Hassan's Henchmen (SD Spoilers)

**Face Heely** · 07-07-2005, 08:15 PM

So, Smackdown has just started, but I wanna make note of an interesting detail before I forget about it completely. I dunno if this was on all UPN channels, but UPN 9 (New York) ran a scroll along the bottom of the screen saying (roughly), "In light of today's tragic events, parental discretion is advised during parts of this program."

Now, I know as well as the rest of you guys who've already read the spoilers that they're referring to the Hassan/Daivari/"Masked Men" segment - which worries me. I know live accounts are saying it didn't necessarily portray them as terrorists per se, but this warning makes me wonder just how this segment will come across - and whether it'll be edited/chopped down a bit. (If they can even do that with such little notice.)

Yeah...dat's not cool.

**Joey Slugs** · 07-07-2005, 08:38 PM

yeah, they flashed it across the screen here on UPN Chicago

**FearedSanctity** · 07-07-2005, 08:44 PM

Quote:

It is confirmed that the tape of the Smackdown show sent to the U.K. today will not include the angle with Undertaker and Muhammad Hassan, an angle that involved "terrorists" that would be in bad taste after the attacks in London. It may also be edited off of the North American version, but that has not been confirmed.

So it looks like they'll show it here, because I got that little warning across the bottom also

**Face Heely** · 07-07-2005, 08:55 PM

As if the angle wasn't in "bad taste" before.

But it seems the WWE is censoring itself here, which is a good thing. (This is the first example of "good judgment" we've seen out of 'em since...Batista going to Smackdown, I guess.)

**Face Heely** · 07-07-2005, 08:55 PM

As if the angle wasn't in "bad taste" before.

But it seems the WWE is censoring itself here, which is a good thing. (This is the first example of "good judgment" we've seen out of 'em since...Batista going to Smackdown, I guess. Totally different kinda judgment, there, though...)

**FearedSanctity** · 07-07-2005, 09:00 PM

I don't think it was in bad taste. Wrestling, in my opinion, is going to have to be more edgy if it hopes to be as popular as it was years ago. While for now Hassan's henchmen might be a little extreme, I feel it's stuff like this that could get people interested.

**Batsu** · 07-07-2005, 09:28 PM

Another reason why SD! should go live should it move away from UPN.

Saw that disclaimer as well, on the second hour...

**Kane Knight** · 07-07-2005, 09:38 PM

Oops. Didn't realise there was a thread on it...

**Mayo** · 07-07-2005, 09:39 PM

Never showed that disclaimer here in Canada on The Score network.

**Joey Slugs** · 07-07-2005, 09:42 PM

That was fucking cool.

**Kane Knight** · 07-07-2005, 09:44 PM

That disclaimer was fucking stupid.

Like it would be better if it was yesterday or tomorrow it aired.

**FearedSanctity** · 07-07-2005, 09:44 PM

I don't see what was so wrong with that. Most of them looked white anyways

**Face Heely** · 07-07-2005, 09:45 PM

This whole thing is coming off a lot more...harmless than I expected. The way the whole thing was staged, it felt like your average post-match gang-up, just colored in a way that fit Hassan's character (he's always been rather militaristic in personality, which excuses the camo pants). My fears have been thoroughly assuaged.

(The pre-match pep talk, though, was a bit overdone.)

I'll tell ya what, trying to pull this early in Hassan's WWE life woulda been a disaster. Now, though, it's pretty well established that he's a just a natural villain to the core, regardless of race, etc.

**FearedSanctity** · 07-07-2005, 09:50 PM

It was funny to watch the crowd not know how to react

**Kane Knight** · 07-07-2005, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FearedSanctity

I don't see what was so wrong with that. Most of them looked white anyways

Maybe those guys who bombed the subways were white.

**Kane Knight** · 07-07-2005, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Face Heely

This whole thing is coming off a lot more...harmless than I expected. The way the whole thing was staged, it felt like your average post-match gang-up, just colored in a way that fit Hassan's character (he's always been rather militaristic in personality, which excuses the camo pants). My fears have been thoroughly assuaged.

