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Old 09-01-2006, 03:44 AM   #41
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FourFifty, WCW probably made triple the amount of money in 1998, with Hogan as the top draw, than WWF made in 1996 and 1997 combined. WCW was making billions and billions of dollars through huge merchandising and tickets/PPV sales.

Shawn Michaels left the WWF because of his back injury just as they began to compete with WCW in the Monday night ratings wars. And even when WCW and WWF were pulling neck and neck, Hogan was main eventing in a top wrestling company that was scoring higher ratings and attendance than ever before.

Had Shawn Michaels stayed around during the ratings wars, it's arguable that he could be considered as high a draw as Hogan. But because he wasn't there for the Attitude era, and only returned in 2001 after WCW was dead, he's not.
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Old 09-01-2006, 03:47 AM   #42
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Triple H is going to inherit part of the WWF. He's a fucking mastermind genius and I bow to his unmatched intellect.
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Old 09-01-2006, 05:43 AM   #43
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Arrow
I would like to take this time to talk about what I've said about HBK in this thread, in an old riddle that has been passed along by my people for as long as the sun has risen and set.
























What did one mime say to the other? (highlight for the answer)


NOTHING!

Seriously, I don't care how much HBK, Bret Hart, Big Daddy Cool, Bob Backlund, Buddy Rogers, Sid Justice, or any other champion has drawn. I say, "Hogan wasn't as big of a draw as everyone says" and all everyone else could come back with is "HBK wasn't a draw!" and yet no one can answer a few simple questions.

If Hogan was such a big draw and made so much money for the company then why did WCW hand out alot of paper?

With Hogan being such a big draw why did WCW go under?

Where in Desert Hot Springs, CA can I get a decent cup a coffee served to me by someone who speaks English?

And please, don't respond with "HBK didn't draw!" For the love of God and all that is holy I don't care.
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Old 09-01-2006, 02:15 PM   #44
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Hogan drawing and WCW going under are sperate issues. WCW was alive until the time warner meger where it was decided internally to kill the product or at least sell it off because wrestling was not congruent with the companies image. WCW could have mounted a comeback - the "star-power" was certainly out there.

I don't think the demise of WCW relates to whether Hogan was a draw or not. If you look at it the WWF didn't go under when hogan left
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Old 09-01-2006, 03:17 PM   #45
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I can't believe I'm even debating Hulk Hogan is a draw.
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Old 09-01-2006, 03:46 PM   #46
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At least you're not debating whether Bret Hart ever drew a dime.
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Old 09-02-2006, 03:23 AM   #47
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My $0.02
I just wanted to comment on a few things that were mentioned in this topic:


1) Triple H's backstage power: I don't fault Triple AT ALL for playing politics backstage (if that actually is true). For one thing, loyalty between employer and employee should ALWAYS be a two-way street. In the WWE's case, this is clearly not the case. The WWE have always been known to unjustly fire people (i.e. Test when he was injured), or commit other sorts of unjust towards their workers.

Triple H is on the look-out for himself. Is that such a bad thing? Lots of people who work their butts off in the WWE (and it IS a very tough job)....never get fully rewarded. Triple H is shrewd, worked his way up the ranks, and married the boss' daughter. GOOD for him!

It's the WWE's fault if they're letting Triple H run things backstage (if that's actually what's happening). Triple H is being smart.....and doing what any smart human being would do. Period.




2) HBK/Flair/HHH, etc. criticising Hogan for not doing jobs: First off, I think it's EXTREMELY hypocritical of HBK to criticise Hogan (for reasons people have already stated on here). HBK has refused to job NUMEROUS times in the past.

As it relates to Flair/HBK/HHH, it seems to me like they're just trying to "bootleg" Hogan (i.e. try and show the people that they "have" some tangible quality that Hogan does not).

All 3 of these men know that Hogan is a far bigger star than all 3 men.

So what HBK and Flair have decided to do, is show the people that they

a) work their butts off
b) Care far more about the company than Hogan

to show that they are better than Hogan in this regard.

The joke here, is that BOTH Ric Flair and HBK would gladly trade in their careers/lifestyle for what Hogan has.....and go about eveything the same way Hogan did! Just my opinion of course.




3) I actually don't think Hogan jobbing THAT much is a bad thing. Hogan has already done significant jobs for the company a few years back.

If Hogan were to KEEP jobbing, then

a) The "prestige" of defeating Hulk Hogan would diminish.

b) Because of 'a', Hulk Hogan appearances/matches may not mean as much (although this is debatable).


Mick Foley and Ric Flair almost always jobs all the time now. Seriously - is there THAT much prestige left in beating those guys?


Now compare that to when someone defeats Taker (as Great Kali did) and Hogan (i.e. if he jobs to Cena at a later date).


bottom line: I like the idea of Hogan winning as long as he does ONE (or two) more significant jobs in the future.



Re-cap:

1) Loyalty is a two-way street between employer and employee. Triple H is not at fault for what he is doing (if in fact, he actually is playing politics backstage).

