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Old 06-20-2005, 02:20 PM   #1
Dave Youell
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Anyone else watching the USA F1 Gran Prix?
WTF!!!

Only 6 fucking cars started! Assholes! Michellin fucked up from the sounds of it and the tires wern't safe for the track, there's only 3 teams that don't use Michellin.

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Old 06-20-2005, 03:49 PM   #2
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LOL what
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Old 06-20-2005, 03:59 PM   #3
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Yeah, crazy stuff. 6 cars started, 6 finished. The only highlight was when Schumacher almost took out Barrichello. Wonder what the odds of Montiero getting a podium finish were this morning?
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Old 06-20-2005, 04:02 PM   #4
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/moto...ne/4109148.stm
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Old 06-20-2005, 05:11 PM   #5
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terrible, as a big F1 fan I'm gutted to see this.
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Old 06-20-2005, 05:19 PM   #6
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That's pretty terrible. You would thik the racers would have a secondary type of tire to use. I bet they will in the future.
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Old 06-20-2005, 07:45 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by YOUR Hero
That's pretty terrible. You would thik the racers would have a secondary type of tire to use. I bet they will in the future.
Legislation this year made the teams run on one tyre for the entire race and that they would have to run on the same kind of tyres that they ran at the start of the weekend. Therefore once all Michelin runners took up their tyres and the fault was found they were destined to not race once Michelin said they were unsafe.

Ultimately I believe the fault lies with Michelin as they couldn't design a tyre of a suitable nature. I felt sorry for all the fans who had paid money and hope that they get a refund. The FIA must also take the blame if it is indeed true that they rejected the Michelin teams idea of running with a chicane but with all Michelin teams not scoring points. This is a terrible day for Formula One and America will probably never forgive it.
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Old 06-20-2005, 08:07 PM   #8
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I watched about the first half an hour, then put the football on.

I'd be pissed if i was a proper hardcore fan, would've been funny if all 6 had crashed though.
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Old 06-20-2005, 08:44 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by packt up
Legislation this year made the teams run on one tyre for the entire race and that they would have to run on the same kind of tyres that they ran at the start of the weekend. Therefore once all Michelin runners took up their tyres and the fault was found they were destined to not race once Michelin said they were unsafe.

Ultimately I believe the fault lies with Michelin as they couldn't design a tyre of a suitable nature. I felt sorry for all the fans who had paid money and hope that they get a refund. The FIA must also take the blame if it is indeed true that they rejected the Michelin teams idea of running with a chicane but with all Michelin teams not scoring points. This is a terrible day for Formula One and America will probably never forgive it.
I'll bet that'll change.
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Old 06-20-2005, 09:24 PM   #10
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Some porblem lies with the FIA too, they had the chance to add an extra chicane to let the race go ahead as planned but instead they left it until the last minute and never gave in.
Bit of a shame really.
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Old 06-20-2005, 09:25 PM   #11
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I heard Michelin were trying to get some new rubber rushed to the track from France or something, but the drivers weren't allowed to use it because of the one tyre weekend thing, pure fucking madness.

I was reading an article before about a fan nuts about F1 who'd taken a week off work and come in from California to see the race...poor fucker.

The problem was all to do with the fact that Michelin tyres weren't safe for the final corner, which is where Ralf Schumacher wiped out (twice in 2 years now I think) - so Michelin came up with the idea of putting in a chicane there.
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Old 06-21-2005, 03:10 AM   #12
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Some of the teams even offered to race without earning points just so the fans were happy but the FIA still wouldn't let them use the other tires.