(The pre-match pep talk, though, was a bit overdone.)

I'll tell ya what, trying to pull this early in Hassan's WWE life woulda been a disaster. Now, though, it's pretty well established that he's a just a natural villain to the core, regardless of race, etc.

When I saw the guys in masks come out, I was like "HOLY FUCK!"

Then I saw what they did and I was like "Holy fuck, that merits a disclaimer?"

**Batsu** · 07-07-2005, 09:55 PM

The one thing that was funny was Hassan doing his impression of the theme music with arms spread before putting on the Camel Clutch...

**Watson** · 07-07-2005, 09:56 PM

I dunno IMO there taking this whole thing a bit too far. Although I doubt it would have been booked if the bombing in London would have happened before the tapings. Alot of you think it's harmless but I beg to differ. Some say it shouldn't be taking seriously but I guarantee alot of non-wrestling fans were quite offended by the whole thing. Especially how they keep commenting that Daivari (sp?) was a "sacrifice" (almost like a suicide jobber). Then the way those guys in masks carried him away from the ring. Not to mention how those guys were dressed. I dunno, man, I just think the whole thing is in poor taste. Maybe not to wrestling fans but certainly to those affected by the terrorist's actions. But to Vince McMahon any publicity (positive or negative) is good publicity. He didn't have any problems making Sgt. Slaughter an Iraqi sympathizer and having him burn the American flag while the Gulf War was going on. He didn't even seem to mind that at Wrestlemania 7 they had to have extra security because so many people were afraid that someone might try to take a shot a Sgt. Slaughter.

**darkpower** · 07-07-2005, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kane Knight

When I saw the guys in masks come out, I was like "HOLY FUCK!"

Then I saw what they did and I was like "Holy fuck, that merits a disclaimer?"

You know how sensitive people are anymore. The second they get a chance, some conservative talk-radio nut (besides JBL), the FCC, President Bush, or whoever it would be would try to fuck them over however they could the second they had the chance, and why? Because they CAN!!

**FearedSanctity** · 07-07-2005, 09:59 PM

But I don't see how it really offends people. It's not like it's making fun of those who've died from terrorist attacks, it's just taking what happens in real life and carries it over into the wrestling world.

**Joey Slugs** · 07-07-2005, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoGimmicksNeeded

Alot of you think it's harmless but I beg to differ. Some say it shouldn't be taking seriously but I guarantee alot of non-wrestling fans were quite offended by the whole thing.

Unless they heard about it ahead of time, or if a fan tells them, how would a non-fan know about it? I always pictured non-fans NOT watching wrestling. Maybe that's just me.

Was it offensive? Of course it was. But so was that angle in the early 90's, yet the Sarge is still a fan favorite.

**Kane Knight** · 07-07-2005, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FearedSanctity

But I don't see how it really offends people. It's not like it's making fun of those who've died from terrorist attacks, it's just taking what happens in real life and carries it over into the wrestling world.

Unless we warped back to the Iran Contra era...

**Face Heely** · 07-07-2005, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FearedSanctity

But I don't see how it really offends people. It's not like it's making fun of those who've died from terrorist attacks, it's just taking what happens in real life and carries it over into the wrestling world.

It's also clearly depicting those using such tactics as the "bad guys." I think that was my biggest concern - that this would be executed in either a silly way that makes light of the situation, or that Hassan would (somehow, someway) come off as a sympathetic character. Neither was the case - it was realistic enough, but also simple enough that you know that a) Hassan's the bad guy, and he's doing a bad thing; b) he will get his comeuppance, like every bad guy in wrestling does, and probably from the one he "terrorized" with these attacks.

