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Old 12-07-2011, 02:04 PM   #1
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Zack Ryder: Next Big Thing or Flash in the Pan?


The story of Zack Ryder has definitely been an inspirational one. He essentially opened a social media parachute to save himself from a seemingly inevitable plummet into the volcano of future endeavors and has somehow become a main feature on Raw. Good for him. Now, one has to wonder...does Zack Ryder have what it takes to become an actual STAR in the professional wrestling world? Are people too caught up in his story to actually evaluate the talent that we're dealing with here?

From a personal standpoint, I think Ryder is pretty decent in the ring. However, I've yet to hear a captivating promo from him, and he often comes off as quite corny on screen. It was never more prevalent for me than this most recent Raw in both his promos with Cena/Laurinitis and his reaction after he lost to Cena. Hell, even his victory celebration after the Henry win felt corny and contrived.

Before I start rambling too much more, I guess I'm just trying to say that Zack Ryder is a feel-good story, and I wish the dude nothing but success for sticking his neck on the line and just "going for it"...but I really don't think he's the STAR that some other people may think he is.

Your thoughts, please.

FREAKY! OUTTIE!

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Old 12-07-2011, 02:09 PM   #2
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He's what is hot right now, the Internet show got him way over, fans love him. I don't think he's a STAR either.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:09 PM   #3
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Totally just a flash in the pan, no doubt about it. I think he has bought for himself at least a consistent mid-card spot though. Which isn't bad at all considering where he was before.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:10 PM   #4
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I think that as he is right now, Zack Ryder is decent in the ring, but I have yet to see him wrestle more than 5 minutes. So for all I know, he only has three moves. His promos are OK, but far from the best. Maybe he needs a bit more practice? He hasn't been relevant for that long, so it's kind of hard to see if he can improve his skills. Ziggler used to be pretty average in terms of promos, then all of a sudden he just got it.

So right now, Ryder is too goofy to be taken seriously, but I want to give him a chance to improve, If he takes it up a notch both promo and wrestling-wise, he'll do just fine. I don't see him main-eventing though.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:10 PM   #5
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He is kind of in the middle. After about half of a year I see him being a mid to lower-carder for the rest of his life. Would compare what his status will be like after this flash is done to Kofi Kingston.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:12 PM   #6
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My biggest concern for Ryder, is that the whole internet show and the 'underdog who can't get a push' thing won't work forever. Eventually if he really wants to step up, he'll have to get a bit more serious, and since Long Island Iced Z and basically Ryder's 'loser' persona is what got him over in the first place, it really comes down to if the fans will buy him as a legit contender when he starts to evolve.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:12 PM   #7
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I'm not sure his current "gimmick" is going to give him too much longevity in the long run. He should do well for himself in the mid-card over the next couple of years though.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:13 PM   #8
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I almost feel bad making this thread, because I was a huge Ryder mark in ECW. I remember going to an ECW taping a couple years ago and I started yelling "WOO WOO WOO!" when he entered. Everybody around me was looking at me like I was retarded.

Something about his reaction to his lost to Cena just really irked me, though.

"THAT WAS MY LAST SHOT, BRO! WHAT AM I GONNA DO NOW, BRO?"

Yuck.

This gimmick has a pretty finite shelf life, and I think I may be getting tired of it already.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:13 PM   #9
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I would say to just give him time. His in-ring work isn't too shabby, and he clearly has the charisma it takes to make it. I would say he just needs to work on his mic skills.

Overall I find him pretty entertaining, and if they handle the US Title chase (run?) correctly, I would hope to see him for quite awhile.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:17 PM   #10
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I think that as he is right now, Zack Ryder is decent in the ring, but I have yet to see him wrestle more than 5 minutes. So for all I know, he only has three moves. His promos are OK, but far from the best. Maybe he needs a bit more practice? He hasn't been relevant for that long, so it's kind of hard to see if he can improve his skills. Ziggler used to be pretty average in terms of promos, then all of a sudden he just got it.

