How did WWE go from this to what we have today??

**PullMyFinger** · 01-13-2007, 02:06 AM

I know this should be in the YouTube thread, but the point of these videos aren't to show a great match. The point of this is to illustrate just what in the hell went wrong with WWE.

Is it that hard to create good mid-card wrestlers (back then Triple H)? One thing I noticed now is that wrestling is getting way too young. People are only like 22 yrs old and have only like 1 year of training under their belt. There's no way someone can be a great wrestler that fast.

We go from Bret Hart as Champ back then....to now John Cena. A guy who has 4 ultra shite moves and is a complete disgrace to wrestling with his belt.

What the fuck happened?!

**The Naitch** · 01-13-2007, 02:24 AM

they listen to what kids like too much

wrestling should try and get back their older fans. The kids will follow

**Jeritron** · 01-13-2007, 04:37 AM

They missed the boat on a whole generation of talent.
Instead of moving onward from the attitude era, they stayed hung up on Triple H and Taker and misused/sabotaged/shittily booked the guys who were ready for stardom in WWE int he new millenium..(Benoit,Booker,RVD,Jericho,Tazz). They were also hurt by becoming what they once sought to oppose in WCW, by catering back to elders like Hogan Flair and Taker, and the return of Shawn Michaels.(Benoit,Booker,RVD,Jericho,Tazz).
So now they have to build young. If they had pushed those guys they'd be top veterans just starting to put over young guys.

But mainly its shitty booking and misuse of talent starting in 2001 that has been snowballing.
They've had some bad breaks as well such as Brock leaving, the Eddie Guerrero tragedy, and what some may consider the premature retirement of Rock and Austin.

**Corkscrewed** · 01-13-2007, 08:28 AM

Oh man, I've almost forgotten what good, crisp wrestling looks like. Hart made it look so damn easy, too. And HHH was a pretty good worker back then, before he super muscled up.

**Kane Knight** · 01-13-2007, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeritron5000

They missed the boat on a whole generation of talent.
Instead of moving onward from the attitude era, they stayed hung up on Triple H and Taker and misused/sabotaged/shittily booked the guys who were ready for stardom in WWE int he new millenium..(Benoit,Booker,RVD,Jericho,Tazz). They were also hurt by becoming what they once sought to oppose in WCW, by catering back to elders like Hogan Flair and Taker, and the return of Shawn Michaels.(Benoit,Booker,RVD,Jericho,Tazz).
So now they have to build young. If they had pushed those guys they'd be top veterans just starting to put over young guys.

But mainly its shitty booking and misuse of talent starting in 2001 that has been snowballing.
They've had some bad breaks as well such as Brock leaving, the Eddie Guerrero tragedy, and what some may consider the premature retirement of Rock and Austin.

Mostly agreed. It's also worth noting that for every bad break, they had one they'd made themselves. Eddie was a drug user long before WWE, but Angle was an addict right up until the end of his WWE term. They could have dealt with it at any time, they didn't, and then when it looked like life or death they tried to pressure him in a poor fashion.

As stupid as I think Angle has been, one thing I know is that you don't act like this to an addict.

**Rammsteinmad** · 01-13-2007, 12:10 PM

1997 = Great storylines / great wrestlers

2007 = Recycled storylines / big men + Triple H

**Rammsteinmad** · 01-13-2007, 12:11 PM

Owen Hart looks like Kenny Dykstra.

**jindrak** · 01-13-2007, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rammsteinmad

Owen Hart looks like Kenny Dykstra.

He always reminded me of a combination of Owen Hart and Randy Orton.

**Innovator** · 01-13-2007, 01:21 PM

Guys get rushed up too fast, mainly because WWE is/was looking for the next Rock. Instead of being 6-7 years experienced, guys are getting 1-2 years in OVW then get shipped up and are definitely not ready for their spot (Lashley).

**KayfabeMan** · 01-13-2007, 03:28 PM

Many, many good points here.

WWE dropped the ball on getting a good crop of talent in the promotion in the late 90's, and pushing the crop of talent they acquired correctly - as it was mentioned above.

They had signed great talents to developmental deals back then, and then foolishly let them go instead of developing them into what would've been a group of well-seasoned, well-respected, talented superstars today, instead of having Cena, Lashley, and Batista running around.