**Marc the Smark** · 07-07-2005, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoGimmicksNeeded

I dunno IMO there taking this whole thing a bit too far. Although I doubt it would have been booked if the bombing in London would have happened before the tapings. Alot of you think it's harmless but I beg to differ. Some say it shouldn't be taking seriously but I guarantee alot of non-wrestling fans were quite offended by the whole thing. Especially how they keep commenting that Daivari (sp?) was a "sacrifice" (almost like a suicide jobber). Then the way those guys in masks carried him away from the ring. Not to mention how those guys were dressed. I dunno, man, I just think the whole thing is in poor taste. Maybe not to wrestling fans but certainly to those affected by the terrorist's actions. But to Vince McMahon any publicity (positive or negative) is good publicity. He didn't have any problems making Sgt. Slaughter an Iraqi sympathizer and having him burn the American flag while the Gulf War was going on. He didn't even seem to mind that at Wrestlemania 7 they had to have extra security because so many people were afraid that someone might try to take a shot a Sgt. Slaughter.

**Kane Knight** · 07-07-2005, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Face Heely

It's also clearly depicting those using such tactics as the "bad guys." I think that was my biggest concern - that this would be executed in either a silly way that makes light of the situation, or that Hassan would (somehow, someway) come off as a sympathetic character. Neither was the case - it was realistic enough, but also simple enough that you know that a) Hassan's the bad guy, and he's doing a bad thing; b) he will get his comeuppance, like every bad guy in wrestling does, and probably from the one he "terrorized" with these attacks.

Yeah, terrorists aren't syjmpathetic characters. If they were, they'd be "freedom fighters."

**Watson** · 07-07-2005, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeventyTimes7

Was it offensive? Of course it was. But so was that angle in the early 90's, yet the Sarge is still a fan favorite.

Yeah but that was before 9/11. THere's still millions of people who haven't gotten over 9/11 and the news said the group who was responsible for the attacks this morning is the same group responsible for the bombing in Madrid as well as 9/11. Whether you or anybody else thinks so or not Muhammad Hassan was created because of the terrorists that caused 9/11 and other disasters. How hard would it be to get a guy over as heel who pretty much portrays the "evil doers" who caused 9/11. That's some serious heel heat. But 9/11 is something that should be handled more seriously than that considering one of the biggest tragedies in American history. That's what makes it so bad, because Hassan is pretty much the wrestling equivalent of Abu Musab Al-Zarqawi. Do you think Nick Berg would find the Hassan character harmless?

Also, Sgt. Slaughter was a fan favorite for years before that storyline in the early 90s. Even the general public (those who don't watch wrestling regularly) have heard of Sgt. Slaughter and therefore they were more aware that it was a storyline. Nobody, other than OVW fans, knew who the Hell Mark Magnus was before Vince brought him up to the big leagues and give him this controversial gimmick. The Sgt. Slaughter storyline was pretty edgy yes but I don't think it's anywhere near being as edgy as this storyline.

**Kane Knight** · 07-07-2005, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoGimmicksNeeded

Yeah but that was before 9/11. THere's still millions of people who haven't gotten over 9/11 and the news said the group who was responsible for the attacks this morning is the same group responsible for the bombing in Madrid as well as 9/11.

And Osama wore a ski mask and choked out the Undertaker too?

BAH GAWD THE FIEND!

(I'm not making light of 911 or London...But this is asinine...Believe it or not, there were bad terrorist things going on before 11 Sept, you shallow fuck).

**Face Heely** · 07-07-2005, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kane Knight

Yeah, terrorists aren't syjmpathetic characters. If they were, they'd be "freedom fighters."

True, but the context here is entertainment and, particularly, pro-wrestling, which has always thrived on carnivalesque, larger-than-life stereotypes. Characters can be complex, but the plot of any pro-wrestling feud has to be good guy vs. bad guy; shades of gray can make a feud interesting, but ultimately, the crowd wants to know who to cheer for.

Look at, say, William Regal. At its simplest, his gimmick is that he's British. If he's a heel, he's a stodgy and arrogant cur; if he's a good guy, he's still got the same gimmick, but it's sold to the audience differently - his aloofness and dry wit are depicted as good things, because he's a good guy. (Who was it, again, that defined morality by the person performing the action, rather than the action itself? The ancient Greeks, perhaps?)

