Benoit had Frontal Lobe Syndrome

[BigDaddyCool]

Originally Posted by Pepsi Man So now...just questioning based on that analogy, as I'm not even entirely sure how I feel about all this...are you saying that if a drunk driver kills someone, you blame the people that did not stop him from getting behind the wheel?

Was that aimed at me or Noid? I am blaming the person that sat down behind the wheel. I question the people who didn't try and stop them, but still it is the person that was behind the wheel's fault.

[Pepsi Man]

Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool Was that aimed at me or Noid? I am blaming the person that sat down behind the wheel. I question the people who didn't try and stop them, but still it is the person that was behind the wheel's fault.

That was blamed at 'noid, since he seems to be removing blame from Benoit and is using that "no one tried to stop him". No one tries to stop every drunk person that tries to get behind the wheel, either, and they still take the blame.

[Loose Cannon]

There's really no point in going back and forth here. Benoit mudered 2 human beings. ok, that's settled. He's at fault for that.

But now there's an big issue here. Were these mental disorders a big part in his decision making process the night of the murders. If so, then the industry has a huge issue to take care of here. Benoit's case might just very well change a lot of things in wrestling.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Originally Posted by Instant Classic No, but if he had a concussion, I'm going to take a wild guess, and say he knew he did, I'm gonna say that before he went crazy, his head probably hurt alot, due to head aches, going back years even. Now I would just assume someone with a concussion in a contact sport of any kind would go see a doctor about this, and get a CAT scan. I'm guessing that he didn't. I'm guessing that his concussions went undiagnosed, I mean, your brain doesn't begin to resemble that of an 85 year old Alzheimer over night, this was something that happened over time. I'm going to have to say that he suffered from concussions and head aches for quiet sometime. And if you don't think someone can go crazy from concussions, do some research. And, also had you been paying any attention at all Alienoid, you would know that some of his friends knew something was wrong with him, and that he wasn't normal.

How many people in the WWE right now do you think have sore heads? It's a part of the business. I'm not saying it's right, but it's a business where you get banged up. Chris Benoit spent years in pain, which was what he expected, and in some ways wanted. It's what every wrestler is guilty of. If we're blaming people for the lead-in to these sorts of events, you might as well blame everyone wrestling right now.

I know concussions can do crazy things, but how do you feel knowing that I could come up, bonk you on the head with something, and then you'd go home and kill your family? You don't want to look at yourself that way. I really doubt Chris Benoit ever said "I should stop wrestling, I might go on a massacre soon." It really doesn't work like that. Every guy who steps out there takes the risk of a head injury, and they still do it. They should all be guilty of reckless endangerment then, not just Chris Benoit. I'm not smiling over this whole thing, but as I said, it's good that Chris Benoit didn't actively seek out to kill anyone, especially his wife and son.

As Rob said, the WWE should make brain scans compulsory, and they need to get on top of this thing and fix it. Why didn't they have brain scans before? Because, quite frankly, it was a risk that the industry did not see as relevant. Why should Chris Benoit if no one else does? As I said, there needs to be some responsibility for oneself, but no one really considered it a likelihood. How many discussions before Chris Benoit did anyone say "the WWE should have head scans so wrestlers don't hang themselves?" I can't recall one in my time as a fan.

I was not aware that there were reports of Chris Benoit acting unusual. When were these? I was only aware of the text messages sent on the weekend this all went down. But let's say people did know that Benoit was going insane...why are they not getting the blame? Isn't there some kind of responsibility Vince owes to his performers?

[IC Champion]

So by your logic, it was WWE's fault when Angle became addicted to pills, and went crazy? I mean it's part of the bussiness, and it helps him wrestle through it, which what is expeted of them. So really, Angle has the WWE to blame and not himself.

[Loose Cannon]

with steroids, pills, pain killers, whatever.....of course the blame goes on the guy taking them first hand. nobody is making him take them. well, some may argue that to an extent I guess.

However, if management knows this is going on and does nothing to stop he/she when there is a problem, then you have to point another finger at those people.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I agree with Loose Cannon. This is pretty much an argument based on political beliefs, so there's not too much point going back and forth. These are discussion boards, though.

