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Old 03-30-2010, 10:52 AM   #1
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And then there were 2...
Shawn Michaels has left the building, the man we all grew up with is retired...for now.

That leaves only two guys from the mid/late 90s in HHH and Undertaker who are on that different level than everyone else. Those two guys have that connection with the crowd no matter what.

WWE is gonna be fucked pretty soon, because going from HBK and Taker to Cena will be a significant drop.







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Old 03-30-2010, 10:54 AM   #2
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Jakob Synn does not have that much rep yet (10+)
I'm just wondering if at every even numbered Wrestlemania there will be a big retirement match from now on.

And my fucking god innovator! your sig is making my computer lag bad
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Old 03-30-2010, 10:56 AM   #3
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They still Jericho and Edge. And apparently Randy Orton is going to be the biggest babyface since the Rock judging by his reactions lately.
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Old 03-30-2010, 11:31 AM   #4
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Thing is Jericho and Edge were just getting started in WWE then, there are legit for us, but not for people who haven't been watching regularly.
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Old 03-30-2010, 11:43 AM   #5
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what about funaki, he's been there a long ass time

and mark henry
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Old 03-30-2010, 11:44 AM   #6
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I think Mark Henry is actually #2 after Taker for 'senior performers' lol
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Old 03-30-2010, 11:48 AM   #7
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Don't forget the Big Show
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:02 PM   #8
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I'm diggin' Show Miz.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:03 PM   #9
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Don't forget the Big Show
or Kane.

But they aren't on the level of Taker and Triple H.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:32 PM   #10
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golddust lol
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:43 PM   #11
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They'll always build new stars.

Shawn Michaels is one of a kind and you'll be hard pressed to find guys that could put on his high quality of matches but there will always be someone new. The WWE has a bunch of wrestlers given 20 minutes of ring time to work could put on 4 stars or better matche and they are as followes

Triple H (as you mentioned)
The Undertaker (as you mentioned)
Christian
Evan Borne
MVP
Randy Orton
Chris Jericho
CM Punk
Edge
Rey Mysterio
Shelton Benjamin
Daniel Bryan

And those are just the people that have proved that they could put on five star matches. I suspect that guys like Jack Swagger, Kofi Kingston, Ted DiBiase, Cody Rhodes, Shemus, and other given the oppertunity can put on five star matches.

Also about half the names I mention have a great connection with the crowd that the WWE could take advantage of.

None of those guys are Shawn Michaels but given their chance they'll do quite well.
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Old 03-30-2010, 01:19 PM   #12
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In some ways this is sad, but in other ways this is really interesting. The senior guys like Chris Jericho, Edge and even Kane suddenly get bumped up by default. While it would be nice if they got a rub or some such, when you look at many of the eras people define the WWE by, a lot of guys got moved up just because there was no one else. If the WWE can't rely on Shawn Michaels or The Undertaker or even Triple H as much (he won't be retiring soon, but it makes sense for him to move out of the spotlight a bit now that his family is growing and he's getting older), they won't be relying on them -- plain and simple.

The WWE will have to create new stars, and this is where things will get interesting. After WrestleMania XXV there was talk of elevating new guys, and we've seen some weird pushes come up over the last year or so (heel CM Punk, R-Truth, Sheamus and even, for a little while, Dolph Ziggler and John Morrison). With Randy Orton turning face, it also leaves room for a new power heel on RAW.

After being one of only three heels to defend a World Title successfully at WrestleMania, Chris Jericho is looking like a golden god right now. This is not a bad thing. With Shawn Michaels out of the way, he's also probably the best pure performer in the entire WWE right now. If The Undertaker steps down, then you can move up Kane, who finally won't be in anyone's shadow. As a mark for him, that is interesting for me. He's recently entered a stage where his ring work has been better than it arguably has his entire career, and he's been getting different sort of "respect pops" in some arenas lately. It's not just that he's consistently over, it's that he's over and he's been around for ages as a solid big man performer.

I just read an interview where Triple H not only put over Sheamus huge, but made note of Kofi Kingston and The Miz as guys with tremendous work ethic. As he takes on more of a grooming role, you gotta believe those guys are on his radar. Jack Swagger has just won Money in the Bank, and one of my thoughts during that match was how solid Evan Bourne was made to look. He not only got a WrestleMania payday, but he was put in the position where it looked like he could have won the match but chose to do something to please the fans.

