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Old 12-02-2005, 09:32 PM   #1
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Does anyone else find the Randy Orton/The Undertaker feud stupid? *FNS Spoilers*
My dad came round when SmackDown! was on (usually he's round when RAW is on), and we watched a bit together. Anyway, when The Undertaker/Randy Orton thing came on, he and I both agreed on two things:

1. It was stupid...

2. It went on way too long...

Now I like both The Undertaker and Randy Orton, and their matches thus far have been of high standard (even if they aren't exactly heart-pumping), and I'm sure their outing at Armageddon will be, but quite frankly, the whole storyline here is pathetic.

Orton has killed The Undertaker, what, twice now? And they actually play it off like murder! What the fuck? A more reasonable storyline would be Orton calling The Undertaker "Mark", and informing us Taker is a mortal man that was born, ages, and retires.

OK, I can live with the Casket Match at No Mercy, and Orton going to extreme measures, I'd forgotten about it. But instead of bringing Taker back as a zombie whose soul is back for revenge, why can't we just get right to the chase and have Taker just challenge Orton to a Hell in a Cell Match to ruin his career, and Orton accept because he wants a huge victory and to force respect out of the lockerroom? No "You can't kill me crap", it is my personal opinion that this feud (which really didn't need to go past Summerslam) would be much better if they replaced the words "kill me" with "make me step aside". Orton looking past the character and seeing a person seems much more arrogant the a kid who crashes cars with unconscious bodies on the back.

I'm not saying have him go back to the American Badass, I'm just saying this feud should be more grounded in reality than it is.

I don't know why I'm posting this, but I guess it is just because it is really bothering me that a segment that could have been used to give Paul London and Brian Kendrick extra time, or have Ken Kennedy or Paul Burchill included in the show could have really been scrapped for something 1000x better and more effective than EXTREMELY fake looking lightning bolts.

Pfft
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Old 12-02-2005, 11:08 PM   #2
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yeah i think the whole feud is old
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Old 12-02-2005, 11:11 PM   #3
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I just hope Kane doesn't have sex with the dead body..
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Old 12-02-2005, 11:12 PM   #4
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Yeah, it should have ended after Summerslam.
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Old 12-02-2005, 11:15 PM   #5
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Tonight was totally fucking pointless.
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Old 12-02-2005, 11:15 PM   #6
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Seriously, Orton wasn't enough of a blubbering vagina already?
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Old 12-02-2005, 11:46 PM   #7
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Yes, well..to the casuals, who gives a shit about London and Kendrick? They'd rather see Undertaker, so guess what? That's what we get. You want London and Kendrick, then watch Velocity.
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Old 12-03-2005, 12:05 AM   #8
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Howabout those of us who just don't want to see 15 minutes of Randy blubbering?
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Old 12-03-2005, 12:10 AM   #9
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i hate when feuds drag on. I mean Randy has been feuding with Taker since Wrestlemania. This is sad
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Old 12-03-2005, 12:13 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by John la Rock
i hate when feuds drag on. I mean Randy has been feuding with Taker since before Wrestlemania. This is sad
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Old 12-03-2005, 12:15 AM   #11
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I wouldn't mind a long feud once in a while, but this shit is dragging. There's been no progression.

Randy: I've stopped the Undertaker!
Taker: (Some supernatural display)
Randy: (Trickle of urine)
Taker: (Erection)
Randy: (Cheap trick) I've stopped the Undertaker!
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Old 12-03-2005, 12:20 AM   #12
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ya same shit over and over. watch Randy will "kill" the deadman again some how at Armageddon.