For the record, because I know a lot of people here are stupid, I'm not saying that Benoit is not a killer. If he didn't kill himself, he should have been tried and convicted for manslaughter. That's all I'm saying it is, though...manslaughter. Still fucking awful, but in the law's eye, it is a step down. This is a good thing for those who wanted to remember Chris Benoit's career, without mashing it up with his personal life, because it means Chris Benoit was not a cold-blooded killer. A killer? Unfortunately for all involved, yes, but his crime was under diminished capacity.

What we are essentially arguing is whether there should be diminished capacity, and whether or not there should be layers in the law, which is politics, and pointless to get into here.

[IC Champion]

I know this, I was going by Alienoid logic.

[IC Champion]

Originally Posted by Alienoid06 I agree with Loose Cannon. This is pretty much an argument based on political beliefs, so there's not too much point going back and forth. These are discussion boards, though. For the record, because I know a lot of people here are stupid, I'm not saying that Benoit is not a killer. If he didn't kill himself, he should have been tried and convicted for manslaughter. That's all I'm saying it is, though...manslaughter. Still fucking awful, but in the law's eye, it is a step down. This is a good thing for those who wanted to remember Chris Benoit's career, without mashing it up with his personal life, because it means Chris Benoit was not a cold-blooded killer. A killer? Unfortunately for all involved, yes, but his crime was under diminished capacity. What we are essentially arguing is whether there should be diminished capacity, and whether or not there should be layers in the law, which is politics, and pointless to get into here.

Who is to blame for his diminished capacity??

[IC Champion]

Also, as for this being political, I'm a Liberal, so....

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Anyone comparing mental/orbital trauma to drunk driving is retarded.

A drunk knows that drinking and getting behind a wheel can hurt someone.

An athlete does not REASONABLY know that getting hit in the head will cause him to kill someone. IF this is true, then there is no way to know if Benoit KNEW the extent of the damage, or the possible effects of it.

Does this make it so it's not murder? NO. Does this possibly remove intent? YES. Does this possibly remove reasonably derived intent? YES.

Did Benoit murder someone? YES. Did he do it on purpose? Maybe, maybe not. Can you still blame Benoit for what happened? Sure. However, this possibly rules out that he did it in cold blood, and that he's some sort of monster.

[lort]

I remember at the time I said I wouldn't be surprised if repeated concussions to the same areas of his brain might have affected him. Though I'm surprised it has taken so long to get results.

I don't think it matters too much for Benoit, but for the industry itself it could change things - even if it just making it harder and harder for companies to insure their athletes.

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Also, Alienoid, this wouldn't be manslaughter, it would still be murder. More likely than not, if this is true, he would have been found to have been insane.

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Shit..... I'd hate to be related to Mark Briscoe...

[IC Champion]

Could it have been prevented had he simply gone to a doctor and had his head checked? Probably.

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Originally Posted by Instant Classic Could it have been prevented had he simply gone to a doctor and had his head checked? Probably.

Depends on when it would have been caught really. It's not like brain trauma can just be fixed. It's a game of "what ifs" at this point.

[Loose Cannon]

he had to have gone to the doctor though and had a Cat scan sometime. I don't see how any wrestler wouldn't do this on a quartely basis. If so, you've got to wonder what doctors told him and didn't tell him.

[IC Champion]

Originally Posted by What Would Kevin Do? Depends on when it would have been caught really. It's not like brain trauma can just be fixed. It's a game of "what ifs" at this point.

No, but it can be treated, and he most likely would have retired, something that sounds like it should have been done 5 years ago.

[BigDaddyCool]

Originally Posted by Alienoid06 How many people in the WWE right now do you think have sore heads? It's a part of the business. I'm not saying it's right, but it's a business where you get banged up. Chris Benoit spent years in pain, which was what he expected, and in some ways wanted. It's what every wrestler is guilty of. If we're blaming people for the lead-in to these sorts of events, you might as well blame everyone wrestling right now. I know concussions can do crazy things, but how do you feel knowing that I could come up, bonk you on the head with something, and then you'd go home and kill your family? You don't want to look at yourself that way. I really doubt Chris Benoit ever said "I should stop wrestling, I might go on a massacre soon." It really doesn't work like that. Every guy who steps out there takes the risk of a head injury, and they still do it. They should all be guilty of reckless endangerment then, not just Chris Benoit. I'm not smiling over this whole thing, but as I said, it's good that Chris Benoit didn't actively seek out to kill anyone, especially his wife and son. As Rob said, the WWE should make brain scans compulsory, and they need to get on top of this thing and fix it. Why didn't they have brain scans before? Because, quite frankly, it was a risk that the industry did not see as relevant. Why should Chris Benoit if no one else does? As I said, there needs to be some responsibility for oneself, but no one really considered it a likelihood. How many discussions before Chris Benoit did anyone say "the WWE should have head scans so wrestlers don't hang themselves?" I can't recall one in my time as a fan. I was not aware that there were reports of Chris Benoit acting unusual. When were these? I was only aware of the text messages sent on the weekend this all went down. But let's say people did know that Benoit was going insane...why are they not getting the blame? Isn't there some kind of responsibility Vince owes to his performers?

