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Old 09-11-2005, 11:30 PM   #1
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The wwe must become more real
After re-watching the Monday night wars recently and forced my brother and sister to watch it with me. It came to me one reason why the wwe has been in such a funk recently (last 2-3 years. )


It doesn’t seem real anymore. Its just a bunch or people reading lines for the most part with no emotion or belief in what there meant to be doing . Now this may seem like crap to us smarks but think about it. On that dvd it showed some of the classic rock-austin- mcmahon- foley interactions. It seemed real to the great acting of the participants. It did seem like mcmahon really hated Austin after he ruined his announcement with Tyson. It seemed like Austin hated vince more than anything else in the world. It seemed like vince really didn’t want foley to win the title.

Heck even the nwo stuff seemed real.

Even my brother and sister were asking me if it was real or not. They know wrestling is fake but due to the great acting and storylines

Now ill compare this to some recent going ons in the wwe. Did anyone really think that cena hated bicholf in their recent feud? If you judged it from cenas acting it seemed like all big bad eric did was ban him from watching big brother uncut not him doing everything he can to rid him of the title.

I love carllito but he acts like a one dimensional cartoon character. HHH in the last two years for the most part seems to be going though the motions. And we as viewers are we meant to believe that lita and edge are attracted to each other. It seems to the writers that showing them grope each other each week and edge calling lita a slut and her smiling back is enough to convince us of that.

These days the storylines don’t seem real (with the exception of hardy-edge minus lita). It doesn’t seem like it but if it seems real we enjoy it a lot more.
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Old 09-11-2005, 11:48 PM   #2
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It never seemed more "real" to me then now, since they attempt to manipulate the fans through the internet now, it's actually one of the only real things they've ever done. Way more wrestler's are just wrestling now under actual names rather than gimmick names... that seems more "real".

If anything WWE is more "real" now then ever and that's their true problem. Nothing will top the age of gimmicks which is slowly dieing. You act like anything else the WWE/F ever pulled before seemed more real than what they do now? Maybe when the Big Bossman stole the Big-Show's dead father from the cemetary and dragged his coffin behind the hurst he was driving..... ahh yes... the old day's of realism.

Also, maybe.. just maybe .. 6 years ago when this was more... "real" to you... perhaps you were 6 years younger and alot more nieve with alot lower expectations(Don't know how old you are)? Or maybe it was before you knew what a "mark" and a "smark" was... back before you discovered the other side of the WWE.

I'm not saying the old days were not GREAT, because they were, but nothing stays the same forever.
The storylines now are just as believeable as they ever were. How real is it when you can beat the living shit out of your millionaire boss night after night, and not be fired? WWE does not really need to become more "real"... They just need to work with their up and coming stars, find the ones that mesh well together and turn them into memorable icons of the business like they did with Austin/Rock/HHH etc..
Last edited by ThruTheWire; 09-12-2005 at 12:00 AM.
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Old 09-12-2005, 12:59 AM   #3
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Yeah, they should go back to the real days fo wrestling, where Hulkamania ruled.
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Old 09-12-2005, 01:03 AM   #4
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He has a point. Back in the attitude era, business was booming. Locker room morale was much higher, they hired much more talented wrestlers. They didn't have much to lose by letting mediocre guys run with titles, so they had to make due. I mean, seriously, a Rock promo back from 99-2000 is way more convincing than John Cena.

I don't think he meant realism in the characters, more of in their promos.
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Old 09-12-2005, 01:41 AM   #5
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Old 09-12-2005, 03:07 AM   #6
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^^ Yes. While the recent internet manipulation is a solid example of being more "real," that's about the only area where the line is blurred. And even that was defeated once Matt Hardy shook Vince's hand.

Really, when the WWE goes wrong, it's not usually in the storyline decisions. It's more along the lines of effort. It's like people don't really try, and if you don't have your heart into it, how can you truly churn out a great product?

And sadly, we've come to accept mediocrity as excellence and subpar as the norm.

I mean, during the boom period, nearly ever RAW was something that you'd want to watch again. Or if you hadn't watched it but had read the results, you were like "OH MAN I REALLY WISH I HAD SEEN THAT!"

But that doesn't happen much anymore. Once a month is stretching it, sadly.
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Old 09-12-2005, 03:52 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaton
I don't think he meant realism in the characters, more of in their promos.
spot on.

Watch some tapes back in 98-00 and compare it to now the wrestlers promo ability is way better than. Even better watch it with some marks and ask them which promos they think are better. It seemed like they meant what they were saying now it just seems like most wrestlers are just going though the motions. Watch stone cold and the rock interacting you can feel general hatred compare that to anyone now (possibly now ) up to him and compare that to cena doing to the same

Sure there was alot of gimmicks back in the midcard but the guys in the top spot were not.


If you think about it the wrestlers if they wrestlers dont seem real to us then we there not entertaining us.

There are a few decent wrestlers that can make us believe in thier character eg angle ,Christian, , jbl by reacting to a situation and not repeating the same lines over and over again .