However this match could be a MOTY candidate
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Old 12-03-2005, 12:24 AM   #13
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The match could be good. Too bad they can't wrap a plot around it.s
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Old 12-03-2005, 12:27 AM   #14
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WWE, the only company where attempted manslaughter is a-ok!
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Old 12-03-2005, 01:06 AM   #15
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LOL... yeah, that definitely dragged on too long, but it was hilarious for all the wrong reasons. It was definitely corny... like Boogeyman corny.
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Old 12-03-2005, 01:08 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corkscrewed
LOL... yeah, that definitely dragged on too long, but it was hilarious for all the wrong reasons. It was definitely corny... like Boogeyman corny.
The Boogyman was funny though.

I have to make Stone Cold Undertaker jokes to amuse myself during this boregasm
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Old 12-03-2005, 01:35 AM   #17
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This whole Undertaker vs Orton fued is old. It was cool for a while and I think it's added a bit more to Orton, but they should really move on to something different and better.
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Old 12-03-2005, 02:23 AM   #18
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How awesome it would be if Orton tried to leave a fourth time, and Undertaker said over the speaker "Wait...no...I haven't set up pyro there yet. Just give me a few minutes to leave the production van and go set it up and then you can try it."
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Old 12-03-2005, 02:33 AM   #19
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It'd be awesome but the whole thing was pretaped (Taker's voice)
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Old 12-03-2005, 02:34 AM   #20
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am I the only one who has actually some-what enjoyed their fued? it's not too often that we see a long-term fued these days. (outside of what they are doing with angle/cena)
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Old 12-03-2005, 02:42 AM   #21
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Mabey it is just me, and I am the only one that watched Undertaker when he first came into the WWE, but he is already dead. He is not a living person, the Biker Undertaker was the stupidest thing ever because challenged the reality that the WW(f) had given us for so many years, that Undertaker was a dead man walking. I thought that the stuff tonite was great, WHY? because they finally did something different with the Undertaker. Seriously, the Undertaker was never meant to be taking seriously, that has been the Undertaker's gimick for over 10 years, if Randy tried to tell everyone that Undertaker's name was Mark, than it would ruin the gimick that has worked for so long. HE IS DEAD, coming back as a ghost, NO, Randy can't kill him because he is already dead, Randy didn't kill him in the casket, and he didn't kill him in the car, he was dead the whole time.

2. I guess I am alone in this too, but I like when fueds last alittle longer than 1 month, I know that's what everyone is used to, but seriously, leaving a fued open for as long as they have with Taker and Orton isn't a bad thing, (That's a good thing - DDP) It could be worse, it could be as stale as the Angle - Cena fued, I wounder who's gonna come out on top this time? Does anyone even have to ask anymore. At least we don't know who is going to win at Hell In A Cell, also, I am sure that is the end of the fued with Orton and Taker, which besides the whole taking so much time off between matches, has been very good IMO.
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Old 12-03-2005, 02:45 AM   #22
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Old 12-03-2005, 02:48 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaton
Yes, well..to the casuals, who gives a shit about London and Kendrick? They'd rather see Undertaker, so guess what? That's what we get. You want London and Kendrick, then watch Velocity.
To non-wrestling fans (whom the WWE seems to try and be reeling in) who gives a shit about The Undertaker?

My whole point is that the WWE seems to think all this stuff is so smart 'cause it sits well with marks. They think John Cena is their saving grace, The Undertaker is the most entertaining character in the world, etc. But for viewers who are just flicking, they perceive these characters as stupid, and quite frankly pathetic.

At least Kendrick and London can wow people. The Undertaker/Randy Orton feud create a veil of unrelatability between non-wrestling fans and smart wrestling fans/marks. The WWE seems to be aiming their product at marks, and it is alienating two completely other categories.

Marks were already clinging to this feud. They will always cling. It's what they do. Do you really think people cheer The Undertaker because he's a "zombie"? No, they cheer him because he's The Undertaker. That wouldn't change if he announced he was Catholic. Taker and Orton could have been a great story that entertained us, marks and may have even drawn in a non-wrestling fan or two. Instead they ridicule themselves with this shit.