Why can't you accept that Benoit was a grown man making desisions to hurt his own head? Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Chris start doing diving head butts way back in Japan? So, Benoit started wrestling what in 87? It is 2007 now, so for shits and giggles, he wrestled 20 years. Lets assume he wreslted 250 matches a year for the sake of arguement. Now I know some years he barely wrestled some years, and in his early years he probably worked 2 matches a day and more matches, but for the sake of argument, lets assume an average of 250 matches a year. And to my knowledge he did the diving head butt every match. For 250 matches (each with a diving head butt) for 20 years, that is 5000 diving head butts. That is 5000 more brain damaging head shots than your normal wrestler. And These are going to be far more taurmatic than other head shots as his head is dropping 11 feet to the canvis.

While hindsight is 20/20, if I was a wrestler, 1) I would never use a move where I drop myself on my head as a finisher, 2) if I did (hell even if I didn't) I would get a regular cat scan to make sure I'm not suffering to much brain damage. Because what is the point of making millions of dollars to retire to a nursing home.

So if you start looking at what Chris could have been doing for himself all along instead of just acting like this was an unforseeable tragidy, it starts to become pretty damning. It is Benoit's fault for dropping himself on his head. It is Benoit's fault for taking 'roids and pain killers. It is Benoit's fault for not trying to have a lighter schedule. And because he constantly choose to do nothing, it is all his fault his family is dead, and he hung himself.

[FourFifty]

Originally Posted by Instant Classic Also, as for this being political, I'm a Liberal, so....

Can I buy some weed from you?

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Originally Posted by Instant Classic No, but it can be treated, and he most likely would have retired, something that sounds like it should have been done 5 years ago.

Like LC said though, he should have had some sort of cat scan. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Benoit was diagnosed with a concussion within the last 2 years ( I think when he was feuding with Booker T), meaning this should have given him CAT scans at some point there.

I think there are more people to blame then just Benoit. Like I said origionally, athletes don't expect to go crazy and kill someone because of a concussion. If Benoit was fine, and this did come on suddenly, it's hard to blame him for not having his head checked out if he didn't have any issues with it, or symptoms. Should doctors have done followups? Should WWE make people do followups? Maybe.

I'm not saying Benoit wasn't in the wrong. We'll never know 100% what happened. I'm just saying if this is true, I don't think Benoit is a cold blooded murderer, or someone who should be held 100% responsible for his actions. If this was true, and he was alive and it went to court, the courts would find it as insanity.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool Why did Benoit's mental capacity diminsh? Wrestling...not just wrestling but head shots, many of which he did to himself? Benoit's fault.

Chris Benoit did take a lot of head bumps. That is his responsibility for getting into the business. He shares in some of that. Chris Jericho also hit Chris Benoit with a steel chair at the 2001 Royal Rumble, and I'm sure when he reads this news, he is going to feel like complete shit, as is anyone who ever hit Benoit in the head during one of their matches. Is it Benoit's fault? Of course it is.

Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool Oh, you didn't see this coming from Benoit, that means a lot because you are just some mark, so naturally you know jackshit about him on a personal level. And there was a person who did see this come and she is dead now. Nancy Benoit reportedly asked Chris to take a lighter schedule and probably even hinted at him retiring. And yes I can fault him for not knowing something bad would happen by constantly hitting his head on opponets, the mat, and steel chairs. Now, it would be impossible to see this scenrio coming, but it there are a few dozen other equally sad and depressing things that could have easily seen scenrios.