2) HBK, Flair, etc. are hypocrites for chastising Hogan. If they were as big a draw as Hogan was, I highly doubt that they'd ne any different than Hogan (i.e. not putting their body on the line as much, not jobbing as much, etc.). As it relates to the latter, we've already seen HBK's unwillingness to job in the past

3) Hogan getting key victories at this point isn't THAT bad an idea....provided that he does ONE (or two) more significant jobs in the future (so that the 'novelty' of defeating Hogan is still there).
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Old 09-02-2006, 05:00 AM   #48
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I would just like to say that ALL WRESTLERS USE POLITICS, yes even the ones that you think don't. ALL OF THEM, EVEN THE ONE THAT YOU'RE THIKING ABOUT. Yes him.
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Old 09-02-2006, 05:49 AM   #49
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Noooo! Not Max Mini!!!!
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Old 09-02-2006, 05:56 AM   #50
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Speaking of someone who wont put people over
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Old 09-02-2006, 11:03 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor
I would just like to say that ALL WRESTLERS USE POLITICS, yes even the ones that you think don't. ALL OF THEM, EVEN THE ONE THAT YOU'RE THIKING ABOUT. Yes him.
Zack Gowen?
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Old 09-02-2006, 02:21 PM   #52
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Shit yes Gowen. And I'm being serious.
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Old 09-02-2006, 02:25 PM   #53
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Somehow knowing Brooklyn Brawler used backstage stroke makes his incredible career seem tainted.
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Old 09-02-2006, 03:07 PM   #54
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LOL. do you think Brakus used backstage politics?(for those who actually remember Brakus)
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Old 09-02-2006, 03:32 PM   #55
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Provided he ever got in a position to ever have some pull he would have and thats a guarantee.
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Old 09-02-2006, 04:20 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
FourFifty, WCW probably made triple the amount of money in 1998, with Hogan as the top draw, than WWF made in 1996 and 1997 combined. WCW was making billions and billions of dollars through huge merchandising and tickets/PPV sales.

Oh, please. Making more than the WWE? Hell yeah. BILLIONS AND BILLIONS?!?!? I don't think so.
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Old 09-02-2006, 04:21 PM   #57
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Quote:
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LOL. do you think Brakus used backstage politics?(for those who actually remember Brakus)
He sure did a crappy job.
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Old 09-02-2006, 04:24 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor
Provided he ever got in a position to ever have some pull he would have and thats a guarantee.
They did try to push him at one point when he got a victory over Miguel Perez but it ended at that. The fact that it was on Raw is the only reason I considered it a push because Perez was a jobber.
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Old 09-02-2006, 04:25 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MacGyver007
Hogan drawing and WCW going under are sperate issues. WCW was alive until the time warner meger where it was decided internally to kill the product or at least sell it off because wrestling was not congruent with the companies image. WCW could have mounted a comeback - the "star-power" was certainly out there.

I don't think the demise of WCW relates to whether Hogan was a draw or not. If you look at it the WWF didn't go under when hogan left
Alive but dying and thanks to lots of factors not excluding the repeated use of stale talent like Hogan and such. The fact that it was drawing horrific ratings (even compared to today's Raw numbers) didn't help either. Not to mention the lack of staff and management necessary to even begin mounting a plan to begin a comeback. Did Hogan help WCW? Sure, but after two years after his debut there and thanks to a shock heel turn to join the hottest new act in town.
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Old 09-02-2006, 05:45 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor
Shit yes Gowen. And I'm being serious.
I feel so...Cheap...
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Old 09-02-2006, 06:03 PM   #61
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Kane Knight vs. Joey Radd
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Old 09-02-2006, 08:08 PM   #62
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It's true. Joey's pissed I out-politicked him.
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Old 09-03-2006, 04:56 AM   #63
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Quote:
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Zack Gowen?
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Old 09-03-2006, 10:21 AM   #64
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HHH has been doing the right thing for the past couple years (except around mainia) so I'm not going to hate on him now.
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Old 09-03-2006, 04:56 PM   #65
James Steele
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Triple H got over and became a main eventer before the Stephanie/Triple H storyline (which is what led to them getting married in real life). It is possible that Triple H was just the only proven guy to carry the ball for the WWF. Is it possible that Triple H actually loves Stephanie McMahon and loves professional wrestling enough to actually have potential to be a great backstage mind in the WWE down the road?

I don't agree with Rob often, but anybody who says Hulk Hogan wasn't a draw is a fucking moron.
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Old 09-04-2006, 03:43 AM   #66
Crippla
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Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)Crippla got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
JamesSteele/KingofOldSchool vs. Rob/The Ravishing One
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Old 09-04-2006, 04:07 AM   #67
St. Jimmy
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St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadianCrippla
Me vs. The Banhammer
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Old 09-04-2006, 11:33 AM   #68
Kane Knight
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesSteele
Triple H got over and became a main eventer before the Stephanie/Triple H storyline (which is what led to them getting married in real life). It is possible that Triple H was just the only proven guy to carry the ball for the WWF. Is it possible that Triple H actually loves Stephanie McMahon and loves professional wrestling enough to actually have potential to be a great backstage mind in the WWE down the road?
Yeah, and already having pull after rimming Michaels...
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