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Old 03-07-2006, 11:25 PM   #1
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Big Show improving?
Latley with his matches against Triple H, and Cena, and some of the tag matches with Kane... does anyone notice the extra effort it seems Big Show is putting out? He is doing more moves and working with the audience a lot more, I have always been a Big Show mark and thought he was the most marketable guy on the roster, I mean look at Andre and Show is leagues better than Andre ever was. Im sure that Kane/Show will drop the titles to Masters and Carlito, which is a good choice, however I think that they should retain at WM, and then loose the titles in a dumpster match, or some gimmick we haven't seen in a while. A Kane and Big Show feud hasn't been done in a long time, it could be pretty entertaining... but who would be the heel? I would say Kane, Show is a great face in my opinion... any discussion?

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Old 03-07-2006, 11:31 PM   #2
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I agree. I actually think he was looking pretty sharp his last few months on Smackdown, too. And because iof his size, it would be pretty easy to establish Show as a main eventer should the WWE ever choose to. I wouldn't mind revisiting Show/HHH for the World Title after WM is done with.
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Old 03-07-2006, 11:59 PM   #3
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Big Show is a great wrestler... I guess it all depends on his motivation. I do agree that Show was been looking very good lately. I can't believe that his match against Cena was good. It's freaking John Cena. I think a good Kane and Big show feud would be a good big man feud. Most tend to not be as great as they seemed on paper.
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Old 03-08-2006, 12:01 AM   #4
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Actually I'm pretty sure most big man matches tend to suck.
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Old 03-08-2006, 12:33 AM   #5
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Show's quietly the best big man they have, actually. And if you compare skill to skill, yes, he IS better than Andre because Andre didn't have to do much in his day. He marketed as unstoppable due to his size alone.

I remember back when I used to hate show and discount him as another hoss, but he's really done well. Though not at the very main event, he's had a sustained main even level push for a while, and they haven't reverted to turning him into a joke. Basically, he's kept his mean streak, which helps a lot.

So it's more like Show's shown what he's capable of, rather than just "he's improved."
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Old 03-08-2006, 01:11 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorkchop
Actually I'm pretty sure most big man matches tend to suck.
You've got limited mobility in a lot of cases there, and you've got two guys each used to having such a weight advantage over his opponent that without that, the guy has nothing.

I'd like to say my personal favorite The Undertaker used to work well with the big guys despite being big himself, because for a guy his size, he could fucking fly, and he was agile.

Bam Bam was another good one, in my opinion, but he wasn't so much tall "big" as he was fat "big".
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Old 03-08-2006, 02:08 AM   #7
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Ahhh, im so glad you guys think so! Everyone used to hate him, and sometimes it was justified, he would be lazy and unmotivated, but he pumped out some tight moves on Cena, I think a Triple H/Show WWE Title feud would sell big... strecher match, maybe even Hell in a Cell (although I really want them to leave this match alone for a while, but they won't).
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Old 03-08-2006, 02:58 AM   #8
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Show has been decent since his feud with Lesner IMO, the guy is beig booked correctly in a way that he can do the job from time to time, but is always there as a legit threat to anyone, which is great! He's got bag loads of charisma to boot. I know there were a few lost years when he just had a bad run of shitty feuds and crap matches, but for the past years I think he's been a real asset to the company
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Old 03-08-2006, 03:40 AM   #9
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Always been a fan, wont really repeat what has been said.

I would like to see him bust out again in later 2006 and maybe have a WWE title run that is about him not an inevitable loss like his others were.
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Old 03-08-2006, 04:14 AM   #10
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The man is in definite need of a 2006 title win. 'Nuff said.
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Old 03-08-2006, 04:38 AM   #11
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I've always thought that (for his size) he was a good wrestler.
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Old 03-08-2006, 09:36 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepsi Man
You've got limited mobility in a lot of cases there, and you've got two guys each used to having such a weight advantage over his opponent that without that, the guy has nothing.

I'd like to say my personal favorite The Undertaker used to work well with the big guys despite being big himself, because for a guy his size, he could fucking fly, and he was agile.