Some of the veterans left over, like Big Show, Kane and even Chris Jericho may not seem like they are on the level of Shawn Michaels and The Undertaker now -- but when those guys aren't there above them, they will be seen as the top dogs by default. At least, I hope so.
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Old 03-30-2010, 01:15 PM   #13
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I think as long as they don't have Orton shaking hands with babyfaces and playing to the crowd too much, that he's going to be their huge star. I think they just have to be really careful with his character.

I never got that though..whenever a heel gets good reactions, the writing team thinks "Okay lets capitalize", and then proceed to completely change their character from what the people fell in love with in the first place. I just really hope Orton's not a victim of this, because he has huge potential as a face.
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Old 03-30-2010, 01:22 PM   #14
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I think as long as they don't have Orton shaking hands with babyfaces and playing to the crowd too much, that he's going to be their huge star. I think they just have to be really careful with his character.

I never got that though..whenever a heel gets good reactions, the writing team thinks "Okay lets capitalize", and then proceed to completely change their character from what the people fell in love with in the first place. I just really hope Orton's not a victim of this, because he has huge potential as a face.
This is true. I've had an on-again/off-again relationship with Randy Orton as a fan. When he started, I thought he did well as the generic blue-chipper babyface. When he did his RNN reports, I thought he had great cocky potential. Evolution was great, and then he won the World Heavyweight Title. All good. Then his face run was awkward, watered-down, and he turned heel again. He has had some good moments since, but I've never really gotten into him except an odd feud here and there. I legitimately marked out for him at WrestleMania, though. He was played his role perfectly, didn't pander, but had complete crowd control. It was very Stone Cold-like.

I hope the WWE have not forgotten how his last face run went, and that they don't change Orton, and just let him be Orton who gets cheered. He will be fine, will sell t-shirts, and everyone will be happy. I think it will be great for his ring work, too. For some reason, intense Orton as a face is someone I can imagine having some classic matches. And while it may not be a popular choice -- if they draft Orton or Cena to SmackDown!, keep them apart for a year, or only tease the occasional confrontation (like they did on RAW), a WrestleMania match between the two next year could be cash. It'd remind me of Austin/Rock from X-7, where I was firmly behind Austin even though both were faces.
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Old 03-30-2010, 01:33 PM   #15
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Yes and Orton has the potential to surpass Cena if they keep him as an anti-hero. This will allow men to cheer him, women will cheer him because he is good looking and kids will cheer a face by default.
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Old 03-30-2010, 01:52 PM   #16
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was the rock or stone cold on smackdown? who the fuck watches smackdown? move it to wednesdays n make it LIVE!

Orton is becoming the new rock/stone cold.. guy you love to hate but gotta cheer for..

Cena's character is washed down... He's like too much over as a face.. never been a decent big heel..
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Old 03-30-2010, 01:58 PM   #17
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was the rock or stone cold on smackdown? who the fuck watches smackdown? move it to wednesdays n make it LIVE!

Orton is becoming the new rock/stone cold.. guy you love to hate but gotta cheer for..

Cena's character is washed down... He's like too much over as a face.. never been a decent big heel..
smackdown IS the rocks' show

cena isn't even a decent face about 1/4 of the crowd cheer for him and i only think that they cheer to irl troll all the 3/4 that boo, although it was funny when cena went and rejoiced with the 'i hate cena' club at ringside after her won at WM
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Old 03-30-2010, 02:06 PM   #18
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I found it funny when The Rock was originally drafted to RAW, though.

Cena and Orton could really have that Austin/Rock chemistry. In the day, I never really liked The Rock too much. His personality was just too...yeah. Now I would kill to have him back, but I was an Austin man, much like today I would be an Orton man.
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Old 03-30-2010, 02:34 PM   #19
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I gots to way in on this one...

RKO: Love how he's doing right now. As long as they don't change him, he'll be bigger than Cena in no time. That makes room for...

Cena: It's time. So he's selling merch, doesn't matter. A solid heel turn while he's got the belt would totally freshen him up. People will still buy his shit if they actually want to see him again. Quit smiling so much and make us give a damn about the fact that you can supposedly kick everyone's ass.