Getting back to the subject, Hassan is already a bad guy, so anything he's gonna do is gonna be bad. If we were supposed to see the other side, he'd be booked as a face, and would, perhaps, be dubbed a "freedom fighter." In order to have the good-vs-evil storyline that drives virtually evey wrestling feud (and just about any non-love-story out there), both we and the WWE have to acknowledge that it's just a simple form of entertainment (which it seems they did, by not attempting to blur the line for the sake of realism).

07-07-2005, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoGimmicksNeeded

Yeah but that was before 9/11. THere's still millions of people who haven't gotten over 9/11 and the news said the group who was responsible for the attacks this morning is the same group responsible for the bombing in Madrid as well as 9/11.

The news also said (believe it or not) that I was wanted for 6 counts of murder.

**Savio** · 07-07-2005, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FearedSanctity

But I don't see how it really offends people. It's not like it's making fun of those who've died from terrorist attacks.

Michael cole said LOL terrorism

But seriously I was shocked at what happened. Next week Hassan should say "I do not support what happened in london but..."

**loopydate** · 07-07-2005, 10:35 PM

BUT NOT IN AMERICA, YA PINKO COMMIE!

...I'll go now.

**Gouda** · 07-07-2005, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Batsu

The one thing that was funny was Hassan doing his impression of the theme music with arms spread before putting on the Camel Clutch...

I thought he yelled something about Allah.

**FearedSanctity** · 07-07-2005, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savior

Michael cole said LOL terrorism

Ah, well I didn't hear that, I guess.

He obviously shouldn't have said it and should've continued to sell how "horrible" what was happening was. But other than a stupid remark by a commentator, it really wasn't that bad.

WWE set out to get a reaction, and they did. This will either hurt their reputation in the media or help Hassan's character

**Watson** · 07-07-2005, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kane Knight

And Osama wore a ski mask and choked out the Undertaker too?

BAH GAWD THE FIEND!

(I'm not making light of 911 or London...But this is asinine...Believe it or not, there were bad terrorist things going on before 11 Sept, you shallow fuck).

No shit. There was alot terrorist activity across the World before 9/11 but none anywhere near as severe as 9/11. 9/11 had a huge impact on alot of people's lives all across the World not just those affected. It will take years to heal the wounds caused by the actions of those terrorist. Some people were traumatized for life and will never get over it. The fact is, to Vince it's just another way to cash in on a real life tragedy. Does the WWE have to bring in a tag team called the Twin Towers and have Hassan squash them both and use some kind of finisher with the word "bomb" or "airplane" on them before anybody finds this shit offensive? I'm not saying it's depicting real life events exactly. All I'm saying is the WWE is taking Hassan's character and actions a bit too far. But that's my opinion and I'm quite sure I'm not the only person who sees it that way. So do you call those American soldiers who might be offended by this storyline "shallow fucks"?

By the way, Why is that 75% of these forums have to resort to insulting people just because they don't see things eye to eye? Can't you debate a point in mature fashion without resorting to childish name calling? Grow up, dude.

**Shadow** · 07-07-2005, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M. Banana

The news also said (believe it or not) that I was wanted for 6 counts of murder.

Aren't you still?

**Amaroqwolf** · 07-07-2005, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoGimmicksNeeded

By the way, Why is that 75% of these forums have to resort to insulting people just because they don't see things eye to eye? Can't you debate a point in mature fashion without resorting to childish name calling? Grow up, dude.

No, no they can't.

**FearedSanctity** · 07-07-2005, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoGimmicksNeeded

By the way, Why is that 75% of these forums have to resort to insulting people just because they don't see things eye to eye? Can't you debate a point in mature fashion without resorting to childish name calling? Grow up, dude.

This is the internet dude. The place where people will give their opinion and don't give a shit about yours. Don't let that stop you though, someone might care. I don't, though

**Kane Knight** · 07-07-2005, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Face Heely

True, but the context here is entertainment and, particularly, pro-wrestling, which has always thrived on carnivalesque, larger-than-life stereotypes. Characters can be complex, but the plot of any pro-wrestling feud has to be good guy vs. bad guy; shades of gray can make a feud interesting, but ultimately, the crowd wants to know who to cheer for.