They did that with Reckless Youth / Tom Carter. Signed him, sent him down south to MCW - a developmental at the time - and he worked great, great matches with Steven Regal, K-Kwick / Ron Killings and dozens of others. He got a dark match or two on RAW shows, and they praised him up the wazoo, but then dropped his contract.

He remained a busy, top-notch guy and could've been a huge star for WWE, as was planned for him to be in ECW.

**Kane Knight** · 01-13-2007, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rammsteinmad

Owen Hart looks like Kenny Dykstra.

I wonder if he'll get Owen's last push...

**Anybody Thrilla** · 01-13-2007, 04:10 PM

Too soon

**KillerWolf** · 01-13-2007, 04:19 PM

it seemed to me like rather than letting the talent that they had come into their own, they frantically tried to turn guys like Cena into "the next Rock" or the "next Stone Cold"

**NeanderCarl** · 01-13-2007, 10:24 PM

A big problem is their newfound insistance over the last couple of years of scripting every last detail of every televised event. Maybe it's because as a public company they have to be in control of what they show, but still.... even as a loyal WWE fan since I was 8/9 years old, if I ever got into the business, I would not want to work for them. Their guys aren't professional wrestlers, more like athletic actors.

**Innovator** · 01-13-2007, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillerWolf

it seemed to me like rather than letting the talent that they had come into their own, they frantically tried to turn guys like Cena into "the next Rock" or the "next Stone Cold"

They should have just done a reality show, The People's Idol.

**Jeritron** · 01-14-2007, 01:31 AM

Yea I think they certainly panicked and started trying to make the "next" superstar from scratch. Guys like Cena, Brock, and Orton benefited from this neccesity for young stars but certainly didn't get to the heights WWE wrongfully hoped.

As I said, they missed the boat on the generation of guys who were rising up on the midcard during the attitude/MNW days. Look at the summer of 2002. Guys like Hogan, Triple H, Undertaker and Rock were holding the belt. Flair was getting a big push.
In the meantime, RVD Booker Tand Jericho, coming off a huge 01 were primed for the top. Benoit was returning from a long hiatus. Eddie Guerrero was back. But instead the old guys were getting the biggest pushes of the year. Brock got a break, but look where that went.
Then 2003 rolls around and they have nobody left and they turn to young guys because they blew it with the others. Some of them went on to get their break but it was too little too late.

Austin, Foley, Triple H and even the Rock found their niche int he midcard and bided their time until their generation came. But when these other guys time came, WWE opted to pull a WCW and cling onto the slipping Attitude era and 80s legends and let the chance get away.

**Outsider** · 01-15-2007, 05:54 AM

I think one of the problems is there 'here today, gone tomorrow' talent policy they seem to have. There have been so many midcarders who have come in, they have attempted to push too fast, not got over, and then fired. There is no longer a solid midcard division, take RAWs intercontintal title, it has two people who ever fight for it, Nitro and Hardy. There should be about 7 or so wrestlers who should be primarily midcarders, even if it is just so Cena doesn't have to work three times a night.

The other problem is if someone does get over, they are pushed to main event far too quickly. It should be a slow climb to main event, working up through tag and lower titles, like Edge has done, not just going straight to the over-crowded main event scene.

**Kane Knight** · 01-15-2007, 08:48 AM

WWE is panicking. That's why, the minute you're over, you're a main eventer. They lack a solid roster, to boot.

**Indifferent Clox** · 01-15-2007, 01:32 PM

If I had any rep I'd Pos rep all of you. This is probably one of the smartest posts on the wrestling forum in a while.

The only thing WWE has going for them IS smackdown and that's still mostly shite. So if they got ECW to at least be all extreme rules maybe that'd be a show to watch (if they didn't go overboard). Raw is harder to figure out how to save. end this roster split would be the best thing. I don't know what they'd do with ECW though

**Jaded-Dragon** · 01-15-2007, 07:45 PM

Much like the Redskins, their roster has no depth. If you're not a main eventer then you don't matter. It's not like 98 when you had HHH, The Rock, Mankind, Kane, etc all at the upper mid card level, any of whom would be fit to be in the main event. They actually tried to push guys to be new stars, as opposed to just looking for the flavor of the month like they do now.