So right now, Ryder is too goofy to be taken seriously, but I want to give him a chance to improve, If he takes it up a notch both promo and wrestling-wise, he'll do just fine. I don't see him main-eventing though.
He had some long matches in ECW, and they were generally pretty good. As far as promos:



...they could definitely use some work.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:18 PM   #11
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He's just a solid mid card-upper mid card guy. Nothing wrong with that.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:20 PM   #12
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My biggest concern for Ryder, is that the whole internet show and the 'underdog who can't get a push' thing won't work forever. Eventually if he really wants to step up, he'll have to get a bit more serious, and since Long Island Iced Z and basically Ryder's 'loser' persona is what got him over in the first place, it really comes down to if the fans will buy him as a legit contender when he starts to evolve.
I agree with this. I think they pushed him too hard, too fast. They could have run with the underdog thing for a while and just had him be considered more of a joke by his peers, even though he somehow won 'fluke' matches. There was no reason to have him pin Ziggler like nineteen times, though.

My idea would have been to keep the Ryder usage to a MINIMUM until the fans were basically salivating and DEMANDING to see Ryder. It's too early to have him featured in four segments (including two matches) on Raw.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:21 PM   #13
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Flash, but hes paved the way for a lot of other guys in his position to get over even when they arent on TV.

Look at how many other guys have Youtube shows and Twitter accounts now after his success.

Matt Hardy might have been the first to do it, but Ryder has 'revolutionised' it.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:23 PM   #14
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And Ted DiBiase has set it back.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:24 PM   #15
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Also, I'd almost say that Miz and Morrison used an internet show to their advantage just as well as Ryder did. It was also a better show.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:27 PM   #16
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And Ted DiBiase has set it back.
ARE YOU TALKING SMACK ABOUT THE DIBIASE POSSE!!!!!
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:30 PM   #17
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Trying much too hard to capitalize on popular trends. That sort of relates to this thread, but I think we can save this discussion for another time.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:32 PM   #18
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:33 PM   #19
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:43 PM   #20
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Maybe not top star status or future top star status but he's managed to at least position himself to be a high mid-card wrestler for the next couple of years.

Compared to where he was almost a year ago, he's improved by a lot with more tv time and built up his fanbase with the lack of the WWE's help until recently.

His best long term plans would be a slow build up into a potential main event status similar to the Miz and Ziggler but this time as a face wrestler. The Miz and Ziggler benefited a lot from the slow build and used that time to improve a lot in both character and overall skills.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:45 PM   #21
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I don't think his build has been very slow. He basically went from 'jobber' to 'threat' in a matter of weeks.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:48 PM   #22
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I agree with this. I think they pushed him too hard, too fast. They could have run with the underdog thing for a while and just had him be considered more of a joke by his peers, even though he somehow won 'fluke' matches. There was no reason to have him pin Ziggler like nineteen times, though.

My idea would have been to keep the Ryder usage to a MINIMUM until the fans were basically salivating and DEMANDING to see Ryder. It's too early to have him featured in four segments (including two matches) on Raw.
My memory is kind of hazy, but didn't Punk and Cena start mentioning him getting more Raw time in their promos/Tweets/Etc back around June or July when everyone started "keeping it real" and dropping pipe bombs in their segments? That was probably the gift and curse for him because those guys gave him even more notoriety to the point where it would be hard for Ziggler and other midcard heels to characterize him as a joke when the two biggest stars in the company openly support him and the fans are chanting his name.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:54 PM   #23
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They could have characterized him as a joke based on his previous track record. They started giving him wins right after all that.
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:57 PM   #24
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Trying much too hard to capitalize on popular trends. That sort of relates to this thread, but I think we can save this discussion for another time.
I am now a Ted Dibiase fan.
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:04 PM   #25
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Ted "The Masterpiece" DiBiase?
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:15 PM   #26
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Ted "The Tebow" DiBiase
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:26 PM   #27
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Like I said in another thread, I think the guy can evolve from here. He needs to tweak his character slightly, and change his promo style a bit, but given some time I can't see why he couldn't stay relevant. I remember it was only a couple of years ago everybody was against CAWdy Rhodes.....
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:29 PM   #28
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Ted "The Tebow" DiBiase
That could be a great gimmick actually. Have him break out an old school 50s-60s style offense against his foes as everyone bashes him saying it will never work, but he somehow wins match after match and endears himself to everyone in the process.
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:32 PM   #29
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Yeah, if he evolves his character (by which I mean almost completely dropping it, like Cena did the rapper), then all of this goes out the window and he will have to be evaluated again.