Look at, say, William Regal. At its simplest, his gimmick is that he's British. If he's a heel, he's a stodgy and arrogant cur; if he's a good guy, he's still got the same gimmick, but it's sold to the audience differently - his aloofness and dry wit are depicted as good things, because he's a good guy. (Who was it, again, that defined morality by the person performing the action, rather than the action itself? The ancient Greeks, perhaps?)

Getting back to the subject, Hassan is already a bad guy, so anything he's gonna do is gonna be bad. If we were supposed to see the other side, he'd be booked as a face, and would, perhaps, be dubbed a "freedom fighter." In order to have the good-vs-evil storyline that drives virtually evey wrestling feud (and just about any non-love-story out there), both we and the WWE have to acknowledge that it's just a simple form of entertainment (which it seems they did, by not attempting to blur the line for the sake of realism).

Actually, I was just pointing out the concept of how horrible it would be that people sympathise with terrorism...Especially in the US, where we just celebrated a country being formed out of many acts, several terrorist.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoGimmicksNeeded

No shit. There was alot terrorist activity across the World before 9/11 but none anywhere near as severe as 9/11. 9/11 had a huge impact on alot of people's lives all across the World not just those affected. It will take years to heal the wounds caused by the actions of those terrorist. Some people were traumatized for life and will never get over it. The fact is, to Vince it's just another way to cash in on a real life tragedy. Does the WWE have to bring in a tag team called the Twin Towers and have Hassan squash them both and use some kind of finisher with the word "bomb" or "airplane" on them before anybody finds this shit offensive? I'm not saying it's depicting real life events exactly. All I'm saying is the WWE is taking Hassan's character and actions a bit too far. But that's my opinion and I'm quite sure I'm not the only person who sees it that way. So do you call those American soldiers who might be offended by this storyline "shallow fucks"?

By the way, Why is that 75% of these forums have to resort to insulting people just because they don't see things eye to eye? Can't you debate a point in mature fashion without resorting to childish name calling? Grow up, dude.

Wow. There's a pretty big difference between Hassan toppling the "Twin Towers" and a bunch of guys jumping the Undertaker. If you have to reach that desperately, then your argument is not worthy of the respect you seem to think you deserve.

Incidentally, "Might be offended?"

What about the soldiers who MIGHT be offended by Cena's Bad Bad man video. BAH GAWD THOSE WOUNDS TOOK YEARS TO HEAL AND SOME PEOPLE NEVER RECOVERED AND IT'S SO INSENSITIVE TO PEOPLE IN THE ARMY WHO MIGHT HAVE BEEN OFFENDED!

I will not deal with your imaginary people who may be offended. Because that argument works for every instance of anything anywhere. If you worry about what might offend, you can never show anything ever again. And until I see the post where you chastised Vince for the Cena video, I'll call you a hypocrite and ignore your tearjerking theatrics.

You want respect, try being less like Fox news, and be more like real journalism.

**Kane Knight** · 07-07-2005, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amaroqwolf

No, no they can't.

FUCK YOU!

**Joey Slugs** · 07-08-2005, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kane Knight

You want respect, try being less like Fox news, and be more like real journalism.

a fucking men

07-07-2005, 08:15 PM	#1
Face Heely Bucky F'N Barnes Posts: 599	Hassan's Henchmen (SD Spoilers) So, Smackdown has just started, but I wanna make note of an interesting detail before I forget about it completely. I dunno if this was on all UPN channels, but UPN 9 (New York) ran a scroll along the bottom of the screen saying (roughly), "In light of today's tragic events, parental discretion is advised during parts of this program." Now, I know as well as the rest of you guys who've already read the spoilers that they're referring to the Hassan/Daivari/"Masked Men" segment - which worries me. I know live accounts are saying it didn't necessarily portray them as terrorists per se, but this warning makes me wonder just how this segment will come across - and whether it'll be edited/chopped down a bit. (If they can even do that with such little notice.) Yeah...dat's not cool.