But the problem is the guys in the top spot eg hhh, cena who react on the most part the same to every situation or even act very badily eg cena wm21 celebrations
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Old 09-12-2005, 04:10 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThruTheWire

Also, maybe.. just maybe .. 6 years ago when this was more... "real" to you... perhaps you were 6 years younger and alot more nieve with alot lower expectations(Don't know how old you are)? Or maybe it was before you knew what a "mark" and a "smark" was... back before you discovered the other side of the WWE.

..

im 19 now and i did started watching wrestling in 1999 when it first became big. It was the first time it became big in australia and i think the first time it got tv on free to air.


But yeah i was a smark back then and i did think that austin and vince really hated each other. But as i said in my first post i recentily watched the classic atticude era moments annd found the top guys believed in their storylines and feud more so than most of the wrestlers today going though the motions.


And if the wwe wants to get back to thier glory days maybe sending a few wrestlers to acting school may not be a bad thing
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Old 09-12-2005, 04:36 AM   #9
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Seriously. If they're going to run with all of the dramatic angles these days, the wrestlers should at least be able to act. You know why Edge's promos have been so good lately? Because he believes (or did at one point) in what he's saying. He's able to draw from the inside, rather than outside. It's something that's sorely missing in the wrestling world of today. It's not just WWE though, TNA is just as bad, if not worse.
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Old 09-12-2005, 10:15 AM   #10
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Spoiler alert- Wrestling is not real.
Now don't tell anybody. (high lite to see.)
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Old 09-12-2005, 10:52 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaton
He has a point. Back in the attitude era, business was booming. Locker room morale was much higher, they hired much more talented wrestlers. They didn't have much to lose by letting mediocre guys run with titles, so they had to make due. I mean, seriously, a Rock promo back from 99-2000 is way more convincing than John Cena.

I don't think he meant realism in the characters, more of in their promos.
Because the Rock was so realistic in terms of promos.
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Old 09-12-2005, 10:53 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor
Spoiler alert- Wrestling is not real.
Now don't tell anybody. (high lite to see.)


I'll try to keep that in mind.
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Old 09-12-2005, 03:34 PM   #13
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DSFGNEFPIGJDFIJG! DAMN YOU KK! YOU MISSED MY POINT!


I'm saying that he seemed to believe in what he was seeing. It may have seemed strange in what he said, but at least you could see the passion in it. God damnit.
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Old 09-12-2005, 08:39 PM   #14
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Jaton is the only one that preety much got my point. Big props to you.

Yer sure the rock did sprout a bunch of catchpharses but he believed in what they meant and conveyed his hatred of his rival to perfection.

Edge is a great example as well. Edge has always been highly criticized on the iwc for his acting ablity but recentily his promos has been good because of the fact that he believes in what he says. Back in the day most of them did not only a select few do.


And yes wrestling is not real but its much more enjoyable if it seems realistic in some way
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Old 09-12-2005, 09:24 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaton
DSFGNEFPIGJDFIJG! DAMN YOU KK! YOU MISSED MY POINT!


I'm saying that he seemed to believe in what he was seeing. It may have seemed strange in what he said, but at least you could see the passion in it. God damnit.
I see his point, despite his semi-literate expression, I just don't agree with it.
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Old 09-12-2005, 09:27 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinnacle Charisma
Jaton is the only one that preety much got my point. Big props to you.

Yer sure the rock did sprout a bunch of catchpharses but he believed in what they meant and conveyed his hatred of his rival to perfection.

Edge is a great example as well. Edge has always been highly criticized on the iwc for his acting ablity but recentily his promos has been good because of the fact that he believes in what he says. Back in the day most of them did not only a select few do.


And yes wrestling is not real but its much more enjoyable if it seems realistic in some way
It's not an issue of believing it. Jesus Christ, if you have to explain yourself fifteen times to get it right, it's YOUR fault that only one person "gets it."

It's your fault that you're putting forth a weak, flawed argument. You misspeak every time you post something. You keep having to backtrack your statements because you don't know what you're saying.
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Old 09-12-2005, 11:24 PM   #17
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I would look outside your house if I was you Kaneknight I am sure the bears are out there.


I hear they can smell period blood
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Old 09-13-2005, 01:37 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinnacle Charisma
I would look outside your house if I was you Kaneknight I am sure the bears are out there.


I hear they can smell period blood
Actually, interesting fact. Most such creatures will avoid menstrual blood. This has been said to be true even of sharks.

Oh, that was supposed to be a cheap shot. I'm sorry, it got lost in your usual "looking like a retard" style of posting.
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Old 09-13-2005, 01:41 AM   #19
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By the way, comparing Edge essentially shooting on net fans to the Rock portraying a fake "hatred" is also flawed. The Rock didn't believe it, he's just a good actor.