Non-wrestling fans are more likely to cling to performers like Kendrick & London (who aren't completely ridiculous and do stuff that generally makes you appreciate their athletic ability), as are smart fans. Marks, they will follow whatever you roll in their direction, so you may as well roll something that the others want to follow.
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Old 12-03-2005, 03:00 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigChris
Mabey it is just me, and I am the only one that watched Undertaker when he first came into the WWE, but he is already dead. He is not a living person, the Biker Undertaker was the stupidest thing ever because challenged the reality that the WW(f) had given us for so many years, that Undertaker was a dead man walking. I thought that the stuff tonite was great, WHY? because they finally did something different with the Undertaker. Seriously, the Undertaker was never meant to be taking seriously, that has been the Undertaker's gimick for over 10 years, if Randy tried to tell everyone that Undertaker's name was Mark, than it would ruin the gimick that has worked for so long. HE IS DEAD, coming back as a ghost, NO, Randy can't kill him because he is already dead, Randy didn't kill him in the casket, and he didn't kill him in the car, he was dead the whole time.

2. I guess I am alone in this too, but I like when fueds last alittle longer than 1 month, I know that's what everyone is used to, but seriously, leaving a fued open for as long as they have with Taker and Orton isn't a bad thing, (That's a good thing - DDP) It could be worse, it could be as stale as the Angle - Cena fued, I wounder who's gonna come out on top this time? Does anyone even have to ask anymore. At least we don't know who is going to win at Hell In A Cell, also, I am sure that is the end of the fued with Orton and Taker, which besides the whole taking so much time off between matches, has been very good IMO.
I can understand what you're trying to say, and you're motivation is not as stupid as what you sounded like (no offense).

The Undertaker is NOT DEAD. He played a character like that once upon a time, but they scrapped that for a more gothic/servant of the Dark Lord character, that sacrificed his humanity for a fearful facade. Then he came back as a guy who just wanted to kick ass.

Then he is "killed" and he is now the same guy that just wanted to kick ass, but with eye-liner. My punk friends look more undead than he does, and they don't even worship the devil.

Now what you are trying to say is that there needs to be a level of kayfabe in the WWE. That's fine. I don't care if The Undertaker no-sells. He's good with pain, and he's a big guy. But please, PLEASE don't try to tell me he's dead when he gets winded in his matches and sweats. At Summerslam 2005, you could see a red knee brace (I think it was at Summerslam '05). So what? The most troublesome souls are re-incarnated with red knee braces these days? If you want to make The Undertaker more like his mid-nineties character, have him suck up the pain. Don't try and "kill him" every week. Killing is against the law these days.

Wrestling needs a level of realism. I'm not too sure what to make of The Boogeyman character yet. I think it's alright, but my dad walked out the room laughing when he came on. Perhaps a guy that plays a character he was "supposed to play on a cancelled UPN show" is too far out of bounds? The Undertaker and his fake lightning bolts, extremely tacky feeling "blackouts" and such are NOT good for the company. I don't mind if they push the human limits with their characters, but making them in-human is just too far, IMO.
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Old 12-03-2005, 03:04 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigChris
If Randy tried to tell everyone that Undertaker's name was Mark, than it would ruin the gimick that has worked for so long.
Sara called Taker "Mark" a ton of times on air back during the Invasion.
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Old 12-03-2005, 03:07 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey Slugs
am I the only one who has actually some-what enjoyed their fued? it's not too often that we see a long-term fued these days. (outside of what they are doing with angle/cena)
I have enjoyed the matches, and I find myself sucked in to the Randy Orton character, but the method they are using ("I killed him!") is too ridiculous for me (or my father) to take seriously. How am I supposed to buy Randy Orton as the wave of the future when he is scared of something me and my dad are laughing at?

If Randy Orton was a little nervous because a 6'10, 305lbs man that can easily handle himself in a fight can finally get his hands on him in an environment where the company accepts all legal responsibility for physical atrocities, then I would be 100% into this feud. Hell in a Cell would be scary if it was a chance for the guy who's been wanting to get your blood on his hands for a long time can get it done in a place that is designed to stop you from running, and give them a little extra oomph to kick your ass with.