I still fail to understand what Chris Benoit is guilty of in the prelude to these events that any other guy in the industry isn't. I'm not forgetting what Chris Benoit did, not at all, I'm just asking what Benoit did that Stone Cold Steve Austin didn't do, or Kevin Nash didn't do. There isn't a damn thing. The only difference between Chris Benoit and someone who didn't do what he unfortunately did, is that Benoit actually did it, and he's the first. Chris Benoit should be precedent from this sort of thing, and people should learn from it, and put measures in place to make sure it never happens again. Putting the blame solely on Benoit, personally, doesn't fix anything. There needs to be some indictment of the scenario surrounding it.

I'll touch on Nancy Benoit later.

As for me being a mark and not knowing Benoit personally, neither do you, so what makes you better qualified to comment on Chris Benoit's state of mind? And besides, my point is that as a mark, I may not know Chris Benoit personally, but I know what hitting your head repeatedly can do. I didn't make any protest against Benoit wrestling. Fuck, I didn't make a protest against wrestling, either. Rob has the right idea, in that from this point on, there need to be head scans.

Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool No, this is Benoit's fault. Is it Vince MacMahon's personal responiciblity to go up to every superstar at every show and see if they want to work a lighter schedule? No. It is the superstar's resposibility to know what their body can and cannot physically take.

Um, hell fucking yes it is Vince's responsibility! Of course it is. If I'm running a school, I don't hire a pedophile as a teacher. Vince McMahon should have screenings in place to make sure that every single employee under him is sane, and if they are going to be taking chair shots to the head, are healthy enough to do so. Yes, someone should know how much they can physical take, but so should those in charge before they hire someone and instruct them to do something. Besides, this is not the business to say "Hey, um, I'm not feeling well today, can I go home?" Guys work with injuries all the time. I'm not saying that's right, but if anything, it makes Vince even more liable than what he normally would be. Chris Benoit didn't walk into the ring against Vince's knowledge, and hit himself over and over again with a steel chair, you know.

Now, onto what you've been saying about Nancy Benoit. For one, you are a mark, and don't know anything. I'm assuming that you read she spoke up from the reports that were circulating on the internet. These same reports said that Nancy Benoit wanted Chris Benoit to take some time off to help raise Daniel because she couldn't handle it. I don't see anything about worry for his health in there. I mean no disrespect to Nancy Benoit, may her soul rest in peace. She, herself, was a part of the business, so obviously didn't have a problem with Chris wrestling.

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool Why can't you accept that Benoit was a grown man making desisions to hurt his own head? Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Chris start doing diving head butts way back in Japan? So, Benoit started wrestling what in 87? It is 2007 now, so for shits and giggles, he wrestled 20 years. Lets assume he wreslted 250 matches a year for the sake of arguement. Now I know some years he barely wrestled some years, and in his early years he probably worked 2 matches a day and more matches, but for the sake of argument, lets assume an average of 250 matches a year. And to my knowledge he did the diving head butt every match. For 250 matches (each with a diving head butt) for 20 years, that is 5000 diving head butts. That is 5000 more brain damaging head shots than your normal wrestler. And These are going to be far more taurmatic than other head shots as his head is dropping 11 feet to the canvis. While hindsight is 20/20, if I was a wrestler, 1) I would never use a move where I drop myself on my head as a finisher, 2) if I did (hell even if I didn't) I would get a regular cat scan to make sure I'm not suffering to much brain damage. Because what is the point of making millions of dollars to retire to a nursing home. So if you start looking at what Chris could have been doing for himself all along instead of just acting like this was an unforseeable tragidy, it starts to become pretty damning. It is Benoit's fault for dropping himself on his head. It is Benoit's fault for taking 'roids and pain killers. It is Benoit's fault for not trying to have a lighter schedule. And because he constantly choose to do nothing, it is all his fault his family is dead, and he hung himself.

For it to be his fault, if this is true, it would have to be proven that he had reasonable knowledge that his job, his being dropped on his head, etc, could lead to the death of his family at his hands.

The same thing could happen to a boxer, or a football player, or a basketball player, etc.

Hell, if someone gets into a car accident and gets a concussion, can they be blamed for actions that happen later due to that concussion? Or since they now know what can happen when they drive, if they drive anyway and get into another accident, that causes another concussion, can they be blamed for their actions later caused by that concussion?

[IC Champion]

Originally Posted by FourFifty Can I buy some weed from you?

What you need? Bout to smoke some of BC's finest.