And Let us not forget that most of the Championships have become mere trinkits. It used to be that guys would feud over the belt because they had a desire to be a champion. Now the belts get lost in the sea of "You offended or wronged me some how and now we are going to have a match". You stole my girlfriend, your mom's a whore, you didn't watch my back in a tag match, whatever the case may be this month.

Also it feels even more stale because they have kind of reverted back to these late 80's early 90's type of characters. I figured with Austin they would of learned that people like realism and can relate better to a "common guy" better than they can a male cheerleader.

**Stickman** · 01-15-2007, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kane Knight

I wonder if he'll get Owen's last push...

You mean over the edge with a bad harness?

**Kane Knight** · 01-15-2007, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stickman

You mean over the edge with a bad harness?

Hey, wrestling is cyclical.

01-13-2007, 02:06 AM	#1
PullMyFinger Posts: 3,319	How did WWE go from this to what we have today?? I know this should be in the YouTube thread, but the point of these videos aren't to show a great match. The point of this is to illustrate just what in the hell went wrong with WWE. Is it that hard to create good mid-card wrestlers (back then Triple H)? One thing I noticed now is that wrestling is getting way too young. People are only like 22 yrs old and have only like 1 year of training under their belt. There's no way someone can be a great wrestler that fast. We go from Bret Hart as Champ back then....to now John Cena. A guy who has 4 ultra shite moves and is a complete disgrace to wrestling with his belt. What the fuck happened?! I AM PABLO. Last edited by PullMyFinger; 01-13-2007 at 02:15 AM.

01-13-2007, 02:24 AM	#2
The Naitch RAPTURE READY. Posts: 31,936	they listen to what kids like too much wrestling should try and get back their older fans. The kids will follow

01-13-2007, 04:37 AM	#3
Jeritron Get a poke on Posts: 35,234	They missed the boat on a whole generation of talent. Instead of moving onward from the attitude era, they stayed hung up on Triple H and Taker and misused/sabotaged/shittily booked the guys who were ready for stardom in WWE int he new millenium..(Benoit,Booker,RVD,Jericho,Tazz). They were also hurt by becoming what they once sought to oppose in WCW, by catering back to elders like Hogan Flair and Taker, and the return of Shawn Michaels.(Benoit,Booker,RVD,Jericho,Tazz). So now they have to build young. If they had pushed those guys they'd be top veterans just starting to put over young guys. But mainly its shitty booking and misuse of talent starting in 2001 that has been snowballing. They've had some bad breaks as well such as Brock leaving, the Eddie Guerrero tragedy, and what some may consider the premature retirement of Rock and Austin.

01-13-2007, 08:28 AM	#4
Corkscrewed Posts: 18,357	Oh man, I've almost forgotten what good, crisp wrestling looks like. Hart made it look so damn easy, too. And HHH was a pretty good worker back then, before he super muscled up.

01-13-2007, 12:10 PM	#6
Rammsteinmad TPWW's #3 Peep Posts: 20,903	1997 = Great storylines / great wrestlers 2007 = Recycled storylines / big men + Triple H

01-13-2007, 12:11 PM	#7
Rammsteinmad TPWW's #3 Peep Posts: 20,903	Owen Hart looks like Kenny Dykstra.

01-13-2007, 01:21 PM	#9
Innovator Inno Knows. Posts: 43,710	Guys get rushed up too fast, mainly because WWE is/was looking for the next Rock. Instead of being 6-7 years experienced, guys are getting 1-2 years in OVW then get shipped up and are definitely not ready for their spot (Lashley).

01-13-2007, 03:28 PM	#10
KayfabeMan TPWW's Glass Ceiling Posts: 5,793	Many, many good points here. WWE dropped the ball on getting a good crop of talent in the promotion in the late 90's, and pushing the crop of talent they acquired correctly - as it was mentioned above. They had signed great talents to developmental deals back then, and then foolishly let them go instead of developing them into what would've been a group of well-seasoned, well-respected, talented superstars today, instead of having Cena, Lashley, and Batista running around. They did that with Reckless Youth / Tom Carter. Signed him, sent him down south to MCW - a developmental at the time - and he worked great, great matches with Steven Regal, K-Kwick / Ron Killings and dozens of others. He got a dark match or two on RAW shows, and they praised him up the wazoo, but then dropped his contract. He remained a busy, top-notch guy and could've been a huge star for WWE, as was planned for him to be in ECW.