Bam Bam was another good one, in my opinion, but he wasn't so much tall "big" as he was fat "big".
Almost every big man, if they let him cut loose, could be as "agile" as the Undertaker.

Seriously, I know you all forget that wrestling is fake and based on a set of stereotypes (Like big guys=slow, women=fucktoys, and cruiserweights=total pussies), but a lot of larger folks are capable of doing what Taker does. Nothing he does is particularly special, and unless it was done by someone who was either significantly larger or significantly fatter, it doesn't really count as remarkable agility.
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Old 03-08-2006, 09:41 AM   #13
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Show's had two handicaps: Weight and laziness. And despite spending much of his career in WWE as a fat, lazy bastard, he's been over. When he puts on a good match, he really puts on a good match. When he doesn't, he tends to blow like a Sperm Whale (Or an intern).

If he's going to be main eventing, he needs to have some level of passion and keep it up. His recent matches have been solid, but I've seen him put one or two good matches on just to go backto his sammichin'.

If I wanted to see a lazy ass in the main event, I'd watch a few recent HHH matches.
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Old 03-08-2006, 10:57 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Almost every big man, if they let him cut loose, could be as "agile" as the Undertaker.

Seriously, I know you all forget that wrestling is fake and based on a set of stereotypes (Like big guys=slow, women=fucktoys, and cruiserweights=total pussies), but a lot of larger folks are capable of doing what Taker does. Nothing he does is particularly special, and unless it was done by someone who was either significantly larger or significantly fatter, it doesn't really count as remarkable agility.
Kevin Nash? Psycho Sid? Hell, even guys not quite as tall like Crush, Hulk Hogan, Scott Hall? I'm just not seeing it.
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Old 03-08-2006, 12:02 PM   #15
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well this is the last year on shows big contract. rember the one he made when he left wcw you know where he got limo rides to the ring an i don't see him getting another big contract like that. so he has to show his best stuff now.
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Old 03-08-2006, 12:05 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6to1
well this is the last year on shows big contract. rember the one he made when he left wcw you know where he got limo rides to the ring an i don't see him getting another big contract like that. so he has to show his best stuff now.
How could it be expiring this year? From what I remember, he signed a ten year contract in 1999, which would mean his contract would run out in 2009...
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Old 03-08-2006, 12:27 PM   #17
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i thought it was only a 6 year deal damm he signed a better deal then i thought.
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Old 03-08-2006, 12:38 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepsi Man
Kevin Nash? Psycho Sid? Hell, even guys not quite as tall like Crush, Hulk Hogan, Scott Hall? I'm just not seeing it.
Wow. And if I wanted to be rigid and anal to try and prove a point, I would probably choose people who are inflexible or had no wrestling skills as examples too. I mean, the fact that you had to go to the "inury prone beyond all reason" guy first indicates how weak your argument is. In an industry full of big men, you didn't even really list a lot of "hosses" to back up your argument.
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Old 03-08-2006, 12:55 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Wow. And if I wanted to be rigid and anal to try and prove a point, I would probably choose people who are inflexible or had no wrestling skills as examples too. I mean, the fact that you had to go to the "inury prone beyond all reason" guy first indicates how weak your argument is. In an industry full of big men, you didn't even really list a lot of "hosses" to back up your argument.
I was trying to go for guys around 6'8" or taller. You don't exactly see them every day. Who did I leave out that's been wrestling in the last ten years or so and has been on television? JBL maybe, but who else? Seriously. If my argument were so weak, you should've been able to give at least a single name of a big guy that works like that, apart from the already aforementioned Big Show or Kane, and even at that, I'd argue that Big Show doesn't seem to have the stamina to do too much of it. Impressive nonetheless, though.
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Old 03-08-2006, 01:08 PM   #20
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Not that I want to jump in to the middle of all this; I just want to point out that Scott Hall is actually extremely agile for his size when he's working at full speed. Especially if you see his AWA stuff.
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Old 03-08-2006, 02:11 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepsi Man
I was trying to go for guys around 6'8" or taller. You don't exactly see them every day. Who did I leave out that's been wrestling in the last ten years or so and has been on television? JBL maybe, but who else? Seriously. If my argument were so weak, you should've been able to give at least a single name of a big guy that works like that, apart from the already aforementioned Big Show or Kane, and even at that, I'd argue that Big Show doesn't seem to have the stamina to do too much of it. Impressive nonetheless, though.
I see now. You don't get the argument. The argument isn't that they do it regularly. My argument is the only reason Taker seems special is because even those who can, do not. Even then, you can find hosses and even fat guys who are "agile." Brock Lesnar, O'Haire (Yes, people have argued he's a hoss, so I throw him in), Kane, Test is rather maneuverable himself despite a limited moveset on TV, Lance Hoyt (As I like to call him, Test Lite), etc. However, my argument was not about what hosses DO, but can do. People cream themselves because of a heel kick from Vis, because agility is supposed to be a talent only the little guys have. Just like little guys don't use hoss moves.