07-07-2005, 08:38 PM	#2
Joey Slugs Second City Saint Posts: 5,806	yeah, they flashed it across the screen here on UPN Chicago

07-07-2005, 08:55 PM	#4
Face Heely Bucky F'N Barnes Posts: 599	As if the angle wasn't in "bad taste" before. But it seems the WWE is censoring itself here, which is a good thing. (This is the first example of "good judgment" we've seen out of 'em since...Batista going to Smackdown, I guess.)

07-07-2005, 09:00 PM	#6
FearedSanctity Von Killer Posts: 4,471	I don't think it was in bad taste. Wrestling, in my opinion, is going to have to be more edgy if it hopes to be as popular as it was years ago. While for now Hassan's henchmen might be a little extreme, I feel it's stuff like this that could get people interested.

07-07-2005, 09:28 PM	#7
Batsu Capcom's Corporate Champ Posts: 2,571	Another reason why SD! should go live should it move away from UPN. Saw that disclaimer as well, on the second hour...

07-07-2005, 09:38 PM	#8
Kane Knight Ron Paul 4 EVA Posts: 152,467	Oops. Didn't realise there was a thread on it...

07-07-2005, 09:39 PM	#9
Mayo not gayo Posts: 7,676	Never showed that disclaimer here in Canada on The Score network.

07-07-2005, 09:42 PM	#10
Joey Slugs Second City Saint Posts: 5,806	That was fucking cool.

07-07-2005, 09:44 PM	#11
Kane Knight Ron Paul 4 EVA Posts: 152,467	That disclaimer was fucking stupid. Like it would be better if it was yesterday or tomorrow it aired.

07-07-2005, 09:45 PM	#13
Face Heely Bucky F'N Barnes Posts: 599	This whole thing is coming off a lot more...harmless than I expected. The way the whole thing was staged, it felt like your average post-match gang-up, just colored in a way that fit Hassan's character (he's always been rather militaristic in personality, which excuses the camo pants). My fears have been thoroughly assuaged. (The pre-match pep talk, though, was a bit overdone.) I'll tell ya what, trying to pull this early in Hassan's WWE life woulda been a disaster. Now, though, it's pretty well established that he's a just a natural villain to the core, regardless of race, etc.

07-07-2005, 09:50 PM	#14
FearedSanctity Von Killer Posts: 4,471	It was funny to watch the crowd not know how to react

07-07-2005, 09:55 PM	#17
Batsu Capcom's Corporate Champ Posts: 2,571	The one thing that was funny was Hassan doing his impression of the theme music with arms spread before putting on the Camel Clutch...

07-07-2005, 09:56 PM	#18
Watson The Reckless One Posts: 1,673	I dunno IMO there taking this whole thing a bit too far. Although I doubt it would have been booked if the bombing in London would have happened before the tapings. Alot of you think it's harmless but I beg to differ. Some say it shouldn't be taking seriously but I guarantee alot of non-wrestling fans were quite offended by the whole thing. Especially how they keep commenting that Daivari (sp?) was a "sacrifice" (almost like a suicide jobber). Then the way those guys in masks carried him away from the ring. Not to mention how those guys were dressed. I dunno, man, I just think the whole thing is in poor taste. Maybe not to wrestling fans but certainly to those affected by the terrorist's actions. But to Vince McMahon any publicity (positive or negative) is good publicity. He didn't have any problems making Sgt. Slaughter an Iraqi sympathizer and having him burn the American flag while the Gulf War was going on. He didn't even seem to mind that at Wrestlemania 7 they had to have extra security because so many people were afraid that someone might try to take a shot a Sgt. Slaughter.

07-07-2005, 09:59 PM	#20
FearedSanctity Von Killer Posts: 4,471	But I don't see how it really offends people. It's not like it's making fun of those who've died from terrorist attacks, it's just taking what happens in real life and carries it over into the wrestling world.

07-07-2005, 10:35 PM	#31
loopydate FIT Challenge Slag People Posts: 13,816	BUT NOT IN AMERICA, YA PINKO COMMIE! ...I'll go now.