01-13-2007, 04:10 PM	#12
Anybody Thrilla Cranky Kong Posts: 78,671	Too soon

01-13-2007, 04:19 PM	#13
KillerWolf \m/(-.-)\m/ Posts: 1,456	it seemed to me like rather than letting the talent that they had come into their own, they frantically tried to turn guys like Cena into "the next Rock" or the "next Stone Cold"

01-13-2007, 10:24 PM	#14
NeanderCarl That's Not My Name Posts: 9,086	A big problem is their newfound insistance over the last couple of years of scripting every last detail of every televised event. Maybe it's because as a public company they have to be in control of what they show, but still.... even as a loyal WWE fan since I was 8/9 years old, if I ever got into the business, I would not want to work for them. Their guys aren't professional wrestlers, more like athletic actors.

01-14-2007, 01:31 AM	#16
Jeritron Get a poke on Posts: 35,234	Yea I think they certainly panicked and started trying to make the "next" superstar from scratch. Guys like Cena, Brock, and Orton benefited from this neccesity for young stars but certainly didn't get to the heights WWE wrongfully hoped. As I said, they missed the boat on the generation of guys who were rising up on the midcard during the attitude/MNW days. Look at the summer of 2002. Guys like Hogan, Triple H, Undertaker and Rock were holding the belt. Flair was getting a big push. In the meantime, RVD Booker Tand Jericho, coming off a huge 01 were primed for the top. Benoit was returning from a long hiatus. Eddie Guerrero was back. But instead the old guys were getting the biggest pushes of the year. Brock got a break, but look where that went. Then 2003 rolls around and they have nobody left and they turn to young guys because they blew it with the others. Some of them went on to get their break but it was too little too late. Austin, Foley, Triple H and even the Rock found their niche int he midcard and bided their time until their generation came. But when these other guys time came, WWE opted to pull a WCW and cling onto the slipping Attitude era and 80s legends and let the chance get away.

01-15-2007, 05:54 AM	#17
Outsider Just Some Guy Posts: 14,679	I think one of the problems is there 'here today, gone tomorrow' talent policy they seem to have. There have been so many midcarders who have come in, they have attempted to push too fast, not got over, and then fired. There is no longer a solid midcard division, take RAWs intercontintal title, it has two people who ever fight for it, Nitro and Hardy. There should be about 7 or so wrestlers who should be primarily midcarders, even if it is just so Cena doesn't have to work three times a night. The other problem is if someone does get over, they are pushed to main event far too quickly. It should be a slow climb to main event, working up through tag and lower titles, like Edge has done, not just going straight to the over-crowded main event scene.

01-15-2007, 08:48 AM	#18
Kane Knight Ron Paul 4 EVA Posts: 152,467	WWE is panicking. That's why, the minute you're over, you're a main eventer. They lack a solid roster, to boot.

01-15-2007, 01:32 PM	#19
Indifferent Clox emerge Posts: 16,710	If I had any rep I'd Pos rep all of you. This is probably one of the smartest posts on the wrestling forum in a while. The only thing WWE has going for them IS smackdown and that's still mostly shite. So if they got ECW to at least be all extreme rules maybe that'd be a show to watch (if they didn't go overboard). Raw is harder to figure out how to save. end this roster split would be the best thing. I don't know what they'd do with ECW though

01-15-2007, 07:45 PM	#20
Jaded-Dragon That Guy Posts: 420	Much like the Redskins, their roster has no depth. If you're not a main eventer then you don't matter. It's not like 98 when you had HHH, The Rock, Mankind, Kane, etc all at the upper mid card level, any of whom would be fit to be in the main event. They actually tried to push guys to be new stars, as opposed to just looking for the flavor of the month like they do now. And Let us not forget that most of the Championships have become mere trinkits. It used to be that guys would feud over the belt because they had a desire to be a champion. Now the belts get lost in the sea of "You offended or wronged me some how and now we are going to have a match". You stole my girlfriend, your mom's a whore, you didn't watch my back in a tag match, whatever the case may be this month. Also it feels even more stale because they have kind of reverted back to these late 80's early 90's type of characters. I figured with Austin they would of learned that people like realism and can relate better to a "common guy" better than they can a male cheerleader.