That's probably what you were trying to get across in the first place. The problem with that being that the WWE has many good actors in their ranks. None are on the same level as the Rock, but nobody really has been.
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Old 09-13-2005, 07:59 AM   #20
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The rock believed in his what he was saying and was immersed in his character. Which is what Edge has been doing recentily.

So no I don't think comparing the two are flawed.


Not only do they do the current crop of wrestlers need to act but they also need to believe in what they are saying.

I think jaton had it spot on before when he said that todays wrestlers are not trying as hard as there predecessors due to a simple lack of motivation.


Oh and Kane Knight ive got four words for you.


YOU CANT SEE ME
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Old 09-13-2005, 10:34 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinnacle Charisma
The rock believed in his what he was saying and was immersed in his character. Which is what Edge has been doing recentily.
Edge has been performing the role of himself, bitching at internet fans for shots taken at Adam Copeland for his personal life.

The Rock wasn't immersed, he was capable of showmanship. There's a difference. Don't try and pretend the two are even remotely close to one another. Edge had two intense promos and then fizzled out.
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Old 09-13-2005, 10:46 AM   #22
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The rock believed in his character which was the cocky son of a bitch that thought he was the man.

Yes Edge did believe in his character during those two promos but after that he did fizz out.

I am a massive rock fan and edge does nothing for me so i am not comparing them in a broad way only comparing them in that aspect
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:00 AM   #23
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No, he portrayed the character well. There's a difference. Edge didn't believe either, he was the character, because he was playing Adam Copeland.

Yes, you're comparing them in a broad way. One so broad as to have to real relavence.
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:07 AM   #24
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But he was required to be adam copeland and did a great promo. Were getting off topic here.

Most wrestlers characters are an extension of themselves anyway

The point is he did a great promo that seemed real, something that is missing in wwe at the moment.
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:38 AM   #25
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Quote:
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But he was required to be adam copeland
Well Duh! It's hard not to be yourself.
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:49 AM   #26
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Unless your a poser.
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:52 AM   #27
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Quote:
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Unless your a poser.
Congrats on 1000 posts
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:54 AM   #28
Kane Knight
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor
Unless you're a poser.
Fixed.

So anyway, What difference does it make? Edge was playing himself, which is pretty real. The Rock was an over-the top performer who could sell wiping his ass if he wanted to.
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Old 09-13-2005, 01:03 PM   #29
Destor
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Is this top[ic about Edge being better than The Rock? Maybe I missed something, cause he aint.
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Old 09-13-2005, 08:38 PM   #30
vampiro03
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[QUOTE=Pinnacle Charisma]im 19 now and i did started watching wrestling in 1999 when it first became big.

have you seen wm 3? has the wwe EVER been able to break their indoor intendence record? when it first became big was waaaay before wm3 even. by big I think you mean competitive and everywhere from billboards to jay leno. the wcw MADE the wwf/e improve their product, period. wrestling was big before 1999.
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Old 09-13-2005, 08:50 PM   #31
Kane Knight
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You misunderstand him. He means when wrestling first became popular...

...By that, he means when it first went mainstream...

...By that, he means when his mommy paid for cable...

...By that, he means he is a dolphin...
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:08 PM   #32
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[QUOTE=vampiro03]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinnacle Charisma
im 19 now and i did started watching wrestling in 1999 when it first became big.

have you seen wm 3? has the wwe EVER been able to break their indoor intendence record? when it first became big was waaaay before wm3 even. by big I think you mean competitive and everywhere from billboards to jay leno. the wcw MADE the wwf/e improve their product, period. wrestling was big before 1999.
I meant when it became big in australia.
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:11 PM   #33
Kane Knight
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See? I knew there was a convenient out.
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Old 09-14-2005, 01:19 AM   #34
Pepsi Man
 
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Frankly, to me, it didn't seem more "real" to me then overall. Sure, you had more feuds and more bitterness between guys that would leave each other out to dry and go to other promotions or whatever, and more moves were allowed to be used, and frankly, more moves WERE used in just about every match, along with better psychology, but overall, it was still an artform, and we all knew it.

Maybe you were just younger at the time and sorting out real from fake. I will admit that even I myself got drawn in by that, when Scott Hall FIRST showed up on Nitro. I knew Kevin Nash had been signed by WCW, but I honestly did not know for sure, nor did I expect, that Hall would be there, and the way they acted like they represented the WWF. And another time I got drawn in was when ECW first started feuding with the WWF via invading their shows. I'll never forget Sandman spitting beer in Savio Vega's face.
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Old 09-14-2005, 01:28 AM   #35
Kane Knight
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Personally, I got itno the whole "religiously watching wrestling" bit when the Cruiserweights started making the "sport" poetry in motion. It's blatantly fake, but the physical displays can be amazing. Promos are blatantly fake, but can really get your energy going anyway.

It's fucking staged, there's rarely any "realism" involved, but I love it anyway.
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Old 09-14-2005, 01:31 AM   #36
Pepsi Man
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
It's fucking staged, there's rarely any "realism" involved, but I love it anyway.
Wrestling fan quote of the year.
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