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Also, I'd say it's a split responsibility between the WWE and Benoit in regards to Benoit's health. I'm in no way saying the WWE is actually responsible for what happened. However, Benoit should be concerned about his own health and get checked up, but likewise, the WWE should be watching out for the best interest of it's employees.

[IC Champion]

I think the point we are both me and BDC making is that, while he isnt a calculated cold blooded killer we thought he was, he is still resonsible for his actions, and more importantly the actions that lead to, and caused this tradegy to happen.

[BigDaddyCool]

Alieniod...I know I'm a mark. Nancy Benoit had been concerned about Chris's health, I remember reading that. Also, her saying he needs to be home to help with Daniel could have been just something she was saying to get Chris out of the ring. It is hard to tell someone they need to quit the job they love, so she may have been using that as a way to hide what she really felt. But I can't say for sure as I am no her.

Also, I already commented above on how it is Benoit's fault, not Vince's.

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Originally Posted by Instant Classic I think the point we are both me and BDC making is that, while he isnt a calculated cold blooded killer we thought he was, he is still resonsible for his actions, and more importantly the actions that lead to, and caused this tradegy to happen.

I understand where you're coming from. Legally however, if this is true, he wouldn't be responsible for his actions. Likewise, it's hard to hold him accountable for the actions leading up to it if he had no reason to believe what it would cause later.

And you can't argue that a drunk may not know what drinking and getting behind the wheel of a car can do. What it comes down to is what an average person reasonablly knows. An average person knows drinking and driving can lead to killing someone. An average person does not know that an athletic career can directly lead to you killing someone.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Originally Posted by Pepsi Man So now...just questioning based on that analogy, as I'm not even entirely sure how I feel about all this...are you saying that if a drunk driver kills someone, you blame the people that did not stop him from getting behind the wheel?

Just to address your question, no I don't believe the people who stop a person from getting into a car should be the one's taking the blame. I mean that if you did see someone getting into a vehicle drunk, you would try to stop them, wouldn't you? You know, for the health and safety of them, and others? No one tried to stop Chris Benoit from the sounds of it. I'm not laying blame on anyone, rather trying to take it off them. I'm assuming that there were people close to Chris Benoit and that if they had seen him operating a vehicle drunk, they would have stopped him. If brain damage and drink driving can be compared (and they can't), and no one stopped Chris Benoit from "driving," surely they didn't know he was drinking.

My ideology behind it was that Chris Benoit is kind of precedent for these sort of things. No one expected Benoit to murder, it was not a foreseeable outcome. The results of drink driving are very foreseeable. Just throwing that out there.

But as WWKD, it is retarded to compare the two anyway, so I don't know why I bothered with this.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool Alieniod...I know I'm a mark. Nancy Benoit had been concerned about Chris's health, I remember reading that. Also, her saying he needs to be home to help with Daniel could have been just something she was saying to get Chris out of the ring. It is hard to tell someone they need to quit the job they love, so she may have been using that as a way to hide what she really felt. But I can't say for sure as I am no her. Also, I already commented above on how it is Benoit's fault, not Vince's.

This is where it gets really pointless to argue. For all we know, Nancy might have known that. That is just ifs and buts, and really can't be argued.

[IC Champion]

I give up.

[BigDaddyCool]

Originally Posted by What Would Kevin Do? For it to be his fault, if this is true, it would have to be proven that he had reasonable knowledge that his job, his being dropped on his head, etc, could lead to the death of his family at his hands. The same thing could happen to a boxer, or a football player, or a basketball player, etc. Hell, if someone gets into a car accident and gets a concussion, can they be blamed for actions that happen later due to that concussion? Or since they now know what can happen when they drive, if they drive anyway and get into another accident, that causes another concussion, can they be blamed for their actions later caused by that concussion?

OMG, I'm not trying to prove that he knew he was going to kill his family. I am saying he willfully dropped himself on his head some 5000 more times than an average wrestler. And I'm willing to assume the average wrestler is going to take a lot more unprotected head shots than the average football player. And as such, Benoit should have known full well he was hurting his own brain and should have at least thought to keep track of that with cat scans. Who really gives a fuck if WWE wasn't making him keep track of that, he should have been doing it himself. If your job doesn't offer you health care wouldn't you go out and get it yourself?

