yeah. Please try and stay with us.

He. DOES. Have. A. Golden. Gimmick.

Large amounts of production on his entrance. LOTS of TV time. More than many of the regular stars. Lots of exposure.



Now who would be stupid enough to say that? Oh right, it's a strawman argument, useful only if you ignore the fact that it goes the other way as well. Just getting in the ring with Michaels doesn't mean you're good. Working a program with him doesn't make you good. All it means is that someone's pushing to continue his exposure.

He's never been in the ring with anyone above Low/Midcard level. Except when the Big Show PUNKED HIM OUT. The path has not been paved for him, this week's raw is his first chance in the ring with an ACTUAL name. Stevie Richards is a piece of shit jobber who has not won a memorable match in years. That doesn't even count.
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Old 08-23-2005, 09:06 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by destor18
Im begining to see why wrestlers hate the internet...
I have a solution for ya...

GET OFF THE DAMN MESSAGE BOARD IF YOU CAN'T STAND THE HEAT!
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Old 08-23-2005, 09:06 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Because people apply reasoning, and choose who they like, not who they're told to like?

Yeah, I can see it too.
No, because there flacid and unwilling to say anything positive.
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