What makes Undertaker "agile?" The same thing that keeps Burchill from outshining Rey Mysterio. The guy's not all that limber, he's just portrayed that way. It's like Don Adams wearing lifts because the producers didn't want Max Smart to be shorter than 99.

You can even see it in wrestling, if you go outside WWE. Hell, I'd wager someone who watches more OVW than I could name a couple of guys, and they have TIES to WWE.
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Old 03-08-2006, 02:28 PM   #22
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Well even Andre was agile in his youth, moving around the ring just as fast as the other middleweights and heavyweights.
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Old 03-08-2006, 02:28 PM   #23
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Well even Andre was agile in his youth, moving around the ring just as fast as the other middleweights and heavyweights.
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Old 03-08-2006, 02:35 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
I see now. You don't get the argument. The argument isn't that they do it regularly. My argument is the only reason Taker seems special is because even those who can, do not. Even then, you can find hosses and even fat guys who are "agile." Brock Lesnar, O'Haire (Yes, people have argued he's a hoss, so I throw him in), Kane, Test is rather maneuverable himself despite a limited moveset on TV, Lance Hoyt (As I like to call him, Test Lite), etc. However, my argument was not about what hosses DO, but can do. People cream themselves because of a heel kick from Vis, because agility is supposed to be a talent only the little guys have. Just like little guys don't use hoss moves.

What makes Undertaker "agile?" The same thing that keeps Burchill from outshining Rey Mysterio. The guy's not all that limber, he's just portrayed that way. It's like Don Adams wearing lifts because the producers didn't want Max Smart to be shorter than 99.

You can even see it in wrestling, if you go outside WWE. Hell, I'd wager someone who watches more OVW than I could name a couple of guys, and they have TIES to WWE.
Lesnar and O'Haire are both smaller, but I guess I could see Test. It's not that I didn't get the argument. The way you're making it out, anyone in wrestling could do anything anyone else does, but they're not allowed.
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Old 03-09-2006, 04:06 AM   #25
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The way Show was booked in 1999, a few people are still seeing Show's improvement and then thinking of how he was like in 99 and holding a grudge (wrestling fans are nortorious for this, and it's not just the Montreal garbage). Remember that crap storyline with him and the Bossman and Show's deceased father. WWE writing at it's very best. :rolleyes:

But yeah, he's really a good wrestler when he wants to be. Getting people over while still looking like a dominant threat. Look at the match vs. Cena last week. We KNEW that him and Cena could put on a decent match, and we KNEW that Cena was capable of lifting Show for the FU (which personally I had to see to believe again, as my respect in Cena went up some when seeing that, I almost forgot Cena could DO that). So naturally, they were a perfect fit.

Thing is, Show is always gonna have to play the "big guy who you can hardly do anything to" kind of character. You can't really have 3/4ths of any roster just be able to manhandle him. You need to play into that angle. And if you get a bigger guy against Show, then you have another problem because then you don't know about the other guy. And finally, I think it's time that someone else had those tag titles. But then again, IS there another tag team for them to face?
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