I just don't like the way the WWE is making it seem like at Armageddon, Hell will literally open up and clain Randall Keith Orton's soul. "Hell in a Cell" should quite frankly be a metaphor for the ass-kicking one of these men is going to receive before their opponent finally decides to put them out of their misery (not with an explosion, but with a professional win).
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Old 12-03-2005, 03:10 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drakul
Sara called Taker "Mark" a ton of times on air back during the Invasion.
Damn, I forget to mention that before. Anyway, how dead does The Undertaker look when he has the name of his wife tattooed on his neck? "SARA" isn't exactly scary stuff (at least not unless it means her beating a former World Champion again).
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Old 12-03-2005, 03:16 AM   #28
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I was gonna say that to.
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Old 12-03-2005, 03:17 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drakul
Sara called Taker "Mark" a ton of times on air back during the Invasion.
Yea, when he was that Damn American Badass, not the dead man, most of you are right, except about the fued taking to long, but what it all amounts to, is my hatred for the American Badass, I try and imagine that he never exsited, all though he was supossed to have been killed by Kane. That's why I never liked it because it contridicted everything about the Undertaker, including his name. The Undertaker isn't a motorcycle riding texan, he is a man from the darkside. Sweating, yes he does, but if you remember they used to say that he didn't sweat, and didn't get tired back in the old WWF, Bobby the Brain put this over many times. I think everything points to the fact that he is to old to play the Dead Man Undertaker charactor, but he can still have good matches, he's just not the same Undertaker he used to be, I blame the American Baddass gimick, there is nothing they can do to get people to forget that he played that charactor, put I always try to. That is why I think of him being dead the whole time, insteed of being dead, slowly become a real person, and then being killed again, and again, and again, remeber they did this same thing with taker back against Yokozuna. They thought they killed him, he came back, because you can't kill what is already dead. I think they even said that many times. The problem is everytime this happend, he came back alittle less of a phenom everytime.

I added it on so no one else has to do it, unless you want to.
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Old 12-03-2005, 03:26 AM   #30
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[QUOTE=Alienoid06]And they actually play it off like murder! What the fuck? A more reasonable storyline would be Orton calling The Undertaker "Mark", and informing us Taker is a mortal man that was born, ages, and retires.

I know that most people in the WWE are people you could actually see walking down the street in a real world, Ken Kennedy, Matt Hardy, Dave Batista, John Cena, but there are some WWE wrestlers, in a time not to long ago, that didn't exactly rep. someone you would see in real life, one of which is the Undertaker, you are to make this into the real world, and if it where the real world, obviously Randy Orton would be arrested for killing The Undertaker, but if this was reality than the Undertaker would not be real anyway because he is already dead, you have to come to realize that Wrestling is fiction, like a movie, or a novel, it's not reality that allows alittle bit of fiction into it, it's Fiction that allows alttile of reality into it, one thing that the WWE has forgot.
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Old 12-03-2005, 03:38 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alienoid06
How am I supposed to buy Randy Orton as the wave of the future when he is scared of something me and my dad are laughing at?
The Undertaker gimmick has always been intended for little kids. It came around in a time when the WWE was marketed to them, almost exclusively (except Jake Roberts I guess.) He was supposed to scare them then, but now he is baby face so now he is supposed to scare the bad guys so the kids can get a laugh. Its treating the character well. Keeping that in mind is how I tolerate the gimmick.
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Old 12-03-2005, 03:46 AM   #32
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I'm a big Taker mark, so while I don't love this feud, I'm enjoying it. The segment tonight was dragged out, and yeah... the reasons for him coming back are pretty lame.

But you know, at least one of our long-running jokes about Taker is true: he's no-selling death now.
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