Benoit was an adult capible of making adult desisions sometime before he killed everyone in a retarded rage or whatever it was. His lack of action before that lead to this tragedy. I am not saying he should have gotten a crystal ball to know he was going to do this. I'm saying that if he got a regular cat-scan, then all of this could have been prevented. But what do I know, I'm dumb. I give up. It is all Vince McMahon's fault for bashing Chris's brains in with steriods and tell chris to kill his family.

Dumb fucks.

[BigDaddyCool]

Originally Posted by Alienoid06 This is where it gets really pointless to argue. For all we know, Nancy might have known that. That is just ifs and buts, and really can't be argued.

I'm sorry, I think I even said that in the paragraph you just quoted.

Anyhow, it is Benoit's own fault.

[BigDaddyCool]

Originally Posted by What Would Kevin Do? I understand where you're coming from. Legally however, if this is true, he wouldn't be responsible for his actions. Likewise, it's hard to hold him accountable for the actions leading up to it if he had no reason to believe what it would cause later. And you can't argue that a drunk may not know what drinking and getting behind the wheel of a car can do. What it comes down to is what an average person reasonablly knows. An average person knows drinking and driving can lead to killing someone. An average person does not know that an athletic career can directly lead to you killing someone.

Ignorance doesn't not negate accountablility in any sence.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Originally Posted by Instant Classic I think the point we are both me and BDC making is that, while he isnt a calculated cold blooded killer we thought he was, he is still resonsible for his actions, and more importantly the actions that lead to, and caused this tradegy to happen.

WWKD said it way better than I can, so I'm going to direct you to his post.

From the few law classes I took, I learned how operative that "responsible" is in a legal sense. Is Benoit responsible for the actions that led up to this? Personally, I do not think so, to a point. As WWKD said, it's like driving and then getting in an accident. Perhaps you shouldn't have been driving, ay? I'd normally be very similar in my hypotheticals, but WWKD is on the ball, and it's 4:15 am over here. He deserves all the positive rep in the world.

The big finding of this report is that Chris Benoit may NOT be responsible for what happened at the time of the crime. Fuck what went before it for a second, when he killed his wife and son, he was not legally sane. It's a small relief, as he is still a killer, but he's not cold-bolded in this case, as we can all agree on.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool I'm sorry, I think I even said that in the paragraph you just quoted. Anyhow, it is Benoit's own fault.

I know it's what you said, I was just re-iterating because you were pulling shit out from nowhere. I could be true, but it could have been false, too. We don't know. The operative word in that is "we." As in neither of us, therefore it applies to both.

[IC Champion]

Oh so now we allow law, to determine what we as people beleive to be morally right and wrong, and what is "personal repsonsibility?

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Originally Posted by BigDaddyCool Ignorance doesn't not negate accountablility in any sence.

I'll get to your other post in a minute, but i'd like to point out, if you read what I said above, yes it does. Legally, responsibility is derived from average, social, common knowledge. So legally, if the average person is ignorant of something, then yes, it can negate accountability.

[BigDaddyCool]

Originally Posted by Alienoid06 WWKD said it way better than I can, so I'm going to direct you to his post. From the few law classes I took, I learned how operative that "responsible" is in a legal sense. Is Benoit responsible for the actions that led up to this? Personally, I do not think so, to a point. As WWKD said, it's like driving and then getting in an accident. Perhaps you shouldn't have been driving, ay? I'd normally be very similar in my hypotheticals, but WWKD is on the ball, and it's 4:15 am over here. He deserves all the positive rep in the world. The big finding of this report is that Chris Benoit may NOT be responsible for what happened at the time of the crime. Fuck what went before it for a second, when he killed his wife and son, he was not legally sane. It's a small relief, as he is still a killer, but he's not cold-bolded in this case, as we can all agree on.

Yeah, he goes from cold blooded to a neglectful, ignorant, crazy killer, big relief their. Plus all his matches sucked.

[BigDaddyCool]

Originally Posted by What Would Kevin Do? I'll get to your other post in a minute, but i'd like to point out, if you read what I said above, yes it does. Legally, responsibility is derived from average, social, common knowledge. So legally, if the average person is ignorant of something, then yes, it can negate accountability.

I meant ignorance of the law doesn't negate accountablility. And if you bash your own brains in to the point you don't know what you are doing any more, still makes you accountable. The same goes for going on a bad acid trip and killing someone during such a trip. Still accountable, even though you think you are killing the devil or something.