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Old 02-19-2005, 06:38 PM   #1
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Mania 21 starting to look hot (spoilers)
Here's the unofficial line-up:

WORLD HEAVYWEIGHT TITLE
Triple H vs. Batista

WWE TITLE
JBL vs. John Cena

The Undertaker vs. Randy Orton

Rey Mysterio vs. Eddie Guerrero

Kurt Angle vs. Shawn Michaels

Chris Benoit vs. Chris Jericho

Matt Hardy vs. Kane vs. Gene Snitsky


I'm stoked.

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Old 02-19-2005, 06:41 PM   #2
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yea, pretty cool. Plus Hogan/Austin/Piper may be involved.
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Old 02-19-2005, 06:48 PM   #3
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Piper is bound to be involved. He is being inducted into the Hall of Fame so they'll probably do the same thing they did at last year's WM where they had all the new Hall of Famers come out and take a bow and such.

And if Piper is there, you KNOW he'll do something else.
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Old 02-19-2005, 06:55 PM   #4
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What do you guys think they will do with these guys

Edge
Christian
Shelton Benjamin
La Resistance
Booker T
The Big Show
The Bashams
The crusierweights

I'd expect Shelton vs Christian and Booker T vs Heidenrich to be added atleast to the Heat card

I think it would work well if each brand had a number 1 contender match. Maybe Big Show against Booker T and Edge vs Jericho vs Benoit

There just isn't a spot for Edge or TBS right now
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Old 02-19-2005, 07:04 PM   #5
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Yeah, it looks pretty good. Here's how I'd like to see the card develope:

World Heavyweight Championship
Triple H vs. Batista

WWE Championship/WWE United States Championship
John Bradshaw Layfield vs. John Cena

Interpromotional Match
The Undertaker vs. Randy Orton

Interpromotional Match
Kurt Angle vs. Shawn Michaels

WWE Intercontinenal Championship
Shelton Benjamin vs. Muhammad Hassan

Singles Match
Edge vs. Mick Foley

Grudge Match
Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio

Triple Threat Match
Kane vs. Gene Snitsky vs. Matt Hardy

World Tag Team Championship
Christian & Tyson Tomko vs. Chris Benoit & Chris Jericho

WWE Tag Team Championship
The Basham Brothers vs. Hardcore Holly & Charlie Haas

Handicap Match
Rhyno vs. William Regal & Tajiri

WWE Women's Championship
Trish Stratus vs. Christy Hemme

WWE Cruiserweight Championship in a Ladder Match
Paul London vs. Akio

Grudge Match
Booker T vs. Heidenreich
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Old 02-19-2005, 07:15 PM   #6
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Has anybody here seen a JBL vs Cena singles match? I have at a house show last year and, believe me, it was the shittest match of the night (btw Orlando Jordan and Chuck Palumbo were in singles matches that night)
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Old 02-19-2005, 07:41 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruiserweight 3:16
Has anybody here seen a JBL vs Cena singles match? I have at a house show last year and, believe me, it was the shittest match of the night (btw Orlando Jordan and Chuck Palumbo were in singles matches that night)
Then I hope to God they at least take some pressure of the guys and have Batista added in there.

How does this sound for a SmackDown! main event: John Bradshaw Layfield vs. John Cena vs. Kurt Angle vs. Shawn Michaels. Granted it takes away from HBK and Angle, but it adds something to te SmackDown! side of things to make it seem more special and important.
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Old 02-19-2005, 07:44 PM   #8
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That's not at you guys, that's at WM.
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Old 02-19-2005, 09:32 PM   #9
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Give Cena vs JBL a gimmick match. Something like Flaming Tables Supported by Ladders in a Barbed Wire Elimination Chamber Padlocked by a Bunch of Steel Chairs Surrounded by a Kennel from Hell Match.
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Old 02-19-2005, 09:39 PM   #10
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Where's all this Taker/Orton stuff coming from? I've seen no build up?
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Old 02-19-2005, 10:12 PM   #11
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For Cena/JBL to work there has to be a gimmick. Niether of the guys are exactly great in the ring. I love Cena as a character, but I don't really like to watch him wrestle.
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Old 02-19-2005, 11:42 PM   #12
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isnt there 7 weeks before Wrestlemania?
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Old 02-19-2005, 11:53 PM   #13
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HHH/Batista will be the last. The dude who wins the Rumble gets to be in the Main Main Event. As in the last match.

Anyways... gimmick match for Cena/JBL? I say put them in one of my very own creations.... the GBSMWYCGBAPRRH! Which stands for the Gouging, Burning, Slashing Match Where You Can Get Burned And Possibly Really Really Hurt!

Replace the ropes with barbed wire. Surround the ring in a cage... Which is heated so it BURNS. Allow each competitor to bring in one trash can filled with whatever objects they want.

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Old 02-20-2005, 12:04 AM   #14
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Yea I don't see how they are going to build up Taker/Orton that quickly since Orton is with Stacy now and that automatically makes him a fully fleged face. They really have to start building this up right away if they want to make it believable.
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Old 02-20-2005, 12:16 AM   #15
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Yup. Mania 21 is shaping up to be S-P-L-E-N-D-I-D. I actually have faith that this year will be. Orton/Taker could be great, if not only for the atmosphere and build-up alone. And did I read that right on the front page that Taker is actually "willing" to job?

Batista/Triple H I'm looking forward to, actually. They've really done a great job in turning big Dave into a guy the fans can really root for. Dave Batista, how can you not love the guy?



Angle/Michaels is gonna be great, though. I'm really looking forward to that one. It's gotta be one of my most anticipated matches of the card. Unfortunate, though, that it might be Angle's last match.

Eddie/Mysterio could be classic if done right. I'd have Mysterio go over, then send him into a short-term WWE Championship program with Cena(who I'm putting all my money on to win the title at Mania, whether I like him or not). Have Cena retain, then have Mysterio win the U.S. Title. Hopefully Cena will have dropped it before Mania. If not, then just have Mysterio win the U.S. Title right off the bat.

Overall, though, Mania 21 is looking good.
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Old 02-20-2005, 12:17 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayo
Yea I don't see how they are going to build up Taker/Orton that quickly since Orton is with Stacy now and that automatically makes him a fully fleged face.
This is the WWE we're talking about. They can turn a heel to a face (and vice versa) at a drop of a dime and never give an explanation.
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Old 02-20-2005, 12:20 AM   #17
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yeah, the US Title would totally suit Rey Rey. BLING BLING!
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Old 02-20-2005, 12:26 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyman
The fans will turn on Orton regardless of whether Stacy is by his side or not. I'm pretty sure that the fans will (clearly) be on Taker's side.
Well with the two of them being on different shows, I don't see where the interaction will occur between Taker and Orton in order to make the fans cheer for Taker and therefore making Orton the heel (albeit a slight heel) in this case. This is why I said that if they are going to go this route, then they have to start it REALLY soon for it to be effective.
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Old 02-20-2005, 11:48 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Naitch
yeah, the US Title would totally suit Rey Rey. BLING BLING!
As long as he doesnt keep the spinning belt.
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Old 02-20-2005, 11:57 AM   #20
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Yeah, looking quite cool right now.
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Old 02-20-2005, 01:44 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan
Piper is bound to be involved. He is being inducted into the Hall of Fame so they'll probably do the same thing they did at last year's WM where they had all the new Hall of Famers come out and take a bow and such.

And if Piper is there, you KNOW he'll do something else.
yea i see piper geting involved in the y2j match since the hightlight real was started to fued with pipers pit before piper was fired.
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Old 02-20-2005, 01:46 PM   #22
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Seems like a strong card in the ring, but poor at the box office.

Batista-HHH will definately go on last. Its the best built storyline going into the show, and well, HHH is a huuuuuuuuuuuge mark, so.

Cena-JBL will be fine, in that it wont suck, but of course it wont be great. Heyman you really need to watch SD. Cena is over, the fans should be behind him. However, I do expect an overbooked match. I expect a coupple of ref bumps, Cabinet interference, and a lot of F-U's.

Rey/Eddie, Benoit/Jericho, Angle/HBK should all be great for workrate fans.

I really hope they do Edge vs Foley, because as of right now, Edge looks pretty screwed with no Mania opponent.

Orton/Taker could be alright as long as Orton wins. I'd love to see him totally lay out Taker after the match.

Big Show and BT are kinda screwed on SD, they dont really have obvious programs heading into the show. I got a feeling we could get Show vs Heidenreich, and man would that suck.

For the CW title, I would do London-Chavo and for the tag titles I would do Christian and Tomko vs Tajiri and Regal on RAW and the returning babyface Dudleys vs Bashams on SD.

But with all that, I dont see one match that will have a casual fan coming out to see the show.
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Old 02-20-2005, 01:48 PM   #23
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The Dudleys vs. The Bashams for the Tag Titles are also a rumored Mania match.

Also I heard that Big Show might take on that Sumo wrestler they worked an angle with in Japan.
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Old 02-21-2005, 12:36 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The CyNick
Cena-JBL will be fine, in that it wont suck, but of course it wont be great. Heyman you really need to watch SD. Cena is over, the fans should be behind him. However, I do expect an overbooked match. I expect a coupple of ref bumps, Cabinet interference, and a lot of F-U's.
Dude,

I don't doubt the fact that the fans will be behind John Cena. I've even admitted to the fact that Cena and Guerrero are arguably the two biggest faces in the WWE.

The problem however, is with JBL. Is JBL's character great? Yes. Is it great as a main-eventer? FUCK no. JBL has looked like a complete joke as a main-eventer in my opinion. The guy has had almost ZERO clean victories over credible opponents!


JBL is a great character, but the fans don't care about him as a main-eventer.

Triple H may be tremendously stale as a heel (or main-eventer for that matter), but atleast the fans still respect the fact that Batista possibly defeating "former mentor" Triple H would be something of huge significance.


Cena has beaten the likes of Big Show, Booker T, and now Angle.

Should people be unbelievably surpised if Cena beats JBL at Mania? Should there be a huge face pop afterwards?


If Austin defeated Marc Mero in the main-event at Wrestlemania (instead of Shawn Michaels) would it have "meant as much"?
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Old 02-21-2005, 01:38 AM   #25
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Quote:
WWE Tag Team Championship
The Basham Brothers vs. Hardcore Holly & Charlie Haas

Handicap Match
Rhyno vs. William Regal & Tajiri

WWE Women's Championship
Trish Stratus vs. Christy Hemme

take out these 3
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Old 02-21-2005, 02:07 AM   #26
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All I wanna know is how, if this is true, the Taker/ Orton fued will be set up. There is not enough time to build this as much as they build up the other WM matches. I feel it will be set up so horribly like we find out that Taker hates concussions and attacks RKO because of this or Randy is upset at Taker's WM return last year and wants to "kill" off the Dead Man for good.

... Or they just announce it's RKO v. Taker. It just doesn't work at all.

And if Cena v. JBL needs a gimmick for WM, here's the perfect one: Lumberjack match, only... the lumberjacks are covered in barb wire. That = ....meh.
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Old 02-21-2005, 11:04 AM   #27
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No no! The lumberjacks are on FIRE!!
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Old 02-21-2005, 01:21 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyman
Dude,

I don't doubt the fact that the fans will be behind John Cena. I've even admitted to the fact that Cena and Guerrero are arguably the two biggest faces in the WWE.

The problem however, is with JBL. Is JBL's character great? Yes. Is it great as a main-eventer? FUCK no. JBL has looked like a complete joke as a main-eventer in my opinion. The guy has had almost ZERO clean victories over credible opponents!


JBL is a great character, but the fans don't care about him as a main-eventer.

Triple H may be tremendously stale as a heel (or main-eventer for that matter), but atleast the fans still respect the fact that Batista possibly defeating "former mentor" Triple H would be something of huge significance.


Cena has beaten the likes of Big Show, Booker T, and now Angle.

Should people be unbelievably surpised if Cena beats JBL at Mania? Should there be a huge face pop afterwards?


If Austin defeated Marc Mero in the main-event at Wrestlemania (instead of Shawn Michaels) would it have "meant as much"?
People went nuts when Warrior beat HTM for the IC belt. HTM never got one legit win in his whole run, people just wanted to see Warrior win/HTM lose.

HBK didn't have any legitimate wins before he dropped the title to Austin in 98, but people still popped for it.

And JBL did win the Armageddon and Rumble matches somewhat clean.

I personally think its more important who is chasing the title, than who the champ is. I think people want to see Cena win, so they'll pop when it happens.
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Old 02-21-2005, 02:25 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The CyNick
I personally think its more important who is chasing the title, than who the champ is. I think people want to see Cena win, so they'll pop when it happens.
People pop when Cena said "I just pooped my pants!"

In fact, people would pop if he DID shit his shorts.

Doesn't mean it makes for a good match.
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Old 02-21-2005, 04:41 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
People pop when Cena said "I just pooped my pants!"

In fact, people would pop if he DID shit his shorts.

Doesn't mean it makes for a good match.
I dont believe I said it would
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Old 02-21-2005, 09:53 PM   #31
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The Cena/JBL match NEEDS to be overbooked for it to work.

There have to be at least 2 moments during the course of the match where we think JBL is going to win. Maybe the Bashams distract the referee and Jordan whacks Cena with the belt and gets out of the ring. JBL slowly drapes an arm over John and gets a long 2 count. Then Cena hits the FU, gets a 2 count, and get dropped with a massive Clothesline from Hell for another long, long 2 count. The fans have to be eating this thing up, believing that the WWE is going to fuck us over and NOT have JBL lose the WWE Title. In fact, I think it might work better for John to get the win after some kind of a rollup pin instead of the F-U, just because it will generate a much bigger pop.


Then again, they could just have Cena lose to JBL.
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Old 02-21-2005, 11:11 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Sunday Night
Then again, they could just have Cena lose to JBL.
Bingo. This is the route I would take. The WWE are rumoured to be considering a roster redraft at this point. I really think you need a huge heel to be the leader of one roster at least until things are settled. Cena and Batista have been built up as parallells, though, so they may not be the worse choice for Champions.

But anyway, can I just say how much I HATE Cena's character. It's not funny, not cool, and it's not going to draw in any fans. I know if any people saw what he does tha weren't previously wrestling fans, they'd laugh and then flick the channel.

I still don't know if the fans really care about Cena. He hasn't really made his mark, and is instead just getting an obvious push towads winning the title. He almost seems spoilt in the way he is receiving the title, IMO.

If the WWE choose to have Cena do the job at WrestleMania, it would be the ultimate test to see if the fans care about Cena or not. The fans may actually become more likely to accept the fact that JBL has a grip on the WWE Title, that not even their hero can relinquish.

I personally think they should have Eddie Guerrero snap at WrestleMania, then have him cost Cena the match for some reason. At Judgment Day, we have Cena vs. Guerrero, where Eddie goes and gets disqualified, by kicking all kinds of shit (or should I say poop?) out of Cena. They then run an angle where Eddie says he has zero faith in Cena, and knows he will lose, which would play off what Eddie said to Cena at No Way Out.

At The Great American Bash, Cena wins a Texas Bullrope Match against JBL to capture the WWE Championship, which plays with Eddie's mind. This leads to a Ladder Match at Summerslam between Cena and Guerrero, where Cena would walk out again with the WWE Title.

Instead of putting the title on Cena in the predictable "as soon as he gets a shot which just happens to be a WrestleMania" way, this is more of a way to build-up John Cena's first reign with the belt.
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Old 02-21-2005, 11:27 PM   #33
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Not to mention get Guerrero back in the title picture.

I like it.
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Old 02-22-2005, 05:06 AM   #34
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This is how I see it panning out:

World Heavyweight Championship Match:
Batista vs. The Winner (a.k.a. Triple H)

WWE Championshite Match:
Boring Blackjack vs. Boring Rapper

"Semi-Retired, Permanantely Injured" Match
Kurt "Bad-Neck" Angle vs. Shawn "Bad-Back" Michaels

Pee-Break #2:
Undertaker vs. Randy Orton
(Let me guess the finish...Tombstone? Nahh!)

Potential Show Stealer:
Rey Mysterio Jr. vs. Eddie Guerrero

Other Potential Show Stealer:
Chris Benoit vs. Chris Jericho

Pointless Match Just to Get Edge a match:
Edge vs. Shelton Benjamin

Women's Championship: Bra and Panties Chocolate Mud-Fight with Jerry Lawler as the Special Guest Referee:
Playmate 1 vs. Playmate 2
(Seriously, is there even a women's champion anymore, or did they just do away with the belt when they fired all their female wrestlers?)

Who Cares Match:
Gene Snitzky vs. Kane vs. the Hardy that didn't leave

Pee-Break #1
Big Show vs. Heidenshite

Opening Match:
Booker T vs. The Winner (since Booker T seems to be contractually obligated to lose, no matter how shite his opponents are).
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Old 02-22-2005, 04:00 PM   #35
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Here is what we have confirmed/being built-up at the moment:

World Heavyweight Championship
Triple H vs. Batista

WWE Championship
John Bradshaw Layfield vs. John Cena

WWE Intercontinental Championship
Shelton Benjamin vs. Gene Snitsky

WWE Cruiserweight Championship
Chavo Guerrero vs. Paul London

Interpromotional Match
The Undertaker vs. Randy Orton

Interpromotional Match
Kurt Angle vs. Shawn Michaels

Grudge Match
Booker T vs. Heidenreich

It doesn't look like a bad card. Maybe you could have Chris Jericho and Edge & Christian challenge Wlliam Regal & Tajiri for the World Tag Team Championship in a TLC Match. Edge said he'd never do one again, but I wouldn't put it past him, as he is a guy that will do a lot for the fans. I can see Edge vs. Christian and Jericho vs. Benoit, though, or a tag team match with Benoit & Jericho vs. E & C, or something mixed like Jericho & Christian vs. Edge & Benoit.
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Old 02-22-2005, 04:35 PM   #36
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Fuck that. An hour of WM will be an iron man pillow fight between Chrissy Hemme and Trish.
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