Y2J: So everyone says he's not on the same level as HBK. Yeah, OK. No, he just hasn't been pushed like HBK. The man can go, and go, and go. Let him do his thing and it'll never stop. Book him right (like they have lately) and he'll not wanna go on a several year vacation.

Edge: See RKO. Even if he's a face, don't forget about the fact that this is the man that'll do whatever it takes to get what he wants. Don't change the character, let the fans decide.

Xtian: There's a reason he goes by captain charisma. The man has proven he can get over without the help of the guys writing this shit. Let him. How many people on this list would he not be great in a match with?

Sheamus: hadn't really seen much of what he's done, but I did enjoy his WM match with Trips. If the Game approves, he's gonna go places.

Punk: Great gimmick. Great performer. Nuff said.

Point is: they got the talent to pack every house the step into. Can they use it?
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Old 03-30-2010, 02:57 PM   #20
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Good post. I think wrestlers that have done great as heel/face are great wrestlers.. That's why I can't consider Cena a great wrestler. He needs to be sent to Smackdown or go film some movies and take a break... Maybe do a heel turn n dissappear. Y2J is a awesome wrestler because he knows how to work the crowd. I watched him on Lopez Tonight recently with David Arquette... HILARIOUS KARAOKE! I don't think Edge vs Jericho is good because these too are just too iffy when it comes to face or heel.. You have so much love/hate for each.. Now the big show,sheamus,the miz, etc.. we can hate these people without regard.

Yes, Undertaker needs to retire... Seriously.. Move Smackdown to WEDNESDAYS N MAKE IT LIVE!!!
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Old 03-30-2010, 03:02 PM   #21
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Good post. I think wrestlers that have done great as heel/face are great wrestlers.. That's why I can't consider Cena a great wrestler. He needs to be sent to Smackdown or go film some movies and take a break... Maybe do a heel turn n dissappear. Y2J is a awesome wrestler because he knows how to work the crowd. I watched him on Lopez Tonight recently with David Arquette... HILARIOUS KARAOKE! I don't think Edge vs Jericho is good because these too are just too iffy when it comes to face or heel.. You have so much love/hate for each.. Now the big show,sheamus,the miz, etc.. we can hate these people without regard.

Yes, Undertaker needs to retire... Seriously.. Move Smackdown to WEDNESDAYS N MAKE IT LIVE!!!
That's the best part... The fans get to decide who to cheer... That's not something WWE does so well and I gotta give em props for it.

I don't want anyone telling me who to cheer for. I loved Trips as a monster heel when he wasn't burying everyone else. I love Y2J, and Edge.
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Old 03-30-2010, 03:09 PM   #22
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So... Whats the future for DX?
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Old 03-30-2010, 03:11 PM   #23
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Ya got me on that one... hopefully they'll finally let it RIP... It deserves it.
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Old 03-30-2010, 03:54 PM   #24
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Wow, upon reading this I am not sure I want to get back into wrestling
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Old 03-30-2010, 03:56 PM   #25
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Actually.. You're right.. It does.. and I'm a huge fan of DX and factions, so that was hard to admit it.

However.. WWE needs more factions, stables, and focuses on Tag Team wrestling... Maybe Cena n Orton will be tag partners n be the coolest most athletic tag team partners currently on any product. Can you see them bein tag champs n going from raw to smackdown, etc? I could..
Now, he'd have to drop the title to someone then, because I'm against people holding multiple titles (like big show n jackass) because theres other wrestlers who deserve some of the spotlight too.

Dropping it to Sheamus so Trips vs Sheamus can be championship material would be a solid.
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Old 03-30-2010, 05:40 PM   #26
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WWE's new generation just lacks the x-factor. Orton hands down is the only one who has "it".

Call me crazy, but I think TNA's roster has a lot more potential and much better "rising stars"

AJ, Joe, Morgan, Pope, Beer Money, MCMG, Abyss, Wolfe, could even include Hardy I guess. All could be massive and be major stars for years.
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Old 03-30-2010, 05:46 PM   #27
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2 could become 3 if they sign Kurt.
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Old 03-30-2010, 05:47 PM   #28
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As much as the IWC loves Edge and Jericho, they are not the stars we see them as. HHH, Undertaker, and Kurt are the only stars left from that era. Obviously Cena, Orton and Batista are over, but I'm going with Inno's premise.
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