He isn't in a position like Santino Marella where he is almost stuck in that one gimmick. Still has the potential for change.
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:45 PM   #30
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ARE YOU STUCK IN THE MID-CARD, BRO?
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:52 PM   #31
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I think that as he is right now, Zack Ryder is decent in the ring, but I have yet to see him wrestle more than 5 minutes. So for all I know, he only has three moves. His promos are OK, but far from the best. Maybe he needs a bit more practice? He hasn't been relevant for that long, so it's kind of hard to see if he can improve his skills. Ziggler used to be pretty average in terms of promos, then all of a sudden he just got it.

So right now, Ryder is too goofy to be taken seriously, but I want to give him a chance to improve, If he takes it up a notch both promo and wrestling-wise, he'll do just fine. I don't see him main-eventing though.
He had better matches on ECW then anything thats on now...most were longer then 5 mins
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:55 PM   #32
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His series of matches with Christian on ECW were pretty damn good, and as his internet show has exhibited, he's got more than a little charisma. Remember, he's only what, 25 or so? Given that he's got plenty of time to develop and that he's already garnered a fanbase (which will stop him from getting prematurely fired), I think he's got some real potential.

Will he main event Wrestlemania? Probably not. But if he continues on an upward trend, I can see him grabbing a world title shot here or there, maybe even a run with the strap.
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:56 PM   #33
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This echos others in the thread, but he is definitely a flash in the pan. He got over on his own, which is great, but it also means that WWE is automatically going to take a dislike towards him because no matter how much they publicly state it's up to the guys to get noticed, they don't want that. He was honestly really lucky to get the push he has because he has guys like Punk and Cena behind him. Without Cena especially, I don't think he would have gone anywhere in WWE and the YouTube series would have been his demise.

I don't think WWE sees him as anything more than something they can milk for merch. As much as people want to say he's over like rover, it's really only with a portion of the fans. The portion that Vince McMahon and the suits detest. Which is another knock against him. To be fair, he is slowly gaining more of a mainstream fanbase, but I think it will fizzle out long before WWE really takes notice of his real worth.

I do think he's solid and there's room for him to grow out of this gimmick and become, at the very least, a solid midcard mainstay. However, as I've said before, I believe that WWE will leave him too long in this gimmick and he'll forever be seen as a Eugene or Santino. Stuck in a terrible side-show gimmick that happens to get over. And there's nothing wrong with that on the surface unless he plans to stay in the business as a top star, because, as said, there's only a finite amount of steam he has for this gimmick before it becomes really old hat and destroys any chance of evolution from the character.
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:59 PM   #34
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Quote:
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I almost feel bad making this thread, because I was a huge Ryder mark in ECW. I remember going to an ECW taping a couple years ago and I started yelling "WOO WOO WOO!" when he entered. Everybody around me was looking at me like I was retarded.

Something about his reaction to his lost to Cena just really irked me, though.

"THAT WAS MY LAST SHOT, BRO! WHAT AM I GONNA DO NOW, BRO?"

Yuck.

This gimmick has a pretty finite shelf life, and I think I may be getting tired of it already.
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Old 12-07-2011, 04:06 PM   #35
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Zack Ryder's in-character promo response to this thread: ARE YOU SERIOUS BRO?! [/End Promo]
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Old 12-07-2011, 04:15 PM   #36
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Another problem with the gimmick is that on his show, he has complete control. I've not seen it, but I'm willing to bet that it's 100 times better than anything WWE has written for him. And that's a huge problem for getting the character itself over to the masses.

Or I could be wrong and it's already wearing thin on the YT show. Again, I've never seen it.
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Old 12-07-2011, 04:19 PM   #37
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I would bet that he's never going to rise above the midcard, but I was also pretty sure The Miz and Cody Rhodes would do the same thing, and those two have never had a crowd reaction like Ryder gets.

So who knows
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Old 12-07-2011, 04:20 PM   #38
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Old 12-07-2011, 04:28 PM   #39
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Flash in the Pan, his character is well over but not main event material IMO. stick to being a mid-carder.
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Old 12-07-2011, 04:47 PM   #40
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I want to see him and his bro Cena form 2 Doosh.
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