Fucking assholes!
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Old 06-21-2005, 03:54 AM   #13
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the FIA is destroying the sport, soon F1 will branch off into "another sport" I'm sure of it.
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Old 06-21-2005, 04:05 AM   #14
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Ferrari blocked both moves, apparently. Firstly to allow the Michelin teams to have new tyres, and then to put the chicane in. Ferrari's pretty much against everyone now, and they're the only team still signed up to race in formula 1 in 2008, apparently they're all branching off into another competition a la what Bad Company said
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Old 06-21-2005, 07:29 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YOUR Hero
I'll bet that'll change.
It's a difficult issue. The fact that Michellin couldn't produce a tyre worthy of a race is more damaging than the rules themselves in my opinion. If you open up "backdoors" then you could have problems of tyre companies going for faster and faster rubber knowing that if they are unsafe to last the distance they could always fall back on another pair through the safety get out clause.

Perhaps the best way to solve the whole tyre issue in formula one would be to move back to one tyre manufacturer. The tyre war would not exist and all cars would have the same tyres and so races would be fairer.

And before everyone jumps on the FIA (and Ferrari's) backs the Michellin teams could have ran at lower speeds and higher tyre pressures but chose not to. The Chicane wasn't the only other alternative. If Michellin can't produce a tyre how is that the FIA's fault?

It isn't Ferrari's fault that Michellin fucked up and they shouldn't be punished for it by just altering the rules for someone else's mess up. I bet if Bridgestone had the problem and the same thing people would be hella pissed off if a new chicane was put in there for Ferrari and the other Bridgestone teams. There is a growing anti-Ferrari sentiment in the sport some of which is deserved and some of which definitely is not.

And Paul Stoddart can shut the fuck up with his hypocritical whining.
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Old 06-21-2005, 09:08 AM   #16
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Yeah well to be fair F1 has been going downhill for a few years now. I used to be semi interested in it but can't stand to watch it now. It's good that the Americans figured it out sooner rather than later.
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Old 06-21-2005, 10:38 AM   #17
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F1 has been alot better this year without the Ferrari dominance really.
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Old 06-21-2005, 11:48 AM   #18
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at least Minardi finally got some points
 
Old 06-21-2005, 01:07 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L L Cool G
at least Minardi finally got some points
But they aren't happy with them at all. Infact, they admitted they would have rather have gone without than race this farce.

Jordan agreed not to race and then went back on their word therefore forcing Minardi to race. I respect the fact Minardi had the balls to stand up for what they believed in before their hand was forced.

Yes, it was extremely unsportsman-like for Ferrari and Jordan (I'll exclude Minardi since they actually show some class) to decide to race. They were given more than one alternative which would have favoured them and still allowed a race like having the Bridgestone cars on the first 3 rows of the grid and have those 6 cars the only ones which were eligable to score points. However, they technically still didn't do anything wrong. I'd still be embarrassed if I were representing their teams.

At the end of the day though, it was Michelin's own fault. They supply teams with 2 sets of tyres (not the same 2 sets for every team though) and they didn't supply safe tyres. They are 100% at fault. The F.I.A has to take some blame but if Ferrari and Jordan don't agree to a chicane then they can't do anything if they don't decide to cancel the race (which they should have done).

I would be really surprised at this point if there was not one single tyre supplier next season or if there was another U.S Grand Prix lined up for a while.
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Old 06-21-2005, 04:44 PM   #20
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Also we need to remember earlier in the season Ferrari was having a horrible time with their Bridgestone rubber when everyone else was finishing races!
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Old 06-21-2005, 09:44 PM   #21
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So Michellin has come out, no appology.

http://msn.foxsports.com/motor/story/3704474

Lots to be read in this article.
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Old 06-22-2005, 07:49 AM   #22
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Looks like everyone's blaming everyone here.
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Old 06-22-2005, 08:29 AM   #23
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Michellin's gotta take the heat. It's their job as a tire company to produce a tire that is up to standard, and they failed.

Putting a chicane in wasn't going to do a lot. It slowed the pace on one section of track and wouldn't reduce wear and tear on the tires enough, which is why Ferrari and the FIA objected apparantly.

Have watched F1 all my life and it was very sad to see.
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Old 06-22-2005, 12:06 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob
Yes, it was extremely unsportsman-like for Ferrari and Jordan (I'll exclude Minardi since they actually show some class) to decide to race. They were given more than one alternative which would have favoured them and still allowed a race like having the Bridgestone cars on the first 3 rows of the grid and have those 6 cars the only ones which were eligable to score points. However, they technically still didn't do anything wrong. I'd still be embarrassed if I were representing their teams.
I agreed with most of what you said Rob but I fail to see how it was unsportsmanlike. What exactly are they supposed to do if the other teams can't finish a race? They shouldn't be expeceted to just drop out too. If Arsenal turned up to Old Trafford complaining that they didn't have any boots would that entitle them to argue for a postponement? Or some to change the sport so that feet weren't necessary? (don't exactly know how but you see my point).

Putting in a Chicane would have been just as ridiculous and just as unsafe as racing with shit tyres. Changing the track means the drivers need to relearn breaking zones, turning points and in essence the entire track becomes a different entity. Not to mention it would need an entirely different set up. Running Formula One cars is a science and throwing Chicanes in at the last minute is not going to make anything safer.
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Old 06-22-2005, 01:32 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by packt up
I agreed with most of what you said Rob but I fail to see how it was unsportsmanlike. What exactly are they supposed to do if the other teams can't finish a race? They shouldn't be expeceted to just drop out too. If Arsenal turned up to Old Trafford complaining that they didn't have any boots would that entitle them to argue for a postponement? Or some to change the sport so that feet weren't necessary? (don't exactly know how but you see my point).

Putting in a Chicane would have been just as ridiculous and just as unsafe as racing with shit tyres. Changing the track means the drivers need to relearn breaking zones, turning points and in essence the entire track becomes a different entity. Not to mention it would need an entirely different set up. Running Formula One cars is a science and throwing Chicanes in at the last minute is not going to make anything safer.
If Arsenal showed up to a match with no boots, the match wouldn't go ahead. You need correct footwear in order to step foot on a football pitch. How exactly is it sportsmanlike for Ferrari and Jordan to race against nobody (because they weren't racing each other and let's not even kid ourselves that they were)? If the example you used for football happened, it would be fixed. Teams have shown up for matches without their kit bags before and the home team lent them their away shirts. Players have also lent boots. My point is your opposition do everything they can to ensure they are going to have a match. Only in Formula 1 would something like this happen.

As for the chicane arguement, they had more practise sessions so they could have learnt the course easily. Something could have easily been done but it wasn't.
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Old 06-23-2005, 01:35 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob
If Arsenal showed up to a match with no boots, the match wouldn't go ahead. You need correct footwear in order to step foot on a football pitch. How exactly is it sportsmanlike for Ferrari and Jordan to race against nobody (because they weren't racing each other and let's not even kid ourselves that they were)? If the example you used for football happened, it would be fixed. Teams have shown up for matches without their kit bags before and the home team lent them their away shirts. Players have also lent boots. My point is your opposition do everything they can to ensure they are going to have a match. Only in Formula 1 would something like this happen.

As for the chicane arguement, they had more practise sessions so they could have learnt the course easily. Something could have easily been done but it wasn't.
You're right on the first point.

You're wrong on the second. The qualifying had already taken place on saturday and so the cars were already in park ferme with their fuel and tyres for the race set in stone. The whole debate for a chicane took place on the saturday evening after qualifying. If the tyres weren't safe how come Michellin teams qualified? Because they wanted the negotiation of the chicane afterwards which is completely rubbish. Once qualifying takes place there are no scheduled practice sessions to follow because the cars qualify in race spec. Also there simply isn't time after qualification for proper practice before a race. There is 24 hours between them with night time and warm up races to include as well.
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Old 06-23-2005, 01:45 PM   #27
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I think you misunderstand what a unsafe tyre is. If I drive about with 4 bald tyres on the road, I might not crash but it's still unsafe.

24 hours was more than enough to find a solution whether it was